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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/6160877076 Basically, all units run automatically out of Blinding Cloud, which really negates the effectivity of Viper against Bio based compositions. It completely disables Tanks on the other hand, which is silly if you take into account that Viper was introduced as a unit to deal with large packs of marines and at the very beginning Blinding Cloud did not affect mechanical units at all. | ||
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Berceno
Spain401 Posts
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TheManInBlack
Nigeria266 Posts
On December 18 2012 21:58 Berceno wrote: who cares how was the spell the first day?? I'm happy with blinding cloud, now terran should spread his tanks and not make a big ball of 15tanks clumped How is this post relevant to the topic? Anyway, I agree it is an issue. The A.I shouldn't be micro'ing for the Terran and running his units out of the cloud. And considering the range of bio in relevance to the range at which the Binding cloud is usually casted, units will just run a couple of spaces out of the cloud and then start shooting from range again. I liked the original posters idea though, to have ranged units not do any damage when in the cloud, although I guess the spell cost would have to increased - Ling armies would tear everything apart. | ||
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DemigodcelpH
1138 Posts
On December 18 2012 21:58 Berceno wrote: who cares how was the spell the first day?? I'm happy with blinding cloud, now terran should spread his tanks and not make a big ball of 15tanks clumped I like your enthusiasm, but Idra himself has recently said that Terrans can't mech with Vipers being in the unit pool. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9404 Posts
On December 18 2012 21:58 Berceno wrote: who cares how was the spell the first day?? I'm happy with blinding cloud, now terran should spread his tanks and not make a big ball of 15tanks clumped Well you can kinda do that and you still get raped. If you have to split out perfectly all the time then we almost have the same issue as playing against the imbalanced 9 range instant fungal growth; Terrans has to play perfectly to win and it requires way more skills to win with terran than with zerg. | ||
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MilesTeg
France1271 Posts
Basically, I don't think there's any point in trying to make cloud good against Bio. It's a good spell against other things, and it works well as it is in my opinion. | ||
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Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On December 18 2012 21:58 Berceno wrote: who cares how was the spell the first day?? I'm happy with blinding cloud, now terran should spread his tanks and not make a big ball of 15tanks clumped In case you did not catch it, I'm proposing a buff to Viper so that bio units don't move by themself from Blinding Cloud. So please, mad Zerg player, think before you just post something. Also, the note about mechanical vs bio units being affected by Blinding Cloud is just a note. If someone, then Blizzard at least should care how units designed by themselves are being used. | ||
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MilesTeg
France1271 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:04 DemigodcelpH wrote: I like your enthusiasm, but Idra himself has recently said that Terrans can't mech with Vipers being in the unit pool. If Idra, a guy who has never been wrong, said that... ok, I'm convinced. | ||
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DemigodcelpH
1138 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:06 MilesTeg wrote: If Idra, a guy who has never been wrong, said that... ok, I'm convinced. He's human just like anyone else, however when professional Zerg players are saying you can't mech vs Zerg then you likely can't mech vs Zerg. This is a beta. It's good that we're getting feedback like this from higher sources. | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:06 MilesTeg wrote: If Idra, a guy who has never been wrong, said that... ok, I'm convinced. Nononooo, if Idra, our Idra said that Terran can't do something, you know that really something is wrong lol.. :D | ||
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Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:10 DemigodcelpH wrote: He's human just like anyone else, however when professional Zerg players are saying you can't mech vs Zerg then you likely can't mech vs Zerg. This is a beta. It's good that we're getting feedback like this from higher sources. Don't know if his opinion is accurate. | ||
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Markwerf
Netherlands3728 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:04 DemigodcelpH wrote: I like your enthusiasm, but Idra himself has recently said that Terrans can't mech with Vipers being in the unit pool. I hardly believe that to be true.. Mech can make it very hard for zerg to get to hive comfortable and a couple vikings + tank spread do really well to prevent blinding cloud from being too bad. | ||
