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If you haven't played the campaign, get out and stop reading, spoilers ahead.
_______________Spoilers after this line ________________
Let's review Raynor's and Kerrigan's relationship, because a very important question to me is why Jim goes to the length he does to save Kerrigan. They met, through Arcturus Mengsk on Antugua while doing a job for Mengsk - getting the Confedration off of Antigua Prime so the Antiguan Protectorate could join the Sons of Korhal. At this point in their relationship Kerrigan is second in command of the Sons and Raynor is some General/Advisor, he's certainly bleow Kerrigan in the pecking order. The next time we see Kerrigan and Raynor interact is when Mengsk orders Kerrigan to implant a psi-emitter in Delta Squadron's base, and both she and him agree that no one deserves the Zerg unleased upon them. This is how the Sons of Korhal bypass Tarsonis' defences and plant psi emitters on Tarsonis itself, the Zerg rain down and the Protoss run after them, ready to exterminate Raynor and Kerrigan are sent down to beat back the Protoss while saving the Zerg. It is in this mission that Kerrian is captured and infested by the Zerg.
Here's my beef: there doesn't seem to be that big of a connection between Raynor and Kerrigan to justify the lengths he went to to save her from being the Queen of Blades. He met this chick like maybe half a dozen times at most, to him she was just another boss, Edmund Duke might have been killed, but Raynor doesn't chase after him, or mourn him, or mention his name at all anymore. She didn't seem to like him very much, she calls him a pig after knowing the guy 5 seconds because she's a telepath, it doesn't seem like they had a relationship, and if they did how could it have been meaningful in the 2 or 3 weeks they knew each other. Was it the sorrow of losing someone? Well Raynor's a career military man, he's fought in wars, been in whatever mess him and Tychus got into, the point is I'm sure the guy learned to cope with losing someone a long time ago.
So the 64,000 dollar question is why. Why go chasing across the galaxy looking for an outside chance at saving the girl he knew all of 3 weeks? It's not a stretch to say he was trying to save her, at the end of SCII he doesn't know what the artifact has done, no one can answer how it works or what it doesn't other than Mengsk's Son saying it de-infests people. Raynor knows about betrayal, he's felt it before from the Confedration, and later from the Sons of Korhal - he can't trust Mengsk's son - if he wanted to be absolutely sure to save his people, he'd put a bullet in her brain, but he doesn't he wasn't out to save the Terran rce, he was out to save a girl he knew from 5 years ago for a couple weeks.
Would you have done it, would you have risked your life and the lives of everyone under your command to maybe possibly save the life of a girl you did a Civics project with sometime in the tenth grade?
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As many other people pointed out already, the story is full of plotholes.
EDIT: I think his attachment is due to the fact that K is still alive (but infested), while the other people you mentioned are simply dead. J tried to save K in SC1 campaign as well.
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1. The things men do for love.
Raynor liked her from the start. When they first meet on Antigua, Kerrigan can't even finish her sentence because she senses his attraction."Commander Raynor, I scouted the area up ahead and...you pig!"
Eventually Kerrigan shares the same feelings. On Tarsonis when Tassadar sends the toss to try and save the Confederates: "Jim stop the knight-in-shining-armor routine. It suits you sometimes, just...not now. I don't need to be rescued."
Even when infested, Kerrigan still has feelings for him. When she first emerges from the chrysalis on Char, she lets Jimmy leave rather than kill him.
And on Korhal after her alliance drove the UED off and she betrayed Fenix's forces and the Dominion, Raynor says "I'm the man who's going to kill you some day." How does Kerrigan react? Anyone else tells her that, and she laughs, but Raynor? She was hurt. "It is done, Cerebrate. Let us return to Tarsonis to rest. For the first time since my transfiguration I am, wearied, of the slaughter." Imagine that, a Zerg tired of swarming.
2. Jimmy blames himself for Kerrigan's infestation.
After turning on Mengsk and the Sons of Korhal, Jimmy laments "now he's the law and we're the criminals" and his helping Mengsk rise to power, but he caps his lament with "I shouldn't have let her go alone." Jimmy protested Mengsk's order to send Kerrigan to face Tassadar's forces, but he didn't do anything but complain.
