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I usually enjoy watching ITG even with some raging and ranting m usually fine with that its light and it's fun, but this weeks show was at its all time low, and i am frankly disappointed in the way the hosts & destiny conducted themselves (with the exception of painuser, who even though getting interrupted, and semi flamed by IncontroL, did not lose his temper.)
But DJ Wheet defiantly disappointed me the most, even if it doesn't come as a surprise, I still thought he had it in him to step in when things got too bad, instead he first of all joined in against the already tag teamed upon Destiny, (note I am in no way defending Destiny here),
and after the call ended you Acted as much like a child than Destiny did, both as a person and especially as a show host of one of the largest sc2 shows out there, it was just disgraceful in so many ways.
Even though i have watched the show from the first episode aired to now, and that the show woun't miss me, I am going to take a break from watching this show, and trust in JP to provide some proper sc2.
Hope to return to a better show in a month or two.
Good luck, and cheers
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On October 25 2012 22:43 5ukkub wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 11:59 IdrA wrote:
the fact that theres actually people saying im too light on blizzard or that im happy/complacent with what theyre doing is the most damning proof ive ever seen that people will say anything to be obstinate assholes. Nobody said you are too light on Blizzard, nobody said you're happy/complacent with them. You said, and IncontroL agreed, that pressuring Blizzard is a nonsense, because they didn't do anything noticable to fix the game client and make it more casual-friendly, so can't ecpect them to suddenly change their approach. Well, i for one disagree, because YOU, the players, commentators, hosts aka PILLARS OF THE COMMUNITY never should stop voicing our concerns and thoughts about the game!Because you are being heared, not us! So when you stopped voicing those concerns, what the community is supposed to do? You can't ignore us! We all see what's going on with SC2 client and how other game's viewer counts rise, but our don't! And then came Destinny. He wrote what he wrote and it was the only thing that community could relate to!So do you want Destiny to be the voice of the community, or you, IdrA, IncontroL, djWheat?
Idra and Incontrol never stopped voicing. Never. Incontrol does with with more humor, often ridiculing Blizzard's decisions. Idra is definantly more vocal about it and more explicit, which resulted in even Blizzard trolling him with the Hots beta key if anyone sill remembers. And they will always be like that if Blizzard screws up. The topics Destiny brought weren't new, and they were discussed many times before by many different influential persons in the community, including Idra and Incontrol.
The main difference is the attitude. While they disagree, with the way they are supposed to approach to Blizzard and what to expect of them, and they voice in perfectly - imo - especially during the times everyone is acting irrational and overreacting. Which is the freaking job of the people that had been here the longest.
The problem here is, and what hurts my soul, is that they couldn't have an argumented discussion with Destiny at no point of this show. Destiny was interrupting all the time and acting very very immature and this seemed like an argument with your parents when you are like 16 or 17 at most. Which is probably why so many people on reddit agree and praise him, because they are just those kinds of children. Destiny is a smart and passionate individual, but he couldn't calm down and, was jumping from topic to topic and just blaming Blizzard for everything that did, and what he assumed they won't do. Even when the ITG people told him that some of the issues he brought up WILL be fixed in the expansion, he ignored that and immediately jumped to the next issue. He was like a kid that wanted a Playstation for a birthday, and got a bike. Then his parents apologized, and got him a Playstation for his next birthday, but he was like: "ITS TOO LATE NOW, I STILL HATE YOU". He is never going to be happy, if Blizzard implemented the things he wanted TOMORROW, he would still just say: "Pfft, fucking finally!"
You can't turn back time. Yes, it sucked these 2 years that they didn't do the stuff everyone wanted and expected them to do BUT they are either fixing it as we speak or they are aware of it and not doing it for various reasons we don't know. It might be their team is too small, it might be they don't get enough funds for additional programmers, it might be they want to save alot of content and release it as a selling point for an expansion, or they just don't deem them necessary. We. Don't. Know. But they DO care, and everyone knows this. This has been said, and the reasons were speculated on this show by Inc Idra and DjWheat, but to no avail. Knowing all this, it is NOT in our best interest to blame mommy and daddy and/or fight among ourselves, but to freaking unite and do what we can to better our game, our community and raise awareness for Blizzard. That's. It.
