On November 10 2012 13:41 Ettick wrote: Holy shit this is so awesome Now they'll have a global ladder too, so people won't keep going on about what server is best lol
What makes you think they will have a global ladder to? I doubt it, but could be wrong.
If I'm reading this right there is no global ladder. It simply gives you the ability to swap servers without purchasing the corresponding copy. Kinda makes me wonder if NA will become vacant, given a lot of north americans can get decent connection in Korea. I'll switch if my connection is good enough.
hence, "so soon". if they dont do it, some of those with multiple accounts would buy multiple hots and lotv. so either 1) it was a hindsight in the first place for not having global access or 2) they changed their mind (either money or approach ie. separated metagame shift)
i expected stuff like global acess and multiple accounts, as it has been with past blizzard games, after lotv
The simple and probably more likely reason it wasnt in at launch was either that they underestimated how much people would want it or they didnt have it ready in time. A lot of the HotS features were probably features they wanted to put in WoL but didnt finish in time because at some point you have to launch your game.
You know, you could launch it when it's done. Or launch it and complete all the features in the next expansion 2 years later, that's cool too.
Spending 2 more years developing a game with zero return isnt really a sound business venture especially when you are launching 2 expansions where you can slip in anything that didnt get finished in time for core game.
Good point, that is if the technology isn't there yet. It exists a decade ago, on the predecessor of the game itself. I'm no programmer, but I don't see how it would take 2 years after launch to implement it.
Lets say I have 20 bonus things i want to put into SC2 and I have 2-3 teams of people whos job it is to make them and have it work. What you do of course is set a priority list and set your teams to work on each of there assignments with what you think is plenty of time to finish them all before launch.
As programming continues though you run into implimentation issues, issues making it work, and the occational weird bug that you cant explain because it doesnt seem to make sense, or even someone spending too much time making something work. This causes delays over time and all of a sudden what you thought was plenty of time becomes you picking and choosing things to delay until HotS and then once the game launches and you are starting on next game the cycle repeats.
I do understand what you are trying to say. There are certain priority, the core game itself is more important than Clan Support/ Chat Channel / Name Change etc. But let's be honest, 2 years after the game launch? For something that already exist?
It comes down to 2 things. 1) Technical limitation/issue Does that not show the incompetency (is that a word?) of the guys at Blizzard? SEA player were able to play on NA server few months after the release. How could it take so damn long, seriously.
2) $$$$ They wanted to sell more copies. I'm totally fine with that, they are a business after all. They are there to make money, not to babysit you. I wish they could just step out and say that, instead of the "technology isn't there yet guys" excuses. They take us as some dumb zombies that don't know a thing.
If they delayed the game a year a lot of it probably could have been in the game because it would have thus delayed everything else (or well a lot of it since people were probably working on HotS before WoL launched) to get those features in but they used the logic of wanting to actually launch the game and pushed the features back to the expansion that they didnt figure were core features.
The global play was probably a combination of that and the fact that they wanted to insure lag-free gameplay for as many as possible and if they had global play inevitably everyone who wanted to be good would be on one server (probably Korea) and they needed to be able to insure lag-free gameplay for all who wanted to play on it and they probably didnt think they could.
Cross server latency is inevitable, there's no way they could fix that.(Proof me wrong HOTS) I'm from SEA, my ping on NA server never ever gone below 250ms. So i don't see that as a valid argument/ justification on the 2 years delay of the implementation.
Lag-free or not, let the player decides if they wanted to play on other servers. Friends have to spend $60 to play together just because they have a different version of the game is ridiculous.
Well on ICCUP I could play koreans and have absolutely no latency when I played them (and they lived in Korea). I am not sure how that worked out on ICCUP on bw, but I know it worked. So it's obviously possible.
I don't know much about latency, so i could be wrong. It's certainly possible to have absolutely no latency. But it's not by Blizzard fixing stuff, it's through the ISP you using.
The simple and probably more likely reason it wasnt in at launch was either that they underestimated how much people would want it or they didnt have it ready in time. A lot of the HotS features were probably features they wanted to put in WoL but didnt finish in time because at some point you have to launch your game.
