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EDIT: I only snipe streamers once, if I get matched up with streamers multiple times in a row(while laddering) it is not my fault, but the system's
Dear TeamLiquid,
most of you guys will not know so let me introduce myself: I am Kevin "Harstem" de Koning a young dutch protoss player who likes to stream snipe famous players every now and then.
When the game was released a lot of players started a stream. To get more exposure, get money from commercials, to have fun with the viewers, interact with the community etc. One downside of streaming is the fact that the opponent can easily open your stream and see what you are doing. This is really annoying for the streamers and even though it sometimes is fun to watch it also annoys the viewers. The only way to stop this is by either delaying the stream a few minutes or by turning off the stream.
The reason I made this thread is to show people the difference between stream sniping and stream cheating. As I stated above stream-cheating is really annoying and people who win games by stream-cheating should not deserve any credit whatsoever(in my opinion). Stream sniping on the other hand is something completely different. When a person stream snipes, he tries to match a professional/well known player by watching their stream and try to search at the same time. If the MMR of the player sniping and the proffesional/well known player is the same or close to the same there is a high probability to find the streamer!
Instead of playing versus average joe you are playing versus Incontrol, Idra, Kas, HuK etc. Unfortunately not all streamers can appreciate it and sometimes they even falsely accuse you of stream-cheating. This is the opposite of what you want, because when I stream snipe I do this to get free good publicity while playing versus extremely good players. The feeling of winning while your opponent is having 5000+ viewers is really hard to describe, but it feels damn good.
What I am trying to say is: If someone is stream sniping this doesn't necessarily mean they are stream cheating. Lately I am getting more and more streamers who are saying "don't mind this guy, he is a cheater" without even knowing me. This isn't only putting me in a bad daylight, but it also affects my play. When my opponent tells me "u streamcheat" I scout less, because I know that if I find his proxy pylon or his hidden gate he will be like "See this guy is a cheater, fucking scrub".
I hope people learn to appreciate me and my fellow stream snipers more and stop falsely accusing me and others of cheating when we are not.
Have a nice day,
Kevin "Harstem" de Koning
Don't be to harsh on my english please <3 tyty
I could not word my feelings any better than Uncultured did in his post
On November 16 2011 07:54 Uncultured wrote:
Calling someone a cheater when you have no evidence they cheated, and basing that judgement solely on past experience of a few bad people doing so... Is incredibly ignorant. People like Incontrol need to have the professionalism to realize that what they say can carry a lot of weight, and possibly end someones career for no reason at all.
Calling every stream-sniper a stream-cheater is ridiculously silly.
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I feel your post is directed to people that have some knowledge about stream sniping / stream cheating. Can you say in a few words what is description of each? Thanks
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
Hey Harstem, ty for the write-up.
i've never thought of it in that way, and I'm glad you wrote this. However, while I don't doubt your intentions, I think the main problem is that a lot of stream snipers don't see it that way, and prefer to just harass the pro players, or outright cheat. While I understand how you are not one of them, I hope you can see why people think you are
Hopefully after this case though, it won't be the same. Good luck in your games!
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On November 16 2011 06:45 r3z3nd3 wrote:
I feel your post is directed to people that have some knowledge about stream sniping / stream cheating. Can you say in a few words what is description of each? Thanks
Seems pretty clear:
Sniping = watching stream of high level player to try and join game at the same time, resulting in playing said high level player (typically someone famous, ex. Huk, Idra, etc.) Once game starts, presumably a stream sniper will close the stream and play as normal.
Cheating = watching the stream of the person you are in-game playing against to gain an advantage and beat them.
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On November 16 2011 06:45 Hassybaby wrote:
Hey Harstem, ty for the write-up.
i've never thought of it in that way, and I'm glad you wrote this. However, while I don't doubt your intentions, I think the main problem is that a lot of stream snipers don't see it that way, and prefer to just harass the pro players, or outright cheat. While I understand how you are not one of them, I hope you can see why people think you are
Hopefully after this case though, it won't be the same. Good luck in your games!
I think most stream snipers want to get exposure and attention.
I for example dont have a good enough computer to stream, i can barely run sc2 on low graphics. This way people still can see me play and I think everybody likes to be in the spotlight and so do I!
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The way I see it is people are going to think you are cheating regardless of what your write on the forums or whether you win or lose. I understand you get a rush from playing a well known player on a stream with alot of people watching, but I still say just don't do it. Find another way to get that rush. Join some tournaments and try and win against the well known pros there. That is better publicity anyways.
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I just watched the game which led to this post. I will say that the pro you faced did admit after the game that he didn't know if you are a stream cheater, and just accused you of it. Maybe trolling? Who knows. Either way, in the same way that pros accept that streaming inevitably leads to stream cheating, when you stream snipe, don't be surprised when you are accused of cheating. I can imagine that anyone facing you repeatedly would assume the worst.
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On November 16 2011 06:45 r3z3nd3 wrote:
I feel your post is directed to people that have some knowledge about stream sniping / stream cheating. Can you say in a few words what is description of each? Thanks
Stream-sniping: Searching for a match at the same time as your 'target' trying to get matched up against him. (I actually tried to get matched against Tyler when he was owning EU Diamond league, but it didn't work ^^)
Stream-cheating: Watching/listening your 'target's stream while playing against him to get information.
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On November 16 2011 06:49 Schwang wrote:
The way I see it is people are going to think you are cheating regardless of what your write on the forums or whether you win or lose. I understand you get a rush from playing a well known player on a stream with alot of people watching, but I still say just don't do it. Find another way to get that rush. Join some tournaments and try and win against the well known pros there. That is better publicity anyways.