Now the part that pisses me off is this: Destiny acted like a freaking teenager. When his argument met a brick wall, he changed the topic. Then when Idra had enough and just said what has been on everyone's mind the entire time, which was the absolute most positive thing anyone can say about the game they love to someone that is clearly too fed up with Blizzard and wont change his attitude, and the high five proceeded to happen (which I view not as a douchy move, but as a comradery "I'm fucking proud of what you said" moment, Destiny then shat on the players, and left as a freaking coward.
Then Wheat lost it, because that's not how arguments with grownups are supposed to go. Nowhere in the freaking world. Nowhere. He lost it, because of the person that has been invited to his damn show, showed no capacity and respect to argue, then left like a child, when he deemed himself fed up enough. Wheat didn't even tell him to fuck off, he was just so mad that he would pussy out like that that he HAD to say something. What he said wasn't coherent, wasn't meant to hurt or belittle anyone, it was just pure rage, disbelief, and dissapointment. And people still got on Destiny's side. People still thought of him as a freaking martyr. I mean... Really? I GET maybe pitting against Geoff and Greg, because they have many haters but DjfreakingWheat? The guy who lives and breathes for this shit?
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On October 26 2012 00:28 bonifaceviii wrote:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of the whole disagreement between Wheat/Idra/Incontrol and Destiny can be summarized as follows:
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol state that non-Blizzard parties were responsible for the development of most post-BW eSports infrastructure and SC2's success as a spectator sport.
Destiny stated that LoL and Dota 2 have used this very base of knowledge and infrastructure to build the eSports communities for their own games, and the fact that these games' developers are pretty much on side with their respective communities means (in his opinion) those games will grow better than SC2 where Blizzard is not, and never has been, on side with the SC2 community's needs.
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol think that Blizzard doesn't necessarily need to do all the things that would make SC2 a more user-friendly game in order for SC2 to survive, and Destiny does.
...Is that right? Am I missing something?
Destiny: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard needs to keep up with the times and fix shit unless they want the game to die.
ITGcrowd: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard is incompetent and shouldn't be relied on for making things better and that we as a community should do everything we can to make esports better. Bringing out desperate doomsday callings will only hurt the community and if blizzard still doesn't fix anything all that it accomplishes is basically wounds and people leaving.
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United States452 Posts
On October 26 2012 00:48 Rasmudd wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 00:28 bonifaceviii wrote:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of the whole disagreement between Wheat/Idra/Incontrol and Destiny can be summarized as follows:
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol state that non-Blizzard parties were responsible for the development of most post-BW eSports infrastructure and SC2's success as a spectator sport.
Destiny stated that LoL and Dota 2 have used this very base of knowledge and infrastructure to build the eSports communities for their own games, and the fact that these games' developers are pretty much on side with their respective communities means (in his opinion) those games will grow better than SC2 where Blizzard is not, and never has been, on side with the SC2 community's needs.
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol think that Blizzard doesn't necessarily need to do all the things that would make SC2 a more user-friendly game in order for SC2 to survive, and Destiny does.
...Is that right? Am I missing something? Destiny: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard needs to keep up with the times and fix shit unless they want the game to die. ITGcrowd: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard is incompetent and shouldn't be relied on for making things better and that we as a community should do everything we can to make esports better. Bringing out desperate doomsday callings will only hurt the community and if blizzard still doesn't fix anything all that it accomplishes is basically wounds and people leaving.
And then Destiny's point is that the VAST MAJORITY of the overall player base don't give a shit about 'esports' and only care about the casual aspect of the game. Therefore it doesn't matter what the competitive community does because the casuals only care about better custom games/better chat channels etc. And only Blizz has the ability to change that aspect of the game.
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On October 26 2012 00:31 VanGarde wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 00:28 bonifaceviii wrote:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of the whole disagreement between Wheat/Idra/Incontrol and Destiny can be summarized as follows:
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol state that non-Blizzard parties were responsible for the development of most post-BW eSports infrastructure and SC2's success as a spectator sport.
