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Poll: Kespa is doing this because...To screw with GOM (part 2) (698) 90% Players aren't ready (38) 5% Bit of A and B (37) 5% 773 total votes Your vote: Kespa is doing this because... (Vote): To screw with GOM (part 2)
(Vote): Players aren't ready
(Vote): Bit of A and B
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On August 23 2012 22:36 Salazarz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:34 MVTaylor wrote:
Pathetic, I'm not paying OSL or any league related to KESPA a penny until they change their stance. Quite frankly I wouldn't mind if Blizzard black listed the OSL tournament and every KESPA pro gaming house until they change their mind. Finally something useful about bnet 0.2 Pathetic, you don't even know that OSL and everything KeSPA related has always been free, including their live events and even merch give-aways during finals etc, and yet you feel you know enough about the situation to spout crap like this. edit: It's so annoying reading comments by these know-it-alls who don't know anything about the ridiculous demands Blizzard had for KeSPA (lol their broadcasting fees), or the awful organisation at WCGs, or the dumb deal with GOM at the launch of SC2, but somehow are super familiar with the evil that is KeSPA, their atrocious crimes, and how KeSPA really SHOULD act. The amount of pure bandwagon hate just for the sake of hating because someone else said, 'hey lets hate on x' is really retarded. It's the number one reason I don't read forums like reddit, but it seems like TL isn't exactly much better these days...
I have to agree with this guy a little bit. Kespa never charged American and non-European viewers to watch their content, while letting Koreans view for free to build their brand (like GOM) so your never going to "have to pay them a penny." Remember when GOM was trying to charge even more then they are now when they first starting producing content? Remember when after ten years of not giving a shit about broodwar Blizzard claimed to care just so they could get ahead of Kespa in the fight for viewers in Korea.
I really don't know why people hate Kespa so much, but then put Blizzard and especially GOM on a pedestal. Obviusly Kespa has its faults, but there are two sides to every story. Yeah it sucks for the players and the viewers, but I think at sc2's current stage competition is a good thing and will result in the best product.
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United States23455 Posts
It just seems like Kespa doesn't want to put their players in the GSL until they are sure that their players can win code s. I don't see what the problem is with letting them play the code A qualifiers. Based on WCS results some Kespa players would get through.
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Thanks for the translation Weirdkid. This is a real shame, I hope Kespa isn't trying monopolize the scene again like they did to gom in BW by pulling all of their players out. Even if not all the kespa players are ready, from wcs results, there are enough of them to compete in the generous seeds presented by gom.
Can't the kespa teams quit kespa, play in gom and still compete in the osl, afterall, gom players can play in the osl, why wouldn't ex kespa players be allowed?
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On August 23 2012 22:55 EAGER-beaver wrote:
Can't the kespa teams quit kespa, play in gom and still compete in the osl, afterall, gom players can play in the osl, why wouldn't ex kespa players be allowed?
Kespa teams ARE Kespa, they're not going to quit their own organization, the one that they created and are running. -_-
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hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2"
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On August 23 2012 22:56 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:55 EAGER-beaver wrote:
Can't the kespa teams quit kespa, play in gom and still compete in the osl, afterall, gom players can play in the osl, why wouldn't ex kespa players be allowed? Kespa teams ARE Kespa, they're not going to quit their own organization, the one that they created and are running. -_-
I sometimes wonder what people think KeSPA actually is.
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On August 23 2012 22:55 EAGER-beaver wrote:
Thanks for the translation Weirdkid. This is a real shame, I hope Kespa isn't trying monopolize the scene again like they did to gom in BW by pulling all of their players out. Even if not all the kespa players are ready, from wcs results, there are enough of them to compete in the generous seeds presented by gom.
Can't the kespa teams quit kespa, play in gom and still compete in the osl, afterall, gom players can play in the osl, why wouldn't ex kespa players be allowed?
Why would they want to?
Kespa: better living conditions, better pay, more prestigious leagues, far more stable career
GOM: team conditions ranging from okay to awful, poor to no salaries, one domestically unpopular league
I don't think you'll find many if any players at all that care enough about GSL to give up on all it means to be on a kespa team
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On August 23 2012 22:57 Forikorder wrote:
hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2"
That'd be an incredibly dumb decision on blizzard's part that would probably cost it millions...
Edit: Unless Kespa agreed, in which case it wouldn't cost anything. But the risk isn't worth it
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Mexico674 Posts
This is definitely sad news.
