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On June 07 2012 23:32 Gorlin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 23:14 IshinShishi wrote:
Ever since the latest patch I consider the Blizzard employees concerned with balance(David Kim and crew?)pure baboons, they managed to MAJORLY fuck up the most balanced matchup(and also, the most entertaining one by far) without even giving the patch enough time to get a proper amount of feedback, baboons is what they are.There are people playing this game for a living, they deserve better than this. There has been one season in the history of code S with more than 4 zergs in the Ro16 and it was in October when there were 5, really only because terran were dominating protoss that season and no protoss made it (similarly, the Super Tournament had 1 toss, 9 terran, and 6 zerg. However, only one of those 6 made it to the quarterfinals). There were three seasons where 4 made it, and the rest were 3 or less. That is in no way a balanced matchup. The fact that it is the most entertaining does not mean it balanced, and plus the games since the patch have for the most part been great games still, just zergs win most of them rather than terran winning most of them. I think the patch may have been too strong, but the fact that it was entertaining in no way proves that it was balanced. There has been a fundamental flaw in the early game since release, and this is the first to do something about it.
This argument is invalid, players are individuals(i.e they have different skillsets, different amounts of skill, different strategic visions etc), there aren't nearly enough of them to make calls on balance based on how many terrans/zergs/protoss are playing in the GSL, this forced balance we have today is actually risible.TvZ is completely imbalanced because every terran at the top feels uncomfortable playing zergs, while zergs are feeling like they are having the time of their life(zergs figured it all out bro hurrr durr), playing with no pressure at all, this is a major pointer(along with forgg and polt losing to jackthesilverstar NA zergs just as much as they win), not the amount of players in the GSL.
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lets give it a few more months and let it settle, we're confident mvp will innovate strategies for us to copy well
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I don't have time to wait for MVP to keep carrying Terrans. We either need to figure something out or....
We just need to innovate. Neither blizzard or MVP is going to save us.
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127 Posts
As usual, the stats are about 4-6 months behind the actual game.
Most Terrans believed the TvZ match was heavily favored before the latest patch due to the ridiculously huge maps that became more and more prevelant over the last 4 seasons.
Zerg has been the most powerful race for a long time. Now there's just no doubt.
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Looks balanced enough to me yo.
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I doubt pvz will still be p favored once june winrates show up
Game is being butchered. TvZ used to be so sick
At least PvT is getting better and better. Such a fun matchup to watch nowadays :D
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The whining in these threads always makes me giggle
Mostly because of posts like this:
On June 07 2012 23:59 JustTray wrote:
As usual, the stats are about 4-6 months behind the actual game.
Most Terrans believed the TvZ match was heavily favored before the latest patch due to the ridiculously huge maps that became more and more prevelant over the last 4 seasons.
Zerg has been the most powerful race for a long time. Now there's just no doubt.
Small sample sizes (including Bo1 series!) are always amazing statistical foundations, right? XD
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Reminder: this is the second month of Z>T in Korea. And the patch has not really yet affected the statistics (only the last 10 days). I'd bet on June TLPD being much worse, and also internationally, as builds generally are innovated in Korea and move to the international scene. Haven't yet seen many foreigners play Yugioh/Symbol style Z, and that's just the beginning.
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On June 07 2012 23:27 sevia wrote:
Marine-tank is on its way out, I think. Recent changes have forced terrans to reevaluate how to play the early- and mid-game vs. a monster economy zerg, and I'm confident that as soon as terrans like MVP can work out the timings and details, a late-game oriented mech style will present itself as the better option.
No. Marauder-Hellion is the most powerful composition vs ground. All you need to do is find a way to counter the air of the opponent. Not to derail, but I have proposed that all armor upgrades for Terran should be condensed into one, on the Ebay and cheap. So you can add Vikings too.
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On June 07 2012 23:56 joeschmo wrote:
lets give it a few more months and let it settle, we're confident mvp will innovate strategies for us to copy well
Lets give it a few months so every Terran has enough time to switch before HotS comes out? 
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The terrans qq'ing in here need to stop it and actually start thinking of new crap, matchups change, deal with it.
For a race that has been at the top for practically the entire game you're all acting absolutely pathetic, after a 2 month of slight international imbalance and some meaningless korean statistics, terran has by far the most versatility in design, use it.
Or qq and switch race, you'll have to do so again when the balance inevitably changes again though.