Destiny stated that LoL and Dota 2 have used this very base of knowledge and infrastructure to build the eSports communities for their own games, and the fact that these games' developers are pretty much on side with their respective communities means (in his opinion) those games will grow better than SC2 where Blizzard is not, and never has been, on side with the SC2 community's needs.
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol think that Blizzard doesn't necessarily need to do all the things that would make SC2 a more user-friendly game in order for SC2 to survive, and Destiny does.
...Is that right? Am I missing something? Yes but also the fact that why they both agree that there are lots of things that need improvement with the game, they also disagree in that Destiny thinks the game is dead/dying, IdrA/Incontrol does not.
The 'dead/dying' thing is a tough call. I mean, we've all watched games of Starcraft and spotted the tipping point before the casters call it, right? Well, is Destiny jumping the gun, or is he just recognising earlier signs?
SC2 feels like a rocket. WoL was the first stage. People put up with a lot of basic UI stuff being missing because the game was new and there would be patches and there was always the second and third stage to look forward to, so up it went. But now it's time for the second stage to kick in, and if it doesn't fire strongly and quickly enough, the trajectory of the game could suffer. The rocket may not be falling right now - it may still be coasting upwards - but the boost everyone was kind of expecting from HotS hasn't materialised. I was super fucking excited for the beta, and now it's kinda... not happening. Nobody's streaming it. There seem to be hardly any games to watch and most have at least one guy playing a straight WoL strategy, if not both.
I think if Blizzard had hit us harder and faster with the planned* HotS UI changes at the start of Beta, #SaveHotS would never have happened. They've done a less than stellar job of fanning the flames of interest.
*I say planned, but... A lot of people saw the quick release of those screenshots as proof the UI changes were already in the pipeline. But what were we actually shown? A few screenshots. A day's work for a competent Photoshopper. Just saying, is all 
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On October 26 2012 00:58 TheWorldToCome wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 00:48 Rasmudd wrote:On October 26 2012 00:28 bonifaceviii wrote:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of the whole disagreement between Wheat/Idra/Incontrol and Destiny can be summarized as follows:
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol state that non-Blizzard parties were responsible for the development of most post-BW eSports infrastructure and SC2's success as a spectator sport.
Destiny stated that LoL and Dota 2 have used this very base of knowledge and infrastructure to build the eSports communities for their own games, and the fact that these games' developers are pretty much on side with their respective communities means (in his opinion) those games will grow better than SC2 where Blizzard is not, and never has been, on side with the SC2 community's needs.
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol think that Blizzard doesn't necessarily need to do all the things that would make SC2 a more user-friendly game in order for SC2 to survive, and Destiny does.
...Is that right? Am I missing something? Destiny: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard needs to keep up with the times and fix shit unless they want the game to die. ITGcrowd: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard is incompetent and shouldn't be relied on for making things better and that we as a community should do everything we can to make esports better. Bringing out desperate doomsday callings will only hurt the community and if blizzard still doesn't fix anything all that it accomplishes is basically wounds and people leaving. And then Destiny's point is that the VAST MAJORITY of the overall player base don't give a shit about 'esports' and only care about the casual aspect of the game. Therefore it doesn't matter what the competitive community does because the casuals only care about better custom games/better chat channels etc. And only Blizz has the ability to change that aspect of the game.
You're assuming that Destiny knows the vast majority. There are people he speaks for, of course, but the casuals would not care about Destiny nor anyone else in the scene.
I feel that both sides have valid points and need to just keep going.
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On October 26 2012 00:58 TheWorldToCome wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 00:48 Rasmudd wrote:On October 26 2012 00:28 bonifaceviii wrote:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding of the whole disagreement between Wheat/Idra/Incontrol and Destiny can be summarized as follows:
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol state that non-Blizzard parties were responsible for the development of most post-BW eSports infrastructure and SC2's success as a spectator sport.
Destiny stated that LoL and Dota 2 have used this very base of knowledge and infrastructure to build the eSports communities for their own games, and the fact that these games' developers are pretty much on side with their respective communities means (in his opinion) those games will grow better than SC2 where Blizzard is not, and never has been, on side with the SC2 community's needs.