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KeSPA better hope someone make through to RO8 OSL then, otherwise they are in a world of hurt.
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On August 23 2012 22:57 Forikorder wrote:
hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2"
That would be retarded and it would accomplish nothing.
The players would just come out and say that it's their own decision not to play in GSL. You'd have the exact same situation, except with Blizzard having acted like dicks.
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On August 23 2012 22:47 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:40 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:36 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:35 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:16 Rustug wrote:On August 23 2012 21:57 floor exercise wrote:On August 23 2012 21:54 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 23 2012 21:49 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 16:45 Qwyn wrote:
No it doesn't really, b/c the lack of KeSPA players just leaves the GSL as it has always been, lol. But when they are allowed to play it's going to be fucking awesome. No, GSL has always been about featuring the best players in the world. Kespa is destroying the integrity of the GSL with this behavior. true, but really I need to know why KeSPA declined its teams from participating I'm sure its not something unreasonable, They've pulled crazy shit before but this is completely random. It all comes down to money. Kespa players are hot commodities, they would certainly increase viewership of gom domestically and around the world. That means more money for Gom, and for what, using another organisations players that they have built and supported for a decade. It's easy for Gom to appeal to the fans and cry victim like this, but we really don't know the arrangement or if Kespa is expected to just hand over their stars, which is their only real valuable asset, for nothing Domestically yes, internationally it's already doing pretty good. This is a domestic "turf war", can't tell who's the good guy and who is the bad guy. But IMO if Blizzard doesn't step in quick, it will be bad for SC in Korea as a whole. Yes, Blizzard, the company that won't even make LAN mode for tournaments is going to try to step in? I think they would be out of their depths. Yes, they created the game and has the license for it, but they don't know the e-sports scene in Korea. Actually, the lack of LAN is why they could step in. Imagine OSL finals, Flash vs MVP say. After the 1st game, Flash's account was suddenly banned. Really? You think Blizzard would risk the entire Korean market by pulling a stunt like that? Look, some of us hardcore SC2 fans might get upset because Kespa players won't be playing in GSL this season. But let's face it, we are a small minority. Blizzard would be stupid to try to step in like this. I would think they would want to step in, though not in the manner I described. They don't want KeSPA to get too much power, since it takes away power from them. They don't have many options anyway. The two things they can do is come up with some slap-on-the-wrist PR statement or deny Kespa the right to run SC2 tournaments. Nobody would care about the former, and they would be digging their own grave as far as Korean market is concerned with the latter. It's mind boggling that GOM (and possibly Blizzard) basically want to pressure the teams to have players compete in their tournaments. Well it's not mind boggling, it's understandable from a business / power play perspective, but that is much more of a dick move than Kespa teams simply deciding that they can't fit another individual league into their schedule at this point in time.
GOM/Blizzard isn't naive. Remember back in BW when KeSPA shut down the GOM league?
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On August 23 2012 22:57 Forikorder wrote:
hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2"
That would be about the worst case scenario. What I really hope happens is that kespa is creating some sort of opening event.
Even then, that federation players are playing in the osl and not vice versa makes this such a shitty move.
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On August 23 2012 23:00 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:57 Forikorder wrote:
hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2" That would be retarded and it would accomplish nothing. The players would just come out and say that it's their own decision not to play in GSL then and you'd have the exact same situation, except with Blizzard having acted like dicks.
Player and coach already said it was not their decision. Too late for that boat.
