EPTTeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 - Page 54
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Strongmang
18 Posts
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9859 Posts
Anyway, time for me to post my silly numbers. I achieved a nice milestone for me today, which is one plate for my training bench press. I haven't gone down in any of my lifts for the last almost 3 months of lifting, and making good progress overall everywhere. Today was my easiest day, and I did: Flat Bench: 12x85lb, 10x95lb, 8x115lb, 7x120lb, 7x125lb, 5.75x135lb Incline Dumbbell: 12x25lb, 10x27.5lb, 8x40lb, 7x45lb, 6x47.5lb, 6x47.5lb Lunges: 24x0lb, 20x50lb, 18x60lb, 16x70lb Standing BB Curl: 12x45lb, 10x50lb, 9x60lb, 8x65lb, 7x65lb, 7x70lb Incline Flyes (10deg): 13x20lb, 11x25lb, 10x30lb, 10x30lb, 9x35lb, 8x37.5lb Sitting Hammer Curl (45deg): 10x25lb, 7x27.5lb, 7x27.5lb Pronated grip forearms: 12x7.5lb, 10x10lb, 10x10lb Everything felt good. I would have gone for 50lbs and a new PR on incline dumbbell, but didn't have a spotter, so I decided not to risk it. New PR for lunges, felt good. For BB curls I did the same weight as last time, though the form looked a lot better. Incline flyes I have more room in them, but they are a finicky exercise, so I'm trying to focus on doing them right, it was also a PR from 35lbs last week. Hammer curls and forearms had the same weight as last week for the last set, but I can see the improvement. A weighed my lightest in over 3 years yesterday (or two days ago), at 168.4lb & 5'10". So after going down from 195lbs 8 months ago, it feels really good. I think I more or less reached my minimum, and now I hope to slowly work my way up in weight, as I feel like I'm at a weight where I like how I look, yet have enough fat to make sure I'm able to make "gainz" relatively easily. I'm aiming for that 170-175lb range at the end of the summer... Quite excited to post progress pics. My Friday workout will be looking something like this: Kinda-wide-grip lat pull downs: 12x60lb, 10x70lb, 8x95lb, 7x105lb, 7x115lb, 6x125lb Deadlift: 7x135lb, 5/6x215lb, 4/5x250lb Close-grip Lateral Cable Row: 12x60lb, 10x70lb, 8x100lb, 8x110lb, 7x120lb, 6x125lb Skullcrushers: 12x45lb, 10x50lb, 9x55lb, 8x60lb, 7x65lb Cable Tricep Extentions (with rope): 12x25lb, 10x35lb, 8x40lb, 7x45lb, 6x50lb Bent-Over Dumbell Row (chest on bench): 12x15lb, 10x20lb, 9x25lb, 8x27.5lb, 7x30lb, 7x30lb Close-grip Bench press (hands 3-4 inches apart): 16x65lb, 14x75lb, 12x85lb The weight of the little sled for the cable row also has a weight, not really sure how much, but there's more friction than if you were at an actualy gym (maybe like 20-25lbs). For reference, the "Kinda-wide-grip lat pull downs", at 125lb where I'd do 6 reps, it's like doing maybe 4 pull ups with the same grip. So I'll be switching to pull-ups soon. Last week I added a few negative neutral grip pull-ups, as well as just going to failure after my workout, which was like 2-3 pulls ups a few times. Anyway, this is more or less the goal... Some of these numbers are quite pessimistic, and I might be able to do 5lbs more, dunno yet. And what do you guys think of regular vs reverse grip for bent over BB row? The reason I do it with dumbbells while laying on the bench is it makes the form more strict... It's very hard for me to do it completely properly without it, as it's just an exercise where it's so easy to cheat without noticing. Definitely my most hated exercise. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9859 Posts
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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Ehzera
Singapore212 Posts
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FFGenerations
7088 Posts
On July 16 2015 13:33 FiWiFaKi wrote: What angle should I focus on maintaining in my back compared to parallel, all videos do it a little bit differently. Like 15 degrees? And should the bar be touching my belly button, upper abs, or chest? Even just searching it on google, you'll see some people who's backs are parallel with the ground, and some are at like geez, 50 degrees. And they all lift it to different areas of their body also. at beginners level, if what you're doing is hard work then you're doing it right. it doesn't matter what precise angle you're leaning it coz you don't have any muscle ANYWHERE. the best you can do is have a basic understanding of what muscles you should be activating during the lift, and trying to activate them. this will become easier and easier over time as you actually grow some muscle to activate. i guess a better answer is , try to copy the most mobile-looking guy lol. and do what your mobility allows you to do. but other than that don't sweat it | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9859 Posts
Progression is pretty much the least important thing for me. By far the most important thing for me is health. I am wanting to know what's best, because I don't want to get injured... I've had injuries in the past, and some will be better than others for it. I don't care for increasing my weight, I'm almost as big as I want to be, I just don't want to be a twig, and have muscle definition you can see. People do it differently, and hence - there is reason for it, and they do have their differences. On July 16 2015 17:14 FFGenerations wrote: at beginners level, if what you're doing is hard work then you're doing it right. it doesn't matter what precise angle you're leaning it coz you don't have any muscle ANYWHERE. the best you can do is have a basic understanding of what muscles you should be activating during the lift, and trying to activate them. this will become easier and easier over time as you actually grow some muscle to activate. i guess a better answer is , try to copy the most mobile-looking guy lol. and do what your mobility allows you to do. but other than that don't sweat it I've worked out for 3 years in the past, I