On January 26 2015 12:39 QuanticHawk wrote: Josh Gordon is either a massive idiot or a hopeless drug addict
He's seeming like a sad combination of both. Being hopelessly addicted to drugs when you have a potentially great nfl career ahead of you makes you a massive idiot.
I don't think he's hopelessly addicted... Like seriously? I don't think people know what that means.
It's not like his substance use would prevent him from holding practically any job that didn't require random UA's or a Drivers License.
If it weren't for stupid drug policies (outside of the DUI) it wouldn't be a problem, He probably does less "drugs" and drunk driving than most of the working people in America (especially if we're talking 18-24 year olds).
The guy wouldn't even have tested positive for cannabis under the new rules, and the only reason the alcohol was a problem was because of what wouldn't even be a problem with cannabis now...
How divorced from reality are people?
You guys make him sound like he's selling his daughter on the corner for meth money... Good Lord.
On January 26 2015 14:49 Slaughter wrote: I dunno if I would say "hopelessly addicted" from the information we have. Probably just an idiot who thinks he can get away with it
Considering how much shit the NFL turns a blind eye towards can anyone really blame him? Also, if you can look back on your 18-24 years and think "whew didn't do anything stupid that put my future at risk" (like smoking cannabis or drinking alcohol when you weren't supposed to, or any of the other countless dumb things people that age do) than you are probably a boring person with boring (if any in real life) friends.
Well the point is that most of us aren't getting constantly tested and have literal millions on the line, which is where the idiot part comes in. But yea weed and booze doesn't exactly inspire great concern (the DUI does though).
On January 26 2015 15:52 Slaughter wrote: Well the point is that most of us aren't getting constantly tested and have literal millions on the line, which is where the idiot part comes in. But yea weed and booze doesn't exactly inspire great concern (the DUI does though).
Yeah I'm not going to argue with it being stupid (though not really outside of the typical range of stupid for his age imo). I'm not making excuses for drinking and driving, but the guy blew a freaking .09 in NC where that's probably under the average BAC for people over the age of 21 at any given time after 5pm driving or not.
What to me, is next level stupid, and far more shameful, is the grown elders at the NFL/in politics being unable to have sensible rules/laws for cannabis and alcohol.
Just seems dumb to be speculating about how stupid he is, and especially ignorant to speculate about him being hopelessly addicted, when the stupid part is the system of hoops he's failing to jump through and the substance "abuse" is a bad joke.
Can we please stop with the deflation discussion? It could have been going on for a really long time, and it could potentially lead to a pretty significant advantage for the Patriots. The arguments are going in circles, failing to convince anyone to change their mind.
What reason have any of you to believe the NFL won't be honest? They came down hard on the Patriots with the recording scandal in 2007. They crushed the Saints for the bounty scandal. They were honest about the bullying situation (although I don't know what came of it, they certainly didn't lie). What reason have you to believe they'll lie now? History is against all of you conspiracy theorists, yet you're insistent that Goodell will protect his pal Robert, as if he's not also pals with the other 31 owners.
Does anyone actually think that the other owners would cover up cheating? Do those of you thinking that Goodell will lie about the investigation understand how the NFL works? The other 31 owners are going to be very interested in this investigation, and there's no reason to think that they'll buy a BS story. If this helped the Patriots win games, it's hitting them right where it hurts the most: their pockets.
I can accept mistrust with the Ray Rice case because owners might cover for a friend in a situation that doesn't affect competition. There's no way they'd cover for the Patriots cheating. Stop being stupid.
On January 25 2015 18:02 cLutZ wrote: Lynch is really confusing to me. He must have some money stream I don't know about, or is super thrifty, because I can't imagine 5 minutes of being an ass to reporters being worth 1% of my salary. For me that is like Christmas gifts for everyone but my girlfriend.
He's not being an ass. He has severe anxiety. I can't understand it myself considering his job but when you watch the interviews it's pretty clear he's incredibly uncomfortable.
The guy is about to cry. If people watched more than the snippits and actually payed attention it would be pretty obvious.
They should really figure out how to help him instead of just fining him...
For a league that focuses so much on fighting the good fight against issues like bullying, they sure don't seem to care when it happens to their own players.
He just can't handle the media, there's no reason to force him to do it. Sherman talks enough for the entire league.
