|
On March 20 2012 21:12 hashaki wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 12:48 KevinIX wrote:
It's always great to see Blizzard getting involved in eSports. I hope this means SC2 will be played alongside BW. What's so fucking great about them getting "involved"? We've seen nothing but a nazi-like DRM and a totalitarian EULA that -demands- any tournament of a certain size get involved with Blizzard, LAN's with the go-ahead still get blocked from accessing bnet 2.0 because Blizz fucks up and in general nothing happens untill Blizzard says "ok". Is that great? What would be great was if Blizzard released a great game and let the community and everyone who wanted to make out of if what they could. Only then would you see the greatness of Esports. As it is now Blizzard is the sole emperor and dictator of what goes on, and I think their businesspolicy have proved time and time again they're not out to further Esports, but their own and Activisions coffers. If history has taught as anything it's that the greatest stuff has always come from places and people without restrictions and limitations.
Lol @ the exaggerations in your post. Not the least of which is saying "LANs with the go-ahead get blocked" when are only two incidents out of thousands that I'm aware of (although feel free to cite the incidents you're aware of as I'm sure you looked into it before making that claim). I know you wanted your post to get attention and all, just realize you won't be taken seriously when you use nothing but outlandish exaggerations.
|
On March 20 2012 22:43 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 21:12 hashaki wrote:On March 20 2012 12:48 KevinIX wrote:
It's always great to see Blizzard getting involved in eSports. I hope this means SC2 will be played alongside BW. What's so fucking great about them getting "involved"? We've seen nothing but a nazi-like DRM and a totalitarian EULA that -demands- any tournament of a certain size get involved with Blizzard, LAN's with the go-ahead still get blocked from accessing bnet 2.0 because Blizz fucks up and in general nothing happens untill Blizzard says "ok". Is that great? What would be great was if Blizzard released a great game and let the community and everyone who wanted to make out of if what they could. Only then would you see the greatness of Esports. As it is now Blizzard is the sole emperor and dictator of what goes on, and I think their businesspolicy have proved time and time again they're not out to further Esports, but their own and Activisions coffers. If history has taught as anything it's that the greatest stuff has always come from places and people without restrictions and limitations. Lol @ the exaggerations in your post. Not the least of which is saying "LANs with the go-ahead get blocked" when are only two incidents out of thousands that I'm aware of (although feel free to cite the incidents you're aware of as I'm sure you looked into it before making that claim). I know you wanted your post to get attention and all, just realize you won't be taken seriously when you use nothing but outlandish exaggerations.
According to iNcontrol, you can add every MLG except the most recent few to that list:
Additionally, you can add Blizzard's own EU Invitational to that list, according to Thorzain.
IPL3 Day 1 also apparently falls into this category. In the last few cases, the events weren't cancelled, but they were delayed by 3-5 hours before the problem was resolved. It's apparently fairly common.
|
On March 20 2012 22:35 QuothTheRaven wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 21:17 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 07:17 maybenexttime wrote:On March 20 2012 04:53 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 03:44 Xenocide_Knight wrote:On March 20 2012 00:58 MadNeSs wrote:
I bet that once Gom's license runs out, then kespa will takeover sc2, and all sc2 will be shown on ogn, and all the bw teams will takeover, because they just have more money to pay the current top sc2 players with, than the current sc2 teams. And then it'll most likely be like bw was, where they dont care much about the foreigners. And then it'll just be like bw, where kespa rules anything, and foreigners wont have a chance to compete, and korean progaming will just purely be in Korea, just like it was with bw. However we might be lucky, that kespa will recognise that how much the foreign scene loves watching korean sc2, and maybe make an english stream, and maybe use tastosis (if possible) as caster, for a stream for foreigners.
