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AirbladeOrange
United States2573 Posts
On April 16 2013 14:10 LuckyFool wrote: YPang wasn't in Boston today? I thought he just qualified recently which means he can run starting in next years event I thought. I think you're right. He just hit the qualifying time so it was probably too late to register or plan for it. | ||
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dudeman001
United States2412 Posts
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LuckyFool
United States9015 Posts
http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/ I can currently run a 21 minute 5k but that's at a pretty hard effort for me. During a normal long run I'll clock 5k's in at like 24 or something. I don't really feel I can push 7:25/mile pace for 13 miles straight but according to this I should be able to? I feel an 8:30/mile pace would be way more realistic (current comfortable training pace), I feel as if I try and power through with 7:25 pace I'll burn out. maybe this is because my history is with shorter distances? I've only been running long distance for a year now. Or maybe if I just rest 3-4 days before the race I'll be able to do it, I'm running almost every day right now. | ||
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AirbladeOrange
United States2573 Posts
On April 17 2013 09:13 LuckyFool wrote: How accurate are running calculators like this http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/ I can currently run a 21 minute 5k but that's at a pretty hard effort for me. During a normal long run I'll clock 5k's in at like 24 or something. I don't really feel I can push 7:25/mile pace for 13 miles straight but according to this I should be able to? I feel an 8:30/mile pace would be way more realistic (current comfortable training pace), I feel as if I try and power through with 7:25 pace I'll burn out. maybe this is because my history is with shorter distances? I've only been running long distance for a year now. Or maybe if I just rest 3-4 days before the race I'll be able to do it, I'm running almost every day right now. I feel like the shorter distances in the calculator are much easier to run than what it says for the longer ones. A 5:20 mile will be much easier for most people to do than a 3 hour marathon. | ||
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LuckyFool
United States9015 Posts
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YPang
United States4024 Posts
I just qualified this year, and was absolutely horrified to hear of the news while i was studying for a quiz in my college's library. I had goosebumps for informed of this. This is absolutely disastrous, famillies sacrifice so much to qualify their athletes to this race, only to be greeted by this sort of tragic. .... However, I still will be at this race next year on patriots day. | ||
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AirbladeOrange
United States2573 Posts
I always had the best times around the 3-8kish area but couldn't meet the times for the lower or higher distances. But there are other factors to take into account as well like fast/slow twitch muscles, mental toughness for varying distances and other stuff. But yeah the mileage you have to put in for a marathon is nothing compared to doing minimal endurance work and lots of speed for something like the 800. | ||
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YPang
United States4024 Posts
On April 17 2013 10:09 AirbladeOrange wrote: I feel like the shorter distances in the calculator are much easier to run than what it says for the longer ones. A 5:20 mile will be much easier for most people to do than a 3 hour marathon. From what i heard of/know, is that your mile time can be viewed as your personal threshold level, and all the times calculated around your best time can be achieved, as long as you have the endurance to maintain the pace the calculator recommends for for such distance. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On April 17 2013 09:13 LuckyFool wrote: How accurate are running calculators like this http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/ I can currently run a 21 minute 5k but that's at a pretty hard effort for me. During a normal long run I'll clock 5k's in at like 24 or something. I don't really feel I can push 7:25/mile pace for 13 miles straight but according to this I should be able to? I feel an 8:30/mile pace would be way more realistic (current comfortable training pace), I feel as if I try and power through with 7:25 pace I'll burn out. maybe this is because my history is with shorter distances? I've only been running long distance for a year now. Or maybe if I just rest 3-4 days before the race I'll be able to do it, I'm running almost every day right now. Its pretty accurate....but with several key assumptions. Assumption one is that you are aerobically developed, if not, you'll tail off as events get longer. It's very common to see high school runners with PRs of like 4:40 and 18:00, but then a 40 year old masters runner will probably do like 4:40 and 16:00. That takes time, in years, to develop. Moreover, it assumes you are properly trained for the event. If your season is a track season focused on 5k and you run 20, don't expect to bust a 1:30 half. It's also worth noting that everyone does have their personal sweet spot. If you are on the extreme end it can be way off. A guy like Leo Manzano, who runs like 3:30/3:50 for 1500/mile and is very much a true miler, struggles to run mid 14s for 5k, and it only gets worth for their. Ryan Hall, especially in the midst of marathon training, could only muster like 4:08 or something for the mile, despite being able to run 26 @ 4:45 pace. If you actually input the WR's and look across the calculator it is shockingly accurate though. I feel an 8:30/mile pace would be way more realistic (current comfortable training pace) Half marathon's are run MUCH faster than comfortable training pace. Even marathons are run at faster than comfortable training pace. 8:30 feeling nice for a 21 flat guy seems about right. 7:30 pace should be a solid effort for 3-4 miles, though not the kind of effort that obliterates you. I would expect 7:30 to be a strong, but tolerable pace for say 20-30 mins, tough for 45-60 min, and all out balls to the wall race effort for 10 miles. Over time with training and half marathon specific workouts you develop efficiency at that pace and clear lactate better, allowing you to sustain it for a half. | ||