He should probably go see a psychiatrist and work with the NFLPA to get an exemption. He apparently hasn't shown evidence for his case, so of course the requirement stands. Maybe the NFL would need their own doctor to confirm the diagnosis. I can't imagine anyone actually wants to watch these interviews, so I don't see a benefit in tampering with the analysis, but they need to avoid players paying off a shrink to write them a BS note. Maybe Lynch believes that seeing a psychiatrist means he's weak?
You'd think the problem would solve itself naturally: awful interviews lead to reporters ignoring him, but no. The whole thing is stupid, but sports journalism is a fucking joke anyway. Time that the media could use to educate the audience about the game is spent on inane topics. People eat the shit up for some reason, so I can't be too mad at the media for it.
On January 25 2015 18:02 cLutZ wrote: Lynch is really confusing to me. He must have some money stream I don't know about, or is super thrifty, because I can't imagine 5 minutes of being an ass to reporters being worth 1% of my salary. For me that is like Christmas gifts for everyone but my girlfriend.
He's not being an ass. He has severe anxiety. I can't understand it myself considering his job but when you watch the interviews it's pretty clear he's incredibly uncomfortable.
The guy is about to cry. If people watched more than the snippits and actually payed attention it would be pretty obvious.
They should really figure out how to help him instead of just fining him...
This is what I don't really get. Is it so hard to believe that being publicly interviewed can make an individual extremely anxious, regardless of that person's aptitude in other areas? People use Marshawn's status as a tier 1 NFL running back as evidence that he couldn't possibly be nervous or bothered by the cameras, mics, and bright lights, and just assume he's being a dick.
Another example is poor Jim Tomsula. He sweats buckets and talks in circles in interviews, yet he seems like such a cool guy from what (little) I've seen and heard from him in random sideline video clips. Reports are generally that he is great at his job and his d-linemen loved playing for him. Watching his interviews however he comes off like some fat guy they randomly pulled in from the stands, and people are attacking him before he even gets a shot to prove himself. I'm not saying he's going to do a good job or anything, but at least let him fail before crucifying him.
Having said that, a big piece of a head coach's job is managing the press and handling the torrents of random drama so that his team doesn't have to. If something like deflategate happens or if Aldon Smith decides to give a gun show again, given what he's showed us about his media skills the team may just collapse instantly. I really can't imagine Jim going doing what Belichick did yesterday night.
Having ten mics and five cameras shoved in your face while people grill you with questions is an unnatural thing. Many athletes find ways to cope and handle it well but for whatever reason some can't.
I think the issue with Tomsula is that if you can't handle the pressure of the media, how can one expect him to handle the pressure of 53 guys in the locker room turning on him? If Aldon Smith and a couple of other guys get out of line and they get a lot of the other players to join in, how will a guy with anxiety issues handle that situation?You need balls of steel to perform well as a head coach. It's similar to Trestman's failure: shit hit the fan and he couldn't control the locker room. I think his lack of ability in a press conference is more telling than mere awkwardness with the press.
At first I thought he was building a decent staff, but the more research I do, the less I believe that.
Considering Lane Kiffin to run the offense is a joke. He's been a cancerous asshat everywhere since his OC days at USC. Kiffin hasn't been good since he coached with Pete Carroll.Alabama's PPG was at its lowest since 2011. Their QB was a pile of shit though. At this point, I don't think we have a good reason to believe that Kiffin's success at USC had anything to do with Kiffin.
Their OL coach is fucking terrible, look at his résumé. Mangini is an arrogant douche. I'm not sure why so many people consider him a great DC. Maybe he was a good position coach, but take a look at his stats and see how woefully his defenses performed. Only once did he coach a top 10 defense in either major category (points and yards).
Perry Fewell might be a good hire for their DBs. I think his biggest problem in NY over the last couple years was talent deficiency, largely because of injuries. It seems like they always had a couple starters out. And can we blame him for having sub-par defenses in Buffalo?
Regarding Josh Gordon, I'll just say that substance abuse is a far more complex issue than a lot of people are making it out to be (though I am not saying he's an addict... I don't know). Making a lot of money doesn't change the effects of addiction. He either has a substance problem or a severe judgement problem, but until he admits it, he cannot change. Either way, he should seek guidance before he throws his life away. He'll never see this kind of pay day anywhere else, and it'd be tragic if he resolved to lead a life of crime or something instead.
On January 26 2015 16:35 Slaughter wrote: Also the lack of any real discipline with the colts owner caught with drugs lol.
The NFL has a problem with perceived inconsistency. Whether it's inconsistent officiating, or very arbitrary punishments for behavior on and off the field, or the owners not holding themselves equally accountable as they hold the players. It's not good for their reputation.
