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On December 16 2011 08:31 kslghost wrote:
Why does anyone speculate fault anymore?
Naniwa already admitted fault and has decided not to compete in the first season of 2012 GSL, even though he is allowed to go for Code A and he's staying in Korea.
The END?
This thread is not about NaNi, this thread is about Code S providence spot which we thought existed for a month and apparently it didn't.
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On December 16 2011 08:25 Integra wrote:
Why are you people still posting about this, it makes no sense. Can't someone create a "ultimate nani vs Gom" thread and post everything in there instead of creating 100 separate threads that seems to be discussing the same thing.
I don't think you really know what this thread is about if you're saying this. This thread is not about Naniwa vs. GOM. It is about GOM changing its agreement with MLG without informing MLG of its decision -- which made it so that all the players involved and all the fans who watched the games thought that Top 3 non-Code S player at Providence would get a Code S seed. Basically, GOM's miscommunication and poor handling of the situation caused MLG to display false advertising. This is hardly about Naniwa.
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On December 16 2011 08:29 Biane wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:28 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:26 dacimvrl wrote:
Cold hard facts:
1. Naniwa *disrespected* the crowd for a hyped match
2. GOMTV CHANGED the prize without informing the involved parties - winner: Naniwa, partner: MLG (+ fans)
so, I guess GOMTV didn't do anything wrong, but Naniwa and MLG deserved it?????
LuLz @ D4B0 S74ND4RD5 woohoo let's blame GOMTV to oblivion for changing their prize. Because 8000+ comments of it wasn't enough. oh the drama queens I'm getting the feeling that your post disregards the time of events, which in this context is almost everything.
yeah i guess i did because what did those event turned out to be? bunch of drama not worth even mentioning anymore?
but I guess some of you havent had it enough.
well, go on ahead, I'm getting outta here.
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So GOM was within their rights to mislead all of the players practicing hard for MLG Providence so that they can earn a Code S spot, only to be given a spot in a different tournament. Up until the Naniwa incident everyone thought that the Blizzard Cup invite was in addition to the Code S invite, not a replacement, but now GOM makes these ambiguous rules where they can invite whoever pleases them to join Code S without a structured format where the players know what they need to accomplish to achieve the spot. Now, it's basically a popularity contest to get into Code S instead of it being based on defined results, and the worst part is that they made this change after players achieved the defined result that GOM previously stated would get them into Code S. Really shady IMO.
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Vatican City State582 Posts
On December 16 2011 08:34 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:31 kslghost wrote:
Why does anyone speculate fault anymore?
Naniwa already admitted fault and has decided not to compete in the first season of 2012 GSL, even though he is allowed to go for Code A and he's staying in Korea.
The END? Naniwas fault doesn't erase GOMTV's fault.
apparently, there are actually ppl who think GOMTV should be able to change whatever, whenever, as they please.
I am pretty glad I breathed democracy and freedom as I grew up, I feel sorry for those who didn't
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Gom should apologize to MLG and us fans for the miscommunication regarding the Providence seed, Naniwa has (as he should have) apologized to Gom and his fans and everyone else for not giving a good match. Naniwa, has, after being taken out of consideration for the Code S seed, decided to stay out for the whole season. After Gom apologizes I think everything should finally die down as there won't be anymore to fuss about.
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Let's try a thought experiment and pretend that Naniwa was really never awarded the code-s spot. We'll chalk up MLG's official statement that:
"...including Providence, who did not already have Code S status would be granted Code S status at GSL for one season."
...Up to contractual confusion...
Then why did GOM in their official statement use the term revoke?
"We will however revoke his candidacy for a Code S seed, which means that he will have to requalify for the GSL."
How can you take away that which was never was? Why you would make an announcement to say Naniwa (who 'never had code-s') doesn't have code-s status? Wouldn't that be redundant? Also why were these new code-s rules not announced publicly earlier? More people might have been willing to watch the Blizzard cup if they knew code-s was on the line. Isn't it just an amazing coincidence that we all learn about these new rules (that always 'have been') and Naniwa's revoked 'candidacy' a day after GOM was so upset with Naniwa's probe rush? Using GOM's rational they could have awarded White-Ra a code-s spot...who would disagree given their inconsistent rational?
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On December 16 2011 08:34 Govou wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:30 dacimvrl wrote:On December 16 2011 08:28 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:26 dacimvrl wrote:
Cold hard facts:
1. Naniwa *disrespected* the crowd for a hyped match
2. GOMTV CHANGED the prize without informing the involved parties - winner: Naniwa, partner: MLG (+ fans)
so, I guess GOMTV didn't do anything wrong, but Naniwa and MLG deserved it?????
LuLz @ D4B0 S74ND4RD5 woohoo let's blame GOMTV to oblivion for changing their prize. Because 8000+ comments of it wasn't enough. oh the drama queens woohoo let's defend GOMTV cuz Naniwa was the bad guy, bad bad bad!! oh the righteous knights in shining armor!! well thank you for proving my points. You can keep going.
I am sorry, but straight facts are:
What Naniwa did was wrong. He admitted it. That's fine. Then GOM called him unprofessional, and not respecting towards fans and his opponent (in this case Nestea). Because of this, they scratched him out of their Code S seed consideration = punishment.
