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On August 10 2016 10:39 Zealously wrote:
A spiritual repeat of his 2008 victory in the 100 fly - probably 2nd at 199m, clenches the gold with a quick do-or-die stroke. You can tell Phelps is getting old though, the last 50 left a lot to be desired. Still, 20 golds...
Wait, how can you tell Phelps is getting old?
He won, usually you don't say more is required.
Many of Phelps races in 2008 were extremely close (like the one against Cavic you mentioned).
edit: Very happy for Phelps, glad he came back.
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On August 10 2016 06:42 RubickPicker wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2016 22:48 L_Master wrote:Yea Gatlin is a pretty big black mark. The fact that you don't get lifetime ban for first offense isnt great in my book...but the fact that you can get two 4 year suspensions and still be allowed to compete....smh I don't have enough confidence in the testing methods to ban for life on the first result, and I think "people make mistakes" is a strong appeal as well. An MLB player got suspended 160 games for PEDs the other year because of a substance that entered his system by using a children's cold & flu medicine. And those guys have much more money at risk than Olympians do. First strike bans seem right based on the IOC's pompous "Olympic Ideal" nonsense, but in reality the science just isn't that precise.
The science is pretty decent, especially with A & B samples. Clear metabolites and/or actual PED substances in blood or urine should be lifetime ban in my book.
Passport detection I would do as 4 years 1st offense, lifetime 2nd offense. In cases where the athlete can make a strong, compelling argument that it was truly unsuspecting and/or in a product that it shouldn't have been, I'd be fine with a 2 or 4 year ban; as in your baseball argument.
I realize people can make mistakes, but for me it depends on the mistake type. If it's a mistake in judgement, as in being young and letting someone talking you into doping..sorry, but that should be it for you and athletics at that point. The problem is that once you take PEDs, it's not like when you go off them you return back to the baseline athlete you were before. They have lasting benefits years down the road. If we are talking innocent mistake, as in you took some asthma medication once that had some trace substance in it once for a legitimate condition, that I could forgive with a more modest ban.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On August 10 2016 11:06 FiWiFaKi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2016 10:39 Zealously wrote:
A spiritual repeat of his 2008 victory in the 100 fly - probably 2nd at 199m, clenches the gold with a quick do-or-die stroke. You can tell Phelps is getting old though, the last 50 left a lot to be desired. Still, 20 golds... Wait, how can you tell Phelps is getting old? He won, usually you don't say more is required. Many of Phelps races in 2008 were extremely close (like the one against Cavic you mentioned). edit: Very happy for Phelps, glad he came back.
Essentially, it's that he doesn't do anything poorly (which makes him possibly still the best male swimmer in the world), but has faded slightly in the things that he used to do incomparably well.
I'm not saying any more than what it takes to win is required, I'm just commenting on visible differences between the Phelps of today and how he would swim in the past. Absolutely not saying he's a pushover or anything now, but still. He loses a lot of power in the last leg of many of his races these days, which is a (fairly to very significant, depending on who you ask) contrast against 2008-2009, even 2012 to an extent. Where his turns and underwater kick would usually pretty much set him up for a cruising victory in many cases, he has to work for it a lot more, and kind of fell through the floor in the last 10, 15m of the 200 fly finals. Just to be clear, what Phelps does is still ridiculously impressive, but it's still possible to tell that his edge over the competition has dulled. Whether or not he wins doesn't impact the details of his races. It'll be interesting to see what happens in the 100 fly.
21 golds, though. Holy crap.
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On August 10 2016 11:58 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2016 11:06 FiWiFaKi wrote:On August 10 2016 10:39 Zealously wrote:
A spiritual repeat of his 2008 victory in the 100 fly - probably 2nd at 199m, clenches the gold with a quick do-or-die stroke. You can tell Phelps is getting old though, the last 50 left a lot to be desired. Still, 20 golds... Wait, how can you tell Phelps is getting old? He won, usually you don't say more is required. Many of Phelps races in 2008 were extremely close (like the one against Cavic you mentioned). edit: Very happy for Phelps, glad he came back. Essentially, it's that he doesn't do anything poorly (which makes him possibly still the best male swimmer in the world), but has faded slightly in the things that he used to do incomparably well. I'm not saying any more than what it takes to win is required, I'm just commenting on visible differences between the Phelps of today and how he would swim in the past. Absolutely not saying he's a pushover or anything now, but still. He loses a lot of power in the last leg of many of his races these days, which is a (fairly to very significant, depending on who you ask) contrast against 2008-2009, even 2012 to an extent. Where his turns and underwater kick would usually pretty much set him up for a cruising victory in many cases, he has to work for it a lot more, and kind of fell through the floor in the last 10, 15m of the 200 fly finals. Just to be clear, what Phelps does is still ridiculously impressive, but it's still possible to tell that his edge over the competition has dulled. Whether or not he wins doesn't impact the details of his races. It'll be interesting to see what happens in the 100 fly. 21 golds, though. Holy crap.
