TSL's Coach Lee speaks out on PuMa - Page 21

On July 22 2011 15:15 TheButtonmen wrote:


1. EG wants a top level Korean player.
2. Top level Koreans come over to NASL finals.
3. EG hands out cards seeing if anyone is interested.
4. Puma is interested and talks to EG staff, when they find out he is open to the idea of working for them, has no contract and no salary they need to compete with they lay out what they are prepared to offer, Puma is interested but he wants to be the one to talk to his coach rather then EG, EG agrees.
5. Puma talks to his coach, coach isn't impressed and thinks that Puma and EG have gone and signed behind his back. (Please note that EG and Puma haven't signed or agreed to anything yet.)
6. Coach feels disrespected and starts this whole thing with his posts.
7. The standard drama fueled shitfest occurs.
8. EG finds out about all of this.
9. Coach clarifies what he meant / what happened as mis-communications start to get cleared up (hell he even throws Puma a goodbye party)
10. EG speaks out on Lo3, saying they didn't do anything wrong and they followed their potential new players wishs. (Again note that EG and Puma still haven't signed anything still.)
11. Dramallamas continue to frolic.
12. EG opens mouth and inserts foot re: what team liquid is for (while I agree partially with them this sure as hell wasn't the time).
13. Even more shit hits the fan as TL defends one of their own.
14. I eat an orange.
15. I write this post.

So where exactly in this chain of events do you think EG crossed the line and needs to apologize?

This was all basically EG doing their best to recruit some new blood, Puma doing his best to find the best option offered to him, TSL not being able to compete due to their lack of cash flow and a tragic misunderstanding between Puma and Coach Lee which started an epic drawn out shitfest.

On July 23 2011 03:39 emythrel wrote:


I don't see how EG disrespected anyone. They appraoched Puma to see if he was interested, if he said no then thats the end of the discussion. He said yes, so they said "here is the general idea of the package we can give you" Puma obviously liked it. They said "What is the best way to do this?" Puma said HE would speak to his coach, Puma could have said that EG should talk to coach Lee but he didn't.

Coach Lee could have asked to speak to EG before going public to find out more about the deal and to check it was the right move for Puma, because he seems to have gotten the impression that EG want Puma only for western events when AG said last night they have been putting stuff in place for a "proper" environment for Korean players, that sounds to me like they are working to secure a house and more players in Korea.

I just personally don't see how what EG did is disrespectful but what Coach Lee has done and said isn't. He has said alot of things in an interview which are pure conjecture and he basically slammed Western teams for not conforming to his ideas about respect and honour but not made any attempt to conform to Western ideas of respect and honour. If I ran a team and wanted a player, the first thing I would do would be to gauge interest before I even thought of speaking to his/her team, if they have no interest then what would be the point in speaking to their team?

I'm never going to be convinced that anyone should conform to another person's standards, I have my own ethics and sense of honour, it no doubt differs from everyone else's. The only thing you can do is hold yourself to your own standards and do things legally, if Puma had been under contract then EG would have had no other option but to speak directly to his team, but he wasn't and he decided that speaking to his team himself was the best option. Those conditions satisfied EG's code of ethics

On July 23 2011 03:51 BZZ wrote:


I actually agree with this post as a solid summary of events. The only issue left is whether the perceived disrespect by EG damages relationships with Korean teams or organizations such that EG is not able to compete in Korean tournaments.

On July 23 2011 03:55 Mioraka wrote:


The funny thing about respect is not whether you felt you were disrespecting the object, but rather if the object felt like being disrespected.

If a whole community felt they are disrespected, AG's "I'm being rational here, the Korea business model suck balls." Arguement doesn't not hold.

On July 23 2011 03:38 Grimsong wrote:Korea wants the "west" to value their beliefs, when completely ignoring ours and calling it foul play? It's two different cultures. EG was wrong in not doing the "respectable" thing even if they didn't have to, so TSL was wrong in just assuming the rest of the world is going to comply to what they want, no?

On July 23 2011 03:39 emythrel wrote:I just personally don't see how what EG did is disrespectful but what Coach Lee has done and said isn't. He has said alot of things in an interview which are pure conjecture and he basically slammed Western teams for not conforming to his ideas about respect and honour but not made any attempt to conform to Western ideas of respect and honour. If I ran a team and wanted a player, the first thing I would do would be to gauge interest before I even thought of speaking to his/her team, if they have no interest then what would be the point in speaking to their team?

