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On April 15 2015 21:37 KrazyTrumpet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns. Yeah, once again "omg the bets looked like,...SO WEIRD guys" is absolutely not proof that you can use to accuse a certain player of matchfixing or not.
That's like finding a thief in your house that's stealing something and assuming he just wanted to return it after he caught someone else trying to steal it, there is no 100%
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On April 15 2015 21:38 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still. It should be investigated agree?
I agree completely.
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On April 15 2015 21:38 Paljas wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:34 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:30 Paljas wrote:On April 15 2015 21:29 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:28 Paljas wrote:On April 15 2015 21:26 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:24 DBooN wrote:On April 15 2015 21:23 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:22 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:20 KristofferAG wrote:
[quote]
It just feels like people here are totally okay with just accepting that SK is matchfixing, and it's weird. Fair enough that subtle mistakes can lead to a loss without anyone being able to say it was intentional, but I don't get why he's instantly a matchfixer now. If he was bet into being an 8-1 underdog in map 1 while being a 3-1 favourite in the bo5 series as a whole... does that set off any alarm bells? Some, but not enough for me to instantly jump on a fucking hate train on SK's ass. The likelyness of something like that happening by chance is probably less than 1% So? I'm not gonna damn anyone till there's an official statement following an investigation. It's not my place to decide whether or not the match really was fixed, and who were involved. It's shady as shit, sure, but what if SK wasn't involved? the problem is that offical statements are not happening. match fixing in korea is well known to insiders To who? Give me sources, show me the proof. Repeating stuff you heard on Twitter or saw in a thread somewhere is *NOT* proof. to guys like rekrul or inuh there is no 100% proof because investigations are not happening Has there been actual, verifiable proof to implicate specific players in matchfixing? If so, why hasn't it been made public? Why keep sitting on it? If no one is investigating, post the proof publicly to force organizations to take action. I just don't think it's right to up and accuse players of matchfixing when not one person has come forward and shown any actionable info. I agree that its wrong to accuse single players. but the match fixing in korea wont stop if everyone just does nothing and waits
Sure, I agree. So the people with all this supposed evidence need to start presenting it, and force organizations into action.
I've been holding my breath on that supposedly scene-shattering article about matchfixing that was supposed to come out and ruin the whole Korean scene and, well, I'm getting a little dizzy from lack of oxygen over here.
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I would be soo Karma if Creator wins this series
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United Kingdom31935 Posts
Creator looking good. Srsly Prime pick up DRG and get your players to play like in GSL and round 3 doesnt look bad
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On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still.
Would be nice if any tournament organizer, team OR Blizzard said anything about it then. Like "we're investigating" or "we've seen proof it's nothing".
The total silence makes me think they all know it's going on, but no-one wants to say anything because it might hurt the scene.
The problem is that eventually it will not only hurt it, but destroy the Korean Starcraft 2 scene.
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Norway25712 Posts
On April 15 2015 21:39 DBooN wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:37 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns. Yeah, once again "omg the bets looked like,...SO WEIRD guys" is absolutely not proof that you can use to accuse a certain player of matchfixing or not. That's like finding a thief in your house that's stealing something and assuming he just wanted to return it after he caught someone else trying to steal it, there is no 100%
Except this time you didn't find a thief, something was just missing from your house...
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On April 15 2015 21:38 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still. It should be investigated agree?
The community should push for investigations.
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On April 15 2015 21:36 DJHelium wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns. How about a player not scouting for proxy hatch after scouting late pool and gas and no expansion?
and then you have the same strategy getting scouted, on same map, against a better opponent and still win, and used in a the last game of bo5 individual league.
hard to say if mkp is just being mkp
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On April 15 2015 21:39 DBooN wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:37 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns. Yeah, once again "omg the bets looked like,...SO WEIRD guys" is absolutely not proof that you can use to accuse a certain player of matchfixing or not. That's like finding a thief in your house that's stealing something and assuming he just wanted to return it after he caught someone else trying to steal it, there is no 100%
So far the "proof" everyone has been trying to use is like...15-20% at best, though.
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Norway25712 Posts
On April 15 2015 21:39 DJHelium wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still. Would be nice if any tournament organizer, team OR Blizzard said anything about it then. Like "we're investigating" or "we've seen proof it's nothing". The total silence makes me think they all know it's going on, but no-one wants to say anything because it might hurt the scene. The problem is that eventually it will not only hurt it, but destroy the Korean Starcraft 2 scene.
Has this sort of thing been happening a lot lately? I haven't really been following for... a couple of years.
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On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns.
