EPTTeamliquid Health and Fitness Initiative for 2014 - Page 61
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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Arisen
United States2382 Posts
When I do this; when should I be eating breakfast? I have tried both eating before and after the walk, and both feel fine. I've heard varying opinions on doing any kind of cardio in a fasted state, and was hoping someone more knowledgable than myself could let me know what's up. If it matters any, usually my breakfast is eggs, some fruit and maybe a few strips of bacon or a few ounces of chorizo/sausage (~400-500 cals). Would it change things if I ran in the morning (I run 3x a week, thinking about moving my run to the morning) as opposed to walking? Thanks for any tips! | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On April 17 2014 23:58 Arisen wrote: So, I've got a question about nutrition in relation to working out. I've recently started walking an hour every morning. I live right on a state trail and it's a great way to see the sun rise in the morning, and I'm not much of a morning person, so I'm hoping this will start to give me more energy through the morning. When I do this; when should I be eating breakfast? I have tried both eating before and after the walk, and both feel fine. I've heard varying opinions on doing any kind of cardio in a fasted state, and was hoping someone more knowledgable than myself could let me know what's up. If it matters any, usually my breakfast is eggs, some fruit and maybe a few strips of bacon or a few ounces of chorizo/sausage (~400-500 cals). Would it change things if I ran in the morning (I run 3x a week, thinking about moving my run to the morning) as opposed to walking? Thanks for any tips! I think you would get more out of your morning cardio (for fat loss purposes) if it's fasted. If it's for CV purposes and not fat loss, I would think you would be running sprints? | ||
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farvacola
United States18857 Posts
When it comes down to it, however, doing the exercise is the most important part and banana or no banana won't make much of a difference given consistency. | ||
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decafchicken
United States20161 Posts
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NeedsmoreCELLTECH
Netherlands1242 Posts
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GoTuNk!
Chile4591 Posts
On April 17 2014 23:58 Arisen wrote: So, I've got a question about nutrition in relation to working out. I've recently started walking an hour every morning. I live right on a state trail and it's a great way to see the sun rise in the morning, and I'm not much of a morning person, so I'm hoping this will start to give me more energy through the morning. When I do this; when should I be eating breakfast? I have tried both eating before and after the walk, and both feel fine. I've heard varying opinions on doing any kind of cardio in a fasted state, and was hoping someone more knowledgable than myself could let me know what's up. If it matters any, usually my breakfast is eggs, some fruit and maybe a few strips of bacon or a few ounces of chorizo/sausage (~400-500 cals). Would it change things if I ran in the morning (I run 3x a week, thinking about moving my run to the morning) as opposed to walking? Thanks for any tips! I think walking is great, given its an hour long I would have breakfast before. This could actually aid in your recovery so you can lift more weight. I'm also on the camp that cardio (jogging++) is a waste of energy that could be better expent lifting weights :d | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20837645 In 2011 van Proeyen et al. observed that training fasted does not only increase the intramuscular fatty acid oxidation in 20 healthy young volunteers, it did also and this may come as a surprise, prevent "the development exercise-induced drop in blood glucose concentration" (Van Proeyen. 2011) - the same drop in blood sugar that will make you feel exhausted and is a potential risk factor for an acceleration of the metabolic downregulation that occurs, whenever you are dieting. One year before van Proeyen et al. had already established that in times of high fat overfeeding (+30%kcal; 50% fat) only fasted training was able to increase the AMPK levels (=anti-cancer, anti-diabetic, anti-obesity effect) in young men (van Proyen. 2011). When you take a look at the AMPK/mTOR pathways for metabolism it becomes pretty clear that in purely in terms of body composition, it's not detrimental to train (semi)fasted, as lifting in trained athletes activates the mTOR pathway, which leads to protein synthesis and halts catabolism (at least as long as you deliver aminos eventually). So exercise prevents your body from breaking down muscle during the fast. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1600-0838.2011.01395.x/abstract The BCAAs pre-workout help to mitigate any muscle-specific catabolism during the lifts, while the activation of the AMPK metabolic pathway through fasting and exercise in the previous 12+ hours helps to mobilize and burn fat. Would I train fasted if I were trying to get as strong and as big as possible as quickly as possible? No. Would I train fasted if I didn't have as much muscle and training history as I do? I don't know. All that said, I think farva is right that eating a small something before working out in the morning can stoke metabolic fire. Whey protein in particular spikes insulin and really cranks up the metabolism. Watch how hungry you get if you take a whey shake in the morning and then don't eat for a few hours. Personally, however, I find that people don't deal well with that kind of hunger feeling, and end up overcompensating by eating more when they get back. I think alternate day fasting is one of the easiest ways to actually drop weight without losing lean body mass because its very very difficult to overcompensate on a non-fast day when you just dropped thousands of calories from your diet the day before. It's very easy to remain compliant because the hunger passes quickly and you don't have to worry about preparing meals. There's plenty of solid research backing up it's efficacy too. | ||
