On July 11 2011 14:20 VsTerminus wrote: I'm getting rather annoyed by how many people are complaining about the lack of NA players representing the league. It's not the North American Player Star League, it's a Starcraft League based out of North America.
I'm not complaining. I MUCH prefer to have better players than only players from NA. Skill > Origin.
The name is funny now that Korea has most participants, and I'm thankful for that.
Yeah, while I agree thorzain is good, I'm not sure how he has maintained his hype level still after tsl 3, which was an online event for the most part. Every lan he's attended since he has not done well such as mlg, dreamhack and home story.
When thorzain does something noteable at a major lan event, then I'll take notice, but until then he's a bit overhyped.
i reckon they could make more sponsorship money/views if they aired this aiming for the european/korean market rather than an american one. looking at the players it seems to make sense.
perhaps play some of the games on the european/korean server to make it fairer on the majority of the participants?
I'm pretty sure Xeris posted a list that had mOOnGLaDe in the safe zone for Season 2, that might have been before it got cut down to 45 players, though.
On July 11 2011 15:04 kellymilkies wrote: Are you sure mOOnGLaDe did not qualify? Where did you get this list from?
Hmm, its close. 16 players are getting the boot. There are 15 players with a worse record/points than moonglade. And then there are a few tied with him. Stalife being one of them. So moonglade may still be in it.
On July 11 2011 14:59 Khaladas wrote: Lindsey will not be casting....she's a sideline reporter essentially.
Hahaha... just you wait and see . But seriously, I wonder if they will get a permanent side caster to Gretorp... maybe Moletrap or someone along that line?
On July 11 2011 14:59 Khaladas wrote: Lindsey will not be casting....she's a sideline reporter essentially.
Hahaha... just you wait and see . But seriously, I wonder if they will get a permanent side caster to Gretorp... maybe Moletrap or someone along that line?
Rumors are Mister Bitter and Moletrap may become permanent casters for NASL along side Gretorp.
On July 11 2011 14:59 Khaladas wrote: Lindsey will not be casting....she's a sideline reporter essentially.
Hahaha... just you wait and see . But seriously, I wonder if they will get a permanent side caster to Gretorp... maybe Moletrap or someone along that line?
Rumors are Mister Bitter and Moletrap may become permanent casters for NASL along side Gretorp.
Mr Bitter and Gretorp would almost out-mellow each other. But they do have a nice rapport/chemistry.
On July 11 2011 12:23 Quintum_ wrote: What is really turns out to be is the EU + NA vs KR, Group play is really going to be about what foreigners can take games off of Korans and there is only a handful at that. The foreigner community is really going to have to step it up NA and EU or the NASL is going to look like this
35 Team Korea
5 Team EU
5Team NA
While i love to root for foreigner there is only a couple that i can see taking games off top koreans like MC
Na man, team EU is almost as strong as team Korea this time around I think. Team Korea only has three players I would consider to be top koreans: MC, MKP, and Puma (and Puma's legitimacy is still in question, but he certainly impressed me tonight). July is a close runner up of course.
While those three are the top who will be difficult to beat, team EU has some truely stellar players, and Thorzain might actually be BETTER than even those three Koreans I just mentioned, after he trains up a bit in korea... It's gonna be exciting.
So I wouldn't expect team EU to get cut down to a third...
Team NA though... yeah they have some SERIOUS work to do. We need HuK in this SO bad to rep NA. (And don't give me that "he's trained in korea nonsense, if he played in the NASL, he would be the iconic representation of North America, being both Canadian and American).
Edit: And yeah, as long as it's the highest level of play, I'm happy, but I REALLY hope the north americans start really kicking it into gear here. I hate having to cheer on Idra.
Man you are crazy if you think yeam eu is as strong as team korea. Team korea has dominated the last mlg, dreamhack and now nasl. EU players would have done better in all three of these tournaments if that was true.
I'm not talking about the Europeans versus the koreans in any tournament but this one right here, and here I believe the europeans in general are as strong as the koreans that they signed. Look at alive getting beat by darkforce in the Nasl finals for example.
Players which I think are gonna take A LOT of games off of koreans: Ret (who only lost to Puma, the NASL champion all season long). Thorzain (he just keeps getting better and is on a similar skill level as MC, currently they're at 5-8 for MC after playing in TSL, MLG, and HSC3) Sjow (had a weak first season but lately has been showing terrific results against some of the absolute top Europeans including White-Ra and Sase) White-Ra: He's good man, just inconsitent lately.