Now, GOM changed the Code S prize without telling anyone (thus unprofessional cause they didnt tell MLG, disrespectful towards fans cause they didnt tell them also and everybody thought there will be a Code S seed as a prize and also disrespectful to players and teams because of exact same reasons). And it's suddenly fine? It's the exact same issue, just on larger scale... Why it's not fine with Naniwa and it's fine with GOM?
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why dont we bring this topic to CHUCK NORRIS. He will decide NaNiwa and GOM's fate.
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I really can't believe that we managed to create yet another shitstorm-thread...
1. Naniwa isn't the devil, but he ain't an angel. What GOMTV didn't want to do is condone the kind of attitude he had, by giving him a spot in Code S, arguably the most prestigious tournament around.
2. Its not a "bait and switch" because who the fuck thinks that naniwa would not have worked his ass off is it turned out it was a spot in the Blizzard cup. Ridiculous. In and of itself 2nd place was bait enough, Code S is maybe just a fleck of icing.
3. Im fucking happy that GOM already had the exchange program and that if they are going to make a change, I'm not going to cry. The easiest way for GOM to solve this whole problem would be to not give any more foreigner Code S spots right? Thats no fun- I'll take what i can get.
4. Yes I love IdrA and Sen more than Naniwa, but I'm not as many are calling it, on Koreans' dicks.
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On December 16 2011 07:58 Govou wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 07:55 Tyrant0 wrote:On December 16 2011 07:51 darkscream wrote:
Man, people stick up for naniwa so much. He even admits he was in the wrong and will change his behavior accordingly, so why are people still talking shit about GomTV (Who by the way, are pretty much responsible for SC2 esport success, lending their brand and talent (tastosis) to other tournaments, etc). No one is saying he was right. What he did was wrong. What GOM did/is doing is much, much worse, and a vast overreaction to what was a trivial offense in the first place. And hop off the dicks of the Koreans; this isn't BW. a lot of posters said Naniwa did nothing wrong first. then they claimed GOM was changing the rule after the incident to punish Naniwa. then when those two are proven wrong, they are claiming GOM is at fault for the miscommunication and should be sued. IMO, it's clear who is the crybaby here.
First a lot of posters pointed out from the beginning, according to the rules Naniwa did nothing wrong. (Even GOM admitts this now, just look at their last announcement)
Then additional everyone is upset of GOM for trying to make up a rule for this.( Look at the translated quote from MR.Chae, the corrected one)
And additional to that we are pretty much pissed about the fact, that they didn't tell anybody untill the announcement after the incident, that in fact they don't give not a Code-S seed for the MLG Providence.( Last News from MLG/Forum Topic, the announcements regarding Blizzard-Cup, Announcements regarding the new format, Liquipedia after MLG Providence, MLG News after MLG Providence etc.)
IMO, it's clear who is arguing without knowing facts. In general I find it very embarassing how many of the people who are protecting the actions of GOM are calling the other side childish, crybabys etc. while they are only arguing with opinions or unproven facts. While I see no one of the other side doing it in such a fashion.
Just stay to the facts, if you don't know them watch LO3, SOTG or do some research on the internet yourself. If you can not prove that the other side is wrong your post is pretty much pointless.
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On December 16 2011 08:41 Ammanas wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:34 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:30 dacimvrl wrote:On December 16 2011 08:28 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:26 dacimvrl wrote:
Cold hard facts:
1. Naniwa *disrespected* the crowd for a hyped match
2. GOMTV CHANGED the prize without informing the involved parties - winner: Naniwa, partner: MLG (+ fans)
so, I guess GOMTV didn't do anything wrong, but Naniwa and MLG deserved it?????
LuLz @ D4B0 S74ND4RD5 woohoo let's blame GOMTV to oblivion for changing their prize. Because 8000+ comments of it wasn't enough. oh the drama queens woohoo let's defend GOMTV cuz Naniwa was the bad guy, bad bad bad!! oh the righteous knights in shining armor!! well thank you for proving my points. You can keep going. I am sorry, but straight facts are: What Naniwa did was wrong. He admitted it. That's fine. Then GOM called him unprofessional, and not respecting towards fans and his opponent (in this case Nestea). Because of this, they scratched him out of their Code S seed consideration = punishment. Now, GOM changed the Code S prize without telling anyone (thus unprofessional cause they didnt tell MLG, disrespectful towards fans cause they didnt tell them also and everybody thought there will be a Code S seed as a prize and also disrespectful to players and teams because of exact same reasons). And it's suddenly fine? It's the exact same issue, just on larger scale... Why it's not fine with Naniwa and it's fine with GOM?
GOM changing the prize pool is actually fine mostly because it didn't harm anyone. The MLG winner was going to get in anyhow, and it was all going to be no big deal.
But then the Nestea game happened, and GOM's opinion on that game was a lot different that some fans' opinion.
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GOM ripping on professionalism while having questionable professionalism of their own.
The plot thickens!