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smr
Germany4808 Posts
I'm a beginner and I have a question because I have no idea how to go on from the point I am at right now. Short history: I played football (soccer) until ~2006. I had to stop because I injured my oudside hinges for the 6th time in 6 years (had to do with a problem at my birth) and I wasn't able to run without pain even after months of easy training and physiotherapy. Last year I wanted to give it a try again. At that point I was 1.76m/98kg. I started doing 5km runs 2-4 times a week for about two months when I got lazy again. I ran in my sneakers because I got no other shoes and didn't want to pay money for something I wasn't sure I would use. The pain from 2006 was felt once or twice a week but it seemed acceptable. I mean I wasn't running for 6 years of course my body will notice that. Those 5km took me about... 45minutes I guess. I was a fast walker with good looking shorts. Now this year everything shall improve and after losing 9kg weight in january I started to think. Maybe I could run a half-marathon (just for myself - no competetive environment) in a few months?! ( need to aim high because I often lose my motivation if my targets are too small - I can't think rational in those moments. I'm running the same 5km as last year 4-5 times a week right now and in most cases it doesn't take 30minutes so I gained a lot of speed (just through weight loss?!). But what now? After reading "Dean Karnazes - Ultramarathon Man" I would love to try a running a half-marathon in about a month (NOW!!!) just to see how long my legs will carry me. On the other hand I'm sure it's a bad idea because I'm still 13-15kg overweight and I might get hurt. How should I go forward from here from an endurance perspective? Less but longer runs? Go cycling to strengthen other parts of my body? Thanks for reading and taking your time. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On April 20 2013 06:00 smr wrote: Hello everybody in the Running Thread. I'm a beginner and I have a question because I have no idea how to go on from the point I am at right now. Short history: I played football (soccer) until ~2006. I had to stop because I injured my oudside hinges for the 6th time in 6 years (had to do with a problem at my birth) and I wasn't able to run without pain even after months of easy training and physiotherapy. Last year I wanted to give it a try again. At that point I was 1.76m/98kg. I started doing 5km runs 2-4 times a week for about two months when I got lazy again. I ran in my sneakers because I got no other shoes and didn't want to pay money for something I wasn't sure I would use. The pain from 2006 was felt once or twice a week but it seemed acceptable. I mean I wasn't running for 6 years of course my body will notice that. Those 5km took me about... 45minutes I guess. I was a fast walker with good looking shorts. Now this year everything shall improve and after losing 9kg weight in january I started to think. Maybe I could run a half-marathon (just for myself - no competetive environment) in a few months?! ( need to aim high because I often lose my motivation if my targets are too small - I can't think rational in those moments. I'm running the same 5km as last year 4-5 times a week right now and in most cases it doesn't take 30minutes so I gained a lot of speed (just through weight loss?!). But what now? After reading "Dean Karnazes - Ultramarathon Man" I would love to try a running a half-marathon in about a month (NOW!!!) just to see how long my legs will carry me. On the other hand I'm sure it's a bad idea because I'm still 13-15kg overweight and I might get hurt. How should I go forward from here from an endurance perspective? Less but longer runs? Go cycling to strengthen other parts of my body? Thanks for reading and taking your time. Sigh. Why does everyone always, when thinking of aiming higher, think of going further? It goes hand in hand with the fact that it seems like nobody asks "how fast did you run?" its always "how far did you run". Why does this matter? I've touched on it before, but it causes two problems. Number one is that it's probably the easier way to get injured, especially if you overextend. The second is that it's a really good way to not get a whole lot fitter. Yes, extending the distance you can run does make you more "fit" but it doesn't take long to plateau from that, and then because of the mindset you don't really get any fitter. It also doesn't make you a better runner. If you can jog 4 miles at 10:00 pace, you have the fitness to jog 20 miles at 10:00 pace. All it takes is time to build up connective tissue strength, ligaments, etc. Most people that aren't runners would be suprised to hear that I am not any more impressed by a 4 mile run in 36 minutes than I am by a 20 mile run in 190 minutes. Now, if it is a RACE...that changes the ball game. But most (all) training runs aren't races and tend to be easy runs in which you can run essentially the same pace whether you are running for 30 minutes or 3 hours. If you really want to run a half-marathon or marathon and train for those races...go for it! However, if you want to get in shape, and have/need goals to motivate you make goals based on improving. Set a goal to get your 5k time under 20 or something. This will put the focus into the most efficient way of getting fit, and help you to train effectively doing so, at a variety of paces, which will make you a better athlete and a better runner, How should I go forward from here from an endurance perspective? Less but longer runs? Go cycling to strengthen other parts