EPTEG signs PuMa, responds to criticism - Page 14
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Duravi
United States1205 Posts
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
EG's defense basically comes down to Puma not being under contract - something that EG wouldn't (and most certainly shouldn't) even KNOW without approaching Puma first and talking about his ties to TSL. We knew since day 1 that he wasn't on a contract - that changes nothing. If you want the "big bad corporate team" image to fade off, this post isn't the best way to do it. It basically reeks of damage control language, all the way until ending it with "sincerely" (is it really?). It's an informative post that isn't really informative because we've already known most of it, and can't be sure how many of the fine details were "tweaked" to make EG look better. We can't really know what was said during the initial talks with Puma, what agreements were made or how TSL was involved. The only relevant new piece of information we have got from this is that Puma is definitely joining EG. It's an apology post that isn't really an apology, because it neither recognizes nor acknowledges the mistakes made (while still throwing occasional jibes here and there). | ||
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SpeaKEaSY
United States1070 Posts
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Destro
Netherlands1206 Posts
I feel like the TSL ship is sinking and its just trying to grab EG and take them down with their failing esports team and piss-poor management. l2contract. This is really just the beginning of sc2 going global. sink or swim korea, your move. | ||
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getpicture
141 Posts
Fact is, everyone makes a choice that benefits themselves, puma was helping his team more than helping himself. Coach lee wanted to invest in him as a money making player and if you ask him, he'll happily take back Puma without paying him. Where are the ethics in that? Who has to feel sorry for coach lee? There was no contract because lee couldn't afford to. He could not determine puma's market value and so retained him knowing he was worth a lot more. think about it. imagine i had flash on my team but didn't pay him, and then a rich team takes him away from me. for too long flash benefited my team too much, i should be hating myself for treating him like that. lee doesn't think like that, instead thinks he's the good guy, changes the topic to manners instead of actually looking at the ones who are suffering- puma. | ||
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JerKy
Korea (South)3013 Posts
Look forward to Puma's progress as a player with EG | ||
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Fugue
Australia253 Posts
On July 26 2011 09:59 RipxDark wrote: I don't see how someone could still be angry at EG. They explained everything and never really did anything wrong. They didn't snipe a korean team's ace because both parties knew what was happening. EG is giving Puma a chance to compete at more events, how could anyone be mad about that? Do they not support the best player being at these competitions? Most of the people that are still mad at EG will always be mad at them because people are just stubborn I'm not angry at EG, but I think a lot of anger and resentment comes from Alex's handling of the situation. That's why the word "unprofessional" is getting thrown around. The one question I don't think ever got asked/answered was this: If EG have been doing their homework, have consultants in Korea and have been shopping around, how did they get so blindsided by this cultural misstep? It's fine if it goes unanswered, because to be honest, as missteps go, it really was minor and it's quite feasible that with all the consultants and research, trusting Puma's word that he would talk to Coach Lee personally may have been a good step under advisement - it just came at a bad time, and the story hemorrhaged out which must have felt absolutely terrible for Alex. But coming back to the anger - Alex acknowledges the cultural misstep, and apologises in that regard. He could have stopped there, but he wanted to make it clear that Coach Lee's reaction shouldn't have happened and it's unfair that EG is copping such bad press for it. He wants to make it known that this shouldn't have been as big of a deal as it is, and furthermore that if people didn't contribute to the spreading of mis-information then this wouldn't have come to this. The backlash from that is that he's essentially trying to take out his anger and resentment because he was thrust into a bad situation. Going further is what fuelled the flames here. Makes for good entertainment, but it didn't help him or EG any. It even got people mad at Wheat for letting it happen, which was a bit of a downer. | ||
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WoundedKite
United States17 Posts
Also, this [the OP] seems to imply that the whole mess was indeed Coach Lee's fault for jumping the gun. Sure, EG states "I'm not so stubborn and belligerent as to sit here and claim that EG is 0% at fault", though he never really specifies exactly where EG was at fault or even may have been at fault. But hey, good for PuMa. It'll be nice to see him at more foreign tournaments  edit: for pronoun clarity. | ||
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Serpico
4285 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:12 jenzebubble wrote: Because the offending comments were made publicly. It would be like if I called you every name in the book here on the forums, then PMed you later and said "my bad, hope we are cool." Well seeing as how his conversation was directed at only one person in particular, it would make sense for the apology to be private and contrite. A PM would satisfy that. | ||
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jenzebubble
United States183 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:12 Serpico wrote: It's not wrong to tell a player you have an interest in negotiating with them when their contract expires. It's pretty common so you can hit the ground running if a team doesn't resign them. In most every professional sporting league that is considered tampering and is very illegal. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-09-21/sports/17932653_1_darrius-heyward-bey-tampering-receiver http://www.cheatersguidetobaseball.com/2007/05/03/tampering-minaya-and-cabrera/ http://www.seattlepi.com/sports/article/MLS-clears-Sounders-FC-of-tampering-paving-way-1294666.php | ||