Hey Schwang,
I obviously also try to play in as many tournament as people, but because I am not a fulltime gamer I also have other things I do: Go to school, play soccer, fitness and mixed martial arts. Those tournaments normally take 5/6 hours, so I simply dont have the time to play a lot of tournaments. When I stream snipe I practice vs good opponents and get some exposure.
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I don't think there is anyone complaining about stream sniping someone once a day. Doing it several times over and over is not fun for the player streaming. Don't EVER do that.
I can understand where you're coming from but you gotta understand there are far more people sniping and cheesing famous players then just sniping and playing straight up without watching the stream. It's easy to generalise, harder to separate the good from the giant mass of bad 
Yes I have sniped beastyqt in the past, but I stopped that maybe 1 month ago. However I still ladder and sometimes get matched against him. That is something he has to deal with, because there is no way in avoiding that!
Yea.. it's very hard to clear a reputation, gl with that.
Stream cheating is obviously unacceptable.
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On November 16 2011 06:48 Harstem wrote:Show nested quote +On November 16 2011 06:45 Hassybaby wrote:
Hey Harstem, ty for the write-up.
i've never thought of it in that way, and I'm glad you wrote this. However, while I don't doubt your intentions, I think the main problem is that a lot of stream snipers don't see it that way, and prefer to just harass the pro players, or outright cheat. While I understand how you are not one of them, I hope you can see why people think you are
Hopefully after this case though, it won't be the same. Good luck in your games! I think most stream snipers want to get exposure and attention. I for example dont have a good enough computer to stream, i can barely run sc2 on low graphics. This way people still can see me play and I think everybody likes to be in the spotlight and so do I!
If you deserve recognition, you'll be noticed. By entering tournaments and placing well, you'll get the recognition you deserve. Its shady for people to try to use someone else's prestige to leech off of.
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I was watching Beastyqt's stream and I saw he was annoyed with you stream sniping him, he implied that you've done it multiple times as well. Maybe you should not stream snipe people who you know don't like it. Otherwise I don't really see any problem with it.
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the problem is your still gaming the system...while you're not directly cheating against a particular player you are swaying the matchmaking system to give yourself a better chance of playing the player that you want to play....Honestly I could care less but some people I'm sure care
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I'm pretty sure this is common knowledge in the community.
You can also look pretty stupid to the community. I was playing IdrA one match and went for a stim timing attack off 2 base composed of MM to hit before he got bane speed or mutas (successful), only to realize that I forgot to tech stim itself, completely.
I looked like a fucking moron.
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On November 16 2011 06:52 Willba wrote:
I was watching Beastyqt's stream and I saw he was annoyed with you stream sniping him, he implied that you've done it multiple times as well. Maybe you should not stream snipe people who you know don't like it. Otherwise I don't really see any problem with it.
Hi Willba,
Yes I have sniped beastyqt in the past, but I stopped that maybe 1 month ago. However I still ladder and sometimes get matched against him. That is something he has to deal with, because there is no way in avoiding that!
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On November 16 2011 06:54 FabledIntegral wrote:
I'm pretty sure this is common knowledge in the community.
You can also look pretty stupid to the community. I was playing IdrA one match and went for a stim timing attack off 2 base composed of MM to hit before he got bane speed or mutas (successful), only to realize that I forgot to tech stim itself, completely.
I looked like a fucking moron.
Even though this is common knowledge for most of the people in the community it isnt for some people. The reason why I made this thread is because Incontrol falsely accused me of stream-cheating.
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On November 16 2011 06:52 Rudo wrote:
the problem is your still gaming the system...while you're not directly cheating against a particular player you are swaying the matchmaking system to give yourself a better chance of playing the player that you want to play....Honestly I could care less but some people I'm sure care
And is that even of concern whatsoever? If you could pick your opponent's, as long as the games were legit, would there be a huge issue? It worked fine for the most part with iccup.
[QUOTE]On November 16 2011 06:56 Harstem wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 16 2011 06:54 FabledIntegral wrote:
I'm pretty sure this is common knowledge in the community.
You can also look pretty stupid to the community. I was playing IdrA one match and went for a stim timing attack off 2 base composed of MM to hit before he got bane speed or mutas (successful), only to realize that I forgot to tech stim itself, completely.
I looked like a fucking moron.[/QUOTE]
Even though this is common knowledge for most of the people in the community it isnt for some people. The reason why I made this thread is because Incontrol falsely accused me of stream-cheating.[QUOTE]
How is that in any way related to your OP? He accused you of stream-cheating when you were stream sniping instead. Your OP just talks about the differences. Incontrol might have been wrong, but there wasn't any miscommunication otherwise. He simply suspected you were stream cheating. Would you still have made this topic if he accused you of map hacking..?
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On November 16 2011 06:47 Menzer wrote:Show nested quote +On November 16 2011 06:45 r3z3nd3 wrote:
I feel your post is directed to people that have some knowledge about stream sniping / stream cheating. Can you say in a few words what is description of each? Thanks Seems pretty clear: Sniping = watching stream of high level player to try and join game at the same time, resulting in playing said high level player (typically someone famous, ex. Huk, Idra, etc.) Once game starts, presumably a stream sniper will close the stream and play as normal. Cheating = watching the stream of the person you are in-game playing against to gain an advantage and beat them.
Oh, thank you, dangerjoe and OP for the clarification about the issue.
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I dont really see the point here, the player being sniped isnt going to know that you arent going to watch the stream during the game. So why do it at all?
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And is that even of concern whatsoever? If you could pick your opponent's, as long as the games were legit, would there be a huge issue? It worked fine for the most part with iccup.
The way he is using it isn't really a problem but the same thing could be used to get matched up against someone you beat much more consistently...or even for example pull a combatex and match up against people you know for win trading
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EPT
