BW Teams playing Starcraft 2 - Page 169
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setmeal
162 Posts
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Olinimm
1471 Posts
On November 05 2011 13:56 Elementy wrote: I would like to see BW and SC2 played together like 3games of bw 3 games of sc2 then ace match is predetermined if it will be sc2 or bw. then they can pick there ace player. then over the season the ace match will alternate between sc2 and bw =O i know this sounds crazy but i truly love both games hell i LOVE starcraft so to me it would be a dream come true Yeah but imagine the LR threads... | ||
Warlock40
601 Posts
I would like to see BW and SC2 played together like 3games of bw 3 games of sc2 then ace match is predetermined if it will be sc2 or bw. then they can pick there ace player. then over the season the ace match will alternate between sc2 and bw =O i know this sounds crazy but i truly love both games hell i LOVE starcraft so to me it would be a dream come true Haha, that's pretty fun to think about! Unfortunately, it cannot and will never happen in an official tournament, for obvious reasons. :[ It isn't called the Fantasy GG THING , It's called Fantasy GG TIMING . On the contrary I laddered a lot in sc2 and what can i say 1 gate zealot and stalker to mass void ray .It's just too easy... the terran didn't stand a chance so this is how corsair is able to function if it is able to attack ground units.... oh and spamming chrono boost makes everything easy .... too It's called "Fantasy GG TIMING", not "the Fantasy GG THING"? Don't you mean "Fantasy's GG timings"? Of course you did, and so did the other guy, so is it really a big deal that the wording varies slightly? And by the way, how much did you ladder in SC2 if you think mass void rays beats Terran? The fact that you think chrono boost makes things too easy leads me to guess perhaps not that much. Zerg and Terran have new macro mechanics in SC2 as well, and mots people complain about MULEs, not chrono boost. | ||
sluggaslamoo
Australia4494 Posts
I think BW will always be around, it may not be as big as it used to be though. I mean "pro Warcraft II" still exists, its just a tiny community. Thing is War2 never got as big as BW so I think BW will still be quite big for a long time. | ||
hunts
United States2113 Posts
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aimaimaim
Philippines2167 Posts
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DreamOen
Spain1400 Posts
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raga4ka
Bulgaria5679 Posts
Also there are currently 20 or so undrafted BW progamers , because of the disbands of the 3 BW teams . Chances are that some of them won't get drafted in a team and might end up switching to SC2 regardless if Kespa gets SC2 in PL for next season or not . | ||
PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On November 05 2011 20:42 raga4ka wrote: I just hope that Kespa doesn't do some stupid shit like having progamers practising both BW and SC2 . It will just worsen the quality of performance in both games . I think SC2 should have it's own division just like the Special Force game . Thouhgt we will see what kind of brainstorm Kespa has in store for us . Also there are currently 20 or so undrafted BW progamers , because of the disbands of the 3 BW teams . Chances are that some of them won't get drafted in a team and might end up switching to SC2 regardless if Kespa gets SC2 in PL for next season or not . well i pretty much know for a fact that SC2 won't be mixed in with BW. they said they were looking at starting maybe halfway into the season. thats not something you do when you will have teams playing both sc2 and BW against eachother in one season. it's clearly going to be SC2 on right before BW as an opening act kind of thing at leats until sc2 gets a huge following, or an every other day thing (less likely as sc2 has a much smaller audience in korea at the moment) | ||
N.geNuity
United States5111 Posts
3 years isn't a bad guess; 6 may be a stretch since that's so far, and it's impossible to predict well. Prince already elaborated, but since I bothered to type this up may as well post! Long post spoilered so as to not distract thread. + Show Spoiler + We all know the answer is simply money; anyways, let's do analysis of sponsors of current (7 + 1 brand brand new) bw teams and "why they are in esports". Useful link is here, the major corporations in south korea on wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_companies_of_South_Korea spoiler is just some compiled financial data; not too relevant. just shows how large the sponsoring companies are (doesn't mean they give to the team, but they are big big companies; compared to something like primezzang or korean sc2 sponsors at this point) + Show Spoiler + --Samsung: largest revenue company in south korea; samsung electronics is a large part --SKT (part of