Basically, right now the Koreans are just a bit more consistent than the europeans, which of course counts for a lot, but it's something that can be improved quite quickly, and I think Ret and Thorzain especially are gonna show us that.
Plus, Nightend took a game off of Puma, so maybe now that he's in Fnatic he'll start doing really well.
Is this a joke post?
Ret - Got destroyed by Puma. Got destroyed by MC at MLG. Thorzain - Beaten by MC twice after TSL also lost to TSL Revival in the NASL open tournament. Sjow - Has lost convincingly to Julyzerg I think three times in the last three months, lost to MMA as well. White Ra - Doesn't practice enough, hasn't happened to play any Koreans for a while, mostly that's because Europeans have knocked him out before he's got a chance. Moon beat him at Dreamhack though.
The Koreans are way, way ahead of everyone in terms of skill, consistancy and results. The gap is far wider now than it has ever been in Sc2 history.
Back in Beta the gap was actually pretty small and foreigners traded games with Koreans without much issue but nowadays Koreans are winning 90%+ of their series versus foreigners and it's higher than that at LAN's.
Across all of Homestory, Dreamhack, MLG and NASL Finals the only foreigners versus Korean wins were.
Idra - MC Slush - Moon Naniwa - Moon Huk - July Huk - Moon Huk - MC Naniwa - MC Sen - Zenio Sen - July Darkforce - Alive.
That's 10 games across four tournaments and five of those results are from Huk and Sen who practice on the Korean server, or in the case of Huk live in a Korean pro gaming house.
The number of games won by Koreans over foreigners is I'm guessing well over 100.
But really, korea is sending SO many top top players, the Americans will HAVE to step up their game. The europeans as well, but they are doing a tad bit better than the americans still. The NASL should become the new GSL, since it invites to all countries, unlike the actual GSL.
On July 11 2011 12:23 Quintum_ wrote: What is really turns out to be is the EU + NA vs KR, Group play is really going to be about what foreigners can take games off of Korans and there is only a handful at that. The foreigner community is really going to have to step it up NA and EU or the NASL is going to look like this
35 Team Korea
5 Team EU
5Team NA
While i love to root for foreigner there is only a couple that i can see taking games off top koreans like MC
Na man, team EU is almost as strong as team Korea this time around I think. Team Korea only has three players I would consider to be top koreans: MC, MKP, and Puma (and Puma's legitimacy is still in question, but he certainly impressed me tonight). July is a close runner up of course.
While those three are the top who will be difficult to beat, team EU has some truely stellar players, and Thorzain might actually be BETTER than even those three Koreans I just mentioned, after he trains up a bit in korea... It's gonna be exciting.
So I wouldn't expect team EU to get cut down to a third...
Team NA though... yeah they have some SERIOUS work to do. We need HuK in this SO bad to rep NA. (And don't give me that "he's trained in korea nonsense, if he played in the NASL, he would be the iconic representation of North America, being both Canadian and American).
Edit: And yeah, as long as it's the highest level of play, I'm happy, but I REALLY hope the north americans start really kicking it into gear here. I hate having to cheer on Idra.
Man you are crazy if you think yeam eu is as strong as team korea. Team korea has dominated the last mlg, dreamhack and now nasl. EU players would have done better in all three of these tournaments if that was true.
I'm not talking about the Europeans versus the koreans in any tournament but this one right here, and here I believe the europeans in general are as strong as the koreans that they signed. Look at alive getting beat by darkforce in the Nasl finals for example.
Players which I think are gonna take A LOT of games off of koreans: Ret (who only lost to Puma, the NASL champion all season long). Thorzain (he just keeps getting better and is on a similar skill level as MC, currently they're at 5-8 for MC after playing in TSL, MLG, and HSC3) Sjow (had a weak first season but lately has been showing terrific results against some of the absolute top Europeans including White-Ra and Sase) White-Ra: He's good man, just inconsitent lately.
Basically, right now the Koreans are just a bit more consistent than the europeans, which of course counts for a lot, but it's something that can be improved quite quickly, and I think Ret and Thorzain especially are gonna show us that.
