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On August 04 2010 05:15 ConsummateK wrote:
Meh, I personally think you're being whiny. Again.
Regardless of this I will say one thing that tickled the back of my brain while playing was how on the UNN reports (and I believe in SC/BW) they reported BILLIONS of casualties from the Zerg and unless reach unit represents a full battalion or something then the numbers for the final confrontation don't quite seem to match up.
civilians, dummy, they attacked many of the outer rim worlds
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On August 04 2010 22:52 Loanshark wrote:
cliffhanger sequel potential to exploit the series more > A plot without holes.
how could you not know that there would be a cliffhanger when there are 2 more expansion packs
Brood War was a far worse cliffhanger that we had to wait 12 years for.
You people will bitch about anything christ
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On August 05 2010 11:51 ArvickHero wrote:
Arcturus is being mind controlled by the Xel'Naga, or he was killed and some look-alike puppet was put in his place. Explains all his retarded actions!!
The Battlecruiser boarding scene was pretty bad, I'm not sure what was going through the storywriter's mind when he wrote that in.
yeah that made no sense, why would he forcibly board it instead of just hailing on the comms
unless they boarded so quickly they didn't even bother, remember Raynor thought it was Arcturus
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On August 05 2010 12:50 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2010 12:22 On_Slaught wrote:On August 05 2010 12:02 perfectflaw72 wrote:On August 04 2010 00:24 Ndugu wrote:
As for 1, there are a thousand reasons Terran technological advancement could have slowed. Perhaps the type of technology used by Terrans peaked long ago, but they don't have the psionic/magic-energy powers of the Protoss to progress in a new direction.
As for 2, I think its pretty clear that almost all the Terran forces were wiped out.
An unimaginably powerful Xel'naga artifact was being used to periodically wipe out every single Zerg in a large radius. yeah but they landed derectly on char THE home planet of the zerg where they live and spawn so youd think that for every 1 marine that lands on the planet their is 100 lings 20 hydras 10 roachs... with the spore cannons it would be impossible to land units so you have to use drop pods but they scatter everywhere and should instantly be overwhelmed but in the game they give you time to get their, yeah the plot has problemes but hey its sc LOVE IT Did you even play the game? Did you watch the videos of the Dominion landing on Char? They were getting fucked up beyond belief. Anyone who bitches about the sc2 story (and there are plenty) should read through this thread. It pretty much explains why all your complains are ignorant or stupid. No, it doesn't. It's just a bunch of B.S. speculation to try to explain away plot holes. Almost nothing in this thread has been even remotely hinted at by Blizzard.
boy its like theres really 2 more games?
did you say "But wait there's millions of Zerg still rampaging on Aiur" after SC1
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On August 05 2010 14:36 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2010 13:48 On_Slaught wrote:On August 05 2010 12:50 Stratos_speAr wrote:On August 05 2010 12:22 On_Slaught wrote:On August 05 2010 12:02 perfectflaw72 wrote:On August 04 2010 00:24 Ndugu wrote:
As for 1, there are a thousand reasons Terran technological advancement could have slowed. Perhaps the type of technology used by Terrans peaked long ago, but they don't have the psionic/magic-energy powers of the Protoss to progress in a new direction.
As for 2, I think its pretty clear that almost all the Terran forces were wiped out.
An unimaginably powerful Xel'naga artifact was being used to periodically wipe out every single Zerg in a large radius. yeah but they landed derectly on char THE home planet of the zerg where they live and spawn so youd think that for every 1 marine that lands on the planet their is 100 lings 20 hydras 10 roachs... with the spore cannons it would be impossible to land units so you have to use drop pods but they scatter everywhere and should instantly be overwhelmed but in the game they give you time to get their, yeah the plot has problemes but hey its sc LOVE IT Did you even play the game? Did you watch the videos of the Dominion landing on Char? They were getting fucked up beyond belief. Anyone who bitches about the sc2 story (and there are plenty) should read through this thread. It pretty much explains why all your complains are ignorant or stupid. No, it doesn't. It's just a bunch of B.S. speculation to try to explain away plot holes. Almost nothing in this thread has been even remotely hinted at by Blizzard. What you should take from all this "speculation" is that there is going to be a follow up. The point is that there are no plot holes because the plot isn't done. What has been pointed out is that it is EASY to explain all of these things with very reasonable explanations (which some people have tried to give) in the next game. Everyone selling the story before we even really know what the story is are foolish. There's a difference between an open plot and a plot with holes in it. You seem to have confused the two. Show nested quote +1. What's wrong with this? It's like you answered your own question. We know very little about them. We found out something. So what? Zeratul has hinted at this multiple times anyway.