SK Group: Fourth largest revenue in south korea; however, sk telecom is a large part of the group regardless) --STX: 10th? largest revenue in south korea --KT: 17th largest revenue in south korea --Air Force ACE: military team; they don't really depend on sponsors the same way other teams do I imagine --CJ Group: not on first wiki link above, but their english site claims 335 billion KRW in operating revenue 2010 (~300 million USD) http://cjir.irplus.co.kr/global_eng/ir/finance/highlight.asp cj is also in list of chaebol (large conglomerate) companies in korea: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaebol; larger than korean air chaebol --Woongjin Group: not on first wiki list, but claims 7831 KRW assets (7 billion USD) and 247 billion KRW (222 million) income in 2010 http://www.woongjin.com/English/investment/mn_result.aspx Then we have shinhan bank, who sponsors the proleague, at ~30th largest company listed on first wiki list with 2520 million USD revenue according to wiki list. Shinhan bank has sponsored the proleague since 2007 (before that SKY did it from 2005-2006). Teams that disbanded: wemade (Wemade entertainment, which lists 290 billion KRW (260 million USD) in total assets 2010 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wemade_Entertainment) mbc game: mbc the media conglomerate is large (661 million USD revenue) but it is converting mbc game to a kpop channel hwaseung: this site lists some of its financial information, but I don't know if it's all of the conglomerate or just whatever this one automotive parts branch of hwaseung has is http://www.hsrna.com/eng/investment/investment1.asp and this site (I think this is more overall) says "1.3 billion won sales as the external value possession 22 companies: 8 in korea and 14 internationally)" http://www.hwaseunggroup.com/eng/hwaseung/about_us.asp?pcode=010101 however, both those sites are 2009 info. skipping that spoiler well, the above spoiler just establishes that major corporations in korea are sponsoring bw, and have been for many years (elaboration down below). 2 teams that disbanded after the last season (Wemade and hwaseung) were a bit smaller corporations. MBC game is shutting down as the overall company MBC (media network) is turning it into a kpop channel. As far as advertising goes, hwaseung doesn't really seem to have the same type of "electronics/gaming" sector that some of the other large companies clearly have and could benefit from sponsoring ESPORTS (samsung, sk telecom, kt (another telecom company/internet), cj which does quite a bit of entertainment/media/internet in addition to their food services). Wemade is an online games company so it's a bit surprising to me they cut their team, but I guess they decided it was too costly for the benefit or were having internal problems. STX is a ship builder and woongjin is an ??? company (website said it started as educational/publication company, and now says its a holdings company) It's no surprise that those 4 teams--sky, kt, samsung, cj--are older (all have been in their current form with same sponsorship since 2006 or older) and have always been viewed as having more "money" than the other teams. STX soul has been in the form of STX since 2004. Woongjin changed to woongjin in 2008. Air Force Ace is a special case. Hwaseung, wemade, and mbc game were comparably smaller sponsors than the other teams in the modern era (when nada was on wemade, I get the impression it may have been larger). summary of stability--good news!: Of the 7 current teams (not counting the brand brand new team put together), 5 (skt, kt, cj, and samsung, air force ace) are pretty much "incredibly stable" in my view. They are sponsored by huge companies in south korea that have been sponsoring the teams for years (latest change was 2006 for CJ as far as I can tell), that all have significant shares in electronic/esports industry; air force ace also is a different type of team. The teams "at risk", in my view, are STX and Woongjin--STX had some internal problems recently (put all players up for draft; not that it's disbanding, but they did some move like that at end of last proleague season) and I can't tell how much woongjin is invested. Both woongjin and STX are seen as "lower money" teams as far as I can tell than teams like kt and skt who cough up those large salaries for players. Jaedong, the best zerg of all time, always had a much lower salary on hwaseung than he "could have had" with other teams. KT and SKT also sends its players on vacations, and Samsung players always have to say how they get the new samsung products in their interviews (Stork talking about his samsung galaxy, etc). The companies are paying the players well, have been doing so for a long time, and even use them as forms of advertisement. Their sponsorship is rock solid for years to come. The proleague has been sponsored since 2007 by the same (major) corporation, shinhan