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On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:
Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air?
Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case?
Micro intensive battles with cost-ineffective units are totally overpowered of course.
Also it's not like 2 ravens can blast 50 mutas by clicking twice either, but that's perfectly balanced by terran standards of course.
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On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:04 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 05 2010 00:02 ltortoise wrote:On December 05 2010 00:01 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:59 ltortoise wrote:On December 04 2010 23:57 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:55 MasterFischer wrote:On December 04 2010 23:53 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:51 kedinik wrote:
In my experience I need infestors against mass banshee and mass mutalisk or I will die almost every time, unless I mass mutalisk.
Like, maybe this won't break the game but this would shut down the (riskier, more micro intensive and interesting) tech route alternative to mutalisks in ZvT and ZvZ. i dont see how mass muta can beat mass air from terran without fungal. HSM, PDD, no harrasment options, mix in a thor and youll get your muta 1 shot. Hydra, Muta, lings Was there anything you missed? Hydras rape air, so does muta and so does corrupters. Lings own Thor. What's the problem? You can run away from SM, and PDD dont last forever against mass hydra and muta or you could try, you know, troll less, read more. To be perfectly honest you seem to be the one that is trolling. Patch notes are out for one night, and you already have it allll figured out. You must be some sort of RTS savant to already understand the entire patch and all possible strategic implications that will result in a single night. You're the man! Seriously. Less blanket statements. More testing. please next time before you make a stupid post read the conversation youre quoting. Thank you. I did read it. You're acting like you have the whole post-patch metagame 100% figured out. You don't. Can I make this any more clear? Stop acting like you understand all the implications of the patch because at this point I don't think anybody does. are you a troll too or can you possibly be this stupid? I said i dont think mass muta can beat terran air without fungal. And he told me to build hydra? Get it? Discussing hydra is irrelevant to the thought wether mass muta can beat terran air or not. You're welcome Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air? Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case?
why should marauders counter roaches?
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This community is so fucking spiteful. I understand being upset at a change to your race, I understand being happy about a buff to your race.
I don't understand people yelling at each other and gleefully saying "Race X really deserved that, they should get nerrfed every time one of those assholes complain," or "STFU ur race was already op and now your just bitching cause you have to play like the rest of us," or "ur race takes half the apm and ur compalianing that ur race takes too much apm?"
You guys suck.
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On December 05 2010 00:09 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:On December 05 2010 00:04 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 05 2010 00:02 ltortoise wrote:On December 05 2010 00:01 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:59 ltortoise wrote:On December 04 2010 23:57 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:55 MasterFischer wrote:On December 04 2010 23:53 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:51 kedinik wrote:
In my experience I need infestors against mass banshee and mass mutalisk or I will die almost every time, unless I mass mutalisk.
Like, maybe this won't break the game but this would shut down the (riskier, more micro intensive and interesting) tech route alternative to mutalisks in ZvT and ZvZ. i dont see how mass muta can beat mass air from terran without fungal. HSM, PDD, no harrasment options, mix in a thor and youll get your muta 1 shot. Hydra, Muta, lings Was there anything you missed? Hydras rape air, so does muta and so does corrupters. Lings own Thor. What's the problem? You can run away from SM, and PDD dont last forever against mass hydra and muta or you could try, you know, troll less, read more. To be perfectly honest you seem to be the one that is trolling. Patch notes are out for one night, and you already have it allll figured out. You must be some sort of RTS savant to already understand the entire patch and all possible strategic implications that will result in a single night. You're the man! Seriously. Less blanket statements. More testing. please next time before you make a stupid post read the conversation youre quoting. Thank you. I did read it. You're acting like you have the whole post-patch metagame 100% figured out. You don't. Can I make this any more clear? Stop acting like you understand all the implications of the patch because at this point I don't think anybody does. are you a troll too or can you possibly be this stupid? I said i dont think mass muta can beat terran air without fungal. And he told me to build hydra? Get it? Discussing hydra is irrelevant to the thought wether mass muta can beat terran air or not. You're welcome Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air? Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case? why should marauders counter roaches?
What the heck does this even mean? What a ridiculous comparison. You're comparing infestors giving the Zerg complete and total air dominance to a Marauder countering a single specific unit.
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On December 05 2010 00:09 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:On December 05 2010 00:04 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 05 2010 00:02 ltortoise wrote:On December 05 2010 00:01 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:59 ltortoise wrote:On December 04 2010 23:57 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:55 MasterFischer wrote:On December 04 2010 23:53 Sfydjklm wrote:On December 04 2010 23:51 kedinik wrote:
In my experience I need infestors against mass banshee and mass mutalisk or I will die almost every time, unless I mass mutalisk.