And what came from Jimmy's inaction? WoL - Horner: What happened to Kerrigan wasn't your fault. Jimmy: Which part? The part where she was infested, or the part where she killed billions of people?
Jimmy didn't act on his feelings for Sarah and billions died.
3. Kerrigan was still a threat to every other race in the sector.
By Brood War's end, she crushed the Protoss, Dominion and UED fleets with only a fraction of her forces - what was on the Omega platform instead of on Char itself.
And in WoL, she launched a massive invasion. Large enough to force the Dominion to abandon many of their colonies. As Jimmy said: "If the Zerg wipe everyone out, it's all been for nothing. So I'm going back to Char."
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whoops, posted in the wrong thread, I'l replace this with a decent comment after the GSL
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He didn't save her only because of his affection.
She is the only one who can stop the hybrids, remember?
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Yeah, OP listen to Capt. Moroni.
Jim rushing off to save her has been a part of his character from the beginning. He also put his army in harms way to rescue Arcturus from UED - at HER request. Jim clearly wanted the UED to take Arcturus and kill the bastard.
About the only thing that WoL did that may be questionable is perhaps exaggerate Jims feelings so that it's more than a crush, but anyone who has been in a romantic relationship can attest to logic and emotion not always going hand in hand. The people complaining about the so called "retcon" are probably virgins in real life.
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On October 26 2010 22:02 Francis wrote:
Yeah, OP listen to Capt. Moroni.
Jim rushing off to save her has been a part of his character from the beginning. He also put his army in harms way to rescue Arcturus from UED - at HER request. Jim clearly wanted the UED to take Arcturus and kill the bastard.
About the only thing that WoL did that may be questionable is perhaps exaggerate Jims feelings so that it's more than a crush, but anyone who has been in a romantic relationship can attest to logic and emotion not always going hand in hand. The people complaining about the so called "retcon" are probably virgins in real life.
That's just a completely ridiculous answer. People do stupid things for love, but they don't risk the lives of their entire crew on a ship with hundreds and hundreds of people on them. That's just a terrible excuse.
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That's nice. Well it happened didn't it. Twice. Tell me something Stratos, has it ever occured to you that the entire SC story was always meant to be kind of cheesy, unrealistic and leaning a bit towards the ridiculous side? Actually had a better excuse than just some vivid dreams this time, so surely you'd view that as an incline.
It is a bit concerning that people are so serious about this game.
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To add something that people haven't mentioned here; Zeratul (someone who he deeply respects, as do most people who know of him) told him that she was the key to the whole world's survival. That kind of implies that he needs to save her in order for her to save the world.
Now I personally think its a laundry list of issues why he does it but I think the nail in the coffin (so to speak) is that she was/is a fairly attractive woman and he is stuck on a battlecruiser with a bunch of men.
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On October 26 2010 22:45 Phrost wrote:
Now I personally think its a laundry list of issues why he does it but I think the nail in the coffin (so to speak) is that she was/is a fairly attractive woman and he is stuck on a battlecruiser with a bunch of men.
Yes, this sounds cheesy enough by Terran campaign standards.
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I'm amazed that everyone always assumes that everything that happens is always shown on screen. You really don't think they were hooking up on the Hyperion between missions and such?
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On October 26 2010 22:15 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 22:02 Francis wrote:
Yeah, OP listen to Capt. Moroni.
Jim rushing off to save her has been a part of his character from the beginning. He also put his army in harms way to rescue Arcturus from UED - at HER request. Jim clearly wanted the UED to take Arcturus and kill the bastard.
About the only thing that WoL did that may be questionable is perhaps exaggerate Jims feelings so that it's more than a crush, but anyone who has been in a romantic relationship can attest to logic and emotion not always going hand in hand. The people complaining about the so called "retcon" are probably virgins in real life. That's just a completely ridiculous answer. People do stupid things for love, but they don't risk the lives of their entire crew on a ship with hundreds and hundreds of people on them. That's just a terrible excuse.