On January 26 2015 12:39 QuanticHawk wrote: Josh Gordon is either a massive idiot or a hopeless drug addict
He's seeming like a sad combination of both. Being hopelessly addicted to drugs when you have a potentially great nfl career ahead of you makes you a massive idiot.
I don't think he's hopelessly addicted... Like seriously? I don't think people know what that means.
It's not like his substance use would prevent him from holding practically any job that didn't require random UA's or a Drivers License.
If it weren't for stupid drug policies (outside of the DUI) it wouldn't be a problem, He probably does less "drugs" and drunk driving than most of the working people in America (especially if we're talking 18-24 year olds).
The guy wouldn't even have tested positive for cannabis under the new rules, and the only reason the alcohol was a problem was because of what wouldn't even be a problem with cannabis now...
How divorced from reality are people?
You guys make him sound like he's selling his daughter on the corner for meth money... Good Lord.
On January 26 2015 14:49 Slaughter wrote: I dunno if I would say "hopelessly addicted" from the information we have. Probably just an idiot who thinks he can get away with it
Considering how much shit the NFL turns a blind eye towards can anyone really blame him? Also, if you can look back on your 18-24 years and think "whew didn't do anything stupid that put my future at risk" (like smoking cannabis or drinking alcohol when you weren't supposed to, or any of the other countless dumb things people that age do) than you are probably a boring person with boring (if any in real life) friends.
no matter how stupid I may think the Nfl's policies are, he knew very well that he couldn't even drink after his last dance with them and he did. He's literally chosing booze rather than playing, and he's still on his rookie contract. I think it's certainly plausible to mention that he might be an addict if he can't even stay clean long enough for that
On January 26 2015 16:35 Slaughter wrote: Also the lack of any real discipline with the colts owner caught with drugs lol.
That was a story that blew over far too easily. Irsay should have been crucified for that but he received a relative slap on the wrist.
He got fined half a million. That's not exactly chump change, even for an owner of a sports team
I mean I dislike Irsay and think he's a huge fucking blowhard dipsit and I dislike him because he's lucked into Two franchise qbs and has done nothing to build around them, but that's a little more than a slap on the wrist
On January 26 2015 16:35 Slaughter wrote: Also the lack of any real discipline with the colts owner caught with drugs lol.
That was a story that blew over far too easily. Irsay should have been crucified for that but he received a relative slap on the wrist.
He got fined half a million. That's not exactly chump change, even for an owner of a sports team
I mean I dislike Irsay and think he's a huge fucking blowhard dipsit and I dislike him because he's lucked into Two franchise qbs and has done nothing to build around them, but that's a little more than a slap on the wrist
I missed the fine. I thought he was only suspended for that short time. My bad.
On January 26 2015 12:39 QuanticHawk wrote: Josh Gordon is either a massive idiot or a hopeless drug addict
He's seeming like a sad combination of both. Being hopelessly addicted to drugs when you have a potentially great nfl career ahead of you makes you a massive idiot.
I don't think he's hopelessly addicted... Like seriously? I don't think people know what that means.
It's not like his substance use would prevent him from holding practically any job that didn't require random UA's or a Drivers License.
If it weren't for stupid drug policies (outside of the DUI) it wouldn't be a problem, He probably does less "drugs" and drunk driving than most of the working people in America (especially if we're talking 18-24 year olds).
The guy wouldn't even have tested positive for cannabis under the new rules, and the only reason the alcohol was a problem was because of what wouldn't even be a problem with cannabis now...
How divorced from reality are people?
You guys make him sound like he's selling his daughter on the corner for meth money... Good Lord.
On January 26 2015 14:49 Slaughter wrote: I dunno if I would say "hopelessly addicted" from the information we have. Probably just an idiot who thinks he can get away with it
Considering how much shit the NFL turns a blind eye towards can anyone really blame him? Also, if you can look back on your 18-24 years and think "whew didn't do anything stupid that put my future at risk" (like smoking cannabis or drinking alcohol when you weren't supposed to, or any of the other countless dumb things people that age do) than you are probably a boring person with boring (if any in real life) friends.
no matter how stupid I may think the Nfl's policies are, he knew very well that he couldn't even drink after his last dance with them and he did. He's literally chosing booze rather than playing, and he's still on his rookie contract. I think it's certainly plausible to mention that he might be an addict if he can't even stay clean long enough for that
Hopeless addicts don't have just a few drinks. The guy would practically get laughed out of AA if he tried to call himself an alcoholic.
