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On October 11 2011 23:50 hysterial wrote:
Wow MVP crushing despite getting the most zerg-favored maps I've ever seen. Nestea has such poor ZvT.
Seriously? Nestea just took 2 games off the best TvZ on the planet, and instead of giving MVP credit for being downright amazing, you take the asshole route and say Nestea's ZvT is bad. Nobody stands a chance against MVP as Z right now, its a testament to Nestea's skill he took two games as is.
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This Mvp - NesTea was so much better than the last ones with them. For the first time NesTea played near his best. Mvp always did it.
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On October 12 2011 00:05 andrewlt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2011 23:47 MisterTea wrote:On October 11 2011 23:41 Andr3 wrote:On October 11 2011 23:37 JWD wrote:
In game 2, why didn't NesTea place his macro hatchery and maybe even his roach warren at his door (rather than floating in his main)? This was a common tactic for fending off vulture harass in BW...don't see why it isn't ever used in SC2.
Weird. It is used in SC2, but mainly evolution chambers are placed to block off hellions. But I wouldn't know why he didn't do that, to answer your question! Because pro players, even as good as Nestea is, haven't got that far yet its still very young maybe in a year or so we'll see zerg players sim city all the time and hellions will be null and void Should that really take a year of practice to do? I can't imagine that it would take more than a few hours to figure out which structures are the best at blocking which ramps. They already have the necessary knowledge from BW and even BW players have to relearn a little every season since the BW mapmakers can slightly change the ramp/choke size on different maps. They could also assign some code B guys to figure it out and then spend a few minutes testing to see if it's correct. That's what the guys at the bottom of the barrel are for.
I've been starting to do this placing the macro hatch at the bottom of the ramp similar to how a toss would place his pylon/forge type deal. My only guess why not to do it would be the fear of having it taken out really easy by tanks or a quick pick off by stimmed marines. If he is confident in his defense it isn't worth exposing your macro hatch that way.
Do you really think one of the best players in the world hasn't thought this through and has a reason for placing his hatch where he does? Common... get over yourselves.
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On October 11 2011 23:37 JWD wrote:
In game 2, why didn't NesTea place his macro hatchery and maybe even his roach warren at his door (rather than floating in his main)? This was a common tactic for fending off vulture harass in BW...don't see why it isn't ever used in SC2.
Weird.
Edit: Nestea did the same thing in game 3 o.o macro hatch in main, leaving door to his natural wide open.
I know on old Taldarim, a macro hatch in the nat could be sieged from the low ground where you saw reapers. That may be a reason.
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On October 12 2011 00:25 HypernovA wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2011 00:22 Cain0 wrote:
Im sorry, but I can no longer enjoy this anymore. Its a tragedy because I love tastosis and the prestige of the GSL, but TvT is getting real boring and 3/9 matchups are basically never seen and 5/9 match-ups become very rare after the RO32. I just watched the first game of MVP vs Nestea and I just saw a buker rush delay nestea's expo for ages then 800 worth of minerals and a medivac wiping out Nestea's entire economy. You might say that he could have reacted better, but why should he have to perfectly split his drones 5 times in a row to mearly survive. Im just gonna watch MLG from now on. I don't understand this. You say that he could have reacted better but he didn't. The consequence? He lost his drones at the mineral line. The splitting drones comment to survive could be related to how Terrans need to micro against banelings to survive. Why should Terran have to perfectly split their marines in order to survive the huge battles?
What im getting at is, Nestea makes a mistake and lets 500 minerals worth of hellions in his main -> GG game over as hellion micro is good enough at this level that roaches cant catch hellions until they have killed all the drones
MVP makes a similar mistake and lets >500 minerals worth of roach and lings in his base and autorepairs his bunker until nesteas attack dies.
Also the marines just run behind the tanks now and LOL at the banes and even in the rare occurance that a bane hits, Terran can just remake the marines in 2 seconds whereas if drones get roasted by hellions, they cannot be replaced without sacrificing an army.
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On October 12 2011 00:30 Cain0 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2011 00:25 HypernovA wrote:On October 12 2011 00:22 Cain0 wrote:
Im sorry, but I can no longer enjoy this anymore. Its a tragedy because I love tastosis and the prestige of the GSL, but TvT is getting real boring and 3/9 matchups are basically never seen and 5/9 match-ups become very rare after the RO32. I just watched the first game of MVP vs Nestea and I just saw a buker rush delay nestea's expo for ages then 800 worth of minerals and a medivac wiping out Nestea's entire economy. You might say that he could have reacted better, but why should he have to perfectly split his drones 5 times in a row to mearly survive. Im just gonna watch MLG from now on. I don't understand this. You say that he could have reacted better but he didn't. The consequence? He lost his drones at the mineral line. The splitting drones comment to survive could be related to how Terrans need to micro against banelings to survive. Why should Terran have to perfectly split their marines in order to survive the huge battles? What im getting at is, Nestea makes a mistake and lets 500 minerals worth of hellions in his main -> GG game over as hellion micro is good enough at this level that roaches cant catch hellions until they have killed all the drones MVP makes a similar mistake and lets >500 minerals worth of roach and lings in his base and autorepairs his bunker until nesteas attack dies. Also the marines just run behind the tanks now and LOL at the banes and even in the rare occurance that a bane hits, Terran can just remake the marines in 2 seconds whereas if drones get roasted by hellions, they cannot be replaced without sacrificing an army.
