Blizz doesnt know how sc2 story ends - Page 8

On October 25 2010 19:20 -Xios wrote:


I know this is a bit off topic, but, no, he didn't.

The Silmarillion

Tolkien had developed a massive narrative structure over the course of his entire life, A narrative structure right from the very beggining of existence to the end of time, after the end of middle earth. The Lord of the Rings is one tiny tiny tiny tiny part of that entire story, the end of the third age with the destruction of the rings of power, of which Sauron (a mere weak creation, a servant, created by a turned/corrupted 'Ainur' named Melkor) plays a majour role in.

The actual story is plotted out quite thoroughly, chronologically before and after the setting of the lord of the rings, in great detail. I've read pretty much all he has written (even the obscure stuff thats not to easy to find) and i actually find it slightly offensive to hear such a comment about Tolkien lol. The guy was a genious, spent his life work dedicated to his craft, he didn't just 'make it up as he went along'.

Please stop comparing WoL to Firefly, you are starting to personally offend me.

On October 26 2010 00:43 Krigwin wrote:


...."well handled"? No. It was awfully handled. Well handled would be something like turning the magic ring Bilbo won in the Hobbit into some kind of MacGuffin god-ring that can resurrect an evil dark lord and must be destroyed. Well handled would be returning to life great characters that were killed for no reason like Sherlock Holmes or Boba Fett. This is kind of like coming out with a new Star Wars movie that reveals that Darth Vader, one of the most badass villains of all time, was actually a whiny emo with metrosexual hair that turned to the dark side after having an 8-second dream sequence- wait...



Please stop comparing WoL to Firefly, you are starting to personally offend me.



How did I think it was going to end? Good question. I kind of thought it was going to end with the gang taking down Mengsk and his evil empire - you know, just the goal you've been working towards for the entire first half of the game? But instead Mengsk kind of disappears when the gang gets a Deus Ex Xel'Naga device so Raynor can go ride off into the Char sunset with his girlfriend, who, by the way, as it turns out, is not a magnificent evil bitch after all, but is instead just some pawn of an ancient evil - a startlingly original plot device only used in about all teenage fanfiction ever.

There's a difference between a good retcon and just completely crapping all over an existing character. Revealing that Luke and Leia were siblings - okay, that's kind of creepy and it's a good thing they immediately ditched all the sexual tension, but it doesn't fundamentally change the characters, just adds a new dynamic to their character, and it helps to set up the plot. This retconning of such characters as the Overmind, on the other hand, even directly contradicting the lore that came with the original game, turning previously brilliant characters into middle school-level tropes all to set up their entirely unoriginal and unimpressive mytharc is unforgivable. And I haven't even gotten to the resurrecting Tassadar part.

On October 26 2010 01:49 Billy_ wrote:
Oh hey, it's another know it all. Hi there, how are you doing?

On October 25 2010 18:31 Paradice wrote:


I'd hate for my lounge to get covered in hot ash - so expensive!

But seriously - I actually enjoyed the SC2 single player story. Sure it was somewhat predictable, but come on - seriously here, how did you THINK it was going to end? With Raynor and Kerrigan dead? At the conclusion of part 1 of 3? Get real. This was always going to be about establishing characters, having them talk to each other a bit, and positioning themselves for the follow-up arcs.

I've seen lots of examples in this thread complaining of retcon and planning and of how the "original 3" Star Wars movies did it right. -points to internet GIFs of Luke and Leia making out before Lucas decided they were siblings-.

On October 26 2010 01:59 Krigwin wrote:


About as well as can be expected on a Monday morning. How are you doing, child that makes elementary school quips?

On October 26 2010 02:11 MalVortex wrote:


Oh, I"m sorry, I made a simple typo on a webforum, clearly that invalidates my argument. Oh wait, no it doesn't! It is, however, a nice little strawman argument - look look, he added an extra letter! He clearly is wrong and should be ignored!

If you don't actually have anything to say about the gross plot narm that I pointed out (and lets be honest, I only posted the tip of the iceberg there), then don't try to play spelling nazi. I don't care about how it stacks up to other scifi plots, or the inevitable "all the main characters live in a PG-13 work syndrome". That's all expected.

What you can't ignore, or get around, or hand-wave, is the narm. The lines are said so seriously, yet are so pants on head retarded, that it destroys the suspension of belief in the game and makes you burst out laughing at the amazingly stupid and blindingly non-genre savvy characters. Findlay is the very embodiment of this narm - think through, reall carefully now, how dumb his plot is.

Mengsk releases him to kill a human-form Kerigan. To do that, he needs to saddle back up with Raynor, rebel and destroy numerous high-value Dominion installations, find, acquire, and assemble previously unknown alien artifacts (seriously, even if Mengsk knew of the Xel'Naga artifacts, he would have no way of knowing what they did), then he needs his son to betray his rule, take over half the dominion fleet, blindly attack char (this happened in SC1. they all died), and finally assemble and activate the artifact.

You can't even read it with a straight face! The plot makes no sense, its based off details that Mengsk could not know or anticipate, yet lo and behold, that was his plan the entire time. Why bother try to kill them then at all? Just to keep up appearances? The only way that makes sense is for the incriminating recovered adjutant to also be part of his plan, and for the plucky Raynor to get it!

That doesn't even get into "serious" lines like the whole Dr. love angle. "Were going to a planet called HAVEN. How convenient, given we are looking for a safe...haven..."


The story was narmy as all hell. There are no two ways about that. Please, Defend the Mengsk Xanatos gambit w/ Findlay, I'd love to see an attempt at justifying that in a way that doesn't invoke bursts of laughter.

