EPTTLPD Winrates May 2012 - Page 15
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RageCommodore
Germany912 Posts
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Twelve12
Australia268 Posts
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sagdashin
Norway45 Posts
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JustTray
127 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:01 KrazyTrumpet wrote: The whining in these threads always makes me giggle Mostly because of posts like this: Small sample sizes (including Bo1 series!) are always amazing statistical foundations, right? XD I think someone said it's 200 games. Were you also saying this when the stats showed Terran up 55-45 mostly over the last year when the sample sizes were identical? The hypocrisy is astounding. Go ahead, use your statistics knowledge to show us the margin of error and why these numbers are not relevant. You won't though, becuase you can't. I play all three races at master level. I switched to Zerg when I realized they were the most OP a while ago. I don't have a bias, Zerg is my main now. | ||
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blamekilly
466 Posts
On June 07 2012 23:14 IshinShishi wrote: Ever since the latest patch I consider the Blizzard employees concerned with balance(David Kim and crew?)pure baboons, they managed to MAJORLY fuck up the most balanced matchup(and also, the most entertaining one by far) without even giving the patch enough time to get a proper amount of feedback, baboons is what they are.There are people playing this game for a living, they deserve better than this. I completely agree. What has David Kim been smoking lately? First they tried out queen energy and then a couple days before the patch is released, they said ok too op, we'll give overlord speed and queen range buff instead. then bam, a couple days later, patch is out.... no time to test, no time to give feedback but who cares right? | ||
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Scootaloo
655 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:17 Chunhyang wrote: No race has a "right" to be imbalanced. The fact that Terran has been strongest the longest is irrelevant. If zerg is imbalanced, the race should be nerfed. Simple. There is no right to be imbalanced, nor did I assert there was, the concept of moral right or wrong is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. What there is though is history, and from that we know that usually by the time Blizzard fixes something the pro's have already found ways to deal with it. Often times terrans call out toss or zerg on being balance whiners, yet when the tables are reversed they cry even harder, even after 2 months, wanna read up on the history of zerg balance? | ||
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MisterTea
United Kingdom1047 Posts
Bunker build time reduced by 10 seconds :D | ||
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xrapture
United States1644 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:19 Gosi wrote: Do you mean that the game is being butchered just because of Blizzard's patching or do you think it's also because of the game design that allows the current meta being like it is? With that I mean like the ZvT 2 evo mass ling infestor style and the 12 min 200/200 roach ZvP that both made the matchups alot less exciting to watch and play (imo)? The only non-mirror matchup that actually have evolved for the good is PvT like you said. It still has its problems because of Blizzard's design of Protoss and some Terran units but compare it to one year ago and it's fucking great. Can't say the same about TvZ and ZvP tho. TvZ went from really fucking good to very stale and ZvP is actually completely broken design vise. More and more lately I've been feeling that TvT is the only decent matchup in the game. No hard counters, no build order losses, tons of viable builds, defenders advantage actually exists, no storms/fungals/banes/collosi that evaporate your entire army or end the game in miliseconds. It's just a straight up strategic battle with no bullshit-- how SC2 is meant to be. | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:24 Scootaloo wrote: There is no right to be imbalanced, nor did I assert there was, the concept of moral right or wrong is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. What there is though is history, and from that we know that usually by the time Blizzard fixes something the pro's have already found ways to deal with it. Often times terrans call out toss or zerg on being balance whiners, yet when the tables are reversed they cry even harder, even after 2 months, wanna read up on the history of zerg balance? PvZ has been a walkover in the lategame for upwards of 6 months. I've been saying that BL/Infestor is unbeatable for ages now, and still people are unwilling to believe it because "this one time" someone landed and Archon Toilet. Forgive me if I have no more patience for Zerg arguments. | ||
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
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SeaSwift
Scotland4486 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:19 Gosi wrote: Do you mean that the game is being butchered just because of Blizzard's patching or do you think it's also because of the game design that allows the current meta being like it is? With that I mean like the ZvT 2 evo mass ling infestor style and the 12 min 200/200 roach ZvP that both made the matchups alot less exciting to watch and play (imo)? The only non-mirror matchup that actually have evolved for the good is PvT like you said. It still has its problems because of Blizzard's design of Protoss and some Terran units but compare it to one year ago and it's fucking great. Can't say the same about TvZ and ZvP tho. TvZ went from really fucking good to very stale and ZvP is actually completely broken design vise. 12 min 200/200 Roach army multipronged aggression against a Protoss trying to take a 3rd base is fucking amazing to watch. It suits the whole swarm vs elite warrior thing and