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On May 10 2012 20:51 Zoesan wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 20:41 Demorase wrote:
It's kind of insane it actually took Blizz so long to buff the queens, zerg have been dying to hellion openings left and right for months and months now. The nerf to blue flame didn't accomplish anything except making the upgrade pretty much worthless without fixing the core problem.
You have to be even more insane to think it wasn't needed. The reason is that zergs are stupidly greedy. Terran needs early game pressure, because if they don't the zerg will just get 70 drones at 8 minutes and run over them without the terran being able to do jack shit. Sure you could open 1rax into 3 orbital, but even that doesn't compare to a pure macro zerg. Not even close. The queen buff is retarded and effectively does one thing and one thing only: mid game all-ins will be the staple of every TvZ from now on, because without the early pressure a terran cannot win against a good zerg in the long run. So have fun being 1/2 base all-inned every game, because blizzard is too retarded to understand sc2.
you seem to not have been playing on the other side of the coin. If you are not ridiculously greedy and cut corners everywhere you can and have 70 drones at 8 minutes, you usually straight up lose (in your words, without the zerg being able to do jack shit). The reason they helped with zerg early game (+ scouting) is not because terran had better scouting, but because zerg needed better scouting, since zerg is all about playing on the edge of being too greedy. Sure, zerg can make twice the army, but zerg will also lose twice the army.
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If by more balanced you mean: "Terran getting nerfed to only be able to win before a certain time x, at which point a time bomb explodes in their face and they autolose against any competent player", then yes you are right.
At the guy above me: I play terran and zerg at about the same level and watch streams/casts featuring both races.
Also, the overlord speed buff is fine. I don't think anyone is gonna complain about that, except idra because they're still too damn slow and terran is so op.
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On May 10 2012 20:49 Timmsh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 20:48 Clarity_nl wrote:On May 10 2012 20:41 The Irate Turk wrote:
Man this is so stupid.
I was watching Select's stream a couple of days ago, and he was playing his little heart out vs a Zerg. He was everywhere at once. He was doing double/ tripple drops simultaneously and causing damage with them.His overall micro was godly (tank deployment, marine spltting, general positioning) and his macro was solid.
All the zerg did was spreed creep, get banelings, infestors and brood lords. This is getting ridiculous now, when there is such a skill mismatch. It is not fair to expect someone to play like a god vs 1a.
Why does Zerg even HAVE creep spread? It is so ridiculous. Vs any good Zerg they will have the whole map covered whatever you do, UNLESS you are 5x the player they are. Yes MKP or whoever can win TvZ but people without that level of skill REALLY struggle.
It seems like Blizzard are saying Hey look, Zerg are this race which should only be played one way. Everything we do about the race design makes it so that they drone up, then mass an army at a moment's notice, as well as have this devastating tech switch. I mean queens only exist because they completely botched with introduction of the roach. So Zerg now needs something that can hit air at Tier 1.5, hey look, we have queens! (I have no problem with larva inject, but they could easily have implemented this in another way)
If Terran finds a way to interrupt Zerg from Blizzard's master plan, rather than make getting more Tier 1 units viable (either offensively or defensively), Blizzard instead nerfs early game attacks. People find new ways of delaying Zerg and Blizzard nerfs these too. You think holding off multiple drops is easier than dropping multiple places? I'm sorry, how many zergs were in the ro8 of gsl this season? and last season? Just wanted to say the same :-) I think it does not change the match ups as much as some people think. Over reaction is an appropriate response to these kinds of comments :-)
And even if it's changing the match up, it changes for the very top player, I still find funny to see player complaining about the balance of the game at each patches while their play is far from perfect.
Edit : By the way, still funny to call zerg greedy while Terran gets a third before zerg with double upgrade on the way and protoss gets nexus first in PvZ. ^^
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On May 10 2012 12:07 SolidMoose wrote:
I had to look at the last TvZ percentages. So 50.1 - 49.9 requires a patch to buff zerg, but 70% PvT winrate on cloud kingdom "makes the game more interesting."
