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[GSL] Code S RO32 Day 2 - Page 164

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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tree.hugger
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
September 21 2011 13:48 GMT
#3261
Looks like 1/1/1 fear is now the #1 killer of protoss, taking over the top spot from the actual 1/1/1.
ModeratorEffOrt, Snow, GuMiho, and Team Liquid
Lorch
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany3690 Posts
September 21 2011 13:48 GMT
#3262
On September 21 2011 22:47 7mk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:40 Cyro wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:24 eot wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:22 Plansix wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:21 Scorch wrote:
Wow. And I thought zealots were strong.


Not vs Terran with ghosts. They don't even need to get mobile detection or to micro.


He was ahead in upgrades and had a bigger army
Zealots can be cost effective against very small groups of bio, but against a clump of that size you don't get enough surface area compared to the DPS inside.



Ahead in upgrades? It was 0-2 vs 1-1, HuK invested 350 gas into charge also.


350 gas? thats odd ^^


He probably talks about the 150 for the citadel, erm sorry council and the 200 for charge, though when you go dt expand you kinda have the council anyways.
7mk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Germany10157 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-21 13:51:15
September 21 2011 13:49 GMT
#3263
On September 21 2011 22:48 Lorch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:47 7mk wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:40 Cyro wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:24 eot wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:22 Plansix wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:21 Scorch wrote:
Wow. And I thought zealots were strong.


Not vs Terran with ghosts. They don't even need to get mobile detection or to micro.


He was ahead in upgrades and had a bigger army
Zealots can be cost effective against very small groups of bio, but against a clump of that size you don't get enough surface area compared to the DPS inside.



Ahead in upgrades? It was 0-2 vs 1-1, HuK invested 350 gas into charge also.


350 gas? thats odd ^^


He probably talks about the 150 for the citadel, erm sorry council and the 200 for charge, though when you go dt expand you kinda have the council anyways.


the council doesnt cost 150 gas.


On September 21 2011 22:48 tree.hugger wrote:
Looks like 1/1/1 fear is now the #1 killer of protoss, taking over the top spot from the actual 1/1/1.



hehe, might be true in some cases (I know I lose quite a lot of matches cause I wrongly think 111 is coming) but I dont see why you would go DT out of 1/1/1 fear
I didnt watch the match though, maybe he planned to go blink and then changed into DT when he realized 111 wasnt coming?
beep boop
bigjenk
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1543 Posts
September 21 2011 13:49 GMT
#3264
Hopefully hots brings some better balance though, only thing keeping any sort of w/l balance in gsl is the fact that bottom half of top 50 terrans are playing top 5 toss and zergs. I can appreciate a good tvt every now and again but its like 75 percent of games at the top 16 of tournaments now a days.
Ignore my opinions I am bad
msjakofsky
Profile Joined June 2011
1169 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-21 13:51:06
September 21 2011 13:49 GMT
#3265
On September 21 2011 22:36 winthrop wrote:
Terran players did well.
However, if we have a look on players eliminated,
We have
(T)Noblesse
(T)Ensnare
(P)MarineKing
(P)Puzzle
(T)NaDa
(T)Keen
(P)HuK
(Z)Zenio

5 terran gone
2 protoss gone
1 zerg gone.
It's quite balanced


yeah you have to take mirror matchups out of the picture if you want it to make sense

code A/code S individual matches combined:

protoss win vs t 5 loss vs t 10 win vs zerg 7 loss vs zerg 12

so Protoss so far has 33% winrate vs terran and 36% winrate vs zerg, but keep in mind that many of those matches come from series that are lost for the p in the end (2-1 series)
Windmill
Profile Joined April 2011
33 Posts
September 21 2011 13:50 GMT
#3266
Well at least HuK doesn't get slaughtered over and over again in code A/B like the Swedes &co. Disparage him all you want but he's still the only foreigner in Korea that matters and he isn't likely to lose that status anytime soon.
AxionSteel
Profile Joined January 2011
United States7754 Posts
September 21 2011 13:50 GMT
#3267
On September 21 2011 22:40 Cyro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:24 eot wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:22 Plansix wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:21 Scorch wrote:
Wow. And I thought zealots were strong.


