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The 100 Four Gate Challenge - Page 5

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10688 Posts
November 24 2010 09:31 GMT
#81
Your better, you win more.
bLuR
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada625 Posts
November 24 2010 09:40 GMT
#82
this thread is embarrassing...
haegN
Profile Joined July 2009
Norway533 Posts
November 24 2010 09:53 GMT
#83
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win
None can give you skills, ubermicro, wins or anything. If you are man - you take it!
haegN
Profile Joined July 2009
Norway533 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-24 09:55:25
November 24 2010 09:54 GMT
#84
On November 24 2010 18:40 bLuR wrote:
this thread is embarrassing...


Please elaborate. One liners that are not funny really does not contribute to the community -.-
None can give you skills, ubermicro, wins or anything. If you are man - you take it!
Jyon
Profile Joined November 2010
United Kingdom39 Posts
November 24 2010 10:23 GMT
#85
Whether or not you believe rehearsing this already well established build will improve your game and ability as a player or not - why 100 games?

Surely 20/25 would be more than enough time for a player of any ranking to aclimatise to the particulars (whether or not you argue there is any in a 4 gate) of the build, AND be enough time that the results can act as data regarding the general success of the strategy?

Personally as a Z player, objectively I'm not particularly bothered one way or the other - the more any one race confines themselves to a build, the more practice and familiarity I gain, which just eventually makes it easier for me to improve - but even if my only motivation to post is for the sake of interesting reading; I think this challenge could use a little more thought. As it stands, I think its likely that very few people will bother 4 gating for 100 games unless they were already planning on doing so, and even then I dont see that there is much to be gained at all by anaysing the results of a build that already enjoys widespread implementation and a great deal of success from bronze level execution to diamond.
haegN
Profile Joined July 2009
Norway533 Posts
November 24 2010 10:39 GMT
#86
On November 24 2010 19:23 Jyon wrote:
Whether or not you believe rehearsing this already well established build will improve your game and ability as a player or not - why 100 games?

Surely 20/25 would be more than enough time for a player of any ranking to aclimatise to the particulars (whether or not you argue there is any in a 4 gate) of the build, AND be enough time that the results can act as data regarding the general success of the strategy?

Personally as a Z player, objectively I'm not particularly bothered one way or the other - the more any one race confines themselves to a build, the more practice and familiarity I gain, which just eventually makes it easier for me to improve - but even if my only motivation to post is for the sake of interesting reading; I think this challenge could use a little more thought. As it stands, I think its likely that very few people will bother 4 gating for 100 games unless they were already planning on doing so, and even then I dont see that there is much to be gained at all by anaysing the results of a build that already enjoys widespread implementation and a great deal of success from bronze level execution to diamond.


I will sleep on in then come back with constructive feedback to your eloquent post.
None can give you skills, ubermicro, wins or anything. If you are man - you take it!
SteveNick
Profile Joined November 2008
United States304 Posts
November 24 2010 10:42 GMT
#87
I can already tell you that as a 1900 diamond player, if I start 4gating every game, my rating will at best, stay even, but most likely go down . 4gate opening has very little versatility.
It's all fun and games until somebody gets 4gated.
Joementum
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
787 Posts
November 24 2010 10:49 GMT
#88
On November 24 2010 18:53 haegN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win


LOL. If you really think 4-gating your way to the higher skill levels is the way to go, then please, keep wasting your time. I can't wait until you get to the point where all your 4-gate all ins are getting held off and you get roflstomped.
A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Wheres the counter?"
FetTerBender
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany1393 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-24 11:09:14
November 24 2010 11:08 GMT
#89
On November 24 2010 19:49 Joementum wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 18:53 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win


LOL. If you really think 4-gating your way to the higher skill levels is the way to go, then please, keep wasting your time. I can't wait until you get to the point where all your 4-gate all ins are getting held off and you get roflstomped.


Not wanting to be a smartass, but a 4-Gate is just a valid opener. Its aswell as i 6-pool (i think i even saw a replay of TLO doing a 6-pool versus Toss recently, where he did damage his opponents eco so hard that he was ahead in Drones after the Attack...)

It teaches you to micro, you can macro up / expand! while you attack and reinforce. As long as you execute it in a good way, there is nothing to criticise a 4-Gate toss for. I dont tech and try to cripple / kill my opponent early on. If it works, i am at least ahead in eco and can tech up, if a timing push fails you are (in most cases) behind, at least a little.

So... Why not do it?
There's a fine line between bravery and stupidity.
DDKz
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia188 Posts
November 24 2010 11:15 GMT
#90
I'm a gold level Terran player on NA, I have a SEA account were I started and is in the silver league which I somewhat play as off-race now and then, should I try to do this challenge and see where I can get from rank 1 silver after 100 4gate games? :D I think it'd be exciting but also probably bad for learning the game. :| Thoughts?
Joementum
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
787 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-24 11:22:18
November 24 2010 11:19 GMT
#91
On November 24 2010 20:08 FetTerBender wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 19:49 Joementum wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:53 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win


LOL. If you really think 4-gating your way to the higher skill levels is the way to go, then please, keep wasting your time. I can't wait until you get to the point where all your 4-gate all ins are getting held off and you get roflstomped.