Plus, Nightend took a game off of Puma, so maybe now that he's in Fnatic he'll start doing really well.
Is this a joke post?
Ret - Got destroyed by Puma. Got destroyed by MC at MLG. Thorzain - Beaten by MC twice after TSL also lost to TSL Revival in the NASL open tournament. Sjow - Has lost convincingly to Julyzerg I think three times in the last three months, lost to MMA as well. White Ra - Doesn't practice enough, hasn't happened to play any Koreans for a while, mostly that's because Europeans have knocked him out before he's got a chance. Moon beat him at Dreamhack though.
The Koreans are way, way ahead of everyone in terms of skill, consistancy and results. The gap is far wider now than it has ever been in Sc2 history.
Back in Beta the gap was actually pretty small and foreigners traded games with Koreans without much issue but nowadays Koreans are winning 90%+ of their series versus foreigners and it's higher than that at LAN's.
Across all of Homestory, Dreamhack, MLG and NASL Finals the only foreigners versus Korean wins were.
Idra - MC Slush - Moon Naniwa - Moon Huk - July Huk - Moon Huk - MC Naniwa - MC Sen - Zenio Sen - July Darkforce - Alive.
That's 10 games across four tournaments and five of those results are from Huk and Sen who practice on the Korean server, or in the case of Huk live in a Korean pro gaming house.
The number of games won by Koreans over foreigners is I'm guessing well over 100.
Ok, so good point on Sjow, the rest of those are hardly shocking. You could replace any of those names with a number of Korean players and nobody would bat an eyelid
. Getting beat by MC and Puma? That doesn't in any way make somebody bad. Ret also whooped MC in the second week of NASL.
I'm gonna let ThorZain's results in the next month speak for that next bit. Again, if you have a decent record against MC, you're doing pretty fucking good. That's what I'm saying, and I gaurantee we're gonna see that in Korea.
I stand by my statement on white-ra.
I still don't understand how you can say "oh, so Darkforce beat Alive, clearly that means nothing".
It DOES mean something. I'm not saying either of those two are particularly good, and that's the difference, I'm saying that both the top koreans and the top europeans would easily beat either of those two and of the top Koreans, this tournament has Puma, MC, and MKP. Those three are gonna rack up a lot of wins, but every other korean out there is gonna have to watch themselves against the europeans.
On July 11 2011 12:23 Quintum_ wrote: What is really turns out to be is the EU + NA vs KR, Group play is really going to be about what foreigners can take games off of Korans and there is only a handful at that. The foreigner community is really going to have to step it up NA and EU or the NASL is going to look like this
35 Team Korea
5 Team EU
5Team NA
While i love to root for foreigner there is only a couple that i can see taking games off top koreans like MC
Na man, team EU is almost as strong as team Korea this time around I think. Team Korea only has three players I would consider to be top koreans: MC, MKP, and Puma (and Puma's legitimacy is still in question, but he certainly impressed me tonight). July is a close runner up of course.
While those three are the top who will be difficult to beat, team EU has some truely stellar players, and Thorzain might actually be BETTER than even those three Koreans I just mentioned, after he trains up a bit in korea... It's gonna be exciting.
So I wouldn't expect team EU to get cut down to a third...
Team NA though... yeah they have some SERIOUS work to do. We need HuK in this SO bad to rep NA. (And don't give me that "he's trained in korea nonsense, if he played in the NASL, he would be the iconic representation of North America, being both Canadian and American).
Edit: And yeah, as long as it's the highest level of play, I'm happy, but I REALLY hope the north americans start really kicking it into gear here. I hate having to cheer on Idra.
Man you are crazy if you think yeam eu is as strong as team korea. Team korea has dominated the last mlg, dreamhack and now nasl. EU players would have done better in all three of these tournaments if that was true.
I'm not talking about the Europeans versus the koreans in any tournament but this one right here, and here I believe the europeans in general are as strong as the koreans that they signed. Look at alive getting beat by darkforce in the Nasl finals for example.
Players which I think are gonna take A LOT of games off of koreans: Ret (who only lost to Puma, the NASL champion all season long). Thorzain (he just keeps getting better and is on a similar skill level as MC, currently they're at 5-8 for MC after playing in TSL, MLG, and HSC3) Sjow (had a weak first season but lately has been showing terrific results against some of the absolute top Europeans including White-Ra and Sase) White-Ra: He's good man, just inconsitent lately.