My impression is he just changed his style.
He used to always race from behind, saving energy for the last 50, and nowadays he gets the big lead at the start. Phelps said he's in the best shape of his life, and maybe he's just saying that, but honestly, his times are amazing, and I think the main reason a lot of people see that is because he changed his style from slow -> fast into fast -> slow.
In 2012 his 4x100m split was 47.15, this year 47.12. His 2012 fly was 1:53.01, 2016 was 1:53.36. His 4x200m split was 1:44.05 (holy shit), this year 1:45.26 (5th fastest, 2nd fastest being 1:44.85). Anyway, we will see in the IM and the 100m fly, but I think his performance has been very very similar throughout compared to his competition, and the main reason for the slight drop off in times is due to the swim suits in 2008 and 2009.
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As a Canadian, if you don't include the 1984 and 1992 olympics, Michael Phelps has won more gold medals since the start of WW2, than all of Canada combined 
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On August 10 2016 08:31 fabiano wrote:
Just came back from Germany x Canada female soccer match.
I know little to nothing about female soccer, but schland sure disappointed me, while Canada surprised me. The overall feeling I had is that Germany team is better technically, seemed to have the most ball possession, but Canada held strong and scored well. In the end, I believe it was a fair result.
But sincerely, Brazil is way above these two, I expect nothing less than a gold medal.
About male soccer, Brazil sucks so bad I feel ashamed when the players enter the field.
The U.S. is the undisputed greatest women's team in the world. If they don't win gold it would be an absolutely incredible upset.
Germany is supposed to be the 2nd best (and historically has been), but they seem to be in the same boat as the men's team; good talent, but an over-hyped team overall that can't actually perform that well when it really comes down to it.
As for the men's tournament, it's a clusterfuck. The men's Olympic tournament never really means much and isn't very predictable.
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Japan has an impressive collection of bronze medals.
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Jesus, if they start televising Rugby games in America, I'd start watching it. Great replacement atm for me until NFL starts up.
Carlin Isles is running circles around these boys.
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United States22883 Posts
NBC is just the worst. That is all.
EDIT: That's not all. The bad commentary and tape delays on TV are one thing, but even their website is a shit show. The video player they've used for the games has degraded every year since 2008. If you try to load the swimming day 4 replay right now, it redirects you to a soccer recap.
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On August 10 2016 12:47 Jibba wrote:
NBC is just the worst. That is all.
Indeed it is. US coverage of the Olympics is subpar in general.
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On August 10 2016 11:27 L_Master wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2016 06:42 RubickPicker wrote:On August 09 2016 22:48 L_Master wrote:Yea Gatlin is a pretty big black mark. The fact that you don't get lifetime ban for first offense isnt great in my book...but the fact that you can get two 4 year suspensions and still be allowed to compete....smh I don't have enough confidence in the testing methods to ban for life on the first result, and I think "people make mistakes" is a strong appeal as well. An MLB player got suspended 160 games for PEDs the other year because of a substance that entered his system by using a children's cold & flu medicine. And those guys have much more money at risk than Olympians do. First strike bans seem right based on the IOC's pompous "Olympic Ideal" nonsense, but in reality the science just isn't that precise. The science is pretty decent, especially with A & B samples. Clear metabolites and/or actual PED substances in blood or urine should be lifetime ban in my book. Passport detection I would do as 4 years 1st offense, lifetime 2nd offense. In cases where the athlete can make a strong, compelling argument that it was truly unsuspecting and/or in a product that it shouldn't have been, I'd be fine with a 2 or 4 year ban; as in your baseball argument. I realize people can make mistakes, but for me it depends on the mistake type. If it's a mistake in judgement, as in being young and letting someone talking you into doping..sorry, but that should be it for you and athletics at that point. The problem is that once you take PEDs, it's not like when you go off them you return back to the baseline athlete you were before. They have lasting benefits years down the road. If we are talking innocent mistake, as in you took some asthma medication once that had some trace substance in it once for a legitimate condition, that I could forgive with a more modest ban.