Wheat, Idra and Incontrol think that Blizzard doesn't necessarily need to do all the things that would make SC2 a more user-friendly game in order for SC2 to survive, and Destiny does.
...Is that right? Am I missing something? Destiny: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard needs to keep up with the times and fix shit unless they want the game to die. ITGcrowd: Starcraft 2 has problems and blizzard is incompetent and shouldn't be relied on for making things better and that we as a community should do everything we can to make esports better. Bringing out desperate doomsday callings will only hurt the community and if blizzard still doesn't fix anything all that it accomplishes is basically wounds and people leaving. And then Destiny's point is that the VAST MAJORITY of the overall player base don't give a shit about 'esports' and only care about the casual aspect of the game. Therefore it doesn't matter what the competitive community does because the casuals only care about better custom games/better chat channels etc. And only Blizz has the ability to change that aspect of the game.
I think there's a philosophical distinction here.
The ITGcrowd thinks that Starcraft 2 can grow (or at least maintain) as an esport without the game actually attracting more players at the bottom, since esports is somehow bigger than BGH/Tower Defence and the viewership and professional/competitive scene has fidelity.
Destiny thinks that without grassroots growth in the actual playerbase of the game (which only Blizzard can help with in terms of the UI, etc) the inevitable result is a slow decline into obscurity.
I can't deny that Destiny's point of view sort of makes more sense to me.
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Fact is, before destiny was on the discussion was calm and reasoned with good points and counter points. Destiny comes on and it ends in a scream-fest. Destiny leaves and it slowly calms down and ends up as another calm reasoned discussion of the points where some agreed and others didn't.
Was screaming good? No. Was Destiny hanging up good? No.
The biggest mistake was bringing destiny on the show. The same thing happened with avilo on SOTG and that ended the same way. All in all I think destiny is to blame here because he couldn't calm down and talk in a reasonable manner. Only after destiny kept shouting down and talking over the others did incontrol and wheat get angry.
At the end of the day it was a bad decision to even bring destiny on. All in all I enjoyed the discussion when he wasn't on and for that I think it was a good show. Just dont bring on destiny again.
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Here is the thing, if Blizzard puts a stream viewer in the client, the players will benefit, because it will introduce more spectators to the scene. I know a LOT of people that play SC2, but have never watched a game. They haven't even heard of eSports. If there was a in-game client for them to watch, it would grow eSports as a whole. The scene and players would benefit, and it would make SC2 even larger.
I don't understand how people can argue against this point. Besides (well..blizzard hasn't done anything yet, so we should stop trying). How about we keep asking and hope that it will be implemented in HoTS. There is a way to do this, instead of just giving up.
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On October 26 2012 01:17 Magnious wrote:
Here is the thing, if Blizzard puts a stream viewer in the client, the players will benefit, because it will introduce more spectators to the scene. I know a LOT of people that play SC2, but have never watched a game. They haven't even heard of eSports. If there was a in-game client for them to watch, it would grow eSports as a whole. The scene and players would benefit, and it would make SC2 even larger.
I don't understand how people can argue against this point. Besides (well..blizzard hasn't done anything yet, so we should stop trying). How about we keep asking and hope that it will be implemented in HoTS. There is a way to do this, instead of just giving up.
Nobody is saying that would be a bad thing, how do you not understand that? All IdrA and Geoff were saying is that we shouldn't start crying that the game is dying and we shouldn't sit on our ass and wait for Blizzard to do everything for us, we should be trying to work with what we have. Blizzard is already more than aware of all the things we want fixed, twitter-bombing them or making doomsday proclamations on reddit/TL isn't going to change that.
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On October 26 2012 01:17 CwnAnnwn wrote:
Fact is, before destiny was on the discussion was calm and reasoned with good points and counter points. Destiny comes on and it ends in a scream-fest. Destiny leaves and it slowly calms down and ends up as another calm reasoned discussion of the points where some agreed and others didn't.
Of course it was, before Destiny came on everyone was just laughing at Destiny's ideas. Why wouldn't it have been calm?
The problem was not letting Destiny on, but given how Incontrol had just bashed Destiny, it should've been expected he was pissed off and that some serious moderation of the discussion was needed.
