EPTIf you want to join vVv just go to their channel and ask to join. They have a lot of low level players there.
vVv Academy Re Launches - Page 5
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MMXMoto-X17
Barbados23 Posts
If you want to join vVv just go to their channel and ask to join. They have a lot of low level players there. | ||
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TangYiChen
Korea (South)195 Posts
Anyways, good luck on finding your star players! :D | ||
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Thug[ro]
Romania340 Posts
don't give me this shit about performing well, you should as a "very large oganization" support/take care/encourage your players no matter what the results are - good results come in time and trust me if you keep this attitude of your academy or whatever you call it then you will just fail... gl anyway | ||
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ketomai
United States2789 Posts
One could argue that starcraft pro gaming is not very stable and the reward of a sponsorship is not very great, but neither is the investment in comparison to a professional degree. The bottomline is you have to be very serious about being a pro gamer if you want to enter this "university", and you must show results or you will not make it in that field (just like many, many other professions out there), and that entails spending the time and the money to reach that goal. To get far you have to take risks in life, this is really no different. You can't expect to dabble and get some free rides to MLG while only investing time and just dropping it if you don't want it. Colleges wouldn't want that, employers wouldn't want that, and vvv does not want it for someone they are considering working for/representing them. edit: However, whether or not they think training/sponsoring by vvv is good enough for that investment of their time/money is another matter. | ||
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-Kyo-
Japan1926 Posts
On August 14 2011 07:41 MMXMoto-X17 wrote: Why would anyone want to join vVv ? 80% of their team are recreational diamond players and the other 20% are not even that good masters players. They have a few Grandmasters but even those aren't that good. If you want to join vVv just go to their channel and ask to join. They have a lot of low level players there. Don't post shit like this please. You have no idea what you're talking about. vVv's A roster team is quite skilled. They ARE a community team, so your other "aggressive" point literally makes no sense. Even the Academy members are strong players looking to get over the hump of competitive gaming. There is a large curve for gaining fame in eSports(SC) right now, vVv expects large things, and if you provide results u get compensated, it makes sense. In response to where players of vVv have placed at LANs, if you even look at any of their games/brackets from Columbus, for example, you'd see some of their players did pretty well, and they had some other things they had to deal with as well, including a team kill in the later stages of the bracket. Don't post random BS when you really have never even followed any of their player's results. I enjoy the fact that the people who are posting the things about "where are your results" are online players only themselves, but with no where near the recognition vVv has. If you don't like the idea of the academy -- as how has been voiced -- then it's not like they're going to stop you from saying so however, that doesn't give you the right to continually bash them for, in any way you look at it, providing people with the opportunity to take their gaming to a new level with the proper dedication. :/ | ||
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TheTrueAmerican
United States132 Posts
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genius_man16
United States749 Posts
On August 14 2011 06:58 infussle wrote: good responses by the OP. I think Sweep makes a very good point on ROI, and what a minority in this thread do not understand is the exact concept of investment and business, especially considering how hard it is for newcomers to the scene to have a piece of the most profitable pie. Although saying that, vVv is an established organisation who have supported the smaller gaming communties out there, and for that, they have my respect. Any project reguarding development of upcoming talent needs as much support as possible He makes a good point except what incentive does Player A have of using the vVv tag if he is paying out of his/her own pocket to go to MLG or NASL or wherever? Essentially vVv is expecting people to commit to being a pro as if it's a job, and also expecting them to travel around playing in tournaments that would require a full time job (not sc2) to pay for them. That's asking far too much from someone. I mean personally I could never afford to pay to send myself to MLG with the job I work at now, and yet I would then have to take up even more of my free time training with the vVv team? With no possibility of sponsorship until I spend MY OWN money going to some event in which I'll probably be knocked out of the open bracket in the 2nd or 3rd round? (sorry but im not beating any koreans, and none of the vVv A-Teamers have either) I find it funny that they are basically asking more of their own academy members than their players already on the sponsored team. Correct me if I'm wrong sweep but that's just how I see it. | ||
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KhAmun
United States1005 Posts
On August 14 2011 07:21 Soleron wrote: The problem most people are having is that you first have to put up thousands of your own money as well as weeks of your life to get yourself to those LANs to prove yourself, only after which will vVv consider paying you. Unlike a pro player contract, vVv can easily just never pay you and don't have to disclose why, all while getting the benefit of having you represent them. The risk is all yours. Look at complexity academy for something that does what you say (quality practice) without the lopsided conditions. I'm unfamiliar with the complexity academy, but my point is that this is an extremely accessible way to break into the competitive scene, and they are providing you with an abundance of quality practice partners that you otherwise wouldn't have access to. In return for this, they expect you to represent them. Obviously they aren't running some charity thing where they don't expect anything of the players. They are looking for quality players