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Active: 1205 users

Boxer: might go random if Terran gets nerfed again. - Page 6

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
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Sprouter
Profile Joined December 2009
United States1724 Posts
October 30 2010 04:55 GMT
#101
sick interview thanks for translating
snorlax
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States755 Posts
October 30 2010 04:58 GMT
#102
I dounbt he will switch to random if he does well in the upcoming gls
Vz0
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada378 Posts
October 30 2010 05:01 GMT
#103
On October 30 2010 13:24 D10 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 30 2010 13:20 We Are Here wrote:
i dont even think boxers even that good, back in his prime he was good for his time but not anymore




HERESY

yeah lets just ban everyone who disagrees or has a different opinion than you of "good"

I was banned back when I said "nada qued up a siege tank againts TLO"

Sure you could interpret that as 'nada sux balls" but thats not what I said, yet I was still banned for shit like that.

Its because of fanboys like that over react to every single slightly negative fact/opinion touching ur bonjwas .

Oh and what happened to

- Julyzerg wiill rofl stomp everyone after 1 week?
- NaDa will make TLO cry
- Foreigners have no chance !

???

How long has it been? Yet the top players are and have always been the ones from the beta

TesteR , Cool, IdrA (up the very recent)
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
October 30 2010 05:05 GMT
#104
On October 30 2010 14:01 Vz0 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 30 2010 13:24 D10 wrote:
On October 30 2010 13:20 We Are Here wrote:
i dont even think boxers even that good, back in his prime he was good for his time but not anymore




HERESY

yeah lets just ban everyone who disagrees or has a different opinion than you of "good"

I was banned back when I said "nada qued up a siege tank againts TLO"

Sure you could interpret that as 'nada sux balls" but thats not what I said, yet I was still banned for shit like that.

Its because of fanboys like that over react to every single slightly negative fact/opinion touching ur bonjwas .

Oh and what happened to

- Julyzerg wiill rofl stomp everyone after 1 week?
- NaDa will make TLO cry
- Foreigners have no chance !

???

How long has it been? Yet the top players are and have always been the ones from the beta

TesteR , Cool, IdrA (up the very recent)

hey all three of those got knocked out, and no foreigner in the Ro8 hmmmm
Writerptrk
muzzy
Profile Joined March 2010
United States640 Posts
October 30 2010 05:11 GMT
#105
On October 30 2010 14:05 ArvickHero wrote:
hey all three of those got knocked out, and no foreigner in the Ro8 hmmmm

Has nothing to do with the fact that they're foreigners... FruitDealer is out as well, but he won the last one... doesn't prove anything. There is a smaller pool of foreigners for the GSL, c'mon, it's in Korea... of course it will be that way.

Anyway, to try and stay on thread topic a bit-

Complaining that Terran is underpowered now? Oh c'mon... we go from everyone screaming "Terran OP!" to this in one patch? The game is more balanced now than it has ever been. Minor tweaks needed, but it's good.

Boxer is good, no doubt about it, but he's not a Tier 1 SC2 player yet... Maybe not even Tier 2. I'd put my vote on just about any Top 100 player over Boxer, honestly. He just needs more practice.

Give it a few months and my opinion will probably be different, favoring Boxer more.
canikizu
Profile Joined September 2010
4860 Posts
October 30 2010 05:14 GMT
#106
People keep saying that Terran players just simply don't adapt with the new patch, but forget that Zerg players also don't adapt with the new patch yet. When Zerg players get their timing right, they'll crush Terran too. It's just simply the snowball effect.
Bleak
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Turkey3059 Posts
October 30 2010 05:17 GMT
#107
I kinda think Boxer is right. At the moment, there isn't much what Terrans can do to gain advantage over Zerg, because imo most Zerg players have "evolved" to deflect any kind of early pressure with minimal resources and drone hard. After that point, Zerg are unstoppable with their ability to techswitch instantly to anything.

Zerg players are fairly comfortable dealing with MMM aswell, I kinda feel like Mech needs to be explored more against Zerg.

I think right now Nada can beat any Zerg tho, that guy has sick macro man!
"I am a beacon of knowledge blazing out across a black sea of ignorance. "
Silidons
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States2813 Posts
October 30 2010 05:21 GMT
#108
I think more terrans need to use ghosts vs protoss, this requires much more micro for the toss which is very hard to do while macroing since you can't just select your warpgates and have units constantly training, you actually have to go to to a pylon and "z-click, s-click, t-click" etc etc to spawn units.