2. Again what's wrong with this? The prophecy is just what they call it. How about we call it a "warning" since that's all it was. This is how the SC universe works. Zeratul found some left over stones that lay out what the process is. They try to get ready to stop it before it comes. Sweet.
3. Ya because dragoons don't exist right? There is a clear ethereal elemenet to the protoss and tassadar, who had mastered both dark and light, clearly has access to this. He broke apart his physical body to destroy the overmind so it's not a stretch that his "being" would survive. The problem with these first three isn't that they happened, it's that it's terrible story telling because it was poorly presented and it has been done plenty of times and even in Blizzard's own work (Warcraft). Show nested quote +
4. Why it worked is pretty obvious... because Valerian allowed it. Why would he want the help of Raynor if he couldn't even kill a couple of marines? Plus, the whole "so many things could of gone wrong" applies to literally almost every single movie, anime or show ever made. Doesn't even hold weight anymore.
What's stupid is that Raynor actually thought of doing this. He is supposed to be an intelligent person (in terms of strategy and tactics) yet any grandma would know that this is suicide. Show nested quote +
5. Clearly there is more to Mengsk than meets the eye. If it turns out there isn't then i'll join you in "this is dumb." Can't say that for a few years tho. Even then, this isn't even a plot hole.
No, there is nothing clear. There was absolutely nothing about Mengsk shown to us through WoL other than the fact that he's an idiot now. Show nested quote +
6. Again, they obviously had understanding. The moebius foundation has been working on this stuff for a while and it's all but certain that Duran is leading this research. Assuming it is, he obviously has the knowledge necessary. Plus, it seems that the artifact was built for this exact reason so why wouldn't it do what it did?
So how does Duran just know this stuff? Furthermore, how does no one get suspicious? Not only that, why would Duran want to wipe out so many Zerg and cure Kerrigan? Again, the main problem is that so many things are left so unbelievably wide open with not even a hint of what's going on.
Oh, and the other problem is this whole idea of the artifact. Super weapons tend to just be lazy story telling (and they are in this situation). There are few situations where super weapons should be used and they need to be used correctly or it just cheapens the story.Show nested quote +
7. Not a plot hole. They could of been watching over them for centuries for all we know. They are fanatics who spent a lot of time looking for them. They eventually found them. What's wrong with that?
Not a plot hole, but a complete failure in story telling. There is no depth to these characters. Show nested quote +
8. Few things on this. First, you could just say that Kerrigan was only so cunning because of Duran and that without him she lost her best strategist. Second, we don't know if there is some greater plan here. If she knew what the artifact did, and it turns out it makes her stronger by balancing her human/zerg powers, then it would make sense to either steal it for herself and use it as you see fit/study it etc. It seems clear to me that there is more to this since her attack on the Dominion comes off as random. I find it very unlikely that it would end up being nothing more than random fighting for hte hell of it. Last, who cares how she got there. Maybe she found it the same way Zeratul did. She does have billions of zerg looking for it around the galaxy... Oh and another thing. She clearly had a connection with the mind of the Overmind who had clear knowledge of the prophecy. That enough could tell her what she needed to know and where things were.
You only say the bold part in a blind attempt to justify this terrible story. There was no real hint of this going on in BW. And like I've said so many times, all of these theories are great, but the problem is that Blizzard hasn't hinted at any of this. All they showed us was an absolutely pathetic character that was more one-dimensional than Sauron.
What, Duran is very obviously an agent of the Dark Voice, how could you not even realize that. Did you not play Brood War secret mission or what? Because of this its very obvious why he'd want to destroy Kerrigan.
Superweapon is a macguffin, deal with it. The boarding party was really dumb though.
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The only thing that bothered me was the boarding party. Like how the hell did they manage to sneak into a BC fleet?
Other than that stop being so negative. I dare you to play just the Terran Campaign from SC Vanilla and tell me there's not plot holes and it's a complete story.