have a pretty solid foundation of knowledge. Anyway, no need to come off so elitist, you don't have to tell someone who's been at it for about 3 months (on top of doing sports like tennis and cycling 300km a week), that they have no muscle. You just come off rude. Like I mentioned in my post, I have worked out in the past, and I know how to do things, hence why I have been making quick progress. The one exercise I've always struggled with is bent over rows, and was just hoping for some pointers and suggestions to improve at is. My entire gym is at home also, and as such, can't really mimic anyone I see. I work out with my 45 y/o dad, and most of you guys work out really recklessly from the videos I see... Just watch your form, and be careful, since right now, most of you are 20-28, so it's harder to get injured - I simply don't want my body to hate me when I'm 50. I workout for health, not gains or getting huge. | ||
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farvacola
United States18845 Posts
Some of the posters here do take injury risks, and it's important to point those out. I do so with Decaf every now and then  Igne, Decaf, myself, and a few others have been doing this for going on a decade and are already on the other side of incurring injuries, so don't be so quick to assume that we're all just reckless powerlifters trying to get more oomph out of our rugby tackles Besides, most of the "reckless" lifters have provided pretty good information on the resulting injuries and their rehab lol. | ||
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MtlGuitarist97
United States1539 Posts
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9859 Posts
I'm asking for advice because there are subtle differences between the two, and instead I get a response "you're weak, just do it". I am very diligent about my workouts and eating habits, and am trying to find little other things to improve my efficiency by that extra 1%. Also when I worked out 3 years back, I always had difficulty making progress in weight on my back. Squats, deadlift, bench press, shoulders, pull-ups, dips, everything I was improving. My back stagnated a lot more than the other parts of my body, and it's probably because my form on them wasn't perfect (back exercises are the hardest to have strict form by far imo). And I'm sure you've seen me post in these threads years back, my working sets were >300lb deadlft, >250lb squat, >200lb bench, >75lb weighted dip, and >25lb weighted pull-up. I'm not saying I'm a know it all, what I am saying is that I did have some 30 months in my life where I did work out quite a bit, and am not a total noob when it comes to fitness knowledge. But instead, everyone here is "lol, benches one plate, must be a fat idiot" (exaggeration, but it's that kind of elitist fueled off of preconceived notions). I just hope you can see where I'm looking at it from, and see how very little that's been said is helpful. Yes, I am being critical, and often times when I come here I end up disagreed with things... But it's because my question is completely avoided instead of being answered, and then mentioning that it isn't the primary focus, or something. I'm just trying to put some perspective on it, because almost always whenever I see a new person post here, they get the "you don't know anything treatment", when that's not necessarily always true. And hell, even if they don't, you don't have to make them shit for them to get in the right mentality. | ||
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JinDesu
United States3990 Posts
And what do you guys think of regular vs reverse grip for bent over BB row? The reason I do it with dumbbells while laying on the bench is it makes the form more strict... It's very hard for me to do it completely properly without it, as it's just an exercise where it's so easy to cheat without noticing. Definitely my most hated exercise. Strict for more upper back. Reverse for middle back. Do both. What angle should I focus on maintaining in my back compared to parallel, all videos do it a little bit differently. Like 15 degrees? And should the bar be touching my belly button, upper abs, or chest? Even just searching it on google, you'll see some people who's backs are parallel with the ground, and some are at like geez, 50 degrees. And they all lift it to different areas of their body also. I don't like parallel to ground. More strain on my lower back. Somewhere between parallel and 45 degree, lift to the bottom of my chest. | ||
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Fwmeh
1286 Posts
Therefore, the most practical advice is to experiment, starting from some reasonable assumptions (i.e. not an obviously retarded form). Just do the exercise, log and evaluate progress. This is why Igne is correct in this matter. The finer details is unimportant at this stage. It is much more important to get hands on experience. The problem with most novice lifters coming here (decide for yourself if you belong in the group, keep in mind that you can have different progression for different lifts) is that they insist on over-complicating things. The reason why one might recommend SS to a beginner is that it does NOT over-complicate things. A novice doesn't need to worry about the finer details. They SHOULD NOT worry about the finer details. They need to shut up and lift. All the details just needlessly gets in the way of that. Once you no longer progress (which is key) then we may talk about the details. But most likely, the answer will still be "lift more". | ||
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9859 Posts