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reading about this makes me question the code S seeds. i mean they are saying that mlg does not affect code s anymore. so does that mean that if idra stays in korea, as long as he's one of the only two top foreigners there, he will always get one of the two code s seeds? also, what does this mean for mlg. they are sending koreans over, but what are they getting out of this?
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Vatican City State582 Posts
On December 16 2011 08:41 Ammanas wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:34 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:30 dacimvrl wrote:On December 16 2011 08:28 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:26 dacimvrl wrote:
Cold hard facts:
1. Naniwa *disrespected* the crowd for a hyped match
2. GOMTV CHANGED the prize without informing the involved parties - winner: Naniwa, partner: MLG (+ fans)
so, I guess GOMTV didn't do anything wrong, but Naniwa and MLG deserved it?????
LuLz @ D4B0 S74ND4RD5 woohoo let's blame GOMTV to oblivion for changing their prize. Because 8000+ comments of it wasn't enough. oh the drama queens woohoo let's defend GOMTV cuz Naniwa was the bad guy, bad bad bad!! oh the righteous knights in shining armor!! well thank you for proving my points. You can keep going. I am sorry, but straight facts are: What Naniwa did was wrong. He admitted it. That's fine. Then GOM called him unprofessional, and not respecting towards fans and his opponent (in this case Nestea). Because of this, they scratched him out of their Code S seed consideration = punishment. Now, GOM changed the Code S prize without telling anyone (thus unprofessional cause they didnt tell MLG, disrespectful towards fans cause they didnt tell them also and everybody thought there will be a Code S seed as a prize and also disrespectful to players and teams because of exact same reasons). And it's suddenly fine? It's the exact same issue, just on larger scale... Why it's not fine with Naniwa and it's fine with GOM?
Dude, it's cool.
Have you tried teaching a donkey to reason?
Apparently, I thought I could, I tried, and I failed.
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On December 16 2011 08:44 FlyingLigerz wrote:
reading about this makes me question the code S seeds. i mean they are saying that mlg does not affect code s anymore. so does that mean that if idra stays in korea, as long as he's one of the only two top foreigners there, he will always get one of the two code s seeds? also, what does this mean for mlg. they are sending koreans over, but what are they getting out of this?
They aren't saying MLG doesn't affect Code S anymore. They are saying that two top foreigners will get in, and MLG will be considered along with other tournaments (and possibly other factors).
We'll have to wait and see who they pick to determine whether their selection methods are fair.
Thus far, there is a lot of outrage about their selections 
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On December 16 2011 08:45 dacimvrl wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2011 08:41 Ammanas wrote:On December 16 2011 08:34 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:30 dacimvrl wrote:On December 16 2011 08:28 Govou wrote:On December 16 2011 08:26 dacimvrl wrote:
Cold hard facts:
1. Naniwa *disrespected* the crowd for a hyped match
2. GOMTV CHANGED the prize without informing the involved parties - winner: Naniwa, partner: MLG (+ fans)
so, I guess GOMTV didn't do anything wrong, but Naniwa and MLG deserved it?????
LuLz @ D4B0 S74ND4RD5 woohoo let's blame GOMTV to oblivion for changing their prize. Because 8000+ comments of it wasn't enough. oh the drama queens woohoo let's defend GOMTV cuz Naniwa was the bad guy, bad bad bad!! oh the righteous knights in shining armor!! well thank you for proving my points. You can keep going. I am sorry, but straight facts are: What Naniwa did was wrong. He admitted it. That's fine. Then GOM called him unprofessional, and not respecting towards fans and his opponent (in this case Nestea). Because of this, they scratched him out of their Code S seed consideration = punishment. Now, GOM changed the Code S prize without telling anyone (thus unprofessional cause they didnt tell MLG, disrespectful towards fans cause they didnt tell them also and everybody thought there will be a Code S seed as a prize and also disrespectful to players and teams because of exact same reasons). And it's suddenly fine? It's the exact same issue, just on larger scale... Why it's not fine with Naniwa and it's fine with GOM? Dude, it's cool. Have you tried teaching a donkey to reason? Apparently, I thought I could, I tried and failed.
Wow, keep it civil man. No reason for personal attacks just because you disagree.
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So have any of the delusional gom fanboys changed their minds yet?
MLG paid for 4 Koreans to come and compete, and GSL stabs them in the back. This is completely unacceptable. "Mr Chae" said on camera that the Providence seed was given to Naniwai. They are nothing but of a bunch of sleezy liars.
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On December 16 2011 08:46 Starcraftmazter wrote:
So have any of the delusional gom fanboys changed their minds yet?
MLG paid for 4 Koreans to come and compete, and GSL stabs them in the back. This is completely unacceptable. "Mr Chae" said on camera that the Providence seed was given to Naniwai. They are nothing but of a bunch of sleezy liars.
I'm pretty sure that MLG didn't actually pay for 4 koreans to come to providence, and we know for a fact that no koreans were seeded in providence except for the ones who were seeded because of the points they had previously earned. As faras I know, mr chae never said on that naniwa was guaranteed a code S spot.
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Sounds like Gom negotiates like Darth Vader. "the terms of our agreement have changed. Prey that I do not alter them any further."
Guess they made MLG an offer that they couldn't refuse.
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EPT