Not vs Terran with ghosts. They don't even need to get mobile detection or to micro.


He was ahead in upgrades and had a bigger army
Zealots can be cost effective against very small groups of bio, but against a clump of that size you don't get enough surface area compared to the DPS inside.



Ahead in upgrades? It was 0-2 vs 1-1, HuK invested 350 gas into charge also.


Uh no....was 0-1 max. seriously people will do anything to qq, it's crazy. Virus had way more supply, and had LOTS of medivacs hovering over the army, was pretty obvious how the battle would turn out.

CrumpetGuvnor
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia302 Posts
September 21 2011 13:50 GMT
#3268
On September 21 2011 22:48 tree.hugger wrote:
Looks like 1/1/1 fear is now the #1 killer of protoss, taking over the top spot from the actual 1/1/1.

yeah haha ive found myself doing the stupidest shit on ladder vT. going for one gate nexus robo stargate thinking a 111 is coming and then a standard marauder expand hits my front and im caught with nothing
s3rp
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany3192 Posts
September 21 2011 13:51 GMT
#3269
On September 21 2011 22:48 tree.hugger wrote:
Looks like 1/1/1 fear is now the #1 killer of protoss, taking over the top spot from the actual 1/1/1.


Well if fear of 1-1-1 freaks Protosses into playing DT's they're incredibly dumb. Thats like massing only Marines,Lings against BFH.
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18159 Posts
September 21 2011 13:52 GMT
#3270
On September 21 2011 22:37 Priwall wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:34 bigjenk wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:28 openbox1 wrote:
I'm just curious, Huk always manages to stick with Code S by the skin of his teeth. I always recall him in the up or downs or just barely avoiding it. Yet, the casters always say he "favored" or "one of the best."

Why? I know internationally where there are less Koreans he has done well and has taken down MC at Homestory, but in the GSL he's always been meh...

Artosis always disses on guys like Ensnare, Zenio etc who have been staples of Code S, but wouldn't Huk be more or less on the same level? Admittedly, he gets alot of lucky breaks in the up/downs avoiding code A several times.



Did pretty well last month. And staying in code s by the skin of your teeth makes you a top 3 protoss in the world at the moment, with mc falling out of code a the only more consistent protoss lately is hong un and genius and neither has been tearing up much of anything.

Last gsl ro8 was more of a luck run imo. Sanghos PvP was not even Code A level as well as Nada's TvP. He then got humiliated by MVP in ro8.


Humiliated by MVP... gosh, lets see, did Nestea do better? Nope. Nor did TOP. July probably put up the best fight over the whole series, but still got pretty effectively destroyed by MVP.

Cut a story short: HuK is one of the best toss in the world and the fact that he's struggling in Code S is not surprising at all given all toss' current problems.
7mk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Germany10157 Posts
September 21 2011 13:54 GMT
#3271
On September 21 2011 22:50 CrumpetGuvnor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:48 tree.hugger wrote:
Looks like 1/1/1 fear is now the #1 killer of protoss, taking over the top spot from the actual 1/1/1.

yeah haha ive found myself doing the stupidest shit on ladder vT. going for one gate nexus robo stargate thinking a 111 is coming and then a standard marauder expand hits my front and im caught with nothing


hehe yea ive done a lot of stupid shit anticipating 1 1 1 too.
Should instead do it like Kiwikaki and get robo before nexus so that you can scout with obs and cancel nexus and then build stargate if you see 1 1 1 coming
beep boop
msjakofsky
Profile Joined June 2011
1169 Posts
September 21 2011 13:55 GMT
#3272
On September 21 2011 22:52 Acrofales wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:37 Priwall wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:34 bigjenk wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:28 openbox1 wrote:
I'm just curious, Huk always manages to stick with Code S by the skin of his teeth. I always recall him in the up or downs or just barely avoiding it. Yet, the casters always say he "favored" or "one of the best."

Why? I know internationally where there are less Koreans he has done well and has taken down MC at Homestory, but in the GSL he's always been meh...