of my body? The opposite. More runs. Work your way to running six or seven times a week. Then you can gradually start lengthening the typical run lengths, and making on of the runs a bit longer, as well as adding in actual training. Strengthening other parts of your body, through both core/hip work and heavy lifting, are good but always ancillary to the running. I'm running the same 5km as last year 4-5 times a week right now and in most cases it doesn't take 30minutes so I gained a lot of speed (just through weight loss?!). Weight loss helps. A general rule of thumb is that for every kg of body fat you lose you gain about 2-4 sec mile in pace (1-2 sec/km). More than anything it's just better general fitness and more efficiency in running as a result of your running. It's really common to improve alot when you are newer, and the longer you are at it the slower than improvement happens. I've seen people drop from running mid 20s in 5k to 17 min 5k in a season when they are new and talented. | ||
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smr
Germany4808 Posts
On April 20 2013 06:59 L_Master wrote: Sigh. Why does everyone always, when thinking of aiming higher, think of going further? It goes hand in hand with the fact that it seems like nobody asks "how fast did you run?" its always "how far did you run". Thanks for answering. For me it just seems more interesting to be outside longer. In addition it might have to do with me having a light allergic asthma. There is a point where I notice that my legs feel fresh and everything is okay but if i accelerate only a tiny bit my lungs shut me down which basically ends all ambition for the day. This might get better after I finished my allergization but right now it's a hard barrier I'm not able to break. Why does this matter? I've touched on it before, but it causes two problems. Number one is that it's probably the easier way to get injured, especially if you overextend. The second is that it's a really good way to not get a whole lot fitter. Yes, extending the distance you can run does make you more "fit" but it doesn't take long to plateau from that, and then because of the mindset you don't really get any fitter. It also doesn't make you a better runner. If you can jog 4 miles at 10:00 pace, you have the fitness to jog 20 miles at 10:00 pace. All it takes is time to build up connective tissue strength, ligaments, etc. Most people that aren't runners would be suprised to hear that I am not any more impressed by a 4 mile run in 36 minutes than I am by a 20 mile run in 190 minutes. Now, if it is a RACE...that changes the ball game. But most (all) training runs aren't races and tend to be easy runs in which you can run essentially the same pace whether you are running for 30 minutes or 3 hours. If you really want to run a half-marathon or marathon and train for those races...go for it! However, if you want to get in shape, and have/need goals to motivate you make goals based on improving. Set a goal to get your 5k time under 20 or something. This will put the focus into the most efficient way of getting fit, and help you to train effectively doing so, at a variety of paces, which will make you a better athlete and a better runner, The opposite. More runs. Work your way to running six or seven times a week. Then you can gradually start lengthening the typical run lengths, and making on of the runs a bit longer, as well as adding in actual training. Assuming I can't put too much focus on speed because of my lung problems would you advise to shorten 2 or 3 runs each week by a a kilometre or two while trying to run faster or is my best bet to run the same distance at varying speeds? Thanks again for taking the time although I make tiring, common mistakes. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
Assuming I can't put too much focus on speed because of my lung problems would you advise to shorten 2 or 3 runs each week by a a kilometre or two while trying to run faster or is my best bet to run the same distance at varying speeds? Thanks again for taking the time although I make tiring, common mistakes. For now, you need a little more frequency and distance. That probably sounds like I'm contradicting what I said earlier, but you need a basic level of running volume so that you're in shape to handle workouts; both aerobically and physically (strength/connective tissues/etc.) I'd just add a day of running every week or two until you are running 6 or 7 times per week. If you feel great towards the end of a run, you can pick it up and go moderate to strong for the last 1-2km, and if you are really feeling great it's even ok to let it RIP the last 30 seconds or so. Don't do this every single time, but if you are feeling good it's generally fine to do. Once you get to where you are running 5k 6 times a week, then we can add some volume to some runs, and work towards 50km week of running, which is a good point to start thinking about adding in actual workouts. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
Literally everyone who is someone in the marathon is here: Olympic Gold Medalist? Check. World Record Holder? Check. World Marathon Majors Champion and guy with fastest marathon ever run? Check. Guy that might be even better than the world record holder? Check. Every course record holder from all 5 of the world marathon majors? Check. A ton of other sub 2:06 guys? Check. Mo Farah is running half of it too, so that should keep the pacers on world record schedule. http://www.letsrun.com/news/2013/04/the-greatest-mens-marathon-field-ever-2013-virgin-london-mens-marathon-mens-preview/ | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
Might be biting off more than they can chew though.... | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
2:03 flat pace at 15k. | ||
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LuckyFool
United States9015 Posts
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