There is every single reason to worry. I was doing everything right for almost 3 years, and then I got a shoulder injury, simply because I was doing dips a little too low, and going down too low on my OHDP press and incline bench. This injury was extremely demotivating... And could be attributed in part to why I stopped working out in the first place. When you workout, and you weigh 170-175lbs as I did back then, but you're moving 70lb dumbbells for these exercises, it is enough weight to easily cause injury. I thought I had the mobility, but I didn't have as much as I thought I did, and now it's an injury that will never go away fully. Most people who only had "injuries" that recover in a month don't understand this. There is no reason to not be extra safe, especially when one mistake can be the end of your lifting career. Anyway, I don't need the lecturing, I just came for my question to be answered, because I'm wanting to be safe. I appreciate the response JinDesu. On July 16 2015 21:44 Fwmeh wrote: The thing is, it is not practical to talk about "strict form", or even "form", without any context. Do we want the form that allows us to move the most weight, the form that is safest with regards to injuries, the form set up by some lifting federation? They need not coincide. The form that targets certain muscle groups? Depends on morphology to a degree, as does the above. Therefore, the most practical advice is to experiment, starting from some reasonable assumptions (i.e. not an obviously retarded form). Just do the exercise, log and evaluate progress. This is why Igne is correct in this matter. The finer details is unimportant at this stage. It is much more important to get hands on experience. The problem with most novice lifters coming here (decide for yourself if you belong in the group, keep in mind that you can have different progression for different lifts) is that they insist on over-complicating things. The reason why one might recommend SS to a beginner is that it does NOT over-complicate things. A novice doesn't need to worry about the finer details. They SHOULD NOT worry about the finer details. They need to shut up and lift. All the details just needlessly gets in the way of that. Once you no longer progress (which is key) then we may talk about the details. But most likely, the answer will still be "lift more". Yes, you're right, I should have been more clear. My goal is a healthy balance between injury prevention, has synergy with the rest of my back workout for muscle balance, and is such that it's not "easy" to cheat on to be an added bonus. I've done the exercise (and I've also done it for years in some form when I worked out in the past, and relative to my peers, it was always my weakest exercise), and it always feels kind of wonky to me, hence why I switched to laying on the bench at a 20-25 degree incline, grabbing dumbbells, and doing like a reverse wide-grip bench press motion, because it's what has felt best to me. However, not that many people do what I do, hence me coming back here, and seeing why that might be. And I agree, I could keep it simple, and maybe achieve 90% of what I would otherwise. But honestly, right now I have the time to focus on the details, so I can make them habit. If I learn that alternating grip, and doing it this way is the way to go, it's a detail that will become muscle memory, and might improve my efficiency by 5%, whatever metric you measure that on. Not only that, it makes me feel good that I'm being optimal.... I understand you don't want to overwhelm someone who is getting into weightlifting with a super tough meal-plan, and everything being super exact.... But this summer, I'm not working, I decided to focus on my health, and I want to do it right. I decided that this is what I want to do, I'm not going to stop working out, that's not a concern. I just want to be as efficient and as safe as I can. I hope that's fair of me to say, | ||
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decafchicken
United States20109 Posts
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Najda
United States3765 Posts
On July 16 2015 21:57 FiWiFaKi wrote: A nice person PM'ed me, and I'll repeat a bit of what I said there. There is every single reason to worry. I was doing everything right for almost 3 years, and then I got a shoulder injury, simply because I was doing dips a little too low, and going down too low on my OHDP press and incline bench. This injury was extremely demotivating... And could be attributed in part to why I stopped working out in the first place. In regards to shoulders, this article has been recently making the rounds on reddit: https://www.t-nation.com/training/shoulder-shocker I know people's opinions of tnation have gone downhill, and I'm going to keep doing the ohp, but it might be worth a read. | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On July 17 2015 03:26 Najda wrote: In regards to shoulders, this article has been recently making the rounds on reddit: https://www.t-nation.com/training/shoulder-shocker I know people's opinions of tnation have gone downhill, and I'm going to keep doing the ohp, but it might be worth a read. Yeah, probably worth reading. I think most of the negative opinions on Tnation have to do with two things 1) most of their articles spend two paragraphs of useless filler on selling you their latest supplement 2) they're always trying to be "revolutionary" with every single article they write. You can't keep that up forever without sounding silly. This isn't anything new or crazy - "If over head presses are bothering your shoulders, there are alternative movements. Especially for people who's competitions dont depend on an overhead press variation. Here's an example _____" is just about the entire text. | ||
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Strongmang
18 Posts
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
@ Fiwikaki You asked "what do you think about grip" and "what angle should i be at?" So I answered you. If you had asked, "What is the difference between the grips?" or "how does angle affect muscle recruitment in the row?" I would have answered those questions. | ||
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