In the end Destiny, Incontrol and Wheat all made fools of themselves. This easily happens when a discussion gets heated so whatever. As is, the discussion didn't really contribute much to anything though, which is unfortunate.
On October 26 2012 01:17 CwnAnnwn wrote:
The biggest mistake was bringing destiny on the show. The same thing happened with avilo on SOTG and that ended the same way. All in all I think destiny is to blame here because he couldn't calm down and talk in a reasonable manner. Only after destiny kept shouting down and talking over the others did incontrol and wheat get angry.
Well, first and foremost, Incontrol really went above and beyond trying to explain how much of an idiot Destiny was making that post. You don't think that had anything to do with how angry Destiny was? So who really started this shitstorm?
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On October 26 2012 00:46 CikaZombi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 22:43 5ukkub wrote:On October 25 2012 11:59 IdrA wrote:
the fact that theres actually people saying im too light on blizzard or that im happy/complacent with what theyre doing is the most damning proof ive ever seen that people will say anything to be obstinate assholes. Nobody said you are too light on Blizzard, nobody said you're happy/complacent with them. You said, and IncontroL agreed, that pressuring Blizzard is a nonsense, because they didn't do anything noticable to fix the game client and make it more casual-friendly, so can't ecpect them to suddenly change their approach. Well, i for one disagree, because YOU, the players, commentators, hosts aka PILLARS OF THE COMMUNITY never should stop voicing our concerns and thoughts about the game!Because you are being heared, not us! So when you stopped voicing those concerns, what the community is supposed to do? You can't ignore us! We all see what's going on with SC2 client and how other game's viewer counts rise, but our don't! And then came Destinny. He wrote what he wrote and it was the only thing that community could relate to!So do you want Destiny to be the voice of the community, or you, IdrA, IncontroL, djWheat? Idra and Incontrol never stopped voicing. Never. Incontrol does with with more humor, often ridiculing Blizzard's decisions. Idra is definantly more vocal about it and more explicit, which resulted in even Blizzard trolling him with the Hots beta key if anyone sill remembers. And they will always be like that if Blizzard screws up. The topics Destiny brought weren't new, and they were discussed many times before by many different influential persons in the community, including Idra and Incontrol. The main difference is the attitude. While they disagree, with the way they are supposed to approach to Blizzard and what to expect of them, and they voice in perfectly - imo - especially during the times everyone is acting irrational and overreacting. Which is the freaking job of the people that had been here the longest. The problem here is, and what hurts my soul, is that they couldn't have an argumented discussion with Destiny at no point of this show. Destiny was interrupting all the time and acting very very immature and this seemed like an argument with your parents when you are like 16 or 17 at most. Which is probably why so many people on reddit agree and praise him, because they are just those kinds of children. Destiny is a smart and passionate individual, but he couldn't calm down and, was jumping from topic to topic and just blaming Blizzard for everything that did, and what he assumed they won't do. Even when the ITG people told him that some of the issues he brought up WILL be fixed in the expansion, he ignored that and immediately jumped to the next issue. He was like a kid that wanted a Playstation for a birthday, and got a bike. Then his parents apologized, and got him a Playstation for his next birthday, but he was like: "ITS TOO LATE NOW, I STILL HATE YOU". He is never going to be happy, if Blizzard implemented the things he wanted TOMORROW, he would still just say: "Pfft, fucking finally!" You can't turn back time. Yes, it sucked these 2 years that they didn't do the stuff everyone wanted and expected them to do BUT they are either fixing it as we speak or they are aware of it and not doing it for various reasons we don't know. It might be their team is too small, it might be they don't get enough funds for additional programmers, it might be they want to save alot of content and release it as a selling point for an expansion, or they just don't deem them necessary. We. Don't. Know. But they DO care, and everyone knows this. This has been said, and the reasons were speculated on this show by Inc Idra and DjWheat, but to no avail. Knowing all this, it is NOT in our best interest to blame mommy and daddy and/or fight among ourselves, but to freaking unite and do what we can to better our game, our community and raise awareness for Blizzard. That's. It. Now the part that pisses me off is this: Destiny acted like a freaking teenager. When his argument met a brick wall, he changed the topic. Then when Idra had enough and just said what has been on everyone's mind the entire time, which was the absolute most positive thing anyone can say about the game they love to someone that is clearly too fed up with Blizzard and wont change his attitude, and the high five proceeded to happen (which I view not as a douchy move, but as a comradery "I'm fucking proud of what you said" moment, Destiny then shat on the players, and left as a freaking coward. Then Wheat lost it, because that's not how arguments with grownups are supposed to go. Nowhere in the freaking world. Nowhere. He lost it, because of the person that has been invited to his damn show, showed no capacity and respect to argue, then left like a child, when he deemed himself fed up enough. Wheat didn't even tell him to fuck off, he was just so mad that he would pussy out like that that he HAD to say something. What he said wasn't coherent, wasn't meant to hurt or belittle anyone, it was just pure rage, disbelief, and dissapointment. And people still got on Destiny's side. People still thought of him as a freaking martyr. I mean... Really? I GET maybe pitting against Geoff and Greg, because they have many haters but DjfreakingWheat? The guy who lives and breathes for this shit?