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On August 23 2012 22:58 boxman22 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:57 Forikorder wrote:
hopefully Blizzard puts on the daddy pants and saids "if you dont let your players participate were pulling the plug on letting you broadcast SC2" That'd be an incredibly dumb decision on blizzard's part that would probably cost it millions... Edit: Unless Kespa agreed, in which case it wouldn't cost anything. But the risk isn't worth it
i dont see how it would cost blizzard anything, worst case scenario it gos back to how it was before KesPA started switching
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On August 23 2012 22:42 Salazarz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:40 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:36 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:35 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:16 Rustug wrote:On August 23 2012 21:57 floor exercise wrote:On August 23 2012 21:54 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 23 2012 21:49 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 16:45 Qwyn wrote:
No it doesn't really, b/c the lack of KeSPA players just leaves the GSL as it has always been, lol. But when they are allowed to play it's going to be fucking awesome. No, GSL has always been about featuring the best players in the world. Kespa is destroying the integrity of the GSL with this behavior. true, but really I need to know why KeSPA declined its teams from participating I'm sure its not something unreasonable, They've pulled crazy shit before but this is completely random. It all comes down to money. Kespa players are hot commodities, they would certainly increase viewership of gom domestically and around the world. That means more money for Gom, and for what, using another organisations players that they have built and supported for a decade. It's easy for Gom to appeal to the fans and cry victim like this, but we really don't know the arrangement or if Kespa is expected to just hand over their stars, which is their only real valuable asset, for nothing Domestically yes, internationally it's already doing pretty good. This is a domestic "turf war", can't tell who's the good guy and who is the bad guy. But IMO if Blizzard doesn't step in quick, it will be bad for SC in Korea as a whole. Yes, Blizzard, the company that won't even make LAN mode for tournaments is going to try to step in? I think they would be out of their depths. Yes, they created the game and has the license for it, but they don't know the e-sports scene in Korea. Actually, the lack of LAN is why they could step in. Imagine OSL finals, Flash vs MVP say. After the 1st game, Flash's account was suddenly banned. Really? You think Blizzard would risk the entire Korean market by pulling a stunt like that? Look, some of us hardcore SC2 fans might get upset because Kespa players won't be playing in GSL this season. But let's face it, we are a small minority. Blizzard would be stupid to try to step in like this. I would think they would want to step in, though not in the manner I described. They don't want KeSPA to get too much power, since it takes away power from them. Yeah, because we've all seen how good and active Blizzard is with developing the e-sports scene or hosting their own tournaments, right?
I think people are being negative nancies here. In the last couple of months I've seen effort from Blizzard. WCS being the prime example. I'm not supporting KeSPA, GOM or Blizzard, neither BW or SC2 here. All I know/feel is that we need a healthy Korean StarCraft scene if we want to grow. Players need to be able to play all the tournaments.
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On August 23 2012 22:42 boxman22 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:15 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 22:01 Condor Hero wrote:On August 23 2012 21:59 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 21:57 Condor Hero wrote:On August 23 2012 21:49 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 16:45 Qwyn wrote:
No it doesn't really, b/c the lack of KeSPA players just leaves the GSL as it has always been, lol. But when they are allowed to play it's going to be fucking awesome. No, GSL has always been about featuring the best players in the world. Kespa is destroying the integrity of the GSL with this behavior. Use your brain. All Kespa has is their players, who have enormous expectations. Why the fuck would Kespa even risk losing the hype around its players if they thought they needed 1 more week or 1 more year?? Use your brain. How does that contradict what I said? You're saying Kespa not allowing it's players fucks up the GSL because some of the best players won't participate. I'm saying Kespa players aren't ready, despite kicking ass at WCS I'm sure everyone will agree the GSL players played like shit. That makes no sense at all. If they can beat them at WCS they can beat them in code A. Just glancing through day 1 of the open bracket, looking at some famous kespa player results: Wooki 0-2 고재흠 Hoejja 1-2 Harrier Flying 0-2 Brown Flash 2-0 Brown, Flash 1-2 Sniper Crazy-hydra 1-2 inori Bisu 0-2 Moon Fantasy 0-2 Pet Only 1 kespa player, Flash, was able to beat a top Code B/Code A player. It's not as though Kespa players winning against GSL players is a common thing
Recent, more relevant results, prove you wrong.