Like, maybe this won't break the game but this would shut down the (riskier, more micro intensive and interesting) tech route alternative to mutalisks in ZvT and ZvZ. i dont see how mass muta can beat mass air from terran without fungal. HSM, PDD, no harrasment options, mix in a thor and youll get your muta 1 shot. Hydra, Muta, lings Was there anything you missed? Hydras rape air, so does muta and so does corrupters. Lings own Thor. What's the problem? You can run away from SM, and PDD dont last forever against mass hydra and muta or you could try, you know, troll less, read more. To be perfectly honest you seem to be the one that is trolling. Patch notes are out for one night, and you already have it allll figured out. You must be some sort of RTS savant to already understand the entire patch and all possible strategic implications that will result in a single night. You're the man! Seriously. Less blanket statements. More testing. please next time before you make a stupid post read the conversation youre quoting. Thank you. I did read it. You're acting like you have the whole post-patch metagame 100% figured out. You don't. Can I make this any more clear? Stop acting like you understand all the implications of the patch because at this point I don't think anybody does. are you a troll too or can you possibly be this stupid? I said i dont think mass muta can beat terran air without fungal. And he told me to build hydra? Get it? Discussing hydra is irrelevant to the thought wether mass muta can beat terran air or not. You're welcome Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air? Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case? why should marauders counter roaches?
Let me guess, you play zerg ?
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On December 05 2010 00:09 Sfydjklm wrote:
why should marauders counter roaches?
Give it a rest; By this guy's idea of "balance", all terran units should have total dominance all game long.
They can spam tier 1 units for 40 minutes straight and still whine that the BC is not powerful enough...
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On December 05 2010 00:09 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:
Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air?
Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case? Micro intensive battles with cost-ineffective units are totally overpowered of course. Also it's not like 2 ravens can blast 50 mutas by clicking twice either, but that's perfectly balanced by terran standards of course.
Lol...what?
Are you honestly suggesting that using seeker missiles is an effective way to deal with mutalisks?
SERIOUSLY? Maybe in the bronze league, or against a really bad Zerg.
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On December 05 2010 00:10 Lexpar wrote:
I don't understand people yelling at each other and gleefully saying "Race X really deserved that, they should get nerrfed every time one of those assholes complain," or "STFU ur race was already op and now your just bitching cause you have to play like the rest of us," or "ur race takes half the apm and ur compalianing that ur race takes too much apm?"
You guys suck.
Such flame wars wouldn't happen if Blizzard put a little more work in their game instead of trying to make it as retarded and noob-friendly as wow.
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You know, if a patch says something like zealot gets + 1000 damage vs all units, then you KNOW protoss is going to win ALL matches. It's not theorycrafting. I'm not justifying what anyone is saying and this is an extreme example. But drawing obvious conclusions like: "Pheonix is going to bemuch much stronger now that they can't be fungal growthed", isn't theorycrafting. It's drawing obvious conclusions. So stop writing everything down as theorycrafting and yelling: " YOU HAVE TO TEST IT" first..
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On December 05 2010 00:09 MasterFischer wrote:
Why the fuck would u go mass muta against air AT ALL?
When zerg got good ground vs air counters?
It seems unless you are able to kill everything with mutas, it's unbalanced.. or if FG and mutas can kill everything then it's over..
Jeesus. I think some zerg players need to rethink their game now, but saying fg is gamebreaking?
I'll wait for the results of pro gamers to decide, thanks.
Our "ground vs air" is called the hydralisks, arguably one of the worst firepower per cost in the game, and also gets raped by tanks and colossus. Normally terran is going air because he's going tanks/thors and turtle mech, and zerg wants to break with broodlords. If protoss is going air he can just make colossus.
Generally, if you have to go ground to counter air there's a problem, since you typically go air to counter ground as zerg.
Now maybe mass queens will be good, i dunno.
I don't think the FG change will be a big deal, maybe mass coruptor/bl vs mech won't work so well. Maybe toss air becomes scarier. But ZvZ is what really gets broken.
EDIT: FIrepower does not mean DPS, its DPS*HP at least in my book
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On December 05 2010 00:09 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:07 ltortoise wrote:
Why in the world should mass muta be able to counter ALL terran air?
