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[WCS EU] RO32 Group G Premier Season 1 2013 - Page 71

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
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Shellshock
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States97277 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-08 20:44:17
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1401
nvm had wrong game
Moderatorhttp://i.imgur.com/U4xwqmD.png
TL+ Member
Grumbels
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Netherlands7032 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-08 20:44:27
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1402
On May 09 2013 05:25 Roman666 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:23 Grumbels wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:19 Swords wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:18 Vadrigar wrote:
Who the fuck thought swarm hosts are a good unit? Seriously it's a LOT more boring than brood lords.


Whoever it is on the design team that things giving Zerg lots of units that produce tons of free units is a good idea.

I do want Zerg to be "swarmy", but free units are just bad RTS design.

Spider mines in Brood War were very cheap, but did make it so committing to a position had some cost. And zerglings are very cheap, but still add up too.

Well spider mines had somewhat limited supply. That design of completely free endless swarm of units is beyond idiotic.

I think I didn't explain it well. In a sense swarm hosts creating free units is something that's silly to say, because locusts have limited life and aren't too different from a unit like the tempest that simply has very long range. I don't think it's free units that's the problem, I think it's the fact you can deal free damage.

In Brood War there were some counter factors to this. Zerglings are very cheap, but they still cost some minerals. Spider mines cover your tanks and allow you to control position, but you can't reposition them after the fact. Reavers and carriers can deal powerful long-range damage, but their attacks cost minerals.

But in SC2 you have locusts and tempests, and you used to have snipe and infested terrans that are free damage and it's kinda silly in a lot of late-game scenarios.

It is why I was against making Seeker Missile have 9 range in WoL, because then the raven can do free damage since you never need to risk them.
Well, now I tell you, I never seen good come o' goodness yet. Him as strikes first is my fancy; dead men don't bite; them's my views--amen, so be it.
Greendotz
Profile Joined October 2011
United Kingdom2053 Posts
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1403
On May 09 2013 05:38 heartagram wrote:
How come we haven't been seeing the "unbeatable" air army a lot of people talked about when HOTS came out, especially in long games? I am barely seeing any tempests/voidrays and have not seen a single Carrier in HOTS.


I've been thinking this too, I look at these games where Zerg's are entrenched with 20+ swarmhosts and I reckon the only army to take it on efficiently is an upgraded skytoss army with templar support. Right now I think Protoss don't know how to deal with Swarmhosts properly and don't exploit the mobility of stalkers and recall. Give it time, historically Protoss pros tend to be the slowest race when it comes to adapting to drastic changes in the meta.
Zerg.Zilla
Profile Joined February 2012
Hungary5029 Posts
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1404
Ok this is annoying i'm gonna try le'french stream.
(•_•) ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) ~Keep calm and inject Larva~
Kevan
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden2303 Posts
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1405
You could play this since the audio is dead:
+ Show Spoiler +
SC2, rip in pepperinos
rOodStar
Profile Joined October 2010
Korea (South)2 Posts
May 08 2013 20:42 GMT
#1406
time to learn another language, for thouse who can only speak english.. LoLz
NovemberstOrm
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Canada16217 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1407
On May 09 2013 05:39 Qikz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:37 Plansix wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:36 Polygamy wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:34 Seronei wrote:
Swarm Hosts is such a horrible unit, it's so boring. Especially how Stephano uses them right now, they were supposed to be used for pressure and yet it's just another turtling unit...

I agree, I would much rather have seen the Lurker come back.


But is it the map or the unit. Split maps with no bases to fight over are terrible and shouldn't be made any more.


I think now would be a good time to look into more 3 player maps as there's always an awesome fight over the last base as there's usually an odd number of bases.

I would love to see more 3 players maps.
Moderatorlickypiddy
s3rp
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany3192 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1408
On May 09 2013 05:41 udgnim wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:38 s3rp wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:36 udgnim wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:34 s3rp wrote:
If i was Grubby i'd just sit in my base and wait for Stephano to attack . He threw away way too much with trying to be aggresive before.


Grubby can't turtle

Stephano would eventually inch up his Swarm Hosts and put Grubby on a clock

it's the Protoss's job to figure out how to break the SH siege once Zerg has enough SHs, Infestors, and Corrupters to turtle

Vortex would actually be a solution to this Zerg turtle play but Vortex is gone in HotS



Just Cloak everything with your Mothership so the Zerg has to bring detection which you can kill with Tempests from way back. Locusts can't chip away at something they can't see.


forgot to mention Zerg having 3-4 Vipers for Abduct which is which is what Stephano had to kill off the Mothership


That should'nt work when your defensive with the Mamaship .
Benjamin99
Profile Joined April 2012
4176 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1409
On May 09 2013 05:41 SCST wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:39 CoR wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:38 Crownlol wrote:
Twitch has gotten real, real bad lately.


not twitchs fault is the streaming pc/ crew/ etc all other wcs streams work fine also everything stream on wcs eu lags 320-720 xD


Sorry this is Twitch's fault and they know it. This has been getting worse and worse.. we need some competition for this medium in my opinion. If I were an SC2 tournament I would dump Twitch as fast as possible.