You can only hope, because I truly think, that once gom's license runs out, things will change in Korea... Alot! Idk how it is in sc2, but as far as BW goes, the only thing holding back foreign BW was how hard everyone sucked in comparison And the fact that you needed a progamer license to compete, you dont need to in sc2. And they sucked in comparison because there was no foreign scene, hell even some of the biggest foreign tourneys, with some of the biggest foreigner names didnt even have any prize money, there just wasnt any foreign scene at all, unlike in sc2, where there's so many tourneys, outside of Korea. Now a days most bw foreigners, who are sc2 progamers, has made more in sc2 than they ever did in bw. The koreans where just so far ahead, they had a huge progaming scene, they had teams with huge sponsors, houses with training facilities, everybody got a salary (yeah some didnt get much, something like 5k and some probably less per year), but they also got food and a place to stay. So to be fair foreigners didnt just suck, but it's pretty hard in any sport for amatours to compete against fulltime professionals. In SC2 there is a foreigner scene, and a pretty big one. However the foreigners are still pretty far behind, except for Stephano, who is just so damn good, even though we have that I still think that things will change alot in Korea, once kespa takes over... I mean why else do they wanna switch to sc2 now that gom's license is soon to expire? Why not earlier? WC3 had a foreign scene comparable the current foreign Sc2 scene (with the size of esports then and now taken into account). Foreigners were invited to numerous tournaments over the years. They still failed for the most part. Hell, did you see the Moon vs. ToD game where Moon used Dark Ranger, stole ToD's Peasant and beat him with Human army? Ogn is on tv, and everything goes through kespa (except for sc2), and they want sc2 to be shown on tv (ogn), so that it can be broadcasted to everybody, but it'll only be to the korean nation. You can say that they might change it to allow foreigners in, yeah maybe they do, but what if they get all the exclusive rights for sc2 in Korea, what will happen to gomtv? Will they coexist with sc2 proleague? Who know, but we can only help. I just have a feeling that once this happens, things are gonna change, and hopefully gsl will stay (it probably will, since it's so big), but things will be different, I am sure. KeSPA already livestreams BW and SF2 proleagues on www.youtube.com/esportstv. They also upload VODs of all proleague matches within a few hours of the match. I see no reason why they wouldn't continue to do this for SC2.
It's still only in korean.
|
On March 20 2012 21:21 ShadeR wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 20:59 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:On March 20 2012 16:24 ShadeR wrote:On March 20 2012 16:13 Shrewmy wrote:On March 20 2012 15:07 Spiner wrote:On March 17 2012 19:11 Onlinejaguar wrote:
I just hope they realize the foreign popularity for SC2 and have english commentators for broadcasts.
On another note if the big guns such as Flash and Jaedong, etc switch to SC2 it will have a massive impact on SC2 becoming more popular in korea i think. That and I have a feeling Hots will be similar to what brood war did to vanilla sc1. A combination of sc1 pros switching over and HoTs re-vitalizing sc2 could make sc2 huge in Korea and everywhere else. I think it comes down to what units they choose to keep in it, I'm a little worried about the Shredder and Protoss' new units. The shredder seems to have a lot of potential for abuse, whereas the new units for Protoss just feel very gimmicky. I hope I'm proven wrong, I don't want Zerg to get all the cool units, even though I play Zerg. This is a bit off topic but one of the main criticisms of SC2's is the ai pathing. That certainly isn't going to change in any patch of expansion. The problem with discussions about AI-pathing is often the solution aims to immitate BW, but doesn't consider BW is actually a 2D sprite type set-up with only 8(?) ways to move versus and Full 3D set-up with a more dynamic range of movement. Its subtle, but its a key aspect that a lot of critics I feel over look when proposing solutions to issues with pathing. I don't know what our trying to get at. Critics have identified a flaw. Unit pathing. The rest is up to Blizzard. Whether they can or can't do it is irrelevant as Browder's position is that they WILL NOT change the AI. Assuming Browder hasn't said anything to the contrary since Kennegit interview.
the unit pathing is quiet fun, you have a hard time fighting against the unit pathing, but you can also use it to your advantage. Same as you did in bw, but flipping it around in sc2, made the game pathing wise harder then bw imo. Atleast i am screaming less at my units in bw. And if i have them run around uncontrolled they don't die to one aoe even if those aoes are 5 times stronger.