You know, you could launch it when it's done. Or launch it and complete all the features in the next expansion 2 years later, that's cool too.
Spending 2 more years developing a game with zero return isnt really a sound business venture especially when you are launching 2 expansions where you can slip in anything that didnt get finished in time for core game.
Good point, that is if the technology isn't there yet. It exists a decade ago, on the predecessor of the game itself. I'm no programmer, but I don't see how it would take 2 years after launch to implement it.
Lets say I have 20 bonus things i want to put into SC2 and I have 2-3 teams of people whos job it is to make them and have it work. What you do of course is set a priority list and set your teams to work on each of there assignments with what you think is plenty of time to finish them all before launch.
As programming continues though you run into implimentation issues, issues making it work, and the occational weird bug that you cant explain because it doesnt seem to make sense, or even someone spending too much time making something work. This causes delays over time and all of a sudden what you thought was plenty of time becomes you picking and choosing things to delay until HotS and then once the game launches and you are starting on next game the cycle repeats.
I do understand what you are trying to say. There are certain priority, the core game itself is more important than Clan Support/ Chat Channel / Name Change etc. But let's be honest, 2 years after the game launch? For something that already exist?
It comes down to 2 things. 1) Technical limitation/issue Does that not show the incompetency (is that a word?) of the guys at Blizzard? SEA player were able to play on NA server few months after the release. How could it take so damn long, seriously.
2) $$$$ They wanted to sell more copies. I'm totally fine with that, they are a business after all. They are there to make money, not to babysit you. I wish they could just step out and say that, instead of the "technology isn't there yet guys" excuses. They take us as some dumb zombies that don't know a thing.
If they delayed the game a year a lot of it probably could have been in the game because it would have thus delayed everything else (or well a lot of it since people were probably working on HotS before WoL launched) to get those features in but they used the logic of wanting to actually launch the game and pushed the features back to the expansion that they didnt figure were core features.
The global play was probably a combination of that and the fact that they wanted to insure lag-free gameplay for as many as possible and if they had global play inevitably everyone who wanted to be good would be on one server (probably Korea) and they needed to be able to insure lag-free gameplay for all who wanted to play on it and they probably didnt think they could.
Cross server latency is inevitable, there's no way they could fix that.(Proof me wrong HOTS) I'm from SEA, my ping on NA server never ever gone below 250ms. So i don't see that as a valid argument/ justification on the 2 years delay of the implementation.
Lag-free or not, let the player decides if they wanted to play on other servers. Friends have to spend $60 to play together just because they have a different version of the game is ridiculous.
Well on ICCUP I could play koreans and have absolutely no latency when I played them (and they lived in Korea). I am not sure how that worked out on ICCUP on bw, but I know it worked. So it's obviously possible.
I don't know much about latency, so i could be wrong. It's certainly possible to have absolutely no latency. But it's not by Blizzard fixing stuff, it's through the ISP you using.
Well I am just saying on iccup in bw you could play anyone and not have latency. Idra played TSL2 from korea for example and lots of players from eu/usa practiced together with no latency. It's just how it was, on iccup there was no latency and you could play anyone from around the world. EU players could play KR players and not have latency issues.
On November 10 2012 11:02 CameLs wrote: [quote] You know, you could launch it when it's done. Or launch it and complete all the features in the next expansion 2 years later, that's cool too.
Spending 2 more years developing a game with zero return isnt really a sound business venture especially when you are launching 2 expansions where you can slip in anything that didnt get finished in time for core game.
Good point, that is if the technology isn't there yet. It exists a decade ago, on the predecessor of the game itself. I'm no programmer, but I don't see how it would take 2 years after launch to implement it.
Lets say I have 20 bonus things i want to put into SC2 and I have 2-3 teams of people whos job it is to make them and have it work. What you do of course is set a priority list and set your teams to work on each of there assignments with what you think is plenty of time to finish them all before launch.
