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On January 18 2013 07:51 lorestarcraft wrote:
The burrow at hatch is such a joke. By by harassment of any kind, just burrow your drones at 5 minutes.
You are neglecting the amount of time burrow takes to research (100 in game seconds), plus that means more drones on gas for longer to get speed (assuming you want it that is).
There will be all ins that can be done with it sure but I see this being more pertinent to ZvZ than any other match up.
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They couldn't find a way to visually communicate to players the void ray attack? Common guys, simplicity should win over an overburden ui.
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Good patch overall. I really like the way HOTS is finally apart from swarm host.
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United States7483 Posts
Why the hell do they nerf void rays by increasing supply, but let the infestors run amok at 2 supply for months? I don't understand them sometimes.
Increasing supply cost of units is something you do if you only want to see a few of those units on the field at any point in time. The void ray, as is, has no real function. It's kind of a flying anti-armored unit but isn't really fast enough to be good for actual harass other than concentrated pressure, and it's only late game use is to fight against slow but powerful units who can't micro away from it anyway.
It just feels like a unit with an identity crisis. I don't know what blizzard wants me to do with it, and it's super expensive.
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I already explained my thoughts in the other thread on burrow, but I still think it is really dumb. It shuts down the early pressure potential of the other races even harder than it already was.
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On January 18 2013 08:09 Larkin wrote:Show nested quote +Players are really forced to utilize the Reaper’s passive healing ability between attacks in order to maximize the unit’s efficiency. We'd like to further promote this type of play by slightly increasing Reaper health. Forced to utilise? I don't think people are like "oh no, I have to have my units regen their health before I can go and do even more economic damage in the early game, woe is me  " It's a gift as it is. I guess Blizz really wants Terrans to use Reapers. That can come out even earlier, move faster, have more health which regens. I fear that Nexus/Hatch first against Terran is going to become next to impossible if the Reaper keeps being buffed.
Oh come on, new Reaper is not nearly as good as the one from the balance update #10 was. They are buffing it because it is back to being a scout again instead of doing economic damage.
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any harass against zerg will be meaningless with burrow you will need to waste a couple of mules to get the scans needed to kill enough to get ahead economic
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I don't get the burrow change. This makes zerg even harder to stop from getting 200 drones, and allows to delay expansions easier. I can't think of any offensive usage of burrow at hatch. It only promotes loooong mutlibase plays, which are already prevailing.
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On January 18 2013 08:09 Larkin wrote:
I fear that Nexus/Hatch first against Terran is going to become next to impossible if the Reaper keeps being buffed.
There is nothing holy that says hatch first must be standard in HotS (and heck, I play zerg).
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On January 18 2013 08:00 Snowbear wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2013 07:06 eviltomahawk wrote:
Burrow
We decided to move the Burrow upgrade requirement to the Hatchery, because we feel that early Burrow usage with units like Zerglings, Banelings, and Roaches creates potential for more action during the early game. Furthermore, the initial feedback from players has been very positive regarding this change, and we've already seen Zerg internal testers pull off some neat tricks using Burrow. What you forget, dear David Kim, is: 1) This makes expansions even harder to take. Ever been blocked by creep? Now we also need to scan to land out command center. 2) When we push out, we need to be even more carefull --> burrowed banelings.
*Cough* Widow mines *Cough*
Honestly I don't think it's a problem. The use of detection are care on the map are becoming more important all round in HoST. It's just a skill we need to develop.
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On January 18 2013 08:07 FLuE wrote:Show nested quote +The burrow at hatch is such a joke. By by harassment of any kind, just burrow your drones at 5 minutes. That is like saying you don't like the spore w/out an evo because air harassment will never work yet it still does. Just because it is at hatchery tech doesn't mean it will be a standard upgrade all zergs will get. That is a considerable investment in the early game simply for the chance you'll need to burrow your drones. The fact is that the hatchery burrow will come into play when people are going for some sorta of specific build/timing/tricky play in the early game. After that it really won't be a huge deal at all. Just think of it this way, people hardly upgrade burrow even in the late game w/ excess resources so don't act like it is game breaking. Cool change, the more that is available early the better as long as there are scouting options for it.
I wish we could add this to the OP. I know it shouldn't but it's starting to really annoy me seeing people write nonsense.
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4supply voidrays sounds a bit wild to me.. it's not like they're a tier 3 unit lol.
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On January 18 2013 07:58 Nazeron wrote:
wonder how the burrow will be utilized against the sentry immortal all in, over i like the changes a lot
I don't understand how burrow is relevant to the sentry immortal all-in?
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Can anyone confirm if the MLG Bo7 showmatch is done/if the HotS server is down yet?
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On January 18 2013 08:17 FutureBreedMachine wrote:
4supply voidrays sounds a bit wild to me.. it's not like they're a tier 3 unit lol.
Trust me, with how strong their beam is, they are tier 3 units. 
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On January 18 2013 08:16 Tommyth wrote:
I don't get the burrow change. This makes zerg even harder to stop from getting 200 drones, and allows to delay expansions easier. I can't think of any offensive usage of burrow at hatch. It only promotes loooong mutlibase plays, which are already prevailing.
Have you even played HotS? Harrass vs zerg is MUCH stronger in HotS, it is actually significantly harder to just drone and both terran and protoss have new defensive tools that allow them to be more greedy, if they want.
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Austria24417 Posts
On January 18 2013 08:18 MilesTeg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2013 07:58 Nazeron wrote:
wonder how the burrow will be utilized against the sentry immortal all in, over i like the changes a lot I don't understand how burrow is relevant to the sentry immortal all-in?
Baneling landmines. Will delay the push for a few seconds until obs is out, don't think it matters too much. Though not sure if the all in will stick around at all.
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On January 18 2013 08:18 MilesTeg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2013 07:58 Nazeron wrote:
wonder how the burrow will be utilized against the sentry immortal all in, over i like the changes a lot I don't understand how burrow is relevant to the sentry immortal all-in?
In theory the Zerg could set up some kind of mass burrowed Zergling / Roach army on the Protoss' path, assuming they don't have Observer. Not having to close the distance and being up close & personal with the Sentries is something Zergs tend to like. Not sure if it really works out so well every time though.
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Reaper change means nothing, not that is a problem because I would rather the Reaper be an expensive scout than be overpowered.
I wish they would just buff siege tank damage but give the upgrade back. It's a beta... Just give it +10-15 damage and see how it goes.
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On January 18 2013 08:18 MilesTeg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2013 07:58 Nazeron wrote:
wonder how the burrow will be utilized against the sentry immortal all in, over i like the changes a lot I don't understand how burrow is relevant to the sentry immortal all-in?
you make tones of roaches , you burrow move under immortals you unborrow and PROFIT since 3 immortals wont kill more then 3-6 roaches while you move under and neighter will a handful of sentrys
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EPT
