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On April 20 2015 20:57 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:56 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:39 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:37 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
or it's a bullshit word used more to make forum dwellers feel better about themselves than it is to reasonably discuss a players form. Are you trolling. Pls don't tell me you are serious. INnoVation is playing bad since Iem no ifs no buts and that is defined as slump. And lol trying to make forum dweller feel better about themselves are you for real? I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". ofc Flash would trash most sc2 players lol he is a pro. Doesnt change the fact that he has been incredibly mediocore to downright bad for a couple of months now and I am pretty sure that is a slump. So once again you arguement falls flat cause those people are actually correct. I dont even get where your point is in Flash would beat Forum users thats just dumb. that was not my point lol First you reply to a post about Inno with lol forum dwellers are dumb slump slump we prove you wrong then you take another specific post about Flash and you are wrong again. Then why even mention it in your point.
lol you think saying someone is wrong makes them wrong. Whatever happened to subjectivity
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:00 Exstasy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:39 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
Are you trolling. Pls don't tell me you are serious. INnoVation is playing bad since Iem no ifs no buts and that is defined as slump. And lol trying to make forum dweller feel better about themselves are you for real? I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. if you haven't noticed most Terrans have been doing scv all ins vs P. It wasn't a bad response to the deathball when people were first doing it but now P just has to force a comfortable engagement by a nexus and they'll likely come out ahead. I think we'll see more of Maru's style (hopefully against stats tomorrow). 'has been very very meh' Very descriptive.
Most terrans? Pretty 50/50 imo. Oh you want more description? Flash has been dowright terrible and has only started to win some games recently after a huge stretch of only losses and even then he looks mediocore.
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Ah well, NaDa is streaming if you want to see true glory.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:01 Exstasy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:57 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:56 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:39 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
Are you trolling. Pls don't tell me you are serious. INnoVation is playing bad since Iem no ifs no buts and that is defined as slump. And lol trying to make forum dweller feel better about themselves are you for real? I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". ofc Flash would trash most sc2 players lol he is a pro. Doesnt change the fact that he has been incredibly mediocore to downright bad for a couple of months now and I am pretty sure that is a slump. So once again you arguement falls flat cause those people are actually correct. I dont even get where your point is in Flash would beat Forum users thats just dumb. that was not my point lol First you reply to a post about Inno with lol forum dwellers are dumb slump slump we prove you wrong then you take another specific post about Flash and you are wrong again. Then why even mention it in your point. lol you think saying someone is wrong makes them wrong. Whatever happened to subjectivity
Answer the point why even mention Flash can beat normal forum "dwellers". And please argue how Flash hasn't been slumping and playing mediocore.
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Flash and INnoVation are both not performing to their standards (tbh I personally expect more from Inno than Flash, given their SC2 histories). Therefore, they are both slumping, and maybe Inno is slumping harder, but for a shorter amount of time compared to Flash.
This is besides the point, but it's sad that we haven't seen enough Dream vs top-tier players since his loss to Maru.
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On April 20 2015 21:03 Wintex wrote:
Ah well, NaDa is streaming if you want to see true glory.
I only care about his body tbh
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On April 20 2015 21:02 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:00 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. if you haven't noticed most Terrans have been doing scv all ins vs P. It wasn't a bad response to the deathball when people were first doing it but now P just has to force a comfortable engagement by a nexus and they'll likely come out ahead. I think we'll see more of Maru's style (hopefully against stats tomorrow). 'has been very very meh' Very descriptive. Most terrans? Pretty 50/50 imo. Oh you want more description? Flash has been dowright terrible and has only started to win some games recently after a huge stretch of only losses and even then he looks mediocore.
Meh mediocre is too much. He's still better than 80% of the players in PL.
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Now I just want to know the matches where Flash loses, KT wins and Flash wins, KT loses.
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On April 20 2015 20:59 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:58 Silvana wrote:On April 20 2015 20:54 sAsImre wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Elentos wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 OtherWorld wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". There are like 3 posts saying that FlaSh is disappointing and these don't even mention a slump, but w/e They also conveniently ignore his opponent. I'm not disappointed by Flash losing to Dark that much, and Dark even almost fucked that one up. Well this match was like, ok Expedition Lost is gone and whatever happens there is still Stats/Zest/Life to cover up. No  I still had faith, thought Flash had something good prepared, thought there may be a reason he is sent in a Zerg map. Instead I saw Flash lose to Dark's trademark corruptors which make me think he didn't prepare well at all. Are you serious? He went into double tank production to counter the style, which is what TaeJa and Maru did at IEM. He was prepared as hell, and if he didn't go for a 5 mine drop at the time Dark attacked he would have been in a great spot.