Well Raynor IS drunk 90% of the time in WoL.
Raynor's actions don't reflect his desire to save Kerrigan until he actually decides to go to Char, which means he'll defeat the Queen of Blades and save the sector from the overwheling Zerg swarm.
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On October 26 2010 22:15 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 22:02 Francis wrote:
Yeah, OP listen to Capt. Moroni.
Jim rushing off to save her has been a part of his character from the beginning. He also put his army in harms way to rescue Arcturus from UED - at HER request. Jim clearly wanted the UED to take Arcturus and kill the bastard.
About the only thing that WoL did that may be questionable is perhaps exaggerate Jims feelings so that it's more than a crush, but anyone who has been in a romantic relationship can attest to logic and emotion not always going hand in hand. The people complaining about the so called "retcon" are probably virgins in real life. That's just a completely ridiculous answer. People do stupid things for love, but they don't risk the lives of their entire crew on a ship with hundreds and hundreds of people on them. That's just a terrible excuse.
Why is it ridiculous? Im sure far worse things than what you've mentioned have been done in the name of 'love' in Earths real history, much less this games.
Anyway, Im at work so I can view the cinematic, but when Horner catches Tychus hacking the ships files to look for info on Kerrigan then talk briefly about Raynor's actions regarding her and I believe he mentions something about them having a history together. Upon which Tychus explaims, "You mean they were shacked up together?". Indicating a significant romantic relationship had taken place.
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sc2 hints that they had a much deeper relationship then what we knew from sc1. simple as that imo
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On October 26 2010 22:15 Stratos_speAr wrote:
That's just a completely ridiculous answer. People do stupid things for love, but they don't risk the lives of their entire crew on a ship with hundreds and hundreds of people on them. That's just a terrible excuse.
You realize that this is the plot of the Iliad, right? One of the oldest (if not the oldest) stories in western civilization? Menelaus coming to Troy to get his wife back causes a war which results in countless lives lost? In fact, it's also the literal plot of the Odyssey, in which Odysseus risks and loses his entire ship and crew trying to get home to his wife and son.
While fighting over women hasn't really manifested itself in history since the modern era, there is no limit to the amount of dumb things people in power will do to satisfy their own selfish wishes. It's just really convenient that Jim Raynor's specific "dumb thing" isn't that dumb in the grand scheme of things -- but that doesn't change the fact that most of his motivation for doing what he does in WoL is pretty selfish.
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They had telepathic sex all day and night long, wouldn't you be in love with a woman that can do that.
You are thousand miles apart and yet you can still have sex with telepathically. They didn't have to interact directly, they got to know each other telepathically and fall in love.
BONUS: Sometimes people do crazy stuff for love.
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On October 26 2010 23:25 psychopat wrote:
I'm amazed that everyone always assumes that everything that happens is always shown on screen. You really don't think they were hooking up on the Hyperion between missions and such?
That's horrible storytelling. If it's important to the plot, you show it or allude to it. It's as simple as that.
Blizzard retconned the entire romance into existence. Nothing more, nothing less.
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On October 27 2010 09:55 0mar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 23:25 psychopat wrote:
I'm amazed that everyone always assumes that everything that happens is always shown on screen. You really don't think they were hooking up on the Hyperion between missions and such? That's horrible storytelling. If it's important to the plot, you show it or allude to it. It's as simple as that. Blizzard retconned the entire romance into existence. Nothing more, nothing less.
It wasn't very important to the plot in SC/BW, so it was only mildly alluded to there. It was important to the plot in SC2 and it was directly referred to several times. I don't see the problem. When Horner told Tychus, my reaction was nothing like "Where the heck did that come from?!", it was more along the lines of a "Yeah, that's what I thought..." They're just confirming for those that played the original and flat out stating it for the people that didn't. I don't see the problem.
To use a bad example because of how 4-5-6 were released out of order, it's kind of like how in the first of the 6 Star Wars movies, they allude to Sidious being Palpatine, who will eventually be the Emperor. By the third, they've laid it out as bluntly as possible. Pretty much the exact same thing.
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EPT