Unsurprisingly, everyone ran a massive positive split after that, with almost everyone blowing up. Last mile was covered in like 5:20 pace by the winner, and Emmanuel Mutai, who led with just 2.5k to go, finished his last 2k at near 6:00min pace. There was a pretty colossal fuck up by the London organizers, as the men's wheelchair race was sent out about 20 minutes after the women's race. This resulted in the wheelchair athletes catching the women's athletes, and unfortunately as they were passing Olympic champ Tiki Galena cut in sharply for her water and got mowed down by one of the wheelchair racers going over 20mph. She took a hard fall and never really recovered, finishing in like 2:36. Jeptoo ran marvelously though in the second half to win in just over 2:20 off a slow, inconsistent start. Full Recap here: http://www.letsrun.com/news/2013/04/2013-london-marathon-mens-race-marathon-1-distance-runners-0/ On April 22 2013 11:53 LuckyFool wrote: I can't believe I'm following marathon results/races now. I feel like such a running nerd. Haha, track and field actually gets pretty damn interesting once you start to know the athletes and understand how the races work, the tactics involved, etc. | ||
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Arisen
United States2382 Posts
So, although my weight is much more in control than it has been in the past, I'm not what you would call fit. Working in a kitchen I'm on my feet 8-10 hours a day or more, but I don't get what I'd consider exercise although I'm not sedentary. I've wanted to join a gym for awhile but I thought office some cardio a shot first. I say and read a few runners world issues and some other resources, but my problem is most of my Info about how to start out is based on publications that sell ad space. They want to push product so I don't know what to trust and what not to. If its not too much of a burden I'd like help with a quick crash course on getting started and some questions I had. What do I need? I've been told everything from nothing but what you're already wearing to a detailed wardrobe complete with 250 dollar shoes. I think it's reasonable that I will at least need a new pair of shoes as the only shoes I have are either slip resistant kitchen shoes or are designed more for fashion than functionality. What do I look for in a shoe? I really would like to avoid spending a ton of money, but if I could get a lot more for a little more, it would probably behoove me to invest that small amount more. What should I use for accessories? Some tell me good socks are a must, some insist its all about having the right shorts/t to absorb sweat (on a related note since they design special shorts to wick away sweat and stay cool, are you supposed to wear without underwear?). Is it generally ok to reuse your workout clothes over multiple sessions or do you need to change each time (buy multiple pairs). When it comes to hydration what do generally do? Are you supposed to carry a water bottle? It seems like it would probably hinder your run but I would assume its also important to stay hydrated during your run. Where to run? How do you plan your route? I'm newly moved to a city for the first time having lived in the country all my life. Do you just take the sidewalk and run in 1 direction and turn around half way? What do you do about foot traffic, and actual traffic? That's all I can think of right now, but any tidbits of wisdom are appreciated. Thanks | ||
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Don_Julio
2220 Posts
You might need a pair of shoes that doesn't make your running painful. No idea about the quality of shops in the US but it's a good idea to check out a running shop that is involved in the local running scene (e.g. sponsoring small events). You need good advise if you want a good shoe. My shop has two people working there who their stuff. They make every customer run on a treadmill, film it and evaluate your style and needs. Or you can just buy a relatively cheap pair and upgrade later if you really want to stick to running. (You don't need any further gear for now. Don't buy any fancy shirts, shorts or socks. You don't need a watch, you don't need a pulse monitor, you don't need a pedometer. You MIGHT want to get some of it if you really enjoy running and want to continue and improve. Yes you can use the same wardrobe multiple times. But, surprise, surprise, it will smell. When you start. Start slowly, short distances (max 5km) and don't hesitate to stop running and start walking if you're exhausted. Do not run less than twice a week. Better run more than twice. It can be really hard if you aren't used to any activity at all but your cardiovascular system should improve the fastest. When I started running after a long phase of no activity at all I felt sick and dizzy for the first few times of running. But my cardio adjusted really fast. Hydration and nutrition: Shouldn't be of any concern for short distances. Just make sure you have eaten the day. It's obvious that you shouldn't run if you're hungry. My stomach starts aching if I run directly after eating so I tend to eat at least half an hour before running. But other people might have no problem with that. I make sure to drink enough over a day like a always do. Nothing special. I can run 90 minutes without drinking without any problem but I'm living in a rather cool area. So, if you get really thirsty take a small bottle with you or bring it to your route beforehand. But don't worry about that for short distances. Abot routes: You can either ask local runners or at the shop you got your shoes from. You could check out http://www.gpsies.com/. No idea if it's a good resource for the US but I get inspiration from there when I'm not at home but want to go running somewhere. You could use this tool to plan your routes, too: http://www.openrouteservice.org/?lang=en. Or just start somewhere and make sure you can get back home before the night :p. Better run in a park or in a forest. Sidewalks are ugly. cars are annoying and you can't run at crowded sidewalks.) It seems that you're putting way too much thought into this. Just start running first. | ||
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