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On August 10 2010 00:24 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
The only thing that bothered me was the boarding party. Like how the hell did they manage to sneak into a BC fleet?
Other than that stop being so negative. I dare you to play just the Terran Campaign from SC Vanilla and tell me there's not plot holes and it's a complete story.
Maybe because Valerian ordered the fleet to stand down after jumping? I don't think he was planning on Raynor thinking he was Arcturus and boarding his ship, intent on killing him.
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What I find more interesting/disturbing is how the Terran Dominion manages to produce BC fleets so quickly.
Several worlds are under dominion control, each with a pop of at least a billion people(except some of the fringe worlds, like the one the female doctor came from).
all those worlds are rich with minerals necessary for the construction of battle cruisers and crap.
the kel morian combine has a monopoly on the minerals in the sector. i'm betting there's a company that's holding a monopoly on military grade hardware construction.
you know, like microsoft is a monopoly on software.
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On August 10 2010 00:24 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
The only thing that bothered me was the boarding party. Like how the hell did they manage to sneak into a BC fleet?
Other than that stop being so negative. I dare you to play just the Terran Campaign from SC Vanilla and tell me there's not plot holes and it's a complete story.
It's not that SC/BW were amazing, it's that WoL really is that terrible.
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On August 10 2010 02:23 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2010 00:24 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
The only thing that bothered me was the boarding party. Like how the hell did they manage to sneak into a BC fleet?
Other than that stop being so negative. I dare you to play just the Terran Campaign from SC Vanilla and tell me there's not plot holes and it's a complete story. It's not that SC/BW were amazing, it's that WoL really is that terrible.
Basically all your conclusions are based on faulty information that showed you didn't pay attention, like at all. Like saying the Zeratul missions didn't influence decision making regarding Kerrigan? That was the ENTIRE point of those missions
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On August 10 2010 02:59 PanzerDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2010 02:23 Stratos_speAr wrote:On August 10 2010 00:24 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
The only thing that bothered me was the boarding party. Like how the hell did they manage to sneak into a BC fleet?
Other than that stop being so negative. I dare you to play just the Terran Campaign from SC Vanilla and tell me there's not plot holes and it's a complete story. It's not that SC/BW were amazing, it's that WoL really is that terrible. Basically all your conclusions are based on faulty information that showed you didn't pay attention, like at all. Like saying the Zeratul missions didn't influence decision making regarding Kerrigan? That was the ENTIRE point of those missions
No, that's you jumping to conclusions. The actual presentation of the story didn't show us that it actually influenced Raynor's decision at all. You knew it should, you waited for it, but it never actually did, because if it did, that would be one of the first things he'd say to Matt, because he told Matt about all of the visions.
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Doesnt Raynor mention the prophecy when he argues with Tychus why they shouldnt kill Kerrigan at some point?
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1. The Artifact. Why did the Xel'naga build it? And when? Why did they split it into pieces and hide them around the galaxy? Why are the pieces so easy to find, being put in large obvious vaults and radiating energy that can be detected across vast expanses of space?
The Xel'naga engineered the Zerg from a bug species and created the Overmind, but after the Zerg took over the planet they originated on the Overmind decided the Zerg had to travel to other worlds to keep expanding so he assimilated some space creatures and made them into overlords, and then the Zerg attacked the Xel'naga because they just happened to be close by.
Obviously the Xel'naga didn't have the artifact at this point. It's conceivable that the few remaining Xel'naga built it after this, but if that's the case why didn't they use it to stop the Zerg? Because they wanted the Zerg to spread? Then why build the artifact in the first place?
And why break it into pieces and hide them? If it was built by the few remaining Xel'naga after most of them were wiped out by the Zerg, why wouldn't they just keep it?
2. The Tal'Darim. The Tal'Darim guy in Welcome to the Jungle says something like "This place was sacred to the Tal'Darim before Terrans ever reached the stars." But according to the books the Tal'Darim were only formed after the fall of Aiur.
3. This one's from SC1: Why did the Protoss land on Tarsonis to fight the Zerg instead of just wiping out all life on the planet from space like they did with Mar Sara and the other colony?
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alot of the complaints you people have are pretty well explicated in the game. Its pretty obvious you haven't paid attention or not done all of the missions. On that note, I've always wondered about how zerg units could fly in space, and how units would never run out of ammo; in the cinematic the marines are always running out of bullets, but never in game.