I am serious but I don't know about TvZ! so my views are... lacking some (lol) insight. I'll take a chance to redeem myself and you can smash-correct me again if I'm wrong:
What I saw about the corrupters is that they denied drops which were meant to keep Dark in his base or punish his economy if he moved out, such punishment would allow Flash to hold the attack. But the corrupters shut the drops down so Dark was able to attack comfortably and massed a nice swarm and overwhelmed Flash who then continued to produce medivac even when corrupters were camped in his base.
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France9034 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:01 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:57 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 KelsierSC wrote:On April 20 2015 20:48 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 KelsierSC wrote:On April 20 2015 20:44 Wintex wrote:
Ok guys let`s just stop discussing with Kelsier since he won't stop repeating the same post over and over again. We are going in circles and should do something productive instead.
Opinions are and will remain opinions. well i've put forward reasons why the all-kill format doesn't make sense here and also why the format is poor in general and your only argument is that i'm bitching about protoss so clearly you didn't want to have a discussion anyway My first two posts directed at you mentioned race. The rest have not. Please look at the logs and reply to the arguments I've made about how the formats complement each other and create a change of pace for the viewers. It will make it easier for us both. you haven't contributed anything particularly valuable that makes me want to read your posts again. I disagree with you about the formats complementing eachother and i'm discussing that with people but if you want to just say "don't talk to him, i disagree with him" then you can be that kind of a person I guess No, you're just failing to assess the situation fairly. The formats work well together from a dramaturgical point of view (spectators, how important matches are etc), from a strategic point of view (one should be able to beat everything a team can throw at one) and because it showcases a different team dynamic. A team should be good as a team to reach a playoffs, and the regular format allows the most skilled teams to show how good their whole team is, while still leaving the ace player to show great stuff in an ace match. The All Kill format changes that and expects that every member that comes out should be able to contribute. If one fails, the next member either picks up the slack or makes the outcome more horrible. It also creates suspense in the order in which players come out in, and allows for clever sniping. A player that reaches the playoffs should be able to take down anything the opposing team can throw at him or her. These arguments seem to hold more ground than your personal dislike of format. This. Regular season allows for teams with depth but no big big stars to do well and reach the playoffs with snipe builds and shit. Playoffs then allow teams with more raw skill to make the difference.
I didn't see anyone bring the issue that actually, the regular season format may sometimes defines the outcome of a match purely based on the match-ups (depending on match-ups winratio, maps, etc), whereas the all-kill format allows for some clever adaptation that in my opinion rewards a bit more actual depth. That's why we don't see all-kills that much, and not always from star players (I mean, Stats is good, but has yet to really become tier 1, though his current record in Proleague and this all-kill makes for serious arguments for it).
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On April 20 2015 20:58 Silvana wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:54 sAsImre wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Elentos wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 OtherWorld wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:39 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
Are you trolling. Pls don't tell me you are serious. INnoVation is playing bad since Iem no ifs no buts and that is defined as slump. And lol trying to make forum dweller feel better about themselves are you for real? I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". There are like 3 posts saying that FlaSh is disappointing and these don't even mention a slump, but w/e They also conveniently ignore his opponent. I'm not disappointed by Flash losing to Dark that much, and Dark even almost fucked that one up. Well this match was like, ok Expedition Lost is gone and whatever happens there is still Stats/Zest/Life to cover up. No I still had faith, thought Flash had something good prepared, thought there may be a reason he is sent in a Zerg map. Instead I saw Flash lose to Dark's trademark corruptors which make me think he didn't prepare well at all.
Imo the best choice would've been action. You can't send a P, going with Life first was a huge gamble so you send Flash if you want to send one of the core 4. Would've liked him to just yolo 2rax tbh.
Then regarding Dark style I think that it isn't solved yet and we will keep seeing him destroy terrans for some times, just look versus Maru at IEM.
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Elentos
55594 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:03 in_flvxx wrote:
Flash and INnoVation are both not performing to their standards (tbh I personally expect more from Inno than Flash, given their SC2 histories). Therefore, they are both slumping, and maybe Inno is slumping harder, but for a shorter amount of time compared to Flash.
This is besides the point, but it's sad that we haven't seen enough Dream vs top-tier players since his loss to Maru.
Dream is in Group B for Bubble in SSL, don't forget.
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:04 dazed25 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:02 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 21:00 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. if you haven't noticed most Terrans have been doing scv all ins vs P. It wasn't a bad response to the deathball when people were first doing it but now P just has to force a comfortable engagement by a nexus and they'll likely come out ahead. I think we'll see more of Maru's style (hopefully against stats tomorrow). 'has been very very meh' Very descriptive. Most terrans? Pretty 50/50 imo. Oh you want more description? Flash has been dowright terrible and has only started to win some games recently after a huge stretch of only losses and even then he looks mediocore. Meh mediocre is too much. He's still better than 80% of the players in PL.