As programming continues though you run into implimentation issues, issues making it work, and the occational weird bug that you cant explain because it doesnt seem to make sense, or even someone spending too much time making something work. This causes delays over time and all of a sudden what you thought was plenty of time becomes you picking and choosing things to delay until HotS and then once the game launches and you are starting on next game the cycle repeats.
I do understand what you are trying to say. There are certain priority, the core game itself is more important than Clan Support/ Chat Channel / Name Change etc. But let's be honest, 2 years after the game launch? For something that already exist?
It comes down to 2 things. 1) Technical limitation/issue Does that not show the incompetency (is that a word?) of the guys at Blizzard? SEA player were able to play on NA server few months after the release. How could it take so damn long, seriously.
2) $$$$ They wanted to sell more copies. I'm totally fine with that, they are a business after all. They are there to make money, not to babysit you. I wish they could just step out and say that, instead of the "technology isn't there yet guys" excuses. They take us as some dumb zombies that don't know a thing.
If they delayed the game a year a lot of it probably could have been in the game because it would have thus delayed everything else (or well a lot of it since people were probably working on HotS before WoL launched) to get those features in but they used the logic of wanting to actually launch the game and pushed the features back to the expansion that they didnt figure were core features.
The global play was probably a combination of that and the fact that they wanted to insure lag-free gameplay for as many as possible and if they had global play inevitably everyone who wanted to be good would be on one server (probably Korea) and they needed to be able to insure lag-free gameplay for all who wanted to play on it and they probably didnt think they could.
Cross server latency is inevitable, there's no way they could fix that.(Proof me wrong HOTS) I'm from SEA, my ping on NA server never ever gone below 250ms. So i don't see that as a valid argument/ justification on the 2 years delay of the implementation.
Lag-free or not, let the player decides if they wanted to play on other servers. Friends have to spend $60 to play together just because they have a different version of the game is ridiculous.
Well on ICCUP I could play koreans and have absolutely no latency when I played them (and they lived in Korea). I am not sure how that worked out on ICCUP on bw, but I know it worked. So it's obviously possible.
I don't know much about latency, so i could be wrong. It's certainly possible to have absolutely no latency. But it's not by Blizzard fixing stuff, it's through the ISP you using.
Well I am just saying on iccup in bw you could play anyone and not have latency. Idra played TSL2 from korea for example and lots of players from eu/usa practiced together with no latency. It's just how it was, on iccup there was no latency and you could play anyone from around the world. EU players could play KR players and not have latency issues.
That's what I'm saying isn't it? (Or am I misunderstanding something) The last sentence was directed at the other guy.
On November 10 2012 13:46 whatevername wrote: If I'm reading this right there is no global ladder. It simply gives you the ability to swap servers without purchasing the corresponding copy. Kinda makes me wonder if NA will become vacant, given a lot of north americans can get decent connection in Korea. I'll switch if my connection is good enough.
Quite the opposite. NA is the only server which has a playable connection from all of NA, Europe, and Korea. Plus, most NA players will play a game on Korea and give up after getting stomped. In fact, there are already many NA pros with Korean accounts who still play almost solely on NA because it provides the best latency and decent opponents.
This changes nothing. They won't be doing anything to latency. They won't have a global ladder or cross-server searching (eg. no idea if you're playing vs a korean or someone in europe). All it does is give you an account on each server. Most professionals and competitive players already have multiple accounts.
On November 10 2012 13:46 whatevername wrote: If I'm reading this right there is no global ladder. It simply gives you the ability to swap servers without purchasing the corresponding copy. Kinda makes me wonder if NA will become vacant, given a lot of north americans can get decent connection in Korea. I'll switch if my connection is good enough.
Quite the opposite. NA is the only server which has a playable connection from all of NA, Europe, and Korea. Plus, most NA players will play a game on Korea and give up after getting stomped. In fact, there are already many NA pros with Korean accounts who still play almost solely on NA because it provides the best latency and decent opponents.
