EPTDo the blizzard people nerf ultralisk on purpose? - Page 5
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Noise
Australia47 Posts
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tarsier
United Kingdom223 Posts
if the findings are that ultra is still underused, then blizzard will change it again. just remember that making ultra own marauders just because the zerg player is too stubborn to use the tried & tested hydralisks would likely make TvZ almost impossible for terran the player. | ||
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fuzzehbunneh
United States66 Posts
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BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
anyone who defends all the changes has no clue at sc, these single target buff/debuff spells have absolutely no place in SC style gameplay Yeah, I certainly hope they don't put in a debuff spell on the Raven that only affects biological targets and causes them to take ~300 damage over time and spread this damage over to nearby biological targets. I hope they don't put a Buff spell that gives +250 hp onto a friendly unit and decreases all incoming damage to 1. I hope they don't put a debuff on the Overseer that, when cast on an enemy unit gives you LoS of their location. I hope they don't put in a Mind Control ability that permanently gave you control of the unit instead of that pusscake ability Neural Parasite. I hope they don't give the medivac two abilities, one that removed any negative debuff on a friendly unit, and one that would debuff an enemy unit so that it had no line of sight and depending on nearby friendly units for LoS. God, who the fuck would want to play that game? | ||
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Equaoh
Canada427 Posts
I personally have the sneaking suspicion that Blizzard is content to pander to their larger customer base - the casual silver/bronze players, etc (void ray nerf unnecessary if you look at high level play, for example?). Unfortunately, I don't think you can make a gaming experience that is equally balanced at all levels and a spectator sport. Look at sc - at D levels people complained about protoss being 1a2a3a easyrace, and terran mech was nearly invincible. Those complaints didn't deserve rebalances. That being said - Ultras had problems against anti-armored units before. Forcing them to be used against armored units (most of which are anti-armored), coupled with an HP nerf just seems ill thought out? I'd like to see frenzy as a cooldown ability on the ultra - no dmg buff, just make it immune to stun and increase its speed for 5s or so? Just so they can initiate, maybe flank a bit more easily without being cut down before reaching the battle. | ||
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BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
And what does competitive play have to do with it anyway? Blizzard made those abilities because they were fun, completely original and made the game cooler to play (and make cool puzzle levels like the Dalyrian shipyards and that first Zerg level in BW). SC style gameplay is what Blizzard said it should be, not what a bunch of insane Koreans teenagers decided it should be. | ||
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danl9rm
United States3111 Posts
On May 23 2010 13:31 IdrA wrote: well they make a lot of mistakes and dont fully understand what theyre doing but thats kind of ridiculous. making collosus, thors, capital ships take an extra 20% damage is well worth clicking on them and theres nothing inherently un-sc about it. there were single target spells aimed at knocking out powerful units in sc1, but you cant have something like lockdown in sc2 because smartcast would make it overpowered. so things like corruption are the middle ground. that being said frenzy is retarded and will never be used over fungal. lol, really gotta agree here. and to the OP: I've thought the same since I saw the patch notes  | ||
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OreoBoi
Canada1639 Posts
On May 23 2010 23:43 iaguz wrote: So? That's not important, he stated that 'sc style gameplay absolutely has no place for single target buff/debuffs' and I showed how full of shit that comment is. Yes, frenzy and corruption are 'boring' in that they don't change the game majorly once you cast them and don't have much use other then their one role (ie, killing colosi and buffing some unit I don't use anymore) and I agree that these abilities are boring and too narrow and should definitely be improved but that's not what I'm getting at here. And what does competitive play have to do with it anyway? Blizzard made those abilities because they were fun, completely original and made the game cooler to play (and make cool puzzle levels like the Dalyrian shipyards and that first Zerg level in BW). SC style gameplay is what Blizzard said it should be, not what a bunch of insane Koreans teenagers decided it should be. Irradiate isn't a debuff... Its a damage over time spell. D-matrix is a buff, but I think its more of an sc style buff. It adds a set amount of hp to a unit, not this percentage over this period of time. So you're saying, Blizzard should make SC style gameplay whatever they want it to be and throw away what made it so popular. Competitive play is the most important thing to prolong a game's lifespan. If there was no competitive scene, do you think brood war would be played so much after all those years? | ||
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teekesselchen
Germany886 Posts