Did you see round 1?
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On April 20 2015 21:02 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:00 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. if you haven't noticed most Terrans have been doing scv all ins vs P. It wasn't a bad response to the deathball when people were first doing it but now P just has to force a comfortable engagement by a nexus and they'll likely come out ahead. I think we'll see more of Maru's style (hopefully against stats tomorrow). 'has been very very meh' Very descriptive. Most terrans? Pretty 50/50 imo. Oh you want more description? Flash has been dowright terrible and has only started to win some games recently after a huge stretch of only losses and even then he looks mediocore.
What I mean is that to contribute to a discussion you should back up claims of 'downright terrible' and 'mediocre' because how are you measuring those? he lost some games and you don't like his play?
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On April 20 2015 21:03 GumBa wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:01 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:57 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:56 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". ofc Flash would trash most sc2 players lol he is a pro. Doesnt change the fact that he has been incredibly mediocore to downright bad for a couple of months now and I am pretty sure that is a slump. So once again you arguement falls flat cause those people are actually correct. I dont even get where your point is in Flash would beat Forum users thats just dumb. that was not my point lol First you reply to a post about Inno with lol forum dwellers are dumb slump slump we prove you wrong then you take another specific post about Flash and you are wrong again. Then why even mention it in your point. lol you think saying someone is wrong makes them wrong. Whatever happened to subjectivity Answer the point why even mention Flash can beat normal forum "dwellers". And please argue how Flash hasn't been slumping and playing mediocore.
Every player is good, there is no mediocrity and slumps are an invention of the Illuminati
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On April 20 2015 21:05 Exstasy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:02 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 21:00 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. if you haven't noticed most Terrans have been doing scv all ins vs P. It wasn't a bad response to the deathball when people were first doing it but now P just has to force a comfortable engagement by a nexus and they'll likely come out ahead. I think we'll see more of Maru's style (hopefully against stats tomorrow). 'has been very very meh' Very descriptive. Most terrans? Pretty 50/50 imo. Oh you want more description? Flash has been dowright terrible and has only started to win some games recently after a huge stretch of only losses and even then he looks mediocore. What I mean is that to contribute to a discussion you should back up claims of 'downright terrible' and 'mediocre' because how are you measuring those? he lost some games and you don't like his play?
Yeah, did you notice how he destroyed everyone in Round 1? And how he went very far in both Korean leagues in S1 too?
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Elentos
55594 Posts
On April 20 2015 21:04 sAsImre wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:58 Silvana wrote:On April 20 2015 20:54 sAsImre wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Elentos wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 OtherWorld wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:
[quote]
I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". There are like 3 posts saying that FlaSh is disappointing and these don't even mention a slump, but w/e They also conveniently ignore his opponent. I'm not disappointed by Flash losing to Dark that much, and Dark even almost fucked that one up. Well this match was like, ok Expedition Lost is gone and whatever happens there is still Stats/Zest/Life to cover up. No I still had faith, thought Flash had something good prepared, thought there may be a reason he is sent in a Zerg map. Instead I saw Flash lose to Dark's trademark corruptors which make me think he didn't prepare well at all. Imo the best choice would've been action. You can't send a P, going with Life first was a huge gamble so you send Flash if you want to send one of the core 4. Would've liked him to just yolo 2rax tbh. Then regarding Dark style I think that it isn't solved yet and we will keep seeing him destroy terrans for some times, just look versus Maru at IEM.
Maru did worse vs Dark than TaeJa did. I guess when the stars align TaeJa is still great.
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On April 20 2015 21:00 dazed25 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 20:55 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:53 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:42 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:39 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
Are you trolling. Pls don't tell me you are serious. INnoVation is playing bad since Iem no ifs no buts and that is defined as slump. And lol trying to make forum dweller feel better about themselves are you for real? I'm sorry Ms.Jackson I am for real. there is more to a players form than looking at a win/loss ratio. You can boil it down to that if you want but you're excluding a lot of information. I'm not exclusively talking about Inno here btw, someone loses and they go 'slump slump slump' as if that contributes anything to any discussion. You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". Flash is in not as much of a slump as he is stubborn in his play. He thinks he can do as much with the small numbers of units he creates during games as he could in BW. See at least you're contributing to the discussion, referencing his playstyle, taking into account other factors etc. Ok playstyle: Flash plays passively and stubbornly and like to allin in TvP. And he has been very very meh at that for a few months. Don't even have to mention his TvZ. He is still stellar in TvT but still ends up dying to guys like Bomber and skyHigh (TvT bonjwa I know) Honestly he has the tools and skills to be great in every matchup but seeing him die because of his greed and stubbornness is so annoying. I thought he had turned a corner last year but seemed like another false coming like when he dominated for a few months during the hellbat era. Oh well he's still good enough to beat everyone else in PL that currently isn't A or S tier. And if you have Flash as your 4th or 5th best player I can't even be mad. inb4 Action/Sleep better than Flash.
the saddest thing is that his macro is good, his micro decent, his build selection a bit predictable but he doesn't get punished for it so it's ok.
