Official State of the Game Podcast Thread - Page 1238

On June 03 2011 13:39 kedinik wrote:


You are so admirably real.

Unless I guess there were any gay or black guys in the room and you had to say this out loud.

And you clearly already feel too uncomfortable even typing out nigger instead of nigga, even in this ridiculous little dramatic post on a practically anonymous website.

On June 03 2011 13:42 Avs wrote:
Hi,

I would like State of the Game to be represented by people who's opinions are neutrally balanced and debated with integrity and fairness. Jon Stewart jokes to keep it interesting helps, but let's not go overboard. Otherwise the "show" will never be anything more than what it is now, and either it will be eclipsed by esports/starcraft 2, or just never take off.

On June 03 2011 10:59 DMK 87 wrote:
hey

Does anyone know where to find that 5 min promovideo they talked about? The one where Idra apparently said f**k Huk or sth...

On June 03 2011 12:38 masterchip27 wrote:
If you're not asking for censorship, then do you still think it is wrong for me to use the term "rape" describing a game with a friend who takes 0 offense to it and is not misogynist? If you think it's wrong, then it sure sounds like you're asking for people to censor themselves, if not, then I'd tend to agree with you.

On June 03 2011 15:39 SSLPrism wrote:
I thought the appropriate language talk was very hypocritical from some of the people involved, not just when they defended that certain words were ok while others werent, the fact that they've used the same terminology before.

For example, I was going to an old clan war thread to look for some information, and found this post on this page: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=164034&currentpage=4

"Motbob you are retarded lol

Criticizing someone's play IS 100% exactly what I JUST THIS THREAD said was fine. It was as fucking constructive as it gets. If I said "LOLOLOL SELECT SUCKS" I would be doing what that comment says.

jesus fucking christ I shouldn't reply to this trash but I can't help it."


Maybe I'm just alone in thinking part of this episode was very ironic/hypocritical.

On June 03 2011 15:50 Rabiator wrote:

I think that some people went too far in the past (just look at some of Day9's early casts) and slowly realize that using such childish immature swearing language actually doesnt make you a grown up adult. Trying to change your habits does take time, so only the future will tell if iNcontrol stops swearing (not even using it for those aggressive jokes he loves) and wasnt hypocritical or if he doesnt do it and was hypocritical. Personally I hope for the first.

There are just some people who have realized the importance of language, while others dont care or want to be the 13 year old rebels who use "forbidden words" to make themselves sound more grown up. Well here is a hint: you dont sound more grown up, you just sound dumber than you might be.

Just try it yourself ... dont use "shit" and "fuck" at all for a week and see how easy it is. It isnt if you were used to using those words reguarly, so it isnt a "flip the switch" thing.

On June 03 2011 14:03 Harrow wrote:


One person can't ask another person to "censor themselves" since censorship involved some kind of governing or controlling body to impose a rule on expression. This isn't a debate about censorship and I wish people would stop trying to paint it as some kind of FREE SPEECH AMERICA FUCK YEAH thing.

I don't think it should be illegal for you to say "dude I raped that protoss" to one guy in a room. It doesn't necessarily do any harm either, but I think more people should question their use of the word in a world in which one in six women are raped at least once in their lifetime (and one in 33 men). Rape is woefully prevalent and terrifyingly under-prosecuted, which indicates that somehow it's far more legitimized and taken far less seriously than it should be.

That culture is the context and the debate is about whether or not we should be using words and concepts in a way that downplays their significance. Of COURSE context matters; if I climb into bed and whisper "rape" quietly into my pillow, no fairies cry. But if someone like Destiny broadcasts a rape joke to thousands of people, could he cause immediate and actual harm to a listener who happens to be a rape survivor with post-traumatic stress disorder and related psychological triggers? It's very possible. And if that isn't happening, is he playing his part in a culture that allows rape to happen too often and doesn't punish it frequently enough or harshly enough? Obviously I accept that that's debatable. But I say yes, to a small degree. And choosing a different fucking word is a pretty small price to pay to be safe. It's not like saying "rape" is an hilariously original joke at this point.

Destiny made a great point on how far you can go with this line of thought, what about "nuke", "kill", "massacre" etc? Hell, for a world war 2 survivor of the nazi camps I'd guess even the word "shower" can be traumatic if you go on this tangent of though.

On June 03 2011 16:50 TuCraiN wrote:



Although I agree with destiny as far is his point goes but this reasoning is falling down the slippery slope fallacy.

On June 03 2011 16:39 svarog wrote:


I take issue with a lot of what you say here. I'd find it rather disturbing if you were whispering "rape" quietly into your pillow, and I'd have no problem if you used it publicly in a non-sexual context, or just like you used the word "fuck" at the end of your post.