I give up.
Cloud Kingdom is balanced on a professional level. Look up TLPD.
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On May 10 2012 21:09 Zoesan wrote:
If by more balanced you mean: "Terran getting nerfed to only be able to win before a certain time x, at which point a time bomb explodes in their face and they autolose against any competent player", then yes you are right.
At the guy above me: I play terran and zerg at about the same level and watch streams/casts featuring both races.
Oh yeah? And how's that any different than playing zerg which is essentially "survive untill a certain time x or auto lose against any competent player" huh?
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
I feel sad for the (HotS-)Reaper :/
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I got kicked off Bnet a couple mins ago, did the changes just go live?
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On May 10 2012 11:22 SoraLimit wrote:
I like the extra terran addition that the OP put up. xD
That one was awesome ^^
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fuck i like playing banshee opening in tvp. 10 seconds is alot. like 5 probekills
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Holy noodles, dat queen range buff.
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Folks at this point any changes Blizz makes is just damage control for things they have no clue how to fix without drastically changing the dynamic of each matchup.
There is absolutely no reason for the obs build time being reduced.
Ovie speed, I can see why, and I like that. They now have better chances for escape... there were times where for reasons outside of the just the actual speed of the overlord, the overlord would die regardless of what the zerg player did to try to help him escape. So I don't mind this change.
Queen range... why? Like, why?
Terran gets no changes... pretty sad.
If I were Terran, (I don't play any race specifically) I would petition to have the banshee removed. It's nothing but a cheese tactic in the early game. When do you ever see banshees as a viable option in mid-major to major battles? Never, that's when. It's a silly unit, oddly enough is most effective in TvT, and there's just no reason for it in the game.
Maybe if banshees were removed Blizz wouldn't mind giving back some of the other buffs for early game harrass. I'd rather have 2 effective options (helions, speed-reapers), than 2 effective options and 1 cheesy option that only ruins my mirror matchup in the early game.
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This patch is just a joke, toss and zerg don't need it.
Toss have no problem with obs and this buff mean that banshee style will be useless.
And again, the warprism late game issue and mass air zerg unit against terran will be not fix.
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Oh shit the qeeu range is getting a buff?? Well there goes any chance of skytoss being successful, but i guess the queen reange is probably for Banshee's i would guess
Can't complain about obs (Cause im toss :D)
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On May 10 2012 21:24 misspo wrote:
This patch is just a joke, toss and zerg don't need it.
Toss have no problem with obs and this buff mean that banshee style will be useless.
Zerg know how to dead perfectly with Air terran and toss, why do you buff this?
You should read the patch notes a little more carefully next time. Not an air attack buff -_-.
On May 10 2012 21:26 DreamChaser wrote:
Oh shit the qeeu range is getting a buff?? Well there goes any chance of skytoss being successful, but i guess the queen reange is probably for Banshee's i would guess
Can't complain about obs (Cause im toss :D)
My god... Two in a row.
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On May 10 2012 21:26 DreamChaser wrote:
Oh shit the qeeu range is getting a buff?? Well there goes any chance of skytoss being successful, but i guess the queen reange is probably for Banshee's i would guess
Can't complain about obs (Cause im toss :D)
Waah waah whine. You realize Queen range is only increased for ground units right?
I feel like people complain just for the heck of it. People should play it without theorycrafting so much. I'm not sure I like the Queen change though I understand where Blizzard is coming from, but I'll wait until I've played 20 - 30 ladder games before saying anything more.
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On May 10 2012 21:26 DreamChaser wrote:
Oh shit the qeeu range is getting a buff?? Well there goes any chance of skytoss being successful, but i guess the queen reange is probably for Banshee's i would guess
Can't complain about obs (Cause im toss :D)
Yeah that ground to ground attack range buff is gonna be pretty dope against air units I hear 
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No-one reads or understands the changes. They just like to whine.
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is "bunker not changed" a buff or a nerf? can't decide..
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EPT
