This isn't going to turn into another LoL vs (all other games apparently) thread. You can speak your mind about the selection of games but keep it civil.
On June 28 2011 04:37 bokchoi wrote: People need to stop hating on LoL. If anything they should be commending LoL and Riot for getting into the IEM the way they did. The company is behind their game and are trying to make it an eSport. If more companies showed the dedication to their game that Riot does, eSports would be a lot more developed.
yes. the slowest most boring game of the moba genre. paying their way in. replacing an extremely interesting and technical game.
no totally. esports will thrive if the rich can just make terrible games and pay their way into massive events.
what are you going to say if activision paid modern warfare 3's way into dreamhack replacing starcraft 2? yes it would never happen but it's no different from this.
these comments are so funny people mad cause they took out QL and put LoL instead, but completly ok with taking out bw and putting sc2. casuals appeal is what make those kind of tournaments, not gameplay, that's exactly why LoL is in ESL. Same goes for sc2
On June 28 2011 04:37 bokchoi wrote: People need to stop hating on LoL. If anything they should be commending LoL and Riot for getting into the IEM the way they did. The company is behind their game and are trying to make it an eSport. If more companies showed the dedication to their game that Riot does, eSports would be a lot more developed.
yes. the slowest most boring game of the moba genre. paying their way in. replacing an extremely interesting and technical game.
no totally. esports will thrive if the rich can just make terrible games and pay their way into massive events.
what are you going to say if activision paid modern warfare 3's way into dreamhack replacing starcraft 2? yes it would never happen but it's no different from this.
Maybe you don't like it, but 200,000 live at any given time seemed to enjoy it. At the end of the day, if people want eSports to be established it has to go mainstream, which means appealing to a MAINSTREAM audience. As a business model, eSports needs to appeal to the public, sponsors, etc. to make it.
These arguments that technical and interesting games are being replaced by less technical or less competitive games are retarded. Newer games replaced older games all the time, whether they're better or not. If tournament organizers were TRULY concerned about skill and technicality in their games, tournaments would still have SCBW in their games list.
On June 28 2011 04:43 SagaZ wrote: casuals appeal is what make those kind of tournaments, not gameplay, that's exactly why LoL is in ESL. Same goes for sc2
pretty sure i remember people being mad about WCG dropping BW for sc2
also lol got in because they paid their way in. lol steam viewer count was bugged. there wasn't 200k viewers.
On June 28 2011 04:43 SagaZ wrote: these comments are so funny people mad cause they took out QL and put LoL instead, but completly ok with taking out bw and putting sc2. casuals appeal is what make those kind of tournaments, not gameplay, that's exactly why LoL is in ESL. Same goes for sc2
BW was never in IEM. It was Wc3 that got replaced by Sc2.
On June 28 2011 04:43 SagaZ wrote: these comments are so funny people mad cause they took out QL and put LoL instead, but completly ok with taking out bw and putting sc2. casuals appeal is what make those kind of tournaments, not gameplay, that's exactly why LoL is in ESL. Same goes for sc2
BW was dead and most of the players who placed at WCG's had already expressed they were moving on to SC2. Thats a far cry from a game that's been around forever and still has a loyal base of players still trying to provide fun games to bring more people into the scene.
On June 28 2011 04:37 bokchoi wrote: People need to stop hating on LoL. If anything they should be commending LoL and Riot for getting into the IEM the way they did. The company is behind their game and are trying to make it an eSport. If more companies showed the dedication to their game that Riot does, eSports would be a lot more developed.
yes. the slowest most boring game of the moba genre. paying their way in. replacing an extremely interesting and technical game.
no totally. esports will thrive if the rich can just make terrible games and pay their way into massive events.
what are you going to say if activision paid modern warfare 3's way into dreamhack replacing starcraft 2? yes it would never happen but it's no different from this.
Maybe you don't like it, but 200,000 live at any given time seemed to enjoy it. At the end of the day, if people want eSports to be established it has to go mainstream, which means appealing to a MAINSTREAM audience. As a business model, eSports needs to appeal to the public, sponsors, etc. to make it.
These arguments that technical and interesting games are being replaced by less technical or less competitive games are retarded. Newer games replaced older games all the time, whether they're better or not. If tournament organizers were TRULY concerned about skill and technicality in their games, tournaments would still have SCBW in their games list.
with that logic they should have put angry birds in.
anyways, tnx for all the Quake love TL (majority at least^^)
On June 28 2011 03:38 mordk wrote: I played DotA for many, many years. I played LoL for approximately 50 games. LoL SUCKS. Out of the 2 big clones of DotA (HoN and LoL), LoL is most definitely the worse game. Even when compared to other games of that type, it falls in low standards. It's really oddly paced, requires little skill, and is inferior in so many other things it's even hard to describe.
The only reason it's so wildly popular is because it's FREE, and the only reason it's DH stream got so many viewers is because of the main menu splash into the stream. However, that's not a bad thing at all. If anything, Blizz should copy this idea and put big tournament's stream into the SC2 main menu, right there in your face, include chatrooms with it as well, and you have a winner.
DotA as an e-sport was/is a blast, it requires HUGE amounts of skill and teamwork. Actually, when you see the game and see these teams like Na'Vi, E-HOME, DK, etc, perform those moves you go like "Oh yeah, that looks so fuckin easy", and then when you try it with your teammates it's an utter failure hahaha. It's so incredibly hard to reach the top in DotA it's very comparable to starcraft. LoL however, with it's odd hero movement, and most importantly, with it's incredibly strange game pace, dumbs the game down waaaay too much.