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zerglingrodeo
United States910 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:01 s4life wrote: Also, if you say you didn't sign Puma until a few days later, you could have just as well not sign him at all until things calmed down, in that way you could have apologized to TSL coach with actions rather than words and you could have saved face. Give it up. It's time for TL to find something else to be mad about. Nothing to see here. | ||
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Izukue
Canada101 Posts
1. You've been communicating with other teams' management first about acquiring a player. 2. You approached Puma first instead of TSL's management first. So you're saying that despite communicating with other teams' management, you made an exception to Puma? Yea, you're saying that you both agreed to discuss with TSL, but that was AFTER approaching Puma himself first. So fact of the matter is you still approached the player first? Just wanted to clarify. Because that nullifies a lot of the credibility that you're probably trying to re-establish in this thread. | ||
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outerspace02
United States136 Posts
promod. | ||
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seiferoth10
3362 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:15 jenzebubble wrote: In most every professional sporting league that is considered tampering and is very illegal. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-09-21/sports/17932653_1_darrius-heyward-bey-tampering-receiver http://www.cheatersguidetobaseball.com/2007/05/03/tampering-minaya-and-cabrera/ http://www.seattlepi.com/sports/article/MLS-clears-Sounders-FC-of-tampering-paving-way-1294666.php Do you honestly not see the difference between those articles and this situation? Here's a hint: the answer is in the OP, you should read that too. | ||
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Molybdenum
United States358 Posts
On July 26 2011 09:04 EGalex wrote: ...We're not just sitting on a pile of money - it didn't just appear out of nowhere. We had to work very, very hard to secure the sponsors that we have, and it's not fair to criticize us for being good at getting sponsors, especially when (unlike other teams) we pass most of our sponsorship money on to our players. For the record, I'd like all of you to know that we put a higher percentage of our gross revenue back into player support than almost any other team in the world. So, for those of you who think I'm typing this from my yacht - I'm not. I'm actually typing this from my one-bedroom apartment. Any proof for this? Pro salaries for sc2 are pretty well hidden, and this is a rather robust claim to make, especially in such a thread. This sort of thing really needs some supporting evidence if you're going to claim to be near the very top of teams paying players. If there's evidence, it should be easy to provide otherwise this kind of claim is a low attempt to try to recover PR. But if this is true, that's truly a great thing to do and all the power to you guys for supporting ESPORTS to its fullest (sincerely). On July 26 2011 09:04 EGalex wrote: Going back to the situation at hand, many of you have argued that our approach here was "aggressive" and "objectionable" because we did not consult TSL management first, but rather, went to the player first. But I would like to again point out that PuMa and EG's mutual decision to have PuMa speak with Mr. Lee first was not motivated by a desire to sneak around Mr. Lee, but rather, it was simply agreed to be the best first step (again, read: *first* step) communication-wise. It's been said a million times in this thread, but the first step was you approaching a Korean player who appeared to be on a Korean team (TSL in his name...) who was overseas at a large American tournament. Either way, what's done is done. Sucks for Milkis to be thrown under the bus and a "private apology" doesn't do much when he was attacked in a public show. | ||
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qck
United Kingdom201 Posts
eSports might still be young in the west, but a certain level of professionalism where teams approach teams if they're interested in signing a player, may help to create a better environment for businesses to invest. | ||
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Tachion
Canada8573 Posts
I want to very clearly state again that I have already sent a letter to Mr. Lee, not only personally apologizing to him for any personal disrespect caused by this situation, but also stating that EG is willing to retroactively negotiate terms for PuMa joining EG which will satisfy Mr. Lee on a business level. I'm pretty happy with this. Even if EG fucked up with this whole thing, they're putting an unnecessary, potentially burdening prospect on the table to make it right. | ||
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outerspace02
United States136 Posts
perfect reason to directly contact puma first lmao | ||
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jenzebubble
United States183 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:16 seiferoth10 wrote: Do you honestly not see the difference between those articles and this situation? Here's a hint: the answer is in the OP, you should read that too. Here's a hint: read my post. They have been contacting PLAYERS directly that are SIGNED to contracts. | ||
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TaKemE
Denmark1045 Posts
On July 26 2011 10:15 jenzebubble wrote: In most every professional sporting league that is considered tampering and is very illegal. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-09-21/sports/17932653_1_darrius-heyward-bey-tampering-receiver http://www.cheatersguidetobaseball.com/2007/05/03/tampering-minaya-and-cabrera/ http://www.seattlepi.com/sports/article/MLS-clears-Sounders-FC-of-tampering-paving-way-1294666.php Tampering is forbidden in many professional leagues but not illegal and its only for contracted players. Got nothing to do with sc2 so no idea why you bring it up. | ||
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