It doesn't seem like he drinks himself into a stupor or really any evidence he drinks a lot or often. He drinks probably less than most people 18-24, especially in NC, hes just had some bad luck when it comes to getting caught.
I mean the guy smoked pot in college (who does that right!?) and got a DUI in NC (10TH drunkest state in the country) with a .09 (was really just a speeding ticket until the BA test) and then got caught with alcohol in his urine at a random screening on a weekend (while he's not working for months).
What seems like a much more likely explanation is that he is like your typical person of that age who thinks he can still get away with shit and doesn't comprehend the potential consequences.
But sure if one knew absolutely nothing about addiction or never bothered to actually read the details of his instances I could see how one might think he is a "hopeless addict".
As for owners/top office people caught with drugs or committing other crimes, they should get temp banned by the same guidelines as the players do, perhaps more so since they are "the boss".
Irsay being a 55 year old man in AA post rehab and getting caught with a car full of cash ($29,000) and prescription medication, and being unable to recite the alphabet. Now that sounds like a potential hopeless addict.
Gordon sounds more like a typical person in their early 20's who just happens to have the opportunity to make millions playing a game. If Wall Street randomly UA'd it's employees or gave random UA's to future employees still in college, that shit would be a ghost town in days.
On January 27 2015 03:52 GreenHorizons wrote: I don't think he's hopelessly addicted... Like seriously? I don't think people know what that means.
It's not like his substance use would prevent him from holding practically any job that didn't require random UA's or a Drivers License.
If it weren't for stupid drug policies (outside of the DUI) it wouldn't be a problem, He probably does less "drugs" and drunk driving than most of the working people in America (especially if we're talking 18-24 year olds).
Based on what?
The guy wouldn't even have tested positive for cannabis under the new rules, and the only reason the alcohol was a problem was because of what wouldn't even be a problem with cannabis now...
How divorced from reality are people?
You guys make him sound like he's selling his daughter on the corner for meth money... Good Lord.
So did he break the rules for substance abuse or not? That's the reality.
Hopeless addicts don't have just a few drinks. The guy would practically get laughed out of AA if he tried to call himself an alcoholic.
It doesn't seem like he drinks himself into a stupor or really any evidence he drinks a lot or often. He drinks probably less than most people 18-24, especially in NC, hes just had some bad luck when it comes to getting caught.
Same questions as above, did he break the NFL's rule on substance abuse or not? The NFLPA makes all their players follow those rules so they seem to be okay with it, while you clearly are not.
I mean the guy smoked pot in college (who does that right!?) and got a DUI in NC (10TH drunkest state in the country) with a .09 (was really just a speeding ticket until the BA test) and then got caught with alcohol in his urine at a random screening on a weekend (while he's not working for months).
What seems like a much more likely explanation is that he is like your typical person of that age who thinks he can still get away with shit and doesn't comprehend the potential consequences.
I totally agree.
As for owners/top office people caught with drugs or committing other crimes, they should get temp banned by the same guidelines as the players do, perhaps more so since they are "the boss".
Difference is they don't subscribe to the same standards as their players, and since they don't have any physical demands of their job I don't see why they'd have to. Though I would like slightly sober owners, the key is nobody with their amount of money are going to be told what to do for very long.
Irsay being a 55 year old man in AA post rehab and getting caught with a car full of cash ($29,000) and prescription medication, and being unable to recite the alphabet. Now that sounds like a potential hopeless addict.
I also agree.
Gordon sounds more like a typical person in their early 20's who just happens to have the opportunity to make millions playing a game. If Wall Street randomly UA'd it's employees or gave random UA's to future employees still in college, that shit would be a ghost town in days.
End on a hyperbole of a hypothetical situation, strong finish!
On January 27 2015 03:52 GreenHorizons wrote: I don't think he's hopelessly addicted... Like seriously? I don't think people know what that means.
It's not like his substance use would prevent him from holding practically any job that didn't require random UA's or a Drivers License.
If it weren't for stupid drug policies (outside of the DUI) it wouldn't be a problem, He probably does less "drugs" and drunk driving than most of the working people in America (especially if we're talking 18-24 year olds).
The guy wouldn't even have tested positive for cannabis under the new rules, and the only reason the alcohol was a problem was because of what wouldn't even be a problem with cannabis now...
How divorced from reality are people?