Or just play random :D
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lol Protoss so OP. All the Terrans are just better, right?
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On June 08 2012 00:02 50bani wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2012 23:27 sevia wrote:
Marine-tank is on its way out, I think. Recent changes have forced terrans to reevaluate how to play the early- and mid-game vs. a monster economy zerg, and I'm confident that as soon as terrans like MVP can work out the timings and details, a late-game oriented mech style will present itself as the better option. No. Marauder-Hellion is the most powerful composition vs ground. All you need to do is find a way to counter the air of the opponent. Not to derail, but I have proposed that all armor upgrades for Terran should be condensed into one, on the Ebay and cheap. So you can add Vikings too.
Not saying I agree, but you could make it common for their ground units at least, as it's the case for Protoss and Zerg.
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On June 08 2012 00:03 Scootaloo wrote:
The terrans qq'ing in here need to stop it and actually start thinking of new crap, matchups change, deal with it.
For a race that has been at the top for practically the entire game you're all acting absolutely pathetic, after a 2 month of slight international imbalance and some meaningless korean statistics, terran has by far the most versatility in design, use it.
Or qq and switch race, you'll have to do so again when the balance inevitably changes again though.
Or just play random :D
Except it never has been at the top, not for the lower levels aka till high masters, things like the queen buff just aggravate it way more, I tried switching to zerg but I ended up playing zvz way too much for my tastes, not fun.
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Well, we will see how everything shakes out after this GSL season where I think Terran will still do pretty well just because more T player. Though I think MLG we might end up top 3-4 Z as it shakes out atm.
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Yikes!
I didn't think it was that bad.
It's too soon to judge yet, but sometimes you just know when something's out of whack.
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On June 08 2012 00:03 Scootaloo wrote:
The terrans qq'ing in here need to stop it and actually start thinking of new crap, matchups change, deal with it.
For a race that has been at the top for practically the entire game you're all acting absolutely pathetic, after a 2 month of slight international imbalance and some meaningless korean statistics, terran has by far the most versatility in design, use it.
Or qq and switch race, you'll have to do so again when the balance inevitably changes again though.
Or just play random :D
No race has a "right" to be imbalanced. The fact that Terran has been strongest the longest is irrelevant. If zerg is imbalanced, the race should be nerfed. Simple.
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On June 08 2012 00:05 SeaSwift wrote:
lol Protoss so OP. All the Terrans are just better, right?
Protoss manage to lose last season of GSL soo...
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On June 08 2012 00:07 IshinShishi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2012 00:03 Scootaloo wrote:
The terrans qq'ing in here need to stop it and actually start thinking of new crap, matchups change, deal with it.
For a race that has been at the top for practically the entire game you're all acting absolutely pathetic, after a 2 month of slight international imbalance and some meaningless korean statistics, terran has by far the most versatility in design, use it.
Or qq and switch race, you'll have to do so again when the balance inevitably changes again though.
Or just play random :D Except it never has been at the top, not for the lower levels aka till high masters, things like the queen buff just aggravate it way more, I tried switching to zerg but I ended up playing zvz way too much for my tastes, not fun.
I understand the low level sentiment but do you really want Blizzard to balance based on plat or silver players?
And even on low leagues terran has a pretty good history, especially with cheeses and especially against toss, or are you one of those rare 'only macro' terrans?
Besides, with the ranking system, would'nt you just rather quickly go down a league and everything be allright again? Unless you believe you're too good for them ofcourse, which is a ego problem on your part, not balance.
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On June 08 2012 00:00 -orb- wrote:
I doubt pvz will still be p favored once june winrates show up
Game is being butchered. TvZ used to be so sick
At least PvT is getting better and better. Such a fun matchup to watch nowadays :D
Do you mean that the game is being butchered just because of Blizzard's patching or do you think it's also because of the game design that allows the current meta being like it is? With that I mean like the ZvT 2 evo mass ling infestor style and the 12 min 200/200 roach ZvP that both made the matchups alot less exciting to watch and play (imo)?
The only non-mirror matchup that actually have evolved for the good is PvT like you said. It still has its problems because of Blizzard's design of Protoss and some Terran units but compare it to one year ago and it's fucking great. Can't say the same about TvZ and ZvP tho. TvZ went from really fucking good to very stale and ZvP is actually completely broken design vise.
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EPT