awwwww it'll be okay  The better player won.
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On October 11 2011 22:29 KanoCoke wrote:Tastosis so bitter about NesTea losing and shitting up the GanZi Supernova games with their negativity. It's also funny how they go offtopic 90% of the time during the matches and just keep on repeating "This game is so bad" in an attempt to brainwash people (which has apparently worked to some degree). I should have just muted the GOMPlayer while watching. But anyhows, the next matches are going to be fun. Coca seems to have improved a lot, but Happy is a pretty scary TvZer from what I've seen, so I really don't know what's going to happen there. MMA's very inconsistent now, and Clide's been on a tear recently, so he's going to be the favorite coming into the match. Looking forward to the games and better commentary. 
Very annoying indeed, looking forward to the next set of matches because they won't be casting, so there'll be a less biased cast.
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On October 12 2011 00:30 Cain0 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2011 00:25 HypernovA wrote:On October 12 2011 00:22 Cain0 wrote:
Im sorry, but I can no longer enjoy this anymore. Its a tragedy because I love tastosis and the prestige of the GSL, but TvT is getting real boring and 3/9 matchups are basically never seen and 5/9 match-ups become very rare after the RO32. I just watched the first game of MVP vs Nestea and I just saw a buker rush delay nestea's expo for ages then 800 worth of minerals and a medivac wiping out Nestea's entire economy. You might say that he could have reacted better, but why should he have to perfectly split his drones 5 times in a row to mearly survive. Im just gonna watch MLG from now on. I don't understand this. You say that he could have reacted better but he didn't. The consequence? He lost his drones at the mineral line. The splitting drones comment to survive could be related to how Terrans need to micro against banelings to survive. Why should Terran have to perfectly split their marines in order to survive the huge battles? What im getting at is, Nestea makes a mistake and lets 500 minerals worth of hellions in his main -> GG game over as hellion micro is good enough at this level that roaches cant catch hellions until they have killed all the drones MVP makes a similar mistake and lets >500 minerals worth of roach and lings in his base and autorepairs his bunker until nesteas attack dies. Also the marines just run behind the tanks now and LOL at the banes and even in the rare occurance that a bane hits, Terran can just remake the marines in 2 seconds whereas if drones get roasted by hellions, they cannot be replaced without sacrificing an army.
Nestea just needed spine crawlers @ mineral line to negate heavy damage, same as how T needs turrets to fend off mass damage/dying to muta harass
Nestea's mistake, not "game sux boring to watch the person that made less mistakes win"
Taldarim game, mvp was doing really well, and then a few baneling hits lost him the game/flow from then on
The slight cost of banelings wiped out the entire T army, so in your logic that's borderline bullshit yes?
T has to micro the shit out of their army to make use of it, while all you see zerg doing is moving banelings in, then mutas, and pray for a effecient trade in Z favor
your opinion just comes as heavily biased, as for some reason if nestea won you'd still be watching gsl
Each race has their own mechanics, sure terran can make scvs and army at the same time, but zerg can remake workers/make workers/make army at an insane production rate, because they are zerg
lose 20 drones to hellions -> remake 24 drones instantly
kill scvs with banes/ling runbys/anything -> remake 1 at a time, per CC
you're complaining about the differences between the races, each of which has mechanics to help deal with the other
chill out with the extreme viewpoints
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ugh. im really not a fan of nesteas ZvT, he relies so much on banelings, although he is using other compositions more often as of late. It works fine vs worse players but not against mvp, he needs his opponent to make control mistakes to win, which in my opinion is a poor way to play. I would like him to play more of a ling muta mid-game composition, a bit like july does, i think he would do a lot better if he were to adapt his style, although it takes a lot more to be able to play it well.
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On October 11 2011 22:29 KanoCoke wrote:Tastosis so bitter about NesTea losing and shitting up the GanZi Supernova games with their negativity. It's also funny how they go offtopic 90% of the time during the matches and just keep on repeating "This game is so bad" in an attempt to brainwash people (which has apparently worked to some degree). I should have just muted the GOMPlayer while watching. But anyhows, the next matches are going to be fun. Coca seems to have improved a lot, but Happy is a pretty scary TvZer from what I've seen, so I really don't know what's going to happen there. MMA's very inconsistent now, and Clide's been on a tear recently, so he's going to be the favorite coming into the match. Looking forward to the games and better commentary.