Or mass muta + 1 fungal. Why should this be the case? Micro intensive battles with cost-ineffective units are totally overpowered of course. Also it's not like 2 ravens can blast 50 mutas by clicking twice either, but that's perfectly balanced by terran standards of course.
Oh yea, that's right. Exept of course, that hunter missle takes FUCKING FOREVER, to reach it's target.
And any zerg with half a brain, should be able to outrun the missles and anything else... but yea other than that, you're right....
Make Fungal Growth a missle attack like the hunter missle against air, and it might work 
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On December 05 2010 00:12 ltortoise wrote:
Lol...what?
Are you honestly suggesting that using seeker missiles is an effective way to deal with mutalisks?
SERIOUSLY? Maybe in the bronze league, or against a really bad Zerg.
It is because most of the time Zerg doesn't have the luxury of doing a 1a like the vast majority of you bio-ball scrubs.
Microing all this crap makes most zerg players APM shoot up to 250-350 in almost every big battle that terran can still win by clicking twice.
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On December 05 2010 00:15 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:12 ltortoise wrote:
Lol...what?
Are you honestly suggesting that using seeker missiles is an effective way to deal with mutalisks?
SERIOUSLY? Maybe in the bronze league, or against a really bad Zerg. It is because most of the time Zerg doesn't have the luxury of doing a 1a like the vast majority of you bio-ball scrubs. Microing all this crap makes most zerg players APM shoot up to 250-350 in almost every big battle that terran can still win by clicking twice.
And the constructive posts have ended.
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On December 05 2010 00:15 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:12 ltortoise wrote:
Lol...what?
Are you honestly suggesting that using seeker missiles is an effective way to deal with mutalisks?
SERIOUSLY? Maybe in the bronze league, or against a really bad Zerg. It is because most of the time Zerg doesn't have the luxury of doing a 1a like the vast majority of you bio-ball scrubs. Microing all this crap makes most zerg players APM shoot up to 250-350 in almost every big battle that terran can still win by clicking twice.
What about a-moving banelings? You think that doesnt take micro for the Terran player to avoid? It does, a lot. It takes fucking pro FOXER micro to do it, and still then it's mildly effective.
Seeker missle is so slow, you have all the time int heworld to make 1 click backwards, and retreat.
Unless your fully retarded of course.
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On December 05 2010 00:15 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:12 ltortoise wrote:
Lol...what?
Are you honestly suggesting that using seeker missiles is an effective way to deal with mutalisks?
SERIOUSLY? Maybe in the bronze league, or against a really bad Zerg. It is because most of the time Zerg doesn't have the luxury of doing a 1a like the vast majority of you bio-ball scrubs. Microing all this crap makes most zerg players APM shoot up to 250-350 in almost every big battle that terran can still win by clicking twice.
Wow. Nice post...
So now you're insulting Terran players as a whole, and making ridiculous claims about how much micro they need to do to win (clicking twice).
Dude, this isn't the Battle.Net forums. If you aren't going to present logical, coherent arguments without insulting people, then maybe this isn't the right place for you?
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omg huge patch... omg voidrays no more speed upgrade T.....T..
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The issue isn't the damage dealt, its that P and T can flick around the map with their air and even if you do have the creep spread to deal with it, not having fungal growth means that there is nothing worrying them. So you have to play very defensive with your hydras as a result. Or go Muta, not that Muta works vs Phoenix without fungal growth.
Hopefully they won't put through the silly change, the rest of the patch is good.
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On December 05 2010 00:13 Shinkugami wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2010 00:10 Lexpar wrote:
I don't understand people yelling at each other and gleefully saying "Race X really deserved that, they should get nerrfed every time one of those assholes complain," or "STFU ur race was already op and now your just bitching cause you have to play like the rest of us," or "ur race takes half the apm and ur compalianing that ur race takes too much apm?"
You guys suck. Such flame wars wouldn't happen if Blizzard put a little more work in their game instead of trying to make it as retarded and noob-friendly as wow.
How is it noob friendly having to press 1 hotkey 2 million times as zerg looking to replenish your army? just how is that noob friendly?
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Can 2 bunkers still wall a ramp in?
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All this thread has shown is how the community seems to have taken a nosedive the last 2 months. The amount of posts saying 'X deserves nerf cus they whine' or 'lol X whines l2p noobs' is just staggering. Before you post, try to be just a little bit objective. Resorting to namecalling and generalization is just gonna degrade the discussion in to something akin battle.net forums.
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EPT
