EPT[GSL 2021] Code S - Semi Finals - Day One - Page 7
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On September 28 2021 00:59 [Phantom] wrote: Can't believe some people here are saying Rogue "misread" Zest in the last game. No. That was his plan all along. Make a ton of Corruptors, kill all air, then make BL and kill the ground cause air takes too long to remake (specially since he killed the stargates) so he knew zests wouldn't go air. He didn't misread the build. He literally dictated what zest would do. The reason he lost is he made BL at the top left of the map instead of basically anywhere else. If he makes them at his third? He wins. At his fourth? He wins. At the middle right? He wins. He literally lost because he foolishly made his BL in literally the worst place possible because he was planning on a quick attack, but didn't consider Zest would attack him slightly sooner and through the right. If zest takes literally 10 seconds more before attacking Zest loses. No, Rogue clearly mis-read the army from Zest. He expected Zest was having a more sky-centric army, and expected the Corruptor to wipe them out, then his ling and Queen could have done the rest of the job. But Zest was growing his ground army a bit, unbeknown to Rogue. Thats why Rogue was making 16 Roach right after that, and START a greater hive to finish the job. If Rogue was planning to get the BL out all along, he should have made the Greater Spire BEFORE the fight start, and could have morphed them right on top of Zest main base after all the Carrier/VR have been destroyed. And he wouldnt have made 16 more Roach to save the supply for more BL. In the end, Rogue ended up with 8BL, which is not scary enough, while all of his Roach/Ravager died to the fight at the 4th base of Zest, forcing Rogue to make bunch of Spine because he did not have supply with 30 of them tied to the Corruptors. You cant tell me that Rogue was planning that all along and the only thing went wrong was the BL morphing elsewhere. | ||
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Elentos
55550 Posts
On September 28 2021 01:20 [PkF] Wire wrote: Fuck. That result really makes me depressed. I don't even want to catch up on the series. Starcraft is harsh, I hope Rogue can find in that first offline bo7 loss the motivation he will need to wreck faces at Katowice. Maybe look at it from the bright side in that Zest is in the finals of the last GSL he gets to play before going to the military. And now that Rogue isn't in the finals, there's a 10% chance the games may be watchable. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25314 Posts
Last game was super tight, both Rogue and Zest had the right plan, formulated quickly in a changing scenario, the timing just worked in Zest’s favour. One of those scenarios I think both players made smart moves with their decision-making processes, but hey one has to lose. It’s impressive, I mean obviously they’re high level pros, but with the observer’s eye it can take many of us a moment, if we even get there to process what the play is here, and these folks can do it with imperfect information and the not small obstacles of having to be the ones to play the game. Zest sniffed a potential kill timing if he threw down multiple robos and just went, Rogue sniffed out that Zest was likely going for this, but made sure to wipe the Stargates to force him 100% into it and counter the counter by delaying the Zest push with a static D wall. Zest just hit slightly too quickly and hard. Cool stuff. I usually dislike PvZ rather a lot but I do enjoy that kind of bluff and counter bluff stuff. | ||
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
On September 28 2021 01:20 [PkF] Wire wrote: Fuck. That result really makes me depressed. I don't even want to catch up on the series. Starcraft is harsh, I hope Rogue can find in that first offline bo7 loss the motivation he will need to wreck faces at Katowice. Don't worry, Rogue will comeback for sure. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
On September 28 2021 01:32 Elentos wrote: Maybe look at it from the bright side in that Zest is in the finals of the last GSL he gets to play before going to the military. And now that Rogue isn't in the finals, there's a 10% chance the games may be watchable. don't get me wrong I'm happy for Zest, the guy deserves it and it's great to probably have a Protoss GSL champion again. But I'm still a Rogue fan, so that one hurts. Bad. | ||
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Solio
France145 Posts
On September 27 2021 17:22 Solio wrote: Zest will win Called it ![[image loading]](https://www.zupimages.net/up/21/37/fqva.png) | ||
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angry_maia
314 Posts
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[Phantom]
Mexico2170 Posts
On September 28 2021 01:24 tigera6 wrote: No, Rogue clearly mis-read the army from Zest. He expected Zest was having a more sky-centric army, and expected the Corruptor to wipe them out, then his ling and Queen could have done the rest of the job. But Zest was growing his ground army a bit, unbeknown to Rogue. Thats why Rogue was making 16 Roach right after that, and START a greater hive to finish the job. If Rogue was planning to get the BL out all along, he should have made the Greater Spire BEFORE the fight start, and could have morphed them right on top of Zest main base after all the Carrier/VR have been destroyed. And he wouldnt have made 16 more Roach to save the supply for more BL. In the end, Rogue ended up with 8BL, which is not scary enough, while all of his Roach/Ravager died to the fight at the 4th base of Zest, forcing Rogue to make bunch of Spine because he did not have supply with 30 of them tied to the Corruptors. You cant tell me that Rogue was planning that all along and the only thing went wrong was the BL morphing elsewhere. I guess we're reading the situationvery differently. What I see is that he didn't wait util greater spire because he needed upgrades and greater spire takes forever, it would have delayed his push a lot letting Zest build the ultimate skytoss