Artosis always disses on guys like Ensnare, Zenio etc who have been staples of Code S, but wouldn't Huk be more or less on the same level? Admittedly, he gets alot of lucky breaks in the up/downs avoiding code A several times.



Did pretty well last month. And staying in code s by the skin of your teeth makes you a top 3 protoss in the world at the moment, with mc falling out of code a the only more consistent protoss lately is hong un and genius and neither has been tearing up much of anything.

Last gsl ro8 was more of a luck run imo. Sanghos PvP was not even Code A level as well as Nada's TvP. He then got humiliated by MVP in ro8.


Humiliated by MVP... gosh, lets see, did Nestea do better? Nope. Nor did TOP. July probably put up the best fight over the whole series, but still got pretty effectively destroyed by MVP.

Cut a story short: HuK is one of the best toss in the world and the fact that he's struggling in Code S is not surprising at all given all toss' current problems.


we all know the scores but you're trying to give too much credit to huk. we understand that you're a fanboy but HuK is getting lucky brackets all the time and had he been in MC's brackets for example he'd be in code B just like MC.
Kettchup
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1911 Posts
September 21 2011 13:58 GMT
#3273
Virus did a tank/marine all-in for the first game. A DT expand would have been great against that, so I can only guess that Huk thought the same build was incoming for the second game.
Ashok
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia339 Posts
September 21 2011 13:59 GMT
#3274
On September 21 2011 22:55 msjakofsky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:52 Acrofales wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:37 Priwall wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:34 bigjenk wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:28 openbox1 wrote:
I'm just curious, Huk always manages to stick with Code S by the skin of his teeth. I always recall him in the up or downs or just barely avoiding it. Yet, the casters always say he "favored" or "one of the best."

Why? I know internationally where there are less Koreans he has done well and has taken down MC at Homestory, but in the GSL he's always been meh...

Artosis always disses on guys like Ensnare, Zenio etc who have been staples of Code S, but wouldn't Huk be more or less on the same level? Admittedly, he gets alot of lucky breaks in the up/downs avoiding code A several times.



Did pretty well last month. And staying in code s by the skin of your teeth makes you a top 3 protoss in the world at the moment, with mc falling out of code a the only more consistent protoss lately is hong un and genius and neither has been tearing up much of anything.

Last gsl ro8 was more of a luck run imo. Sanghos PvP was not even Code A level as well as Nada's TvP. He then got humiliated by MVP in ro8.


Humiliated by MVP... gosh, lets see, did Nestea do better? Nope. Nor did TOP. July probably put up the best fight over the whole series, but still got pretty effectively destroyed by MVP.

Cut a story short: HuK is one of the best toss in the world and the fact that he's struggling in Code S is not surprising at all given all toss' current problems.


we all know the scores but you're trying to give too much credit to huk. we understand that you're a fanboy but HuK is getting lucky brackets all the time and had he been in MC's brackets for example he'd be in code B just like MC.


But he's not. He's in Code S. I don't buy the "lucky" bracket argument, all top players are quite good and capable of taking games off each other. If you stay in Code S then you are damn good.
_vladimir_
Profile Joined September 2010
Serbia530 Posts
September 21 2011 13:59 GMT
#3275
Guys guys, i just had premonition!

Do you see how everything falls left and right by the hands of Terrans? First we had to find Protoss heroes, and Zerg heroes, as bastions of light and consolation, those few people that can fight Terrans and live (MC , Huk, Nestea, Losira, etc) but as Terrans keep pounding even heroes, soon there will be non left, untill last man standing in TvT world - NESTEA finaly drops.
And this is all part of grand scheme, for Zerg and Protoss to re unite in future (unrevealed 4th expansion) back into one Xelnaga race, and togeter stand in one final battle vs forces of Terran, suported by crapload of new units, and together, we shall be victorius! and there shall be no Terrans anymore!
MC:" 2nd game i all in, he drone he drone, me win."
ladyumbra
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Canada1699 Posts
September 21 2011 14:00 GMT
#3276
Slightly of topic ( but sort of not) I know you can accidentally storm your own units does the same apply to FG and EMP? I'm wondering if a terran has ever accidentally emp'd his own ghosts while trying to get the emp off on advancing zealots or something.