Basically, LoL is a marketing victory, it's like... junk food. It's shit, it's fast, it requires little effort, and it has large marketing around it. A huge win for the developers, a major flaw in the world for hardcore gamers .
Quoted for truth. About 50 people in my school play LoL, maybe 5 SC2. And that's alone because of 2 reasons: 1. LoL is free. 2. LoL is pathetically easy, and you can feel good about yourself the whole time (put the blame on your teammates) while also not being officially branded as 'bronze' league (aka newb).
edit: oh yea and riot does a good job advertising its esports events to all the kids^^
SC2 still can't bring out 200k viewers on livestream, so even if LoL does suck (Having played it and dota a lot, i think it kinda does), right now it's more legit as an esport than SC2 =/ . Yes it all comes down to viewership. But there is reason behind it.
True, LoL is easy to learn and play compared to SC2. So one might say it's not a "good enough" esport. However, simplicity and team play make it more appeling. Just as soccer is more appealing than tennis. Plus, simplicity of gameplay doesn't mean players won't, by refining their play to the utmost, make it a technical game at high levels, and thus make it interesting.
If you don't consider LoL an esport, then you can't consider SC2 an esport seeing how BW was.
Still, IMO Dota2 will crush that shit :p Im calling 500k viewers.
Carmac how u could do that to QL. i am a total quake noobie but i enjoyed watching it peactically as much as i enjoy watching BW T_T It is definitely super epic thing and to replace it with LoL...
On June 28 2011 04:08 DonKey_ wrote: People really shouldn't be trying to put down LoL just because they feel it's a "casual" game; this is no WoW arena repeat, this game actually has a large viewership believe it or not.
It's easy see why QL was replaced by LoL, because their viewer count is MUCH larger even if the skill required is less. (their Dream Hack viewers were something like 200,000 concurrently<--- not a made up number, google it)
I'm happy for LoL it's amazing a game other than SC2 can bring in numbers like that.
still its sad that the greatest and most skillful fps still actively beeing playd gets removed for the joke of a game lol is. yeah many play it yeah it has a big viewership. but esports wise its not much better for me then any random needforspeed,fifa or whatever
I'd like to see a group of people who call LoL an "easy no skill game" play on a team against CLG or Fnatic and tell me that its a no-brainer type of game. It requires skill and cooperation just like any other competitive game.
The main difference I see between SC2 and QL compared to LoL is that in SC2 and QL are 1v1, and the teams play a background role (even in team/clan wars, its 1v1 game). In LoL its 5v5 and not everyone is going to be MORE KILLS SO EASY TO WIN.
LoL in casual play is much different from LoL in competitive play IMO
the skill requirement in LoL is laughable compered to QL or any "real" esport game, dont even try to compare the amount of skill u need to play some shitty dota wannabe to playing even game against rapha/cooller. Personaly i have nothing against LoL being on IEM, but cant stand the fact they decided to put it instead of QL ....
On June 28 2011 05:13 Aurdon wrote: Half the Quake viewers must be in this thread. A hundred people jumping on the bandwagon saying what a tragedy that is being removed.
How many of you actually watched the Quake competition at the last IEM?
There's your answer as to why it was removed.
what a silly thing to say i watched the quake stream more than sc2. ESL got me into quake. goto the ESL website and you'll see 90% of the comments on this announcement dissapointed in removing quake
On June 28 2011 04:37 bokchoi wrote: People need to stop hating on LoL. If anything they should be commending LoL and Riot for getting into the IEM the way they did. The company is behind their game and are trying to make it an eSport. If more companies showed the dedication to their game that Riot does, eSports would be a lot more developed.
yes. the slowest most boring game of the moba genre. paying their way in. replacing an extremely interesting and technical game.
no totally. esports will thrive if the rich can just make terrible games and pay their way into massive events.
what are you going to say if activision paid modern warfare 3's way into dreamhack replacing starcraft 2? yes it would never happen but it's no different from this.
Maybe you don't like it, but 200,000 live at any given time seemed to enjoy it. At the end of the day, if people want eSports to be established it has to go mainstream, which means appealing to a MAINSTREAM audience. As a business model, eSports needs to appeal to the public, sponsors, etc. to make it.
These arguments that technical and interesting games are being replaced by less technical or less competitive games are retarded. Newer games replaced older games all the time, whether they're better or not. If tournament organizers were TRULY concerned about skill and technicality in their games, tournaments would still have SCBW in their games list.
with that logic they should have put angry birds in.
anyways, tnx for all the Quake love TL (majority at least^^)
I don't know what Angry Birds is, but if its played competitively and sponsors want to get behind it, then by all means, LETS INCLUDE IT!!
Seriously though, I never said there was anything wrong with QL as a game, and I actually played/followed QL a little bit. The game is fun, its technical, its exciting, but the fanbase (??), and/or sponsors(??) weren't there for it. The removal of QL sucks for the Quake/FPS community, but from the perspective of ESL as a tournament organizer and business model, its a no-brainer to add LoL.
so many LoL haters rofl it may be an easier game then DotA and HoN but those two games are nearly dead in the same sense bw (foreigner scene) is as well.
For E-sports to grow you need viewers and HoN and DotA wouldn't get anywhere near the numbers LoL can and most likely will if Riot keeps promoting it.
EPT
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