Not enough Korean terrans use ghosts!
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon Bonaparte
Losticus
Profile Joined August 2010
United States62 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-30 05:38:09
October 30 2010 05:34 GMT
#109
Boxer is good, no doubt about it, but he's not a Tier 1 SC2 player yet... Maybe not even Tier 2. I'd put my vote on just about any Top 100 player over Boxer, honestly. He just needs more practice.


I guess all those "Tier 1" and "Tier 2" SC2 players no longer in the GSL didn't get the memo and forgot to sign up.

For the record, he's undefeated in the GSL and just made the BlizzCon runner-up look like a noob.


helokity
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada47 Posts
October 30 2010 05:37 GMT
#110
im baffled by the responses saying that BoxeR isnt even that good.
hes a great player and is up there in GSL2 rightfully so.
im not a fanboy and havent heard of him until recently because i had never played or got into sc until sc2 came out.
boxer is only noting that unless terrans do heavy rax play with timing pushes. it is pretty much banking on your opponent to make a mistake for any variation of mech play or late game play to win. terrans have the best early game and as the game progresses just get overrun by both zerg and toss.
i very highly doubt BoxeR would ever follow through with this as he is someone who continues sc because of his large fan base and ending his terran play this late wouldnt be his style.
on the contrary after watching NaDa recently, i think terran play might heavily evolve. ive never seen a terran macro and expand that hard before. in all this time of sc2, its the first variation of terran play ive seen and it looks like it may drastically improve mid game transitions
i'll agree that reapers were OP at the start but since being triple nerfed have been taken out of the game aside from being a weak scout that is easily picked off.
and although Terrans are not very UP right now, it is getting pretty frustrating having every patch have nerfed terrans the most. and it kind of needs to stop the nerfs is what BoxeR was getting at. especially when buffing other races. you can see that almost every zerg at the time of the patch was laughing and feeling bad for terrans because they knew the patch went overboard on changing ZvT
DooMDash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1015 Posts
October 30 2010 05:41 GMT
#111
2-0ing loner like he did.... takes some talent.
S1 3500+ Master T. S2 1600+ Master T.
Insanious
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada1251 Posts
October 30 2010 05:41 GMT
#112
I think that the big problem was that Zerg was UP compared to the other races.

This meant that the Z players had to play harder in order to compete vs T and P. So, they explored more parts of their races, and Z learned to deflect early harass with relative success.

Then came the latest patch. What happens? Now Z who has been working so hard to learn to survive vs early game anything has a little less to worry about. They have to cover less based, but their "defend with as little resource loss" skills have carried over. Now Z has learned the best ways to defend vs early game pressure but now with slower early game pressure (zealot time nerf, supply before rax, etc...) Z can now has a more consistent macro + defense pattern than before (where they had to worry about stupidly fast 2 gates and reaper rushes).

Now T and P have to adapt to not being able to bust in so early. Z changed their tactics very little... went from prepare for cheese -> scouted no cheese plays. T and P have to change the way they play all together as parts of their games were removed.

Z has been practicing this style of play since the game came out... T and P are just evolving. Now that Z, T, and P are relatively equal (T needs a small late game buff) Z has their strat ironed out and T and P are still trying to figure stuff out.

In time, T and P will learn a more optimal way of play, just currently we haven't seen is as there's been too little time.

I think Z is just a little more refined and evolved play as Z had to play that way due to being UP, T and P are catching up but really wont take long for them to figure out the new way to play, the new timings, and everything will be A OK once again.
If you want to help me out... http://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4b82744b816d3
NikonTC
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom418 Posts
October 30 2010 05:42 GMT
#113
Do terran really have the best early game? Up to what stage is classed as "early" these days. personally i'm finding it ridiculously hard to put any kind of pressure out at all without compromising myself utterly economically.
"IdrA crushes the marine push, absolutely demolishes this 2 rax play. Would not be suprised to see a GG from IdrA at any moment" Day[9]
YMCApylons
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Taiwan359 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-30 07:16:30
October 30 2010 06:01 GMT
#114
On October 30 2010 13:54 blade55555 wrote:
I also think Boxer will stay at top level play for a long time as long as he keeps playing and doesn't quit I doubt he'll fall behind. This isn't bw so macro should not hurt Boxer too much at least not like in bw. We'll see though only time will answer this question.