On July 22 2011 12:34 GTR wrote:

Q: There are some rumors that there were salary issues with the players. What are your thoughts on this?

A: While I can’t give you the exact amounts, FruitDealer, Tester and Clide received a monthly salary from the team. Besides those three, the other members were on a stipend basis. After the rebuilding phase, Clide and SangHo returned the salaries / stipends that they received to provide some additional financial support for the whole team. We were very thankful for their gesture. Now that I think about it, our team was fairly quick in providing salaries compared to the others. Starcraft 2 was slow to catch on in Korea. On top of that, back then the economy was in a poor state and the sponsorship endowment was quite low. We were even in danger to losing our main team sponsor.

On July 23 2011 03:55 Mioraka wrote:


The funny thing about respect is not whether you felt you were disrespecting the object, but rather if the object felt like being disrespected.

If a whole community felt they are disrespected, AG's "I'm being rational here, the Korea business model suck balls." Arguement doesn't not hold.

On July 23 2011 02:30 Carkis wrote:

you are ignoring a lot here. just because it wasnt legally binded it doesnt mean there shouldnt be respect given to coach lee. Yes legally there is no obligation but in a tightnit community like ours respect goes a long way. I know a lot of players teams and most importantly fans will not forget this lack of respect very easily

On July 22 2011 14:12 xBillehx wrote:

I agree. GSL reaches out to nearly all the global Starcraft fans, there has to be some good return on investment in that. Hopefully more get on the ball with some nice translators to help out.

On July 23 2011 03:59 ore0z wrote:


EG is doing business with TSL. TSL is not doing business with EG. An example would be like, if you want to do a transaction with someone, you should be respectful to the other person. They can refuse your business.

Puma seeking out EG is slightly different. EG may have handed him a card, but they handed every korean a card. Puma sought EG out. There's not much to blame on EG, except maybe they allowed Puma to talk to the coach first.

On July 23 2011 04:06 Grimsong wrote:
EG is not doing business with TSL.

TSL was not doing business with EG.

The only possibility of TSL doing business with EG, was if TSL was informed directly FIRST about signing a FREE AGENT PLAYER who is not CONTRACTUALLY OBLIGATED to TSL. Then THEY would have taken ADVANTAGE of EG and forced them into a BUYOUT situation more likely than not.

They did business with Puma. If TSL signed Puma to a contract, then they would have done business with TSL.

Cut and dry.

On July 23 2011 03:51 Highwayman wrote:
This interview and most of the responses in this thread fall under the category of mental diarrhea. All parties pursuing their best interest. Puma is his own person and can make his own decisions. Any talking to the coach beforehand is purely a formality and he's just using that as a point to garner sympathy and rally his team so they don't lose any more players.

Man up please.

On July 23 2011 03:22 emythrel wrote:

I don't see how EG disrespected anyone. They appraoched Puma to see if he was interested, if he said no then thats the end of the discussion. He said yes, so they said "here is the general idea of the package we can give you" Puma obviously liked it. They said "What is the best way to do this?" Puma said HE would speak to his coach, Puma could have said that EG should talk to coach Lee but he didn't.

Coach Lee could have asked to speak to EG before going public to find out more about the deal and to check it was the right move for Puma, because he seems to have gotten the impression that EG want Puma only for western events when AG said last night they have been putting stuff in place for a "proper" environment for Korean players, that sounds to me like they are working to secure a house and more players in Korea.

I just personally don't see how what EG did is disrespectful but what Coach Lee has done and said isn't. He has said alot of things in an interview which are pure conjecture and he basically slammed Western teams for not conforming to his ideas about respect and honour but not made any attempt to conform to Western ideas of respect and honour. If I ran a team and wanted a player, the first thing I would do would be to gauge interest before I even thought of speaking to his/her team, if they have no interest then what would be the point in speaking to their team?

I'm never going to be convinced that anyone should conform to another person's standards, I have my own ethics and sense of honour, it no doubt differs from everyone else's. The only thing you can do is hold yourself to your own standards and do things legally, if Puma had been under contract then EG would have had no other option but to speak directly to his team, but he wasn't and he decided that speaking to his team himself was the best option. Those conditions satisfied EG's code of ethics