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On August 23 2012 23:01 holy_war wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:47 Talin wrote:On August 23 2012 22:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:40 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:36 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:35 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:16 Rustug wrote:On August 23 2012 21:57 floor exercise wrote:On August 23 2012 21:54 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 23 2012 21:49 monkybone wrote:
[quote]
No, GSL has always been about featuring the best players in the world. Kespa is destroying the integrity of the GSL with this behavior. true, but really I need to know why KeSPA declined its teams from participating I'm sure its not something unreasonable, They've pulled crazy shit before but this is completely random. It all comes down to money. Kespa players are hot commodities, they would certainly increase viewership of gom domestically and around the world. That means more money for Gom, and for what, using another organisations players that they have built and supported for a decade. It's easy for Gom to appeal to the fans and cry victim like this, but we really don't know the arrangement or if Kespa is expected to just hand over their stars, which is their only real valuable asset, for nothing Domestically yes, internationally it's already doing pretty good. This is a domestic "turf war", can't tell who's the good guy and who is the bad guy. But IMO if Blizzard doesn't step in quick, it will be bad for SC in Korea as a whole. Yes, Blizzard, the company that won't even make LAN mode for tournaments is going to try to step in? I think they would be out of their depths. Yes, they created the game and has the license for it, but they don't know the e-sports scene in Korea. Actually, the lack of LAN is why they could step in. Imagine OSL finals, Flash vs MVP say. After the 1st game, Flash's account was suddenly banned. Really? You think Blizzard would risk the entire Korean market by pulling a stunt like that? Look, some of us hardcore SC2 fans might get upset because Kespa players won't be playing in GSL this season. But let's face it, we are a small minority. Blizzard would be stupid to try to step in like this. I would think they would want to step in, though not in the manner I described. They don't want KeSPA to get too much power, since it takes away power from them. They don't have many options anyway. The two things they can do is come up with some slap-on-the-wrist PR statement or deny Kespa the right to run SC2 tournaments. Nobody would care about the former, and they would be digging their own grave as far as Korean market is concerned with the latter. It's mind boggling that GOM (and possibly Blizzard) basically want to pressure the teams to have players compete in their tournaments. Well it's not mind boggling, it's understandable from a business / power play perspective, but that is much more of a dick move than Kespa teams simply deciding that they can't fit another individual league into their schedule at this point in time. GOM/Blizzard isn't naive. Remember back in BW when KeSPA shut down the GOM league?
They didn't shut it down as far as I know. They just didn't endorse it, and then the teams eventually pulled their players due to schedule congestion (having 3 individual leagues was too much and they're clearly not going to drop OSL or MSL for it). Then it shut down.
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On August 23 2012 22:47 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 22:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:40 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:36 achan1058 wrote:On August 23 2012 22:35 vthree wrote:On August 23 2012 22:16 Rustug wrote:On August 23 2012 21:57 floor exercise wrote:On August 23 2012 21:54 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 23 2012 21:49 monkybone wrote:On August 23 2012 16:45 Qwyn wrote:
No it doesn't really, b/c the lack of KeSPA players just leaves the GSL as it has always been, lol. But when they are allowed to play it's going to be fucking awesome. No, GSL has always been about featuring the best players in the world. Kespa is destroying the integrity of the GSL with this behavior. true, but really I need to know why KeSPA declined its teams from participating I'm sure its not something unreasonable, They've pulled crazy shit before but this is completely random. It all comes down to money. Kespa players are hot commodities, they would certainly increase viewership of gom domestically and around the world. That means more money for Gom, and for what, using another organisations players that they have built and supported for a decade. It's easy for Gom to appeal to the fans and cry victim like this, but we really don't know the arrangement or if Kespa is expected to just hand over their stars, which is their only real valuable asset, for nothing Domestically yes, internationally it's already doing pretty good. This is a domestic "turf war", can't tell who's the good guy and who is the bad guy. But IMO if Blizzard doesn't step in quick, it will be bad for SC in Korea as a whole. Yes, Blizzard, the company that won't even make LAN mode for tournaments is going to try to step in? I think they would be out of their depths. Yes, they created the game and has the license for it, but they don't know the e-sports scene in Korea. Actually, the lack of LAN is why they could step in. Imagine OSL finals, Flash vs MVP say. After the 1st game, Flash's account was suddenly banned. Really? You think Blizzard would risk the entire Korean market by pulling a stunt like that? Look, some of us hardcore SC2 fans might get upset because Kespa players won't be playing in GSL this season. But let's face it, we are a small minority. Blizzard would be stupid to try to step in like this. I would think they would want to step in, though not in the manner I described. They don't want KeSPA to get too much power, since it takes away power from them. They don't have many options anyway. The two things they can do is come up with some slap-on-the-wrist PR statement or deny Kespa the right to run SC2 tournaments. Nobody would care about the former, and they would be digging their own grave as far as Korean market is concerned with the latter. It's mind boggling that GOM (and possibly Blizzard) basically want to pressure the teams to have players compete in their tournaments. Well it's not mind boggling, it's understandable from a business / power play perspective, but that is much more of a dick move than Kespa teams simply deciding that they can't fit another individual league into their schedule at this point in time.
"can't fit it into their schedule" is a PR way of saying "we're going to start our own league and keep the current players to ourselves".
To me it seems like it's KeSPa backing out on agreements here, trying to get the same monopoly they had in BW by denying Blizzard ownership and blocking GOM by witholding their players from non-KeSPa league participation. It's only logical for GOM and Blizzard to frown upon such a selfish goal, especially since it isn't in the players' best interest at all, nor the fans' for that matter.
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EPT