On October 26 2010 02:19 DiracMonopole wrote:
Why did Raynor want to rescue Kerrigan? Didnt he swear over Fenix's dead body that he would one day kill her?

On October 26 2010 02:22 Billy_ wrote:


He said and did a lot of things. Why does everyone act like that thing with Fenix invalidate everything he did and said which were all pro-Kerrigan? You know, back before she got infested and seemingly irredeemably evil until Valarian made Raynor a deal regarding the artifacts? I swear, these forums are proof positive that people are tunnel visioned and only see what they want to see.

On October 24 2010 23:21 MrLonely wrote:
Legitimate storymaking technique. Stephen King doesn't know how his stories will end either, and I consider him a pretty good writer.

On October 26 2010 02:28 Sabu113 wrote:


bros b4 hos

qed ^^

On October 26 2010 02:15 Billy_ wrote:
You seem to have missed the whole life-as-a-slave theme that's been following Kerrigan ever since the beginning.

On October 26 2010 02:22 Billy_ wrote:


He said and did a lot of things. Why does everyone act like that thing with Fenix invalidate everything he did and said which were all pro-Kerrigan? You know, back before she got infested and seemingly irredeemably evil until Valarian made Raynor a deal regarding the artifacts? I swear, these forums are proof positive that people are tunnel visioned and only see what they want to see.

On October 26 2010 02:35 Billy_ wrote:
Seriously though.... Jim wanting to save Kerrigan is just consistent character development. So he gave up on saving her and threatened her, big deal. Doesn't change the fact that he once liked her, rushed to her aid before she hatched on Char, and then got told by Valarian that he might not have to kill her.

On October 26 2010 03:11 Krigwin wrote:



You know, if you really enjoyed the babby's first RTS story of WoL, and are taking the official Blizzard stance of "don't take SC-BW too seriously, we're making a somewhat new plot here out of our ass", that's fantastic, I hope you really enjoy the expansions, etc., but don't try to argue with people who actually liked SC-BW and think things like a sequel should be somewhat true to the original and not retcon everything into a steaming pile of garbage.

It's been explained a dozen times and clearly you just don't care, but for everyone else here reading, let me sum it up here:

First, the implied romance garbage. Nowhere is this really implied unless you're doing some kind of mind-meld with the Blizzard writers - they have one short exchange of quips when they first meet and people are taking this to mean he's deeply in love with her? Yes, he tries to save her - because she was one of his unit and was abandoned to the enemy, if she was a dude he'd do the same, it doesn't have to imply romance - especially since right after that she reveals how irredeemably evil she has become and is no longer the same person he knew.

She then goes on to betray and kill Fenix, whom if you'll remember fought side by side with Raynor to the extent of fending off hordes of Zerg on Aiur, and Raynor swears over his corpse he'll get revenge on Kerrigan himself. Fast forward to WoL, and what happens? Raynor has discarded his blood oath and fights to keep Kerrigan alive, to the point of shooting his own man, a romance plot is shoehorned in seemingly out of thin air, and all the previous exchanges where Raynor realizes Kerrigan is beyond saving and even if she wasn't, she still deserves to die for her crimes, totally forgotten. This is not "consistent". This is bizarre retcon garbage. I haven't even gotten to how contrived and nonsensical the whole "magicky Xel-Naga de-infesting device" plot arc was.

The most pathetic thing is the entire "Raynor carries human Kerrigan off" scene, which obviously Blizzard was working towards all along, could have very easily been done well, as countless people have suggested, by making it happen at the end of the third campaign. If this was the story Blizzard now intends, that's fine, the retcons could have been handled gracefully, but instead the whole thing was pulled off extremely poorly and makes WoL look like trash compared to SC-BW.

On October 26 2010 03:11 Krigwin wrote:



You know, if you really enjoyed the babby's first RTS story of WoL, and are taking the official Blizzard stance of "don't take SC-BW too seriously, we're making a somewhat new plot here out of our ass", that's fantastic, I hope you really enjoy the expansions, etc., but don't try to argue with people who actually liked SC-BW and think things like a sequel should be somewhat true to the original and not retcon everything into a steaming pile of garbage.

It's been explained a dozen times and clearly you just don't care, but for everyone else here reading, let me sum it up here:

First, the implied romance garbage. Nowhere is this really implied unless you're doing some kind of mind-meld with the Blizzard writers - they have one short exchange of quips when they first meet and people are taking this to mean he's deeply in love with her? Yes, he tries to save her - because she was one of his unit and was abandoned to the enemy, if she was a dude he'd do the same, it doesn't have to imply romance - especially since right after that she reveals how irredeemably evil she has become and is no longer the same person he knew.

She then goes on to betray and kill Fenix, whom if you'll remember fought side by side with Raynor to the extent of fending off hordes of Zerg on Aiur, and Raynor swears over his corpse he'll get revenge on Kerrigan himself. Fast forward to WoL, and what happens? Raynor has discarded his blood oath and fights to keep Kerrigan alive, to the point of shooting his own man, a romance plot is shoehorned in seemingly out of thin air, and all the previous exchanges where Raynor realizes Kerrigan is beyond saving and even if she wasn't, she still deserves to die for her crimes, totally forgotten. This is not "consistent". This is bizarre retcon garbage. I haven't even gotten to how contrived and nonsensical the whole "magicky Xel-Naga de-infesting device" plot arc was.

The most pathetic thing is the entire "Raynor carries human Kerrigan off" scene, which obviously Blizzard was working towards all along, could have very easily been done well, as countless people have suggested, by making it happen at the end of the third campaign. If this was the story Blizzard now intends, that's fine, the retcons could have been handled gracefully, but instead the whole thing was pulled off extremely poorly and makes WoL look like trash compared to SC-BW.