About Tastosis, I think it is more about Artosis. Normally, Tasteless will agree anything Artosis says during the match. He is just being a good host, to let the guest speaker dominate the conversation. Artosis should really tone it down a notch about Nestea. I have no problem with Tasteless. Once Artosis tone it down, tasteless will follow.
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United States12607 Posts
On October 12 2011 00:30 Micket wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2011 23:37 JWD wrote:
In game 2, why didn't NesTea place his macro hatchery and maybe even his roach warren at his door (rather than floating in his main)? This was a common tactic for fending off vulture harass in BW...don't see why it isn't ever used in SC2.
Weird.
Edit: Nestea did the same thing in game 3 o.o macro hatch in main, leaving door to his natural wide open. I know on old Taldarim, a macro hatch in the nat could be sieged from the low ground where you saw reapers. That may be a reason.
Good point. Thanks dude.
Just finished watching this series. Sick games, couldn't have hoped for better. Such a close match too. Is there any doubt that we just watched the Code S Finals?? 
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congrats to mvp, gg to nestea, and good bye GSL till next month.
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On October 11 2011 23:50 hysterial wrote:
Wow MVP crushing despite getting the most zerg-favored maps I've ever seen. Nestea has such poor ZvT.
It's not that Nestea has a poor ZvT, MVP is just untouchable TvZ.
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On October 12 2011 00:27 ch33psh33p wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2011 23:50 hysterial wrote:
Wow MVP crushing despite getting the most zerg-favored maps I've ever seen. Nestea has such poor ZvT. Seriously? Nestea just took 2 games off the best TvZ on the planet, and instead of giving MVP credit for being downright amazing, you take the asshole route and say Nestea's ZvT is bad. Nobody stands a chance against MVP as Z right now, its a testament to Nestea's skill he took two games as is.
I think that Nestea is less likely to beat MVP in a Bo5-7 than some other zergs for the simple fact that he and MVP have so much history. They are not only teammates, but play against each other in GSL every other season. This means MVP has spent a lot of time figuring Tea out, I could see some other zerg coming up with something to snipe him (see, july) but not nestea.
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On October 12 2011 00:51 Jaedong4thOSL wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2011 22:29 KanoCoke wrote:Tastosis so bitter about NesTea losing and shitting up the GanZi Supernova games with their negativity. It's also funny how they go offtopic 90% of the time during the matches and just keep on repeating "This game is so bad" in an attempt to brainwash people (which has apparently worked to some degree). I should have just muted the GOMPlayer while watching. But anyhows, the next matches are going to be fun. Coca seems to have improved a lot, but Happy is a pretty scary TvZer from what I've seen, so I really don't know what's going to happen there. MMA's very inconsistent now, and Clide's been on a tear recently, so he's going to be the favorite coming into the match. Looking forward to the games and better commentary. About Tastosis, I think it is more about Artosis. Normally, Tasteless will agree anything Artosis says during the match. He is just being a good host, to let the guest speaker dominate the conversation. Artosis should really tone it down a notch about Nestea. I have no problem with Tasteless. Once Artosis tone it down, tasteless will follow.
i completely agree with all of this. i love tastosis, but as of late artosis's undying love for nestea, to the point where he's still talking about him in the next series after nestea has played and left, is something that has really been shitting up the commentary lately. nothing but love for the both of them but it's gotta be reined in a bit.
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Lol people all over Artosis about his Nestea love. Get over it. The Ganzi Supernova games were sub par and sloppy, so of course they would criticize it in comparison to the games beforehand.
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On October 12 2011 01:14 Flonomenalz wrote:
Lol people all over Artosis about his Nestea love. Get over it. The Ganzi Supernova games were sub par and sloppy, so of course they would criticize it in comparison to the games beforehand.
it's been going on for a while.
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When Drones get stim and Hellions are melee range only, maybe people can begin to split Drones as well as Terrans spread Marines against Banes, until then, LOL at the Drone splitting comments.
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On October 12 2011 01:16 kabar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2011 01:14 Flonomenalz wrote:
Lol people all over Artosis about his Nestea love. Get over it. The Ganzi Supernova games were sub par and sloppy, so of course they would criticize it in comparison to the games beforehand. it's been going on for a while.
i know, personally i think it's hilarious, but who cares, they still offer near perfect insight on what's going on in the game, and always gave credit to mvp. people need to calm down.
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As much as people are derping on Nestea's ZvT, he has become the only Zerg ever to take 2 games off MVP in a series.
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EPT