At least Huk avoided the up/down matches and has time to just relax for a few days and get himself in a better mental place. I really expect a lot from him next season, also for him to stop going DT's so often especially because he's just so known for it like MC is known for favouring stargate openings.

Minor question, is it possible to have enough gas to do some sort of fairly early voidray + DT rush? Could Huk pull off something weird like that or is it just unfeasible due to resources and or it's just a dumb idea?

So excited to see Nestea beating MMA and Nada, I think if he keeps focusing in improving his TvZ he may be unstoppable this season.
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38257 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-21 14:03:36
September 21 2011 14:03 GMT
#3277
On September 21 2011 23:00 ladyumbra wrote:
Slightly of topic ( but sort of not) I know you can accidentally storm your own units does the same apply to FG and EMP? I'm wondering if a terran has ever accidentally emp'd his own ghosts while trying to get the emp off on advancing zealots or something..


EMP does friendly fire. Most people control well enough to not EMP their own ghosts, but I have seen a couple of medivacs hit accidentally =p

People have also used it to intentionally drain energy from units so they don't die from feedback (thors etc)
feelo
Profile Joined July 2011
Australia19 Posts
September 21 2011 14:05 GMT
#3278
As much as I love HuK the game changed when he lost his probe. Could of poked in at a later time and adjusted accordingly but since he had no info he had to play from behind.

Hope he takes a week or so off to relax and get his mind right. He's been travelling far too much lately and relax

There's always next season.
:)
ch33psh33p
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
7650 Posts
September 21 2011 14:06 GMT
#3279
On September 21 2011 23:00 ladyumbra wrote:

So excited to see Nestea beating MMA and Nada, I think if he keeps focusing in improving his TvZ he may be unstoppable this season.


The only way for Nestea to improve his ZvT is to practice with MVP.... and you know, there's a problem there. Thats the reason he can't ever beat MVP.
secret - never again
msjakofsky
Profile Joined June 2011
1169 Posts
September 21 2011 14:11 GMT
#3280
On September 21 2011 22:59 Ashok wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 21 2011 22:55 msjakofsky wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:52 Acrofales wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:37 Priwall wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:34 bigjenk wrote:
On September 21 2011 22:28 openbox1 wrote:
I'm just curious, Huk always manages to stick with Code S by the skin of his teeth. I always recall him in the up or downs or just barely avoiding it. Yet, the casters always say he "favored" or "one of the best."

Why? I know internationally where there are less Koreans he has done well and has taken down MC at Homestory, but in the GSL he's always been meh...

Artosis always disses on guys like Ensnare, Zenio etc who have been staples of Code S, but wouldn't Huk be more or less on the same level? Admittedly, he gets alot of lucky breaks in the up/downs avoiding code A several times.



Did pretty well last month. And staying in code s by the skin of your teeth makes you a top 3 protoss in the world at the moment, with mc falling out of code a the only more consistent protoss lately is hong un and genius and neither has been tearing up much of anything.

Last gsl ro8 was more of a luck run imo. Sanghos PvP was not even Code A level as well as Nada's TvP. He then got humiliated by MVP in ro8.


Humiliated by MVP... gosh, lets see, did Nestea do better? Nope. Nor did TOP. July probably put up the best fight over the whole series, but still got pretty effectively destroyed by MVP.

Cut a story short: HuK is one of the best toss in the world and the fact that he's struggling in Code S is not surprising at all given all toss' current problems.


we all know the scores but you're trying to give too much credit to huk. we understand that you're a fanboy but HuK is getting lucky brackets all the time and had he been in MC's brackets for example he'd be in code B just like MC.


But he's not. He's in Code S. I don't buy the "lucky" bracket argument, all top players are quite good and capable of taking games off each other. If you stay in Code S then you are damn good.


then you're simply ignorant, luck plays a HUGE factor in every tournament. i could arrange the brackets of the past few gsls so that like 5-6 different players could've won. ofc skill matters a lot but so does luck.
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