While criticizing is something okay to do, for example the targeting ai makes non instant hit ranged units pretty bad in some situations. I think they made a really good job with the pathing in terms of difficulty.
Compared to bw where its just hard to master, in sc2 its easy to learn harder to master.
|
On March 20 2012 23:14 MadNeSs wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 22:35 QuothTheRaven wrote:On March 20 2012 21:17 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 07:17 maybenexttime wrote:On March 20 2012 04:53 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 03:44 Xenocide_Knight wrote:On March 20 2012 00:58 MadNeSs wrote:
I bet that once Gom's license runs out, then kespa will takeover sc2, and all sc2 will be shown on ogn, and all the bw teams will takeover, because they just have more money to pay the current top sc2 players with, than the current sc2 teams. And then it'll most likely be like bw was, where they dont care much about the foreigners. And then it'll just be like bw, where kespa rules anything, and foreigners wont have a chance to compete, and korean progaming will just purely be in Korea, just like it was with bw. However we might be lucky, that kespa will recognise that how much the foreign scene loves watching korean sc2, and maybe make an english stream, and maybe use tastosis (if possible) as caster, for a stream for foreigners.
You can only hope, because I truly think, that once gom's license runs out, things will change in Korea... Alot! Idk how it is in sc2, but as far as BW goes, the only thing holding back foreign BW was how hard everyone sucked in comparison And the fact that you needed a progamer license to compete, you dont need to in sc2. And they sucked in comparison because there was no foreign scene, hell even some of the biggest foreign tourneys, with some of the biggest foreigner names didnt even have any prize money, there just wasnt any foreign scene at all, unlike in sc2, where there's so many tourneys, outside of Korea. Now a days most bw foreigners, who are sc2 progamers, has made more in sc2 than they ever did in bw. The koreans where just so far ahead, they had a huge progaming scene, they had teams with huge sponsors, houses with training facilities, everybody got a salary (yeah some didnt get much, something like 5k and some probably less per year), but they also got food and a place to stay. So to be fair foreigners didnt just suck, but it's pretty hard in any sport for amatours to compete against fulltime professionals. In SC2 there is a foreigner scene, and a pretty big one. However the foreigners are still pretty far behind, except for Stephano, who is just so damn good, even though we have that I still think that things will change alot in Korea, once kespa takes over... I mean why else do they wanna switch to sc2 now that gom's license is soon to expire? Why not earlier? WC3 had a foreign scene comparable the current foreign Sc2 scene (with the size of esports then and now taken into account). Foreigners were invited to numerous tournaments over the years. They still failed for the most part. Hell, did you see the Moon vs. ToD game where Moon used Dark Ranger, stole ToD's Peasant and beat him with Human army? Ogn is on tv, and everything goes through kespa (except for sc2), and they want sc2 to be shown on tv (ogn), so that it can be broadcasted to everybody, but it'll only be to the korean nation. You can say that they might change it to allow foreigners in, yeah maybe they do, but what if they get all the exclusive rights for sc2 in Korea, what will happen to gomtv? Will they coexist with sc2 proleague? Who know, but we can only help. I just have a feeling that once this happens, things are gonna change, and hopefully gsl will stay (it probably will, since it's so big), but things will be different, I am sure. KeSPA already livestreams BW and SF2 proleagues on www.youtube.com/esportstv. They also upload VODs of all proleague matches within a few hours of the match. I see no reason why they wouldn't continue to do this for SC2. It's still only in korean.