On May 23 2010 19:48 Stationary wrote: Hey guys, I don't know if you know this but 3 zealots actually take out and ultra lol. + Show Spoiler + Ultras are totally useful, now the protoss just need to make zealots instead of sentrys. I'm not saying "hey guys look ultras don't counter tier 1 light units anymore". All I'm saying is, every protoss player has the means to build zealots, and if just a few zealots are enough to counter X ultras cost efficiently, why bother going for TIER 3 ultra at all? The terran... Well I guess I don't even have to call that. This is an ultralisk in a situation where it cannot use it's splash damage and, I think, does not have any upgrades. Now I'm rather a terran than a zerg player but when I went ultralisks (what I sometimes did for fun before patch) I always had at least 1-1 tech and ultralisk extra armor when engaging. In lategame when there are ultralisks, this situation that ultralisks cannot use their splash is very very unlikely. Also, there are many high tier units that will not come out cost efficiently against low tier units because they have a certain situation they need to be in. For new ultralisks, this would be: - have techs - have frenzy - use them either against armored targets or many small AoEable targets Also, they now have this value that cannot be put in numbers, which is that it will help alot against forcefields. Btw consider to use them as drops and not in bad situations like a widespread group of tanks or in front of a 20-marauder-group without supporting it. | ||
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bendez
Canada283 Posts
Btw consider to use them as drops and not in bad situations like a widespread group of tanks or in front of a 20-marauder-group without supporting it. That's why ultras are not viable. Every terran will have marauder heavy army, or mech build which consists of group of tanks. Not sure why these non-zerg players are claiming ultras are viable in the first place. | ||
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iounas
409 Posts
http://imgur.com/eqvqS.jpg http://imgur.com/jxOKd.jpg something in my throat.. | ||
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lololol
5198 Posts
It's pretty much useless to cast it just for the bonus damage and again ultras benefit from that the most with a gain of 11.6 DPS against armored targets + splash(hydras are in second place with a gain of 3.6 DPS, which is a waste of infestor energy). | ||
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HubertFelix
France631 Posts
The problem is that they hard counter nothing which is standart, they have no role in this game. What's the point of those spells if they can't be used? | ||
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marshmallow
United States93 Posts
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
On May 24 2010 02:08 marshmallow wrote: Blizz is trying to give the ultra survivability and the infestor a good spell but without using dark swarm. GL with that. Blizz is giving the ultra survivability by reducing its hp by 25% | ||
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Backpack
United States1776 Posts
On May 23 2010 20:01 Tinithor wrote: Lol WC3 and WoW , what terrible games to reference in terms of balance. Yet, they are all successful e-sports. Amazing! | ||
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
On May 24 2010 02:10 Backpack wrote: Yet, they are all successful e-sports. Amazing! Define successful. The Blizzard devs have all but said Arena is a failure because the game wasn't originally designed for competitive play. They are even moving away from Arena in the next expansion and into rated bgs because it sucks so much. Just because a small minority of players play it at a competitive level in blizzard sponsored tournaments doesn't make it a success. In fact it has no sustainability without Blizzard events WC3 is a success in my opinion, it's just overshadowed by SC so often that people don't realize it has/had a big scene Actually come to think of it wow arena is a pretty good example of why Blizzard shouldn't try to exert too much control of SC2 competitive play. They pushed really hard to make arena an esport and it has for all intents failed | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
There- I just solved 3 things- the ultra, frenzy, and zvt. Thank me later. | ||
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7mk
Germany10157 Posts
On May 23 2010 13:56 travis wrote: alright well u clearly would know better than I would if it has a place in the game but I still do hate it, if only cuz im slow and it just feels like added actions to me (I wouldn't complain if it added some sort of strategy element, but I really don't think it does) I agree with idra that there's nothing un-sc1-like about single unit spells in general, and also about corruption being useful vs colossi, but I absolutely agree with you that the spell is just really stupid because it's incredibly boring. There's nothing original or exciting about it. Think about defense matrix, it's not the most original spell in the world but It causes lots of excitement when it's casted on a marine and causes you to take out several lurkers with a small force. Or think about that Jaedong vs Firebathero game on I believe destination, where FBH casted def matrix on his battlecruiser a split second before tons of scourge hit it. Def matrix was used way less than irradiate and EMP but was still an interesting spell. There will never be anything exciting ever about the new corruption spell. | ||
Zelniq
United States7166 Posts
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