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On August 10 2010 03:41 Lysdexia wrote:
1. The Artifact. Why did the Xel'naga build it? And when? Why did they split it into pieces and hide them around the galaxy? Why are the pieces so easy to find, being put in large obvious vaults and radiating energy that can be detected across vast expanses of space?
The Xel'naga engineered the Zerg from a bug species and created the Overmind, but after the Zerg took over the planet they originated on the Overmind decided the Zerg had to travel to other worlds to keep expanding so he assimilated some space creatures and made them into overlords, and then the Zerg attacked the Xel'naga because they just happened to be close by.
Obviously the Xel'naga didn't have the artifact at this point. It's conceivable that the few remaining Xel'naga built it after this, but if that's the case why didn't they use it to stop the Zerg? Because they wanted the Zerg to spread? Then why build the artifact in the first place?
And why break it into pieces and hide them? If it was built by the few remaining Xel'naga after most of them were wiped out by the Zerg, why wouldn't they just keep it?
2. The Tal'Darim. The Tal'Darim guy in Welcome to the Jungle says something like "This place was sacred to the Tal'Darim before Terrans ever reached the stars." But according to the books the Tal'Darim were only formed after the fall of Aiur.
3. This one's from SC1: Why did the Protoss land on Tarsonis to fight the Zerg instead of just wiping out all life on the planet from space like they did with Mar Sara and the other colony?
1. Who knows? Maybe that's what Xel'Naga do, engineer species and make a kill switch for them should things get out of hand, or maybe they knew that one day something like it would be needed. As for the splitting of the artifact, that one's still a mystery but it's a pretty common theme in fiction for the main plot device to be fragmented. Regarding the placement of the artifacts, they were the gods of the universe. If I was a god I'd like my relics to be in pretty flashy temples.
It also seems like you don't know how the Cycle works. It's been described (by Zamara if memory serves) as "a benevolent destruction of two species." The Xel'Naga wanted the Zerg to find the Protoss.
2. Yes, the books do imply that the Tal'Darim were formed after the fall of Aiur by Ulrezaj but Nyon's statements seem to imply some form of retcon on Blizzard's part.
3. The Protoss decided to help the Terrans fight the Zerg rather than purify the planet. That one comes from the installer and one of the audios on the Dominion hype-site (they're actually the same audio/picture clips, just from two different sources)
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On August 10 2010 03:58 afirlortwo wrote:
alot of the complaints you people have are pretty well explicated in the game. Its pretty obvious you haven't paid attention or not done all of the missions. On that note, I've always wondered about how zerg units could fly in space, and how units would never run out of ammo; in the cinematic the marines are always running out of bullets, but never in game.
That'd be a pretty terrible game if we followed realism to the letter.
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On August 10 2010 03:58 afirlortwo wrote:
alot of the complaints you people have are pretty well explicated in the game. Its pretty obvious you haven't paid attention or not done all of the missions. On that note, I've always wondered about how zerg units could fly in space, and how units would never run out of ammo; in the cinematic the marines are always running out of bullets, but never in game.
I believe the Zerg flying in space was explained by air pockets inside their body, or some other sort of biological trait that allowed them to survive in vacuum. And if my Marines ran out of ammunition in the middle of a battle then quickly got destroyed by my opponent's Zealots that would suck so hard, wouldn't it?
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On August 04 2010 02:04 Dezzimal wrote:High heels, the pinnacle of Zerg evolution. ![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/AzPAu.jpg)
yea, this is probably on the list of terrible terrible things about the campaign.
the only fun missions where the micro non-base building missions (anyone with d+ macro can beat the brutal missions with MMM or banshee+tank+viking. build two scvs at once! that is so nice. )
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The Terran were having huge problems thats why the sent the ships to expand. Who knows what war/choas/lack of resources or any other problem that could have made the UED limited. Maybe they do have more advanced tech but in the expeditionary fleet they didn't send it. The only thing that bothers me is that the UED isn't mentioned except like once. I would at least like blizzard to go "and the UED were planning/notseen/waiting" anything besides this half assed story. The funny thing is the game was really fun and great levels for playing, but the story just sucked and the missions felt like wow quests rather than immersive story that matters.
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Mutalisks flapping their wings in space... it bothers me sooooo much
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EPT