The reasoning that some rape victim might hear the word, get offended, hurt and suffer a psychological trigger event is idiotic in my opinion. This reasoning is equal to me saying that everybody that I know owns at least one pair of blue jeans, therefore there is high probability that rape victims have been raped by someone wearing a pair of blue jeans, and in conclusion we should all just not wear blue jeans in public.

Destiny made a great point on how far you can go with this line of thought, what about "nuke", "kill", "massacre" etc? Hell, for a world war 2 survivor of the nazi camps I'd guess even the word "shower" can be traumatic if you go on this tangent of though.

Context is all that mattters, words no matter what else they can describe are just there to put a point across. The context in which "rape" is being used in gaming for me coveys a very precise emotion of such an overwhelming victory that boosts your ego in a way only online gaming can. And saying that you raped or are going to rape someone in this context is far less disrespectfull or hurtfull to the individual than just blankly labeling them as an idiot.

On June 03 2011 17:06 SSLPrism wrote:


I'm sorry if it seems like I'm ignoring your entire post, but are you kidding me? Calling someone a retard is not just labeling them an idiot, I honestly don't even want to go far into this subject. Clearly from your text it seems that you don't have a family member/close friend that suffers from mental retardation, why is it ok to label rape as offensive/shouldnt be used in a kiddingly way while retard is ok to joke around with? I hope you can open your mind to other aspects of the world, I myself have a close family member who suffers from the disease, and does his best to go on with his life.

Where is context ok, is where I would respond to you. If the term 'rape' isnt allowed to be used around in a jokingly fashion then why is 'retard' or 'retarded' allowed to be used? Why is it ok for some to be defensive about the term/action rape, but not retard, or other forms of insults that have conveyed themselves into insults/jokes/modern language?

Using retard is a FAR more offensive term to me, but I suppose that is because I have respect for those who weren't as well set off as the rest of us from birth, while rape is a violent, terrible act, having mental problems is such a tough challenge in life.

On June 03 2011 17:29 svarog wrote:


I agree, calling someone idiot is far more dismissive and/or offensive than using the word rape to describe something.

But look, noone is celebrating because of the fact that there are people with disabilities when they use such words to push a compeltely different point across. If I say that something/someone is retarded I am not making a case that they suffer from a mental disability (or whatever the politicaly correct term is) it isn't even a stab at mentally retarded people, it is a joke/stab at the other person's opinions or actions, and by coloring them to the extreme we can describe our thoughts and beliefs better.

And this is the point that I am trying to make. If people need to change something, it is not the way they talk and what words they use but rather they should just learn to pay more attention to the context and intent of the post/discussion and not just rage off on the first word that out of context is derogatory. If this is acheived we get still to have colorfull use of words, interesting debates and mutual respect. And if we go down the road the SOTG crew suggested then we just ignore the issue alltogether, people will still find some other words to be outraged about, context will still be ignored and with that every point that you're trying to push across and explain gets lost due to semantics.

On June 03 2011 17:06 SSLPrism wrote:


I'm sorry if it seems like I'm ignoring your entire post, but are you kidding me? Calling someone a retard is not just labeling them an idiot, I honestly don't even want to go far into this subject. Clearly from your text it seems that you don't have a family member/close friend that suffers from mental retardation, why is it ok to label rape as offensive/shouldnt be used in a kiddingly way while retard is ok to joke around with? I hope you can open your mind to other aspects of the world, I myself have a close family member who suffers from the disease, and does his best to go on with his life.

Where is context ok, is where I would respond to you. If the term 'rape' isnt allowed to be used around in a jokingly fashion then why is 'retard' or 'retarded' allowed to be used? Why is it ok for some to be defensive about the term/action rape, but not retard, or other forms of insults that have conveyed themselves into insults/jokes/modern language?

Using retard is a FAR more offensive term to me, but I suppose that is because I have respect for those who weren't as well set off as the rest of us from birth, while rape is a violent, terrible act, having mental problems is such a tough challenge in life.

On June 03 2011 17:51 lichter wrote:
retard
–verb (used with object)
1.
to make slow; delay the development or progress of (an action, process, etc.); hinder or impede.

The word "retarded" isn't solely used to describe people with mental retardation or disability. It can be used in other unrelated contexts as well.

Can a better, less politically incorrect (seriously, I hate this PC bullshit, but I understand why people go with it) word be used? Yeah, sure. But just because someone uses the word "retard" or "retarded", doesn't mean they are talking about, insulting, disparaging, etc, the mentally handicapped. They COULD be using it in a contextually appropriate way.

For example:

"His strategy was retarded by that gas steal"

I understand that people will RARELY, if ever, use the term retard correctly, but that doesn't mean that everyone who uses the word is an insensitive jerk. They may just know what the word means.

But yeah some people really are jerks. Context context.

On June 02 2011 17:19 Maliris wrote:

top4 mlg after cheesing everyone is the same as top8 in the GSL? Interesting