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MtlGuitarist97
United States1539 Posts
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
On April 18 2014 03:59 IgnE wrote: The people who know better probably haven't tried it, and probably aren't familiar with the latest fasting research. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20837645 In 2011 van Proeyen et al. observed that training fasted does not only increase the intramuscular fatty acid oxidation in 20 healthy young volunteers, it did also and this may come as a surprise, prevent "the development exercise-induced drop in blood glucose concentration" (Van Proeyen. 2011) - the same drop in blood sugar that will make you feel exhausted and is a potential risk factor for an acceleration of the metabolic downregulation that occurs, whenever you are dieting. One year before van Proeyen et al. had already established that in times of high fat overfeeding (+30%kcal; 50% fat) only fasted training was able to increase the AMPK levels (=anti-cancer, anti-diabetic, anti-obesity effect) in young men (van Proyen. 2011). When you take a look at the AMPK/mTOR pathways for metabolism it becomes pretty clear that in purely in terms of body composition, it's not detrimental to train (semi)fasted, as lifting in trained athletes activates the mTOR pathway, which leads to protein synthesis and halts catabolism (at least as long as you deliver aminos eventually). So exercise prevents your body from breaking down muscle during the fast. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1600-0838.2011.01395.x/abstract The BCAAs pre-workout help to mitigate any muscle-specific catabolism during the lifts, while the activation of the AMPK metabolic pathway through fasting and exercise in the previous 12+ hours helps to mobilize and burn fat. Would I train fasted if I were trying to get as strong and as big as possible as quickly as possible? No. Would I train fasted if I didn't have as much muscle and training history as I do? I don't know. All that said, I think farva is right that eating a small something before working out in the morning can stoke metabolic fire. Whey protein in particular spikes insulin and really cranks up the metabolism. Watch how hungry you get if you take a whey shake in the morning and then don't eat for a few hours. Personally, however, I find that people don't deal well with that kind of hunger feeling, and end up overcompensating by eating more when they get back. I think alternate day fasting is one of the easiest ways to actually drop weight without losing lean body mass because its very very difficult to overcompensate on a non-fast day when you just dropped thousands of calories from your diet the day before. It's very easy to remain compliant because the hunger passes quickly and you don't have to worry about preparing meals. There's plenty of solid research backing up it's efficacy too. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I would be very careful about linking the latest study and calling it truth, especially when it looks that good. Peer-review, trial and error and time will prove it true or false, the scientific method takes time. I'm obviously not saying it's wrong, but to assume it's true is irresponsible. That said, you certainly come across as a guy who's done his homework. Me, I can hardly interpret that shit. What's a metabolic pathway lol? But if you believe the above study, why wouldn't you always train semi-fasted? On a related note I do intermittent fasting as well (16/8 which basically means I skip breakfast), been doing it for two years now I guess and I've found that in terms of hunger it is much better to simply eat nothing up until lunch than having "just something" like a tiny fruit or a slice of bologna. If I eat anything at all short of a full meal before lunch I become queen bitch of the universe, the crankiest motherfucker you can imagine. It's like my body was expecting a treat and then it gets this tiny crumb and it just goes straight into inconsolable toddler mode. But I've also tried working out in the mornings with nothing but a BCAA shake up until lunch, and for some reason that was no problem. May have been the workout, may have been the insulin boost, may have been the fact I just ate more vegetables back then. I dunno, sheeeit. Btw, you wouldn't train fasted while bulking, but would you still do intermittent fasting? From what I understand it would reduce the fat you put on, but it sure as hell is alot harder to get your calories in. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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NeedsmoreCELLTECH
Netherlands1242 Posts
Also from other researchers I really didn't get the impression that "all the data is pro-intermittent fasting". | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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sJarl
Iceland1699 Posts
How you all been? | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
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decafchicken
United States20161 Posts
On April 19 2014 05:23 sJarl wrote: Good to see many of you still hanging around here. How you all been? cold and drunk. where ya been?? | ||
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MtlGuitarist97
United States1539 Posts
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