is really tense. Take, for example, MC vs DRG Game 1 from MLG Spring Arena 1, with DRG poking in everywhere with Roaches and MC struggling to hold on for dear life until he could get his 3rd up and running. PvT, I find dull unless it is a Parting lategame or an MC/Hero earlygame, or just MKP in general with lots of aggression. TvZ reached its peak stage when Leenock was destroying everyone on his way to the finals in November. Nowadays we rarely see excellent games, but you do get some good series (MVP vs Leenock last season in the Ro16). I do think that ZvZ is getting more exciting, TvT is staying the same as always and PvP is still just raw micro and BO wins. | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:27 SeaSwift wrote: 12 min 200/200 Roach army multipronged aggression against a Protoss trying to take a 3rd base is fucking amazing to watch. It suits the whole swarm vs elite warrior thing and is really tense. Take, for example, MC vs DRG Game 1 from MLG Spring Arena 1, with DRG poking in everywhere with Roaches and MC struggling to hold on for dear life until he could get his 3rd up and running. I have no idea how you find it amazing to watch. The onus is entirely on the Protoss to actually Forcefield correctly, have the perfect composition of units, and not mess up at all. What you call "multipronged aggression" is basically just hotkeying 2 groups of Roaches and a-moving them at the same time. Riveting. Sorry, that sounds harsh, but it's true. 3base Roach takes almost no skill to execute. The difference between a GM player with perfect macro executing it and Stephano executing it is practically nothing, except maybe Stephano knows when to pull back. Builds like these are horrible for the game because now Protoss has pretty much 2-3 macro builds that allow them to take a third (and all of them are similar early Robo builds). Why? Because if you don't do this you get an autoloss to 3base Roach. The entire PvZ matchup is broken beyond belief. Either Protoss all-ins, gets 3base Roached, or has to go up against BL/Infestor. None of these are interesting to watch. At all. | ||
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imanoobcs
184 Posts
1. The sample size is way to small to make assumptions. I see TvZ in Korea being the most complained about. It is probably based on about 20 games and a difference of 4-5 wins would show those kinds of results. 2. The new patch has not fully been seen in gameplay. Terran still rushes to hellions against a unit that was buffed to counter them. As soon as terran switches up their gameplay, the W/L will level out. Zerg had to do it many times as well,dont complain mini Jim Raynors. 3. This is the 3rd time zerg has been ahead of terran in the last year in korea. In fact in Feb. the W/L was almost exactly opposite. Also, overall terran is not out of line in W/L. Give it time and stop complaining. Most of you havent done anything to change your approach to the matchup besides adding QQ. | ||
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zezamer
Finland5701 Posts
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Embir
Poland567 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:26 xrapture wrote: More and more lately I've been feeling that TvT is the only decent matchup in the game. No hard counters, no build order losses, tons of viable builds, defenders advantage actually exists, no storms/fungals/banes/collosi that evaporate your entire army or end the game in miliseconds. It's just a straight up strategic battle with no bullshit-- how SC2 is meant to be. I think you might be right. P.S. One of the reasons I switched to Terran was great mirror match up.  | ||
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Gl!tch
United States573 Posts
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Crow!
United States150 Posts
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imanoobcs
184 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:37 Gl!tch wrote: Is the sample size (for example, the 1611 games in ZvT) for just the month of may or for the total games used for the entire graph, june 2011 through may 2012? If the latter, anybody know the sample size for just may? I would assume the entire year. The complete graph at the top lists a couple hundred games for each month. | ||
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boxturtle
United States224 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:32 imanoobcs wrote: This thread is a joke. And here is why: 1. The sample size is way to small to make assumptions. I see TvZ in Korea being the most complained about. It is probably based on about 20 games and a difference of 4-5 wins would show those kinds of results. 2. The new patch has not fully been seen in gameplay. Terran still rushes to hellions against a unit that was buffed to counter them. As soon as terran switches up their gameplay, the W/L will level out. Zerg had to do it many times as well,dont complain mini Jim Raynors. 3. This is the 3rd time zerg has been ahead of terran in the last year in korea. In fact in Feb. the W/L was almost exactly opposite. Also, overall terran is not out of line in W/L. Give it time and stop complaining. Most of you havent done anything to change your approach to the matchup besides adding QQ. Since that data came, Zerg has gone 9-0 against Terran in GSTL. Statistically speaking, it's going to be worse than 5rax reaper when the numbers hit full swing. | ||
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Gosi
Sweden9072 Posts
On June 08 2012 00:26 xrapture wrote: More and more lately I've been feeling that TvT is the only decent matchup in the game. No hard counters, no build order losses, tons of viable builds, defenders advantage actually exists, no storms/fungals/banes/collosi that evaporate your entire army or end the game in miliseconds. It's just a straight up strategic battle with no bullshit-- how SC2 is meant to be. Yup, and Blizzard wants to ruin that by adding some fucking Katyusha rocket launcher from Red Alert. xD | ||
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