We had that in the Marineking match and some people still werent convinced
A good match fixer will make a bunch of small mistakes to lose, Marineking was just bad at it.
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This thread is gonna be fun.
Enjoy (:
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On April 15 2015 21:39 KrazyTrumpet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:38 Paljas wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:30 Paljas wrote:On April 15 2015 21:29 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:28 Paljas wrote:On April 15 2015 21:26 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:24 DBooN wrote:On April 15 2015 21:23 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:22 Swoopae wrote:
[quote]
If he was bet into being an 8-1 underdog in map 1 while being a 3-1 favourite in the bo5 series as a whole... does that set off any alarm bells? Some, but not enough for me to instantly jump on a fucking hate train on SK's ass. The likelyness of something like that happening by chance is probably less than 1% So? I'm not gonna damn anyone till there's an official statement following an investigation. It's not my place to decide whether or not the match really was fixed, and who were involved. It's shady as shit, sure, but what if SK wasn't involved? the problem is that offical statements are not happening. match fixing in korea is well known to insiders To who? Give me sources, show me the proof. Repeating stuff you heard on Twitter or saw in a thread somewhere is *NOT* proof. to guys like rekrul or inuh there is no 100% proof because investigations are not happening Has there been actual, verifiable proof to implicate specific players in matchfixing? If so, why hasn't it been made public? Why keep sitting on it? If no one is investigating, post the proof publicly to force organizations to take action. I just don't think it's right to up and accuse players of matchfixing when not one person has come forward and shown any actionable info. I agree that its wrong to accuse single players. but the match fixing in korea wont stop if everyone just does nothing and waits Sure, I agree. So the people with all this supposed evidence need to start presenting it, and force organizations into action. I've been holding my breath on that supposedly scene-shattering article about matchfixing that was supposed to come out and ruin the whole Korean scene and, well, I'm getting a little dizzy from lack of oxygen over here.
It will probably never happen because it would mean bad publicity if they were to confirm match fixing happening...
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On April 15 2015 21:40 KristofferAG wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:39 DJHelium wrote:On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still. Would be nice if any tournament organizer, team OR Blizzard said anything about it then. Like "we're investigating" or "we've seen proof it's nothing". The total silence makes me think they all know it's going on, but no-one wants to say anything because it might hurt the scene. The problem is that eventually it will not only hurt it, but destroy the Korean Starcraft 2 scene. Has this sort of thing been happening a lot lately? I haven't really been following for... a couple of years. :|
This is the 5th time bets have been cancelled in a couple months and there were multiple other matches that were suspicious.
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Norway25712 Posts
wtf forward blink
ok it worked out good.
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On April 15 2015 21:40 KristofferAG wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:39 DJHelium wrote:On April 15 2015 21:37 lamehater wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. It's circumstantial evidence and not direct evidence. You need a lot of it to judge someone. I'm not saying that the accusations are incorrect, but the situation can undoubtedly be argued. Soulkey matchfixing isn't an absolute fact, it's just a possibility still. Would be nice if any tournament organizer, team OR Blizzard said anything about it then. Like "we're investigating" or "we've seen proof it's nothing". The total silence makes me think they all know it's going on, but no-one wants to say anything because it might hurt the scene. The problem is that eventually it will not only hurt it, but destroy the Korean Starcraft 2 scene. Has this sort of thing been happening a lot lately? I haven't really been following for... a couple of years. :|
Yeah voided bets are at... 5? 6? since the beginning of the year iirc. Swoopae confirmation? d:
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On April 15 2015 21:40 KrazyTrumpet wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2015 21:39 DBooN wrote:On April 15 2015 21:37 KrazyTrumpet wrote:On April 15 2015 21:35 KristofferAG wrote:On April 15 2015 21:34 Swoopae wrote:On April 15 2015 21:27 KrazyTrumpet wrote:
Stop throwing around accusations like "Soulkey is matchfixing!:" without actual fucking proof.
No, saying "But the betting patterns were TOTALLY suspicious!" is NOT sufficient proof to outright accuse a player of matchfixing. We have proof. If you don't understand the proof, that's your problem. You have proof that the bets were fucky. What you need is proof from the game showing some sort of suspicious play, or something directly linking SK to the odd betting patterns. Yeah, once again "omg the bets looked like,...SO WEIRD guys" is absolutely not proof that you can use to accuse a certain player of matchfixing or not. That's like finding a thief in your house that's stealing something and assuming he just wanted to return it after he caught someone else trying to steal it, there is no 100% So far the "proof" everyone has been trying to use is like...15-20% at best, though.
Heh, that's not how probability works
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EPT