Yea l8tly Twitch has been getting worse and worse. Maybe its just the EU servers but so many times it lags lags and more lags
Stephano & Jaedong <-- The Pain Train. Polt and Innovation to EG plz
mrtomjones
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada4020 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1410
No sound?
Yhamm
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
France7248 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1411
On May 09 2013 05:39 -_- wrote:
Sorry to repeat the question, but how did BK beat Stephano.

http://www.twitch.tv/wcs_europe/b/400845289
starts at 2h20
LiquipediaWe will have only each other at the last
LighT.
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4501 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1412
On May 09 2013 05:41 Heartland wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:40 LighT. wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:38 heartagram wrote:
How come we haven't been seeing the "unbeatable" air army a lot of people talked about when HOTS came out, especially in long games? I am barely seeing any tempests/voidrays and have not seen a single Carrier in HOTS.

Voidray/tempest: See Flying, Trap, Stats games.
Carrier: see Stork


Stork made carriers? In what game?

One of the show matches. Forget against who. I think it was against Soulkey.
Just rolled through the zerg.

Mithridates
Profile Joined June 2011
United States446 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1413
On May 09 2013 05:40 Yello wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:39 CoR wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:38 stuchiu wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:36 udgnim wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:34 s3rp wrote:
If i was Grubby i'd just sit in my base and wait for Stephano to attack . He threw away way too much with trying to be aggresive before.


Grubby can't turtle

Stephano would eventually inch up his Swarm Hosts and put Grubby on a clock

it's the Protoss's job to figure out how to break the SH siege once Zerg has enough SHs, Infestors, and Corrupters to turtle

Vortex would actually be a solution to this Zerg turtle play but Vortex is gone in HotS



12 tempests, 2 oracles for revelation, hts/collosus and a mothership could probably out siege this. I think.


nice idea, not working corrupters make to much dmg vs tempest and tempest not enough vs corrupter, so you viper them into your army and kill them
they rly expensive and you need the voids to block, its just ... no possible


I've been saying this all the time. Carriers beat Corruptors. I think Grubby needs to max out on Carriers


Carriers dont even kind of beat corrupters. Thats like saying siege tanks counter immortals
grs
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Germany2339 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1414
On May 09 2013 05:42 Kamate wrote:
Nobody told them they they don't have sound yet?

I guess they have, but they are around 5 minutes in the past.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1415
On May 09 2013 05:40 Fenrax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:39 SCST wrote:
On May 09 2013 05:37 _SpiRaL_ wrote:
Wow am I even in the minority that thought that was great? Sure if every game was like that it would be boring perhaps but it was such a war of attrition, starvation, positioning, control, economy and resource management. Loved it tbh.


Nope I also really enjoyed the game and thought it was great. Just because the game isn't played exactly how you "think" it should be played doesn't mean it isn't great for spectators.

The viewership jumped from 30k - 55k during that game. I'd say it was a huge success.


I enjoyed it, too. For the same reasons. I wouldn't mind if most PvZs went this way.


At least we thought Grubby could win if he got a good engagement. I don’t know if that end game is broken, but we will see. I don’t think the pro’s know 100% what to do when they get there.

That map is terrible through. There is no way around the center and the swarmhost can just blanket the area in locus.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
bgx
Profile Joined August 2010
Poland6595 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1416
In few weeks protoss will pray for vortex to come and save their lives.
.
.
.
Again
Stork[gm]
eonDE
Profile Joined November 2011
Canada371 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1417
According to lore and everything, I always thought Zerg were the aggressors but most of the time they play as though they are defending their homeworld from alien scum. ;D
Zenbrez
Profile Joined June 2012
Canada5973 Posts
May 08 2013 20:43 GMT
#1418
Oh god, DAYBREAK, is the next game?
Refer to my post.
tOOkOmA4U
Profile Joined November 2006
Germany253 Posts
May 08 2013 20:44 GMT
#1419
that game was so shit, i want my hour back :/
~Smoke Weed Every Day~
Swords
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
6038 Posts
May 08 2013 20:44 GMT
#1420
On May 09 2013 05:40 Zarahtra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2013 05:38 heartagram wrote:
How come we haven't been seeing the "unbeatable" air army a lot of people talked about when HOTS came out, especially in long games? I am barely seeing any tempests/voidrays and have not seen a single Carrier in HOTS.

Well guess Grubby doesn't know how to play it or something. Revelation would've been so kick ass in the lategame there, where he could be sniping the infestors and vipers without stephano being able to do much. There were many things in that game Grubby did well, but he didn't seem to know what to do in the lategame.


Yeah, honestly it doesn't seem like foreign protoss players (I haven't seen any KeSPA/GSL lategame PvZs yet) aren't trying to be patient like their zerg opponents. Tempest/Carrier/ht seems like it'd be really terrifying lategame cause you can just use hallucinations/oracles/etc to get vision and pick off units and force the zerg to engage into storm/carriers. Otherwise the Zerg sends free units into carriers and storms and it's an even trade.
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