Basically, right now the Koreans are just a bit more consistent than the europeans, which of course counts for a lot, but it's something that can be improved quite quickly, and I think Ret and Thorzain especially are gonna show us that.
Plus, Nightend took a game off of Puma, so maybe now that he's in Fnatic he'll start doing really well.
Is this a joke post?
Ret - Got destroyed by Puma. Got destroyed by MC at MLG. Thorzain - Beaten by MC twice after TSL also lost to TSL Revival in the NASL open tournament. Sjow - Has lost convincingly to Julyzerg I think three times in the last three months, lost to MMA as well. White Ra - Doesn't practice enough, hasn't happened to play any Koreans for a while, mostly that's because Europeans have knocked him out before he's got a chance. Moon beat him at Dreamhack though.
The Koreans are way, way ahead of everyone in terms of skill, consistancy and results. The gap is far wider now than it has ever been in Sc2 history.
Back in Beta the gap was actually pretty small and foreigners traded games with Koreans without much issue but nowadays Koreans are winning 90%+ of their series versus foreigners and it's higher than that at LAN's.
Across all of Homestory, Dreamhack, MLG and NASL Finals the only foreigners versus Korean wins were.
Idra - MC Slush - Moon Naniwa - Moon Huk - July Huk - Moon Huk - MC Naniwa - MC Sen - Zenio Sen - July Darkforce - Alive.
That's 10 games across four tournaments and five of those results are from Huk and Sen who practice on the Korean server, or in the case of Huk live in a Korean pro gaming house.
The number of games won by Koreans over foreigners is I'm guessing well over 100.
Ok, so good point on Sjow, the rest of those are hardly shocking. You could replace any of those names with a number of Korean players and nobody would bat an eyelid
. Getting beat by MC and Puma? That doesn't in any way make somebody bad. Ret also whooped MC in the second week of NASL.
I'm gonna let ThorZain's results in the next month speak for that next bit. Again, if you have a decent record against MC, you're doing pretty fucking good. That's what I'm saying, and I gaurantee we're gonna see that in Korea.
I stand by my statement on white-ra.
I still don't understand how you can say "oh, so Darkforce beat Alive, clearly that means nothing".
It DOES mean something. I'm not saying either of those two are particularly good, and that's the difference, I'm saying that both the top koreans and the top europeans would easily beat either of those two and of the top Koreans, this tournament has Puma, MC, and MKP. Those three are gonna rack up a lot of wins, but every other korean out there is gonna have to watch themselves against the europeans.
Thorzain doesn't have a good record against MC.
He beat him 3-2 once, using a strat that Blizzard almost insta nerfed straight afterwards.
Since then he's been put in his place by MC three times.
Thorzain is currently 5 wins to 8 losses versus MC and down 3 series to 1. At LAN events (which are what really matter, even if the TSL game was played with both on EU) he is 2 wins and 6 losses. Keep in mind this is MC's worse matchup and Thorzain's best.
Now Polt, he has a good record versus MC. I don't call being behind against a player a good record.
Ret's doing solidly now after a massive slump, but he's nowhere near Korean level and won't win any major tournaments anytime soon.
White Ra hasn't posted results in a long time. The professionalisation of the Sc2 scene has hurt him badly.
Alive is terrible in TvZ, he is in Korea too, his TvP and TvT are a lot better than that. He still could have easilly beaten Darkforce though, it was hardly a crushing defeat. They were close games.
On July 11 2011 17:15 robih wrote: depending on lag NA/EU players will get destroyed by the koreans
This is the stupid part. Koreans just have to make it to the finals and then the lag doesnt matter. So the seeding is all screwed up cuz koreans will lose from lag
Looking bad for team NA and EU. I hope Idra will improve his game, was a shame to not see him at the main bracket. Apart from him, Sheth and Select nobody from team NA really has a chance to make it too far. From EU I guess Thorzain, Sjow and Socke could do pretty well. I'm not sure about Morrow and Ret. Would be kinda sad if the whole main bracket was korean, but hey, it's all about skill.
EPT
. But seriously, I wonder if they will get a permanent side caster to Gretorp... maybe Moletrap or someone along that line?