bank. Proleague has had steady sponsorship for a while. The starleagues have had mixed success in finding high end sponsors recently, but they still bring in some nice sponsors (like korean air sponsoring 2 leagues in 2010). So, basically, it's kind of bad timing that hwaseung dropped it's sponsorship (it had been sponsoring since 2006; it was lecaf from 2006-2009, but lecaf is just a subsidiary of hwaseung) at the same time as wemade and mbc. MBC game is a factor of whether esports can survive on television--they're dropping of their team just indicates bw may have to rely on internet broadcasts, like sc2 does, in the future. It would make the scene smaller, but the scene would exist. Wemade I guess just didn't have the financials/didn't care anymore, but again they kind of surprised me as they are a large online game company. But we saw the weaker sponsorships drop, and it's not a bad thing. When proleague starts up again with the 8 teams, missing 1 or 2 teams isn't too detrimental and can even liven up the scene some. What would make bw not last 3 years or longer in its current form? A) the broadcasting channels for it goes away. OGN (ongamenetwork) is the television channel that will now broadcast all the games as mbc is shutting down it's gaming channel (unless another network picks it up). A lot of bw fans are casual--in fact a huge portion of the audience is women. There are a lot of casual fans of bw, and if it has to go entirely to online streams new sponsors may not be too interested in it (or sponsors would be specifically companies relating to electronics/gaming, which most of the time means smaller sponsors). We already know that bw numbers are huge in china online, but that doesn't help attract the big corporate sponsors. MBC dropped because it's corporation must have decided broadcasted esports was too much work when they think they can get the same results with a generic kpop channel; that just means bw may have to go to a more online form. B) some more scandals; bw was rocked a bit by the betting scandal. Those things hurt the image of esports, particularly to sponsors (I'd imagine). Scandals could just kill bw forever, and is really only option I think that could do that. C) decline of esports period, which is possible in korea. A lot of people play games like MMORPG's or flash games, etc etc. That is just as bad for sc2 as it would be for bw. D) the teams aren't as stable as I think they are; I really do believe that ~6 teams would be stable for as long as bw is televised in korea. I have complete faith in 4 teams being totally stable for years to come; as long as the league doesn't really dip below 7 teams, you can have a pretty legit competition year-round (may have to change it some). E) the league doesn't get sponsorship. Again, I don't think this will really happen. Shinhan bank has sponsored proleague since 2007, and I can't imagine it's a huge investment. The prize pool isn't completely gigantic. | ||
PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
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Sabre
United Kingdom1086 Posts
could it be ![]() | ||
Sabre
United Kingdom1086 Posts
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MuK_x
743 Posts
CJ Entus Hydra's Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/dongwon8247 @dongwon8247 seoul CJ ENTUS / STARCRAFT 1,2 wtf? 1 is okay but 2???? | ||
raf3776
United States1904 Posts
On November 06 2011 11:04 SabreUK wrote: I also think its quite incredible how hyvaa already has over 400games this season.. he must be practising full-time? 400 games is a lot. seasons only been out like... 2 weeks right? | ||
rift
1819 Posts
On November 06 2011 11:06 cklrkzk wrote: I dont know why but CJ Entus Hydra's Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/dongwon8247 @dongwon8247 seoul CJ ENTUS / STARCRAFT 1,2 wtf? 1 is okay but 2???? tweeting Puma, JYP -_- | ||
ZAiNs
United Kingdom6525 Posts
On November 06 2011 11:06 cklrkzk wrote: I dont know why but CJ Entus Hydra's Twitter https://twitter.com/#!/dongwon8247 @dongwon8247 seoul CJ ENTUS / STARCRAFT 1,2 wtf? 1 is okay but 2???? From that page I managed to find this! EG Puma's Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/EGPuMa @EGPuMa LoL !! Holy shit, Puma giving up SC2 for League of Legends? | ||
zyzq
United States3123 Posts
On November 06 2011 11:02 SabreUK wrote: http://sc2ranks.com/kr/3385722/zero could it be ![]() could be a fake zero, you know? | ||
MuK_x
743 Posts
On November 06 2011 11:13 ZAiNs wrote: From that page I managed to find this! EG Puma's Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/EGPuMa @EGPuMa LoL !! Holy shit, Puma giving up SC2 for League of Legends? LOL!NO,this is not my point. You can play LoL for fun,but when you are a sc1 progamer,there is a no reason for writing Starcraft 2 over here. | ||
ch33psh33p
7650 Posts
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