disruptor army he was doing. Roach ravager queen was good, and worked quite well. Like you said he expected the corruptors to wipe everything out, and they did. It wasn't an all in push in any way, he had 4 bases (I think he was building a fifth), and 86 drones, so there was no need to break Zest with just 1 push. He made some roaches after that because BL withouth any support suck. If you are expecting your enemy to continue to go air, you don't go BL because they straight up die. He knew Zest wouldn't be going air anymore. The problem is he thought he would stay at his base. You're right in that he misjudged how much ground army Zest would make, as he had quite a bit more gateways than he expected. But he knew he was going ground. He lost because he wanted to push Zest (that's why he morphed the BL there), and wasn't ready when Zest pushed him faster. I'm 100% sure if he had his BL with him at his base he would have won. | ||
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Crocolisk Dundee
870 Posts
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Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On September 28 2021 02:55 angry_maia wrote: Will Zest being going to military before IEM katowice? Unfortunately, yes, according to the history of it. I dont even know if Zest can play in the DH Global Final in Nov. | ||
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tigera6
3397 Posts
On September 28 2021 02:59 [Phantom] wrote: I guess we're reading the situationvery differently. What I see is that he didn't wait util greater spire because he needed upgrades and greater spire takes forever, it would have delayed his push a lot letting Zest build the ultimate skytoss disruptor army he was doing. Roach ravager queen was good, and worked quite well. Like you said he expected the corruptors to wipe everything out, and they did. It wasn't an all in push in any way, he had 4 bases (I think he was building a fifth), and 86 drones, so there was no need to break Zest with just 1 push. He made some roaches after that because BL withouth any support suck. If you are expecting your enemy to continue to go air, you don't go BL because they straight up die. He knew Zest wouldn't be going air anymore. The problem is he thought he would stay at his base. You're right in that he misjudged how much ground army Zest would make, as he had quite a bit more gateways than he expected. But he knew he was going ground. He lost because he wanted to push Zest (that's why he morphed the BL there), and wasn't ready when Zest pushed him faster. I'm 100% sure if he had his BL with him at his base he would have won. Yeah, I think we just have different read on the situation. To me, it was more of an all-in from Rogue, especially when he moved all the Queen along as well. After wiping Zest initial air army, Rogue can just go home and keep expanding, it would have been great for him imo. Instead Rogue tried to stay around for too long, losing all the Queens and Lings (he did not make Roach with the original Corruptors push) and then making more effort to kill Zest on-point with more Roach-Ravager, and then the Greater Spire, all the while leaving Zest free to build up his ground army. That look like a failed all-in to me, but yeah, we can agree to dis-agree on this/ | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On September 28 2021 00:59 [Phantom] wrote: Can't believe some people here are saying Rogue "misread" Zest in the last game. No. That was his plan all along. Make a ton of Corruptors, kill all air, then make BL and kill the ground cause air takes too long to remake (specially since he killed the stargates) so he knew zests wouldn't go air. He didn't misread the build. He literally dictated what zest would do. The reason he lost is he made BL at the top left of the map instead of basically anywhere else. If he makes them at his third? He wins. At his fourth? He wins. At the middle right? He wins. He literally lost because he foolishly made his BL in literally the worst place possible because he was planning on a quick attack, but didn't consider Zest would attack him slightly sooner and through the right. If zest takes literally 10 seconds more before attacking Zest loses. He could have made them behind the main base in the top right corner. That's the worst possible place. you're wellcome. | ||
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Gilgamesh_
36 Posts
Game 7 was kind of fun and I think too unorthodox to be judgemental of the decisionmaking on either side. | ||
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Gottingen
United States27 Posts
On September 28 2021 02:55 angry_maia wrote: Will Zest being going to military before IEM katowice? Yes | ||
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angry_maia
314 Posts
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Zambrah
United States7297 Posts
Am I dreaming, or is Protoss legitimately close to winning a GSL? Also, Zest leaving the game after being the first person to beat Rogue in an offline Bo7 is the most Mic Drop way to go out of all time. | ||
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
On September 28 2021 07:24 Zambrah wrote: Holy shit, a chance Protoss might win a GSL, this is a hallucination right? Cure is going to stomp Trap and Zest right?? Am I dreaming, or is Protoss legitimately close to winning a GSL? Also, Zest leaving the game after being the first person to beat Rogue in an offline Bo7 is the most Mic Drop way to go out of all time. I want the fairly tale zest ending so bad, he's got to be the favourite of the 3 players left now. To break clear of MC and get that 3rd GSL win would really cement him as the Protoss GOAT, and what a career since royal roading back in 2014 I don't think anyone other than Maru has the longevity and sustained success over such a time period and to think he has been nearly solely defining the meta for Protoss these past 5 years | ||
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Poopi
France12880 Posts
Winning right before leaving would be awesome | ||
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