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MilesTeg
France1271 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:11 Everlong wrote: Nononooo, if Idra, our Idra said that Terran can't do something, you know that really something is wrong lol.. :D He has a tendency to jump to conclusions. I wonder how much he's played with it before saying that. You can't just quote Idra like anything he says is an established fact. In my experience Mech is very viable, and Bio/Mech is in my opinion the strongest option for Terran vs Zerg. Anyway that's not really the issue here.I thought the topic was about Bio. We're all just answering a guy who just took this as an opportunity to whine... (my bad). | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:05 Wildmoon wrote: It's still effective agaisnt bio anyway because AI automatically moves forward to reach the range which is not what terran want to do. Who wanna hug Ultra? Indeed, how would it be considered a nerf for bio if they didnt immediatly run forward towards their doom when under blinding cloud? When I had it happen to me I was seriously considering shooting my own bio for being retarded. The zerg already took care of that, so it wasn't necesary, but I really dont consider it a pro they walk right into the enemy, back is the direction they should be going. Maybe blinding cloud needs to be adjusted to keep mech relevant, but frankly, atm I really don't see the issue. It forces terrans to make nice positions, and vipers are squishy. Bit ago I was watching a zerg HotS stream and he attacked with blinding cloud a mech armies forces, and proceeded to destroy them. Round two the terran spread out his tanks alot better, missile turrets in between them, etc, and suddenly he traded fine with the zerg (especially considering how badly he lost round 1). | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:28 Sissors wrote: Indeed, how would it be considered a nerf for bio if they didnt immediatly run forward towards their doom when under blinding cloud? When I had it happen to me I was seriously considering shooting my own bio for being retarded. The zerg already took care of that, so it wasn't necesary, but I really dont consider it a pro they walk right into the enemy, back is the direction they should be going. Maybe blinding cloud needs to be adjusted to keep mech relevant, but frankly, atm I really don't see the issue. It forces terrans to make nice positions, and vipers are squishy. Bit ago I was watching a zerg HotS stream and he attacked with blinding cloud a mech armies forces, and proceeded to destroy them. Round two the terran spread out his tanks alot better, missile turrets in between them, etc, and suddenly he traded fine with the zerg (especially considering how badly he lost round 1). Yeah, I agree that Viper vs Mech currently forces positional play and there seems to be nothing wrong with it. It might be a bit too strong, time will tell. But it seems that with the new medivac and widow mine usage, mid-game bio pushes are incredibly hard to stop for Zerg. So now we have mine replacing tank and Viper not countering bio in TvZ, as was intended. | ||
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justinpal
United States3810 Posts
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Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:28 Sissors wrote: Indeed, how would it be considered a nerf for bio if they didnt immediatly run forward towards their doom when under blinding cloud? When I had it happen to me I was seriously considering shooting my own bio for being retarded. The zerg already took care of that, so it wasn't necesary, but I really dont consider it a pro they walk right into the enemy, back is the direction they should be going. Maybe blinding cloud needs to be adjusted to keep mech relevant, but frankly, atm I really don't see the issue. It forces terrans to make nice positions, and vipers are squishy. Bit ago I was watching a zerg HotS stream and he attacked with blinding cloud a mech armies forces, and proceeded to destroy them. Round two the terran spread out his tanks alot better, missile turrets in between them, etc, and suddenly he traded fine with the zerg (especially considering how badly he lost round 1). I think it would even be a buff imo to change AI so that bio forces won't move forward under the cloud. lol | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On December 18 2012 22:33 justinpal wrote: Thors in any number destroy vipers so fast. The issue here is, that even though Vipers get destroyed, they will cast Blinding Clouds and you will lose whole your army and trade extremly ineffective. I guess its "ok" for Zerg to lose few Vipers and kill whole Tank/Thor army? edit: Anyways back on topic, I agree that it migh be even a buff if units affected by Blinding Cloud would't run away, haha.. :-) | ||
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TheManInBlack
Nigeria266 Posts
And less talk about idra please, he's irrelevant and his opinion really shouldn't taken as a stone tablet. | ||
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