What about year round "random testing"? Few things are as shady as "random" testing in weightlifting.
I would rather eliminate random testing and have competition testing only or just remove testing completely, simply because the current system is just not fair.
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United States97276 Posts
On August 10 2016 12:44 sung_moon wrote:
Jesus, if they start televising Rugby games in America, I'd start watching it. Great replacement atm for me until NFL starts up.
Carlin Isles is running circles around these boys.
Watched it for the first time. Was really interesting
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How was his time in the relay?
Other people spend all their energy in the finals and he just swims two within the span of two hours? Lol
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I love how people are worshipping Phelps like he is the second coming of God. This guy didn't even have a top 20 performance this year in the 100m freestyle yet he manages to be below 48 in the relay ? Are you all realizing how ridiculous this is ? And it's not just one race. There are no miracles in sport, if you're bad all year, you don't suddenly come back to be the best. Case in point : Agnel or Laure Manaudou.
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On August 10 2016 08:51 LaNague wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2016 00:01 Harris1st wrote:
Meanwhile Germany ..... zero medals.... ZERO! What the hell? We are supposed to be in the Top 5!
We got 4 x 4th place already, so that's that we dont have any serious sport support. First you lack facilities except for 20 football fields in every small town, then you lack organisation and recruiting like US does in highschool and then you have to balance pro sports with your career since pro sports isnt a career for most sports. So dont excpect any serious competing except for the few talents that get though the system.
I'm not sure how it is nowadays or with sommer olympics in general but I'm pretty sure most of the winter olympic contenders are in the Bundeswehr and get funding from there.
On August 10 2016 06:02 Mafe wrote:
"Supposed" in which sense? Realisitically, USA, Russia, China, and to a lesser the UK (benefitting from heavy investments due to London 2012) should finish ahead of us no matter what, and Brazil is a host nation with a massive potential. Also from what I understand, other nations like Japan, South Korea, Australia seen to invest heavily into olympic sports, in particular such which have the potential to yield several gold medals. I'd argue that if we were to finish ahead of all of them, that would consitute an overall successful olympics.
Also, if you look at the schedule, was there any event before today were a german was really among the favorites to win? Maybe Biedermann, but otherwise?
Supposed in: when we do something, we do it well 
Historically we have lots of 3rd, 5th and 6th places in medal rankings.
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On August 10 2016 16:46 Otolia wrote:
I love how people are worshipping Phelps like he is the second coming of God. This guy didn't even have a top 20 performance this year in the 100m freestyle yet he manages to be below 48 in the relay ? Are you all realizing how ridiculous this is ? And it's not just one race. There are no miracles in sport, if you're bad all year, you don't suddenly come back to be the best. Case in point : Agnel or Laure Manaudou.
"If you're bad all year, you don't suddenly come back to be the best."
Happens in football all the time. Player played bad all season and suddenly becomes the ultimate playmaker during world cup.
And no, there is no doping that can make a player play incredible passes suddenly or read the game better.
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2 full days of 6 races for windsurfers both men and women, no one vomiting just yet
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The pool for men's diving did turn green though that was an indoor pool.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On August 10 2016 16:46 Otolia wrote:
I love how people are worshipping Phelps like he is the second coming of God. This guy didn't even have a top 20 performance this year in the 100m freestyle yet he manages to be below 48 in the relay ? Are you all realizing how ridiculous this is ? And it's not just one race. There are no miracles in sport, if you're bad all year, you don't suddenly come back to be the best. Case in point : Agnel or Laure Manaudou.
What are you saying, exactly, and what bearing does 100 free have on Phelps' overall form? It's not something he tends to swim- didn't swim it at the Olympic Trials, and doesn't tend to swim it when he doesn't have to - but he has a proven record of delivering when he does. I think most people knew he's in good shape, but there's a degree of separation between being one of the best in the world and winning Olympic golds. No matter what he did earlier this year, it's still a little surreal to watch him deliver endlessly.
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EPT
