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On August 05 2010 07:08 HowardRoark wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2010 06:18 tehemperorer wrote: It's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. Losing to Terran as Zerg doesn't mean the matchup is imba, it means that as a community, Zerg players still haven't caught on to strong ways to deal with Terran. That's my belief; it is more rewarding to try and think of a clever way to beat T than to complain about the difficulty of it. You are wrong IMO. What you are saying are true at the highest level of skill most foreigners will never be able to reach. What is bugging me so much about the poor design of Starcraft 2 is that at any level but top diamond the Zerg are not skilled enough to beat a similar skilled terran, or protoss. The issue is not as big as if there were imbalances at the pro level, but it will water down the game if at any level below top diamond there are glaring imbalances that skew up the player statistics. Any noob that start playing Zerg in Starcraft 2 will instead of just quit hopefully play protoss instead, but they could quit aswell. In Starcraft 1 there were these imbalances at D level for Terran players versus Protoss. Protoss was so much easier to play than Terran that at that level we had total roflstomping. In SC2 this has been taken to the extreme, but instead of Terran being the hard race compared to Protoss at lower levels, Zerg are now ridiculously hard compared to the Protoss (that is even easier than in SC1) that it almost feels like two different games playing Z instead of P. EDIT: Again as I am reading through your post, I must make it plain why this is a problem: In SC1 the small imbalances Terran had a lower levels were just a spice to the game, but in SC2 it has gone too far. The Zerg shouldn't need to be at triple the APM and always walking the thin line between dying, scouting, flanking, and expanding vs the other two races that at that level doesn't even have to scout, but just build a wall, make 2 collossi with some stalkers, control group on "1" and then just sit by and watch. Actually, IMO Terran are not as bad as Protoss, since some of the harder mechanics of SC1 Terran are still in this game. amen brother! preach it!!! in the mean time toss here i come!
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I started playing z in sc2 because I enjoyed them so much in sc/bw. Didn't take long to discover that they aren't the same thing. But I've stuck with them anyway - the game has only been out of beta a few weeks, it's way to early to say.
My decision is probably partly influenced by the fact that I am still a very poor player and so inherent structural weaknesses in particular match-ups aren't the primarily reason for my losses... ><
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I play more games as random, with time, partly because of how unstable zerg is (which makes me want to understand the other races better and better). I see how your zerg play improves when you get more games as T and P too, under your belt. Not surprisingly, some of the best zerg players have serious experience with other races as well (IdrA, TLO etc).
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I voted I still play Zerg, but after losing 99% of 1v1 vs Terran I'm thinking about switching to Toss.
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Most of the people I play against in Bnet are playing Protoss. I rarely go up against zerg and terran.
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I actually don't mind ZvT at all, but I'm not at IdrA's level yet so I guess I can't really contradict his opinions.
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i have switched, but because of another reason.
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I play Zerg, but recently I've been off-racing as Terran (and taking a huge hit to my Win-Loss record as I learned), because their units are much more specialized and their build orders have much more room for diversity.
My worst MU with both races are still the mirror matchups.
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Still playing zerg since the beta. Have been rolling with random just to learn about the game itself. Unit interactions, Timings for pushes, all good to experience in how to deal with it when I go back to Zerg. Sort of, looking at the issue from the other side of the fence.
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still playing zerg, praying for bigger maps
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Long live the SWARM!
I think that the current standard play is not good against terran. But someone will find something. Each race has its seasons of ups and downs, it happened in BW, too.
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I've ended up with zerg being my favourite race. And I really dont think they're inferior other races in any way.
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Have played Z since I got a beta key back in april. Sticking to it since I like the heavy macro, somewhat dependent on positioning style of play. Heck you even get some micro(not that much though ) with the ultras and banelings. Playing Z just feels right for me vs what I've experienced from playing terran and protoss. The fact that you have to work hard against terran(my worst matchup) and that against P it's somewhat balanced(would say that Z is at an advantage once you get infestors) is just icing on the cake since I like a challenge.
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Getting closer to deciding if I want to spend my main time as a zerg or a toss. I love the terran race and units but I just don't care for the feel I get when I play them. The fact terrans are hugely popular (due to campaign familiarity) doesn't come into my decision at all. Then again alot of beta time might have to do with that.
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i cannot decide which race suits me best... terran have interesting units but the whole gamestyle doesnt fit me at all. so im currently stuck with zerg and im not influenced by all the terrans that are coming up because of the campaign.
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Played zerg in the beta, switched to protoss in phase 2.
I was surprised how much easier it was to get a win in the same league as where I was having trouble as zerg.
Then at the release I switched back to zerg. I played zerg in BW and the whole style just suits me a lot more. Plus I hate terran and protoss building mechanics :3 .
I figured as I will play starcraft II a lot anyway I might aswell pick the hard race and train with it really well, then if they buff it I will dominate ^^.
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I still play zerg (played terran back then). And guys, you know why is it good that we play underpowered zerg? We will be much much better when things will get balanced 
So in a long run I think we benefit more cuz we have to play really well to actually win
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It's true that there are a lot of Terrans on the ladder, but most of them are not beta players and therefore bad.
Most of the good players( beta players and non-beta BW players) will have already picked their race, so in essence the only change to the player pool post-release is a large influx of weak Terran players. Good Zergs will crush those players the same as any good Terran or Protoss would, so I don't see why it's that much harder for Zerg players now than in the beta...
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On August 05 2010 21:17 FuRong wrote: It's true that there are a lot of Terrans on the ladder, but most of them are not beta players and therefore bad.
Most of the good players( beta players and non-beta BW players) will have already picked their race, so in essence the only change to the player pool post-release is a large influx of weak Terran players. Good Zergs will crush those players the same as any good Terran or Protoss would, so I don't see why it's that much harder for Zerg players now than in the beta...
lol were you sleeping for past 2 weeks ?
And regarding your first statement, did you see statistic for TOP diamond 100/1000/5000 ?
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