It really looks like he doesn't understand totally TvP/TvZ and he's forced to do gimmicks like scv pulls vP or get beaten badly :'(
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On April 20 2015 21:06 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:03 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 21:01 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:57 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:56 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:52 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:50 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 GumBa wrote:On April 20 2015 20:45 Exstasy wrote:On April 20 2015 20:43 GumBa wrote:
[quote]
You specifally call out a post talking about INnoVation though. Yeah I think it applies to Inno but I'm not exclusively talking about him. Form naturally ebbs and flows, It is stupid after some good form to then expect only that or spout slump slump. Nobody did that though. You just came out of nowhere insulted forum "dwellers". For example, go to earlier pages of this thread and see the 'slump slump' comments about Flash. Flash would still trash 99% of sc2 players everytime but the fact that he has bad form is a testament to the skill level of the game, especially in Korea. but it's "Flash loses to Dark, derp slump slump". ofc Flash would trash most sc2 players lol he is a pro. Doesnt change the fact that he has been incredibly mediocore to downright bad for a couple of months now and I am pretty sure that is a slump. So once again you arguement falls flat cause those people are actually correct. I dont even get where your point is in Flash would beat Forum users thats just dumb. that was not my point lol First you reply to a post about Inno with lol forum dwellers are dumb slump slump we prove you wrong then you take another specific post about Flash and you are wrong again. Then why even mention it in your point. lol you think saying someone is wrong makes them wrong. Whatever happened to subjectivity Answer the point why even mention Flash can beat normal forum "dwellers". And please argue how Flash hasn't been slumping and playing mediocore. Every player is good, there is no mediocrity and slumps are an invention of the Illuminati
You... you... said the G-word about WCS players
I can't believe it, you're lost
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On April 20 2015 21:04 Ragnarork wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2015 21:01 OtherWorld wrote:On April 20 2015 20:57 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:51 KelsierSC wrote:On April 20 2015 20:48 Wintex wrote:On April 20 2015 20:46 KelsierSC wrote:On April 20 2015 20:44 Wintex wrote:
Ok guys let`s just stop discussing with Kelsier since he won't stop repeating the same post over and over again. We are going in circles and should do something productive instead.
Opinions are and will remain opinions. well i've put forward reasons why the all-kill format doesn't make sense here and also why the format is poor in general and your only argument is that i'm bitching about protoss so clearly you didn't want to have a discussion anyway My first two posts directed at you mentioned race. The rest have not. Please look at the logs and reply to the arguments I've made about how the formats complement each other and create a change of pace for the viewers. It will make it easier for us both. you haven't contributed anything particularly valuable that makes me want to read your posts again. I disagree with you about the formats complementing eachother and i'm discussing that with people but if you want to just say "don't talk to him, i disagree with him" then you can be that kind of a person I guess No, you're just failing to assess the situation fairly. The formats work well together from a dramaturgical point of view (spectators, how important matches are etc), from a strategic point of view (one should be able to beat everything a team can throw at one) and because it showcases a different team dynamic. A team should be good as a team to reach a playoffs, and the regular format allows the most skilled teams to show how good their whole team is, while still leaving the ace player to show great stuff in an ace match. The All Kill format changes that and expects that every member that comes out should be able to contribute. If one fails, the next member either picks up the slack or makes the outcome more horrible. It also creates suspense in the order in which players come out in, and allows for clever sniping. A player that reaches the playoffs should be able to take down anything the opposing team can throw at him or her. These arguments seem to hold more ground than your personal dislike of format. This. Regular season allows for teams with depth but no big big stars to do well and reach the playoffs with snipe builds and shit. Playoffs then allow teams with more raw skill to make the difference. I didn't see anyone bring the issue that actually, the regular season format may sometimes defines the outcome of a match purely based on the match-ups (depending on match-ups winratio, maps, etc), whereas the all-kill format allows for some clever adaptation that in my opinion rewards a bit more actual depth. That's why we don't see all-kills that much, and not always from star players (I mean, Stats is good, but has yet to really become tier 1, though his current record in Proleague and this all-kill makes for serious arguments for it).
Stats IS tier one, top 5 toss easily
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EPT