My faith in humanity is restored. Thank you. Everyone who's raging on ITG, but not with Destiny is blatantly just ignoring asshat things Destiny did the entire interview. That final 'hurrah' as he left was what pushed Wheat into a rage, but conveniently is left out of every argument attacking ITG.
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On October 26 2012 01:43 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 01:17 CwnAnnwn wrote:
Fact is, before destiny was on the discussion was calm and reasoned with good points and counter points. Destiny comes on and it ends in a scream-fest. Destiny leaves and it slowly calms down and ends up as another calm reasoned discussion of the points where some agreed and others didn't.
Of course it was, before Destiny came on everyone was just laughing at Destiny's ideas. Why wouldn't it have been calm? The problem was not letting Destiny on, but given how Incontrol had just bashed Destiny, it should've been expected he was pissed off and that some serious moderation of the discussion was needed. In the end Destiny, Incontrol and Wheat all made fools of themselves. This easily happens when a discussion gets heated so whatever. As is, the discussion didn't really contribute much to anything though, which is unfortunate.
To be honest I'm just so sick of people saying sc2 is dead or dying. It makes me want to rip my hair out in frustration. Seriously if people think is starcraft is so bad why dont they go try the beta for command and conquer? that is a free to play casual focused RTS that will probably have millions of people playing it (atleast initially). If you really feel sc2 is dead or dying with a slim to no chance of surving to LOTV just leave the game.
I know sc2 will be fine and nothing is wrong but seriously all these doomdayers are pissing me off. The only thing that has died is the sanity of the sc2 community.
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On October 26 2012 00:46 CikaZombi wrote:
Now the part that pisses me off is this: Destiny acted like a freaking teenager. When his argument met a brick wall, he changed the topic. Then when Idra had enough and just said what has been on everyone's mind the entire time, which was the absolute most positive thing anyone can say about the game they love to someone that is clearly too fed up with Blizzard and wont change his attitude, and the high five proceeded to happen (which I view not as a douchy move, but as a comradery "I'm fucking proud of what you said" moment, Destiny then shat on the players, and left as a freaking coward.
Idra's love of the game? The reason Idra play SC2 is because he's invested so much time into SC and made a big name for himself it would just be stupid not cashing in on that investment.
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I am not sure why people were expecting an explosion in stream viewers with hots beta. WoL beta was really popular for streams because it was fucking starcraft 2, the successor to broodwar and no one had the game. It was a whole new game so obviously everyone watches and dreams about playing it themselves. Hots is an expansion, not a new game, and since it is an expansion we are already playing the game giver or take a few units. There is not that much reason to tune in and watch a beta that is changing constantly when you can just watch WoL tournaments instead. It is perfectly normal for hots beta to not draw in huge stream numbers.
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On October 26 2012 01:17 CwnAnnwn wrote:
Fact is, before destiny was on the discussion was calm and reasoned with good points and counter points. Destiny comes on and it ends in a scream-fest. Destiny leaves and it slowly calms down and ends up as another calm reasoned discussion of the points where some agreed and others didn't.
Was screaming good? No. Was Destiny hanging up good? No.