...which is not watched by any foreigners. Sc2, on the other hand, is, and they will most definitely want to use that to make revenue.
|
SCBW: Nostalgia League
If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes.
|
On March 20 2012 23:14 MadNeSs wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 22:35 QuothTheRaven wrote:On March 20 2012 21:17 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 07:17 maybenexttime wrote:On March 20 2012 04:53 MadNeSs wrote:On March 20 2012 03:44 Xenocide_Knight wrote:On March 20 2012 00:58 MadNeSs wrote:
I bet that once Gom's license runs out, then kespa will takeover sc2, and all sc2 will be shown on ogn, and all the bw teams will takeover, because they just have more money to pay the current top sc2 players with, than the current sc2 teams. And then it'll most likely be like bw was, where they dont care much about the foreigners. And then it'll just be like bw, where kespa rules anything, and foreigners wont have a chance to compete, and korean progaming will just purely be in Korea, just like it was with bw. However we might be lucky, that kespa will recognise that how much the foreign scene loves watching korean sc2, and maybe make an english stream, and maybe use tastosis (if possible) as caster, for a stream for foreigners.
You can only hope, because I truly think, that once gom's license runs out, things will change in Korea... Alot! Idk how it is in sc2, but as far as BW goes, the only thing holding back foreign BW was how hard everyone sucked in comparison And the fact that you needed a progamer license to compete, you dont need to in sc2. And they sucked in comparison because there was no foreign scene, hell even some of the biggest foreign tourneys, with some of the biggest foreigner names didnt even have any prize money, there just wasnt any foreign scene at all, unlike in sc2, where there's so many tourneys, outside of Korea. Now a days most bw foreigners, who are sc2 progamers, has made more in sc2 than they ever did in bw. The koreans where just so far ahead, they had a huge progaming scene, they had teams with huge sponsors, houses with training facilities, everybody got a salary (yeah some didnt get much, something like 5k and some probably less per year), but they also got food and a place to stay. So to be fair foreigners didnt just suck, but it's pretty hard in any sport for amatours to compete against fulltime professionals. In SC2 there is a foreigner scene, and a pretty big one. However the foreigners are still pretty far behind, except for Stephano, who is just so damn good, even though we have that I still think that things will change alot in Korea, once kespa takes over... I mean why else do they wanna switch to sc2 now that gom's license is soon to expire? Why not earlier? WC3 had a foreign scene comparable the current foreign Sc2 scene (with the size of esports then and now taken into account). Foreigners were invited to numerous tournaments over the years. They still failed for the most part. Hell, did you see the Moon vs. ToD game where Moon used Dark Ranger, stole ToD's Peasant and beat him with Human army? Ogn is on tv, and everything goes through kespa (except for sc2), and they want sc2 to be shown on tv (ogn), so that it can be broadcasted to everybody, but it'll only be to the korean nation. You can say that they might change it to allow foreigners in, yeah maybe they do, but what if they get all the exclusive rights for sc2 in Korea, what will happen to gomtv? Will they coexist with sc2 proleague? Who know, but we can only help. I just have a feeling that once this happens, things are gonna change, and hopefully gsl will stay (it probably will, since it's so big), but things will be different, I am sure. KeSPA already livestreams BW and SF2 proleagues on www.youtube.com/esportstv. They also upload VODs of all proleague matches within a few hours of the match. I see no reason why they wouldn't continue to do this for SC2. It's still only in korean.
They will be broadcasting their new LoL tournament on English, including streaming on twitch and own3d.
|
On March 20 2012 20:59 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 16:24 ShadeR wrote:On March 20 2012 16:13 Shrewmy wrote:On March 20 2012 15:07 Spiner wrote:On March 17 2012 19:11 Onlinejaguar wrote:
I just hope they realize the foreign popularity for SC2 and have english commentators for broadcasts.
On another note if the big guns such as Flash and Jaedong, etc switch to SC2 it will have a massive impact on SC2 becoming more popular in korea i think. That and I have a feeling Hots will be similar to what brood war did to vanilla sc1. A combination of sc1 pros switching over and HoTs re-vitalizing sc2 could make sc2 huge in Korea and everywhere else. I think it comes down to what units they choose to keep in it, I'm a little worried about the Shredder and Protoss' new units. The shredder seems to have a lot of potential for abuse, whereas the new units for Protoss just feel very gimmicky. I hope I'm proven wrong, I don't want Zerg to get all the cool units, even though I play Zerg. This is a bit off topic but one of the main criticisms of SC2's is the ai pathing. That certainly isn't going to change in any patch of expansion. The problem with discussions about AI-pathing is often the solution aims to immitate BW, but doesn't consider BW is actually a 2D sprite type set-up with only 8(?) ways to move versus and Full 3D set-up with a more dynamic range of movement. Its subtle, but its a key aspect that a lot of critics I feel over look when proposing solutions to issues with pathing.