trying the break onto the scene and who see this as a mutually beneficial opportunity. And yes, it is unlike a pro contract because you aren't pro, they are merely giving you access to be able to make it, something that is really hard to come by. On August 14 2011 07:21 Moa wrote: You make a good point, getting to train with some of the vVv players would be beneficial but it requires an inordinate investment from the people in the academy. A huge time commitment on top of their practice load they already bear and then a massive financial commitment to attend these lans. It would be a more sound decision to just buy lessons as you get access to better players who are working one on one to make you a better player. While coaching will always help it is not a substitution for an abundance of practice partners that play regularly and have a mutual desire to improve to the highest level. And yes i recognize that it's a big investment to go to LANs, but it says you might be removed, it does not definitively say one way or the other. It is in my opinion perfectly fair for them given what they are providing you with to expect you to go to LANs and represent the team that enabled you to get the level you would be at. | ||
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pwncakery
Canada131 Posts
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DuckS
United States845 Posts
A nice academy attempt I suppose, but not for me. Good luck with it. | ||
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Swwww
Switzerland812 Posts
On August 14 2011 07:26 vVvSweep wrote: If you are in the Academy for 90days and then you choose to attend a LAN, if we feel you will perform well we will provide you with steelseries gear. If you then DO perform well, consideration will be made for benefits based on performance. If you DO NOT perform well, you keep the gear and are able to go to another LAN of your choosing to try again. I wont discuss benefits in a public forum because its not black and white. If i post "if you place in top 50 at MLG then we will reimburse your expenses" then that could mean gas money to one person or several hundred dollars to another. At the same time, the people you play in the bracket can have an effect as well and would be considered. This is a small team that will get a lot of attention. But there is no simple answer to what you will be given. Well just about everyone who is in the leagues you are looking for will have their own gear made by SS or rival companies already, I mean just look at the number of bronzers who want the best mech boards to 'improve their skill'. I fail to see how getting a keyboard and a mouse out of a 90 day commitment PLUS what could be potentially travelling costs in excess of 1500 USD to be worth it... Especially when you consider that you are not even a member of the team in any way... | ||
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akalarry
United States1978 Posts
it's just not possible. you want ppl to commit VERY hard and spend thousands to attend lans. you can't do that without having a full time job. but you can't commit to sc2 like this with a full time job. my mind does not compute. online tournaments are what should matter for situations like this. if you can prove yourself beating well know players online, then that's what will attract team's attention. going through online tournaments is the FEASIBLE option. | ||
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Utinni
Canada1196 Posts
 You gotta really think before you post something this big. | ||
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SugarBear
United States842 Posts
1. Players not getting compensated but expected to attend LANs out of pocket. If you feel you are already skilled enough to be a sponsored player and should have your expenses mitigated for traveling to LANs, no one is stopping you from applying to be on the sponsored team. 2. Complexity's Academy as gold standard / vVv not doing well at MLG Complexity did HORRIBLY at Anaheim. I haven't heard of any of their academy team doing well. With that as the basis, why does everyone in this thread consider Complexity's academy as the gold standard for Academy teams? It seems to me that Complexity wasted a lot of money on computers/travel stipends for players who didn't bring any recognition to their team. If anything, I would expect Complexity to discontinue their academy because it's such a bad deal for the organization. 3. What is the benefit for joining the Academy team? Well obviously if you are already skilled enough to be a sponsored player you wouldn't join the Academy. If you are a skilled player who feels that you can perform better with some structured training and community support then you should join. Obviously you could do this without joining the vVv Academy team, but it will be much more difficult. For example many people find losing weight on their own to be difficult because no one is there to hold them accountable when they make poor choices. The Academy is that entity willing to hold you accountable to stay on a practice schedule and give you the experience needed to succeed at a high level. | ||
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SwEEt[TearS]
Canada1575 Posts
Now, catch the flip side: you're asking for Masters/GM level players who are willing to participate in a monthly in-house tournament, a weekly meeting as well as attending clan wars even if the players won't be participating because your A-Team is doing all the work. Sure. But then you're saying that if those players don't make the effort to attend offline events, they can be dropped from the academy. If they perform not too great (and then again, that's purely subjective right?) in the monthly tournaments, they can get sacked as well. The level of commitment you're asking from them versus your ability to pull the plug whenever you feel like it is rather ridiculous. You have to realize that Masters/GM level players generally don't have a lot of money. At least not the kind of money to attend let's say at least 3 events. At best, you'll be lucky to find some guys who are able to go to one MLG or NASL or whatever because it's close to their parents' house. I honestly think you should reconsider your "online tournaments don't matter" policy. While they aren't as amazing for your sponsors, they'll at least show you the level of dedication of your academicians. While offline LAN events are certainly different (different environment, having to play away from home, dealing with jetlag if applies, etc.), you'll at least get some online appreciation. And who knows, with what the players win playing online, they might make enough to join offline events. Right? | ||