I don't know if this is true or not, but I was thinking the same thing.

SC2 makes macroing easier than BW, I don't know if anyone doubts this. So Boxer might find taking his third a little easier than he did in BW. With multiple building select, smart-cast on MULEs, its just much easier to be macroing hard as Terran.

But micro is still micro. Smart-cast and large control-groups are nice, but as Boxer showed in Ro16, with that awesome SCV ramp-block, you still need individual unit control. Think about Nada's marine spread against banelings. Virtually all BW-pros re-assign their army control groups on-the-fly, depending on what they need at the moment. Boxer is clearly a master at BW-micro.

And Terran micro is going to develop much more. Right now, Boxer is basically going Tank-Viking with extra mins in marines. But after future patches, I'd expect Boxer to come up with some creative uses for Ghosts and Ravens.

So the transition from SC:BW to SC2 might be helping Boxer more than most pros.

Finally, Boxer is by nature more of a creative player than a flawless macro perfectionist, and because the SC2 meta-game hasn't been mapped out like BW, there's still a lot of room for Boxer to wreak havoc with unconventional play. He's not going to be shut down by standard play, because standard play hasn't had time to develop and adapt to all the new things Boxer (and people like him) will throw at it. And every patch will give Boxer a little more room. My guess is Boxer has at least a year or two of "imba!" patches to exploit, and then another year as the metagame is mapped out.

But, I still think Nada > Boxer in SC2 circa 2010, because Nada >> Boxer in BW, circa 2009. There's just nothing quite like perfect SC:BW macro. There's just no comparison between something like Steppes of War or Metalopolis and the utterly massive maps of ICCUP BW. Put Nada in SC2, and he starts out-expanding zerg 30% of the time. FWIW.
You must construct additional pylons.
malaan
Profile Joined September 2010
365 Posts
October 30 2010 06:22 GMT
#115
Terran dropship play and free bunkers / STIM / MarOWDERS still own me on ladder
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
October 30 2010 06:41 GMT
#116
Terran was a joke when he picked it up in BW. I find it hard to believe/fathom his complaints about terran in SC2 when they are much better off and completely capable of winning any given game in any MU.
HomicidaL
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States283 Posts
October 30 2010 06:55 GMT
#117
Imo...Terran need to use more units other then just the bio ball. Ravens need to be used much more often...I really think once raven become popular they will be considered OP...the unit is amazing
intergalactic
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada428 Posts
October 30 2010 06:59 GMT
#118
On October 30 2010 06:09 YMCApylons wrote:

A: If Terran gets weakened again I might go random.



As a terran player, I am willing to embrace the nerfhammer in order for something like this to happen.
If you value your soul, do not look into the eye of an horse
JackDino
Profile Joined July 2010
Gabon6219 Posts
October 30 2010 07:12 GMT
#119
On October 30 2010 14:01 Vz0 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 30 2010 13:24 D10 wrote:
On October 30 2010 13:20 We Are Here wrote:
i dont even think boxers even that good, back in his prime he was good for his time but not anymore




HERESY

yeah lets just ban everyone who disagrees or has a different opinion than you of "good"

It has nothing to do with opinions, you don't question the emperor or talk down on him.
This isnt Broodwar so I dont owe anyone respect for beating me. -arb
Samus
Profile Joined July 2010
Australia47 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-30 07:16:26
October 30 2010 07:16 GMT
#120
On October 30 2010 15:55 HomicidaL wrote:
Imo...Terran need to use more units other then just the bio ball. Ravens need to be used much more often...I really think once raven become popular they will be considered OP...the unit is amazing


I don't think anyone gets the point
WE HAVE TO USE IT OTHERWISE THE ZERG AND PROTOSS WILL EXPAND AND MASS UP and beat us quicker.

Basically as Terran you must delay and stop the inevitable of you losing by pressuring the zerg and protoss and keeping them in check. Note what Nada did was every time the zerg expanded, nada had already expanded making sure he was on even footing with his zerg enemy and also kept harassing him with drops, timing attacks and what not to ensure that he could not mass up and beat him.

You need to these drops or timing attacks to ensure that their macro does not get out of hand.
If you leave a protoss or zerg for 15 minutes, their clump > your clump.

Boxer is not saying that Terran is Underpowered but he is saying that the way that the terran has to play is a problem because games will have to either end in 15 minutes or lower or the Terran will simply lose.

Engines are screaming
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