Yeah, those are players who live in areas that have bad connection to korea, like texas [for col] and Cali with EG. Yet Vibe has perfectly fine connection to KR, and Catz did when he was in Florida. But that isnt the point. If something like 40% of Americans can switch to KR, whereas 100% of KR's can switch to America, it hardly means the traffic will be going in the way thats most efficient. I just dont believe Koreans are as liable to switch gateways as Americans are. People bloody well idealize koreas server.
On November 10 2012 13:41 Ettick wrote: Holy shit this is so awesome Now they'll have a global ladder too, so people won't keep going on about what server is best lol
What makes you think they will have a global ladder to? I doubt it, but could be wrong.
Yeah I can almost guarantee that there probably wont be a global ladder. Because you have to make a new account for different regions, global ladder would only make sense if one account can be accessible for all regions without having to relog to a different region etc.
So basically you are assumign that they only are doing it because they already made the money they would make off of multiple accounts despite the fact that two more expansions are on the way.
hence, "so soon". if they dont do it, some of those with multiple accounts would buy multiple hots and lotv. so either 1) it was a hindsight in the first place for not having global access or 2) they changed their mind (either money or approach ie. separated metagame shift)
i expected stuff like global acess and multiple accounts, as it has been with past blizzard games, after lotv
The simple and probably more likely reason it wasnt in at launch was either that they underestimated how much people would want it or they didnt have it ready in time. A lot of the HotS features were probably features they wanted to put in WoL but didnt finish in time because at some point you have to launch your game.
You know, you could launch it when it's done. Or launch it and complete all the features in the next expansion 2 years later, that's cool too.
Spending 2 more years developing a game with zero return isnt really a sound business venture especially when you are launching 2 expansions where you can slip in anything that didnt get finished in time for core game.
Good point, that is if the technology isn't there yet. It exists a decade ago, on the predecessor of the game itself. I'm no programmer, but I don't see how it would take 2 years after launch to implement it.
Lets say I have 20 bonus things i want to put into SC2 and I have 2-3 teams of people whos job it is to make them and have it work. What you do of course is set a priority list and set your teams to work on each of there assignments with what you think is plenty of time to finish them all before launch.
As programming continues though you run into implimentation issues, issues making it work, and the occational weird bug that you cant explain because it doesnt seem to make sense, or even someone spending too much time making something work. This causes delays over time and all of a sudden what you thought was plenty of time becomes you picking and choosing things to delay until HotS and then once the game launches and you are starting on next game the cycle repeats.
I do understand what you are trying to say. There are certain priority, the core game itself is more important than Clan Support/ Chat Channel / Name Change etc. But let's be honest, 2 years after the game launch? For something that already exist?
It comes down to 2 things. 1) Technical limitation/issue Does that not show the incompetency (is that a word?) of the guys at Blizzard? SEA player were able to play on NA server few months after the release. How could it take so damn long, seriously.
2) $$$$ They wanted to sell more copies. I'm totally fine with that, they are a business after all. They are there to make money, not to babysit you. I wish they could just step out and say that, instead of the "technology isn't there yet guys" excuses. They take us as some dumb zombies that don't know a thing.
If they delayed the game a year a lot of it probably could have been in the game because it would have thus delayed everything else (or well a lot of it since people were probably working on HotS before WoL launched) to get those features in but they used the logic of wanting to actually launch the game and pushed the features back to the expansion that they didnt figure were core features.
The global play was probably a combination of that and the fact that they wanted to insure lag-free gameplay for as many as possible and if they had global play inevitably everyone who wanted to be good would be on one server (probably Korea) and they needed to be able to insure lag-free gameplay for all who wanted to play on it and they probably didnt think they could.
Cross server latency is inevitable, there's no way they could fix that.(Proof me wrong HOTS) I'm from SEA, my ping on NA server never ever gone below 250ms. So i don't see that as a valid argument/ justification on the 2 years delay of the implementation.
Lag-free or not, let the player decides if they wanted to play on other servers. Friends have to spend $60 to play together just because they have a different version of the game is ridiculous.
If you are going to impliment something badly its often better to not do it at all. Having it be ridiculously laggy might be expected but if you think that people wont complain non stop about it being that than you are being delusional. There are people in a beta who complain that the game isnt stable.
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