You guys make him sound like he's selling his daughter on the corner for meth money... Good Lord.
So did he break the rules for substance abuse or not? That's the reality.
Hopeless addicts don't have just a few drinks. The guy would practically get laughed out of AA if he tried to call himself an alcoholic.
It doesn't seem like he drinks himself into a stupor or really any evidence he drinks a lot or often. He drinks probably less than most people 18-24, especially in NC, hes just had some bad luck when it comes to getting caught.
Same questions as above, did he break the NFL's rule on substance abuse or not? The NFLPA makes all their players follow those rules so they seem to be okay with it, while you clearly are not.
I mean the guy smoked pot in college (who does that right!?) and got a DUI in NC (10TH drunkest state in the country) with a .09 (was really just a speeding ticket until the BA test) and then got caught with alcohol in his urine at a random screening on a weekend (while he's not working for months).
What seems like a much more likely explanation is that he is like your typical person of that age who thinks he can still get away with shit and doesn't comprehend the potential consequences.
As for owners/top office people caught with drugs or committing other crimes, they should get temp banned by the same guidelines as the players do, perhaps more so since they are "the boss".
Difference is they don't subscribe to the same standards as their players, and since they don't have any physical demands of their job I don't see why they'd have to. Though I would like slightly sober owners, the key is nobody with their amount of money are going to be told what to do for very long.
Irsay being a 55 year old man in AA post rehab and getting caught with a car full of cash ($29,000) and prescription medication, and being unable to recite the alphabet. Now that sounds like a potential hopeless addict.
Gordon sounds more like a typical person in their early 20's who just happens to have the opportunity to make millions playing a game. If Wall Street randomly UA'd it's employees or gave random UA's to future employees still in college, that shit would be a ghost town in days.
End on a hyperbole of a hypothetical situation, strong finish!
My contention on his substance use compared to an average 18-24 yo is based off mostly personal experience, I didn't spend a day in college where I didn't see someone new/different use some substance. Also based off statistics of substance use among 18-24 yo. Also it's not like he's some slob or that anyone ever said any substance has ever impacted his performance directly.
Prevalence of Alcohol Use: Prevalence of Drinking: In 2012, 60.3 percent of college students ages 18–22 drank alcohol in the past month compared with 51.9 percent of same-age peers not in college.18
Prevalence of Binge Drinking: 40.1 percent of college students ages 18–22 engaged in binge drinking (5 or more drinks on an occasion) in the past month compared with 35 percent of same-age peers not in college.19
Prevalence of Heavy Drinking: 14.4 percent of college students ages 18–22 engaged in heavy drinking (5 or more drinks on an occasion on 5 or more occasions per month) in the past month compared with 10.7 percent of same-age peers not in college.20
I'm not arguing whether he broke the rules or not? That's not in contention. My point was that insinuating he is a hopeless addict is resoundingly ignorant. I think the rules are dumb but they are the ones they agree to so that's on them.
On January 27 2015 05:59 oneofthem wrote: i think i prefer deflationgate over this drug thing. at least deflationgate has hilarious pats fans being defensive.
There really isn't much to either one. The hopeless addict part just got to me because I work/volunteer with addicts (mostly veterans and pain/ptsd medication) and it's not fair to Gordon or for the veterans for people to be so recklessly and ignorantly throwing around "hopeless addict" insinuations.
Addiction is serious business, especially when you're talking about "hopeless". A huge problem in recovery is that a lot of addicts feel written off as "hopeless" by society and their families. People edging toward doing the same with a guy who is otherwise a spectacular athlete and only had less than a handful of incidents (none of which were especially significant) is a huge part of a much larger social problem.
If people knew anything about addiction they would know you could fit the grand canyon in between "hopeless" and someone with a record like Gordon.
On January 27 2015 06:15 Zdrastochye wrote: It'll flare back up once the Seahawks lose to the Pats and the whole league will be full of NaCl.
As a Seahawks fan I can assure you if anything isn't on the up and up from the Pats or the refs the whole world will know about it haha. But the Hawks got this.
On January 27 2015 05:59 oneofthem wrote: i think i prefer deflationgate over this drug thing. at least deflationgate has hilarious pats fans being defensive.
Deflationgate about to become even more hilarious. Latest report is that the NFL is zeroing in on a Patriots locker room attendant and has video evidence. They are now in the process of briefing Roger Goodell on what video technology is and teaching him how to operate Windows Media Player.
EPT