Why not just change the default spacing to a rectangle rather than a circle? You know, the invisible shape that a unit draws around itself to spread it from other units. It it were a square or quadrilateral, we might not have this problem.
|
Vancouver14381 Posts
Here's some possible good news for foreign fans of OGN shows.
OGN will be using twitch and own3d to broadcast their LoL league in English. They still have their own platform for the Korean cast but this is a good first step for easily accessible OGN media.
|
As much as I wish BW could go on forever, I'd rather see this happen asap, if bw is the sacrifice we have to make to make sure LoL doesn't take over I'm willing to make it. The prime esport in korea shouldn't go from the most skilled game of all time to the shittiest casual magnet of all time, atleast sc2 is still one of the hardest games of all time.
As much as I'd rather not see kespa get involved in the sc2 scene and what not, sc2 needs a pro league and a OSL, and even more important korean sc2 needs flash, jaedong, bisu etc. pp.
|
Yeah, look around BW forums and see how much that argument (sacrifice BW to prevent LoL domination!) is prevalent.
But once again I'll exit before too late.
|
In order to compete with LoL we need to mainstream sc2 and people on TL are mad about that?
|
On March 21 2012 02:58 Marddox wrote:
In order to compete with LoL we need to mainstream sc2 and people on TL are mad about that?
Depends what you mean by "mainstream".
|
On March 21 2012 03:01 SeaSwift wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 02:58 Marddox wrote:
In order to compete with LoL we need to mainstream sc2 and people on TL are mad about that? Depends what you mean by "mainstream".
Broadcasting on Korean TV.
|
On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes.
I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches"
|
On March 21 2012 05:36 Josh_rakoons wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes. I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches"
BW is already free. ._.
|
On March 21 2012 05:40 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 05:36 Josh_rakoons wrote:On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes. I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches" BW is already free. ._.
It is if you pirate it... You can buy it from them for like 5 or 10 dollars or something but it's not free
|
On March 21 2012 05:41 Chocolate wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 05:40 StarStruck wrote:On March 21 2012 05:36 Josh_rakoons wrote:On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes. I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches" BW is already free. ._. It is if you pirate it... You can buy it from them for like 5 or 10 dollars or something but it's not free
Private servers anyone? You can get the client easily and yes a cd would cost 5 bucks now, but technically it is free if you want to play on certain servers. No one plays on B.Net anymore.
-.-
|
On March 21 2012 05:41 Chocolate wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 05:40 StarStruck wrote:On March 21 2012 05:36 Josh_rakoons wrote:On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes. I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches" BW is already free. ._. It is if you pirate it... You can buy it from them for like 5 or 10 dollars or something but it's not free
If you play on ICCUP you can(Just only multiplayer and their servers)
|
On March 21 2012 05:45 ragnorr wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 05:41 Chocolate wrote:On March 21 2012 05:40 StarStruck wrote:On March 21 2012 05:36 Josh_rakoons wrote:On March 21 2012 00:09 saritenite wrote:SCBW: Nostalgia League If Blizzard would make BW a free download/disk with every purchase of SC2 HOTS, I see hope for both scenes. I think you're forgetting that this is blizzard we're talking about, they have never sold anything for free except from "hotfixes and patches" BW is already free. ._. It is if you pirate it... You can buy it from them for like 5 or 10 dollars or something but it's not free If you play on ICCUP you can(Just only multiplayer and their servers)
Which is why SC2 doesn't have LAN, incidentally.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