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rei
United States3593 Posts
you people needs to stop patronizing vVv and get your facts straight, they will pay for everybody's traveling expenses | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On August 14 2011 08:35 rei wrote: dude SwEEt, vVv is paying for traveling expenses, why does everybody expect vVv to be so stupid that they don't realize ppl who play almost 24/7 to get into GM don't have excess money laying around? you people needs to stop patronizing vVv and get your facts straight, they will pay for everybody's traveling expenses You are trolling so hard, you won't get your flights paid for guarantee it lol. | ||
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SwEEt[TearS]
Canada1575 Posts
On August 14 2011 08:35 rei wrote: dude SwEEt, vVv is paying for traveling expenses, why does everybody expect vVv to be so stupid that they don't realize ppl who play almost 24/7 to get into GM don't have excess money laying around? you people needs to stop patronizing vVv and get your facts straight, they will pay for everybody's traveling expenses Do you know that on a first hand basis? And if you do, explain how vVvSweep hasn't mentionned it yet? Could it be because he doesn't discuss benefits, because they're tailored to each player's experience/loyalty/performance/time in the clan/whatever else is taken into account? I'm not trying to come out as insulting, but you're really barking up the wrong tree. There's an amazing lack of explanation about this project and it seems like they're just expecting people to commit and THEN be told what's what | ||
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eourcs
United States459 Posts
On August 14 2011 08:35 rei wrote: dude SwEEt, vVv is paying for traveling expenses, why does everybody expect vVv to be so stupid that they don't realize ppl who play almost 24/7 to get into GM don't have excess money laying around? you people needs to stop patronizing vVv and get your facts straight, they will pay for everybody's traveling expenses On August 14 2011 06:09 vVvSweep wrote: If you cannot attend major LANs (no matter what the reason) then I can settle this by saying the vVv Academy is not for you. If you CAN attend major LANs and you perform well, then there will be support from vVv. vVv-gaming is a very large organization and while strict on what we expect, our rewards are always on par with your performance. I want you to think about the process here... If a company pays your entire travel expenses (several hundred dollars) to attend a LAN, then you are expected to produce a fan base worth those several hundred dollars. If you aren't able to keep up with your part of the deal then you are fooling yourself to think a sponsor will keep you.. Uhhhh.... doesn't sound like they're paying for anything travel related. | ||
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SugarBear
United States842 Posts
On August 14 2011 08:27 SwEEt[TearS] wrote: From a business point of view I 100% understand what you're trying to say. Online tournaments, while they get decent viewership and good prizepools for the players are a horrible proof to get sponsors to keep paying you. That's why MLG and other major offline events have been doing better, because the number of people has been dramatically increasing and so has online viewership. Now, catch the flip side: you're asking for Masters/GM level players who are willing to participate in a monthly in-house tournament, a weekly meeting as well as attending clan wars even if the players won't be participating because your A-Team is doing all the work. Sure. But then you're saying that if those players don't make the effort to attend offline events, they can be dropped from the academy. If they perform not too great (and then again, that's purely subjective right?) in the monthly tournaments, they can get sacked as well. The level of commitment you're asking from them versus your ability to pull the plug whenever you feel like it is rather ridiculous. You have to realize that Masters/GM level players generally don't have a lot of money. At least not the kind of money to attend let's say at least 3 events. At best, you'll be lucky to find some guys who are able to go to one MLG or NASL or whatever because it's close to their parents' house. I honestly think you should reconsider your "online tournaments don't matter" policy. While they aren't as amazing for your sponsors, they'll at least show you the level of dedication of your academicians. While offline LAN events are certainly different (different environment, having to play away from home, dealing with jetlag if applies, etc.), you'll at least get some online appreciation. And who knows, with what the players win playing online, they might make enough to join offline events. Right? I don't think you do 100% understand, and let me explain why. Please explain for me why vVv needs an Academy team? Besides Complexity, no other major gaming organization in NA has one. So what benefit does vVv gain from having an Academy team? Keep in mind that *potential talent* does not impress sponsors, actual results do. On the other hand, players willing to join the Academy gain a lot of benefits. If they are potential talent they can develop that talent and gain recognition from an organization that sponsors players who perform well. Players have an entire community to share the expenses of traveling and hotels etc. Players get mentoring and experience learning how to work with sponsors and connections to sponsors who would never look at them twice without the connection to vVv. Sure it's potentially competitive and you will have to pay out of pocket to attend MLGs, but the community will share expenses and it doesn't come anywhere near thousands of dollars as some people in this thread have been suggesting. I think it's very generous of vVv to offer a training ground for people seriously interested in improving their talent. I hope that the vocal minority in this thread who feel that organizations should: 1. Spend thousands of dollars for unknown players to provide no results, 2. Organizations (and players) should be satisfied with Academy teams that never go anywhere or accomplish anything Is just a vocal minority that doesn't represent the majority of the SC2 community. | ||
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