Not wanting to be a smartass, but a 4-Gate is just a valid opener. Its aswell as i 6-pool (i think i even saw a replay of TLO doing a 6-pool versus Toss recently, where he did damage his opponents eco so hard that he was ahead in Drones after the Attack...)

It teaches you to micro, you can macro up / expand! while you attack and reinforce. As long as you execute it in a good way, there is nothing to criticise a 4-Gate toss for. I dont tech and try to cripple / kill my opponent early on. If it works, i am at least ahead in eco and can tech up, if a timing push fails you are (in most cases) behind, at least a little.

So... Why not do it?


Opening with just a 4-gate all the time is going to cripple you in the long-run. Most people don't know how to properly defend against a 4-gate and it's just going to get you up higher in the ladder than you should be. If you ever decide to transition out of just doing the 4-gate build all the time, then you're going to get roflstomped. Sure, you can do a 4-gate and then learn how to transition out of it, but chances are your opponent left and gg'd out before you even got a chance to transition out of the 4-gate, so when you start playing against people who defend the 4-gate build you won't know what the hell to do.

A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Wheres the counter?"
Panoptic
Profile Joined September 2009
United Kingdom515 Posts
November 24 2010 11:43 GMT
#92
On November 24 2010 18:53 haegN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win


Nope. Play to get better. You'll lose more games in the short term, win more in the long term.
"Crom laughs at your four winds!"
ABAH
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia43 Posts
November 24 2010 11:43 GMT
#93
On November 24 2010 15:32 MementoMori wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 15:30 Trebis wrote:
You forgot to add--all the players that have already been 4 gating for hundreds of games need to STOP and track their rating for another 100.


lol I totally support this


seconded.
reapers still do ~18 dmg per second against light ppl
mustache
Profile Joined April 2010
Switzerland309 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-24 11:55:18
November 24 2010 11:47 GMT
#94
lol how is this a challenge? every protoss and his brother up to 1800 diamond do 4 gate almost every game anyway. How about you challenge people to NOT do 4 gate for 100 games and see if they are still in diamond.

4 gating will teach you how to 4 gate and nothing else, it is not demanding macro wise and despite what everyone says it isn't demanding micro wiso either. how it can be more micro intense than a 200/200 army battle i dont understand. Surely a handfull of units (generally of 1-2 types) are less demanding than an army consisting HT stalkers zealots sentrys and collosus?
smallerk
Profile Joined October 2010
897 Posts
November 24 2010 11:52 GMT
#95
I stopped 4 gating frequently once i got promoted to diamond, i only really 4 gate on PvP sometimes(korean variant), because the matchup is just so retarded i cant be arsed to play a macro PvP, i also 4 gate vs zerg sometimes but never that often anymore, usually just go 3 gate blink stalkers which is way more effective.
Never Regret anything because at one time it was exactly what you wanted.
bobbingmatt
Profile Joined June 2010
Australia224 Posts
November 24 2010 11:52 GMT
#96
On November 24 2010 18:53 haegN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 24 2010 18:25 Spiegel wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:20 haegN wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:11 beef42 wrote:
On November 24 2010 18:06 hugedong wrote:
Out of all the pointless posts I've read on this site, this one takes the cake as the worst thread I have ever seen. The only thing it will do is get every bronze player to diamond in a few games, and absolutely suck after they try any other strategy.

Maybe if this was a 15 nexus for 100 games it would actually be beneficial to someone's play and not be the most boring thing you have ever done.


Please stop this build snobbery.

First of all, 15nexusing anywhere other than PvZ is instant lose.

Secondly, if 4gate wins games, why is it a bad build? Why are only macro builds "beneficial to someone's play"?


I agree, people saying you dont learn a lot from 4 gating is wrong, you definately learn to micro! Its a good build for having quick micro battles.


If you are winning 75% of games with 4 gate are you better or worse than someone who wins 60% of games with a macro oriented play?


I got 3 words for you brother.

Play To Win


Depends how you define winning, if you want to win most of your games now, go ahead and 4 gate. But if you want to win in the long term you will need to become better at the game by using less cheesy strategies.
no
justiceknight
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Singapore5741 Posts
November 24 2010 11:53 GMT
#97
I rather u hold a challenge that u will use 4 gate against any1 in this forum,the person who beat you will give u some sort of punishment.
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
November 24 2010 12:03 GMT
#98
how about 9001 fourgate games?!
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
November 24 2010 12:35 GMT
#99
There is nothing wrong with 4gating, and it not bad for learning the game. Sure if you 4gate your whole sc2 career it might not be so good but if you start by 4-gating alot you will eventually learn how to vary your 4gate to beat different kinds of opponent strategies and you will also learn when 4gate won't work, it's an excellent build to branch off from.
NastyMarine
Profile Blog Joined May 2006
United States1252 Posts
November 24 2010 12:37 GMT
#100
I will stop this every time as Terran. GL Protoss - submit yourself to me!
Treatin' fools since '87
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