The biggest mistake was bringing destiny on the show. The same thing happened with avilo on SOTG and that ended the same way. All in all I think destiny is to blame here because he couldn't calm down and talk in a reasonable manner. Only after destiny kept shouting down and talking over the others did incontrol and wheat get angry.
At the end of the day it was a bad decision to even bring destiny on. All in all I enjoyed the discussion when he wasn't on and for that I think it was a good show. Just dont bring on destiny again.
Fact is, before destiny was on the discussion was calm and reasoned with good points and counter points
Well to be fair this is not entirely true. iNcontroL was already being his usual self even before Destiny was on. I honestly think that there were already a hostile attitude towards Destiny when he joined the discussion. Furthermore i don't really think that Destiny was the most immature, compared to iNcontroL and especially djWHEAT.
Only after destiny kept shouting down and talking over the others did incontrol and wheat get angry.
I also really have to disagree on this. They were all equally bad right of the bat. The difference really is that iNcontroL and djWHEAT was somewhat mocking Destiny. Especially after he left the show.
One can argue that Destiny should not have been brought on the show, but it really wasn't his fault that the discussion went down the drain. He obviously didn't encourage a mature discussion, but my god, neither did any of the other guys aside from PainUser. Why on earth did iNcontroL have to give Idra a high five for calling Destiny a pussy? It is not secret that iNcontroL is not the most sophisticated member of the Starcraft community, and that his academic level most likely could be rivaled by any inhabitant of a white trash trailer park. But please, as one of the leading community personalities he should be a little more classy than that. There is not much to say about the way that djWHEAT acted. It was flat out disgusting.
Good thing that SOTG is up and running again, so i don't have to support ITG anymore, and don't have to watch iNcontroL being a moron. I agree that he has to put up with a lot of shit, but it really is no coincidence that it is him, and not someone like Artosis
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On October 26 2012 01:57 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 00:46 CikaZombi wrote:
Now the part that pisses me off is this: Destiny acted like a freaking teenager. When his argument met a brick wall, he changed the topic. Then when Idra had enough and just said what has been on everyone's mind the entire time, which was the absolute most positive thing anyone can say about the game they love to someone that is clearly too fed up with Blizzard and wont change his attitude, and the high five proceeded to happen (which I view not as a douchy move, but as a comradery "I'm fucking proud of what you said" moment, Destiny then shat on the players, and left as a freaking coward.
Idra's love of the game? The reason Idra play SC2 is because he's invested so much time into SC and made a big name for himself it would just be stupid not cashing in on that investment.
yeah deathmonkey the only thing you could pick on on that entire post was idras passion for the game. You dont want to comment on how he convincgly shows destiny to be acting like a teenager. How wheats anger was a reaction to destiny being immature. no clearly the focus of his entire post was idras passion.
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Is there a vod of this show? Checking on the ITG site I can only find shows from March 2012.
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On October 26 2012 02:02 CwnAnnwn wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 01:57 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:On October 26 2012 00:46 CikaZombi wrote:
Now the part that pisses me off is this: Destiny acted like a freaking teenager. When his argument met a brick wall, he changed the topic. Then when Idra had enough and just said what has been on everyone's mind the entire time, which was the absolute most positive thing anyone can say about the game they love to someone that is clearly too fed up with Blizzard and wont change his attitude, and the high five proceeded to happen (which I view not as a douchy move, but as a comradery "I'm fucking proud of what you said" moment, Destiny then shat on the players, and left as a freaking coward.
Idra's love of the game? The reason Idra play SC2 is because he's invested so much time into SC and made a big name for himself it would just be stupid not cashing in on that investment. yeah deathmonkey the only thing you could pick on on that entire post was idras passion for the game. You dont want to comment on how he convincgly shows destiny to be acting like a teenager. How wheats anger was a reaction to destiny being immature. no clearly the focus of his entire post was idras passion.
I commented on that in the post right above the one you quoted. For some reason you chose to ignore that post.
Destiny did indeed act like a teenager, as did most of the ITG ensemble. The way Cika shifted all of the blame on Destiny and portrays Idra as someone just defending the game he loves is really silly for many reasons.
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EPT
