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+ Show Spoiler +On June 17 2011 02:42 emythrel wrote:
i feel bad for idra, if that fungal in g2 had hit all the mutas he would have been in a good spot.... however it only hit 1 and that was basically gg, he was gonna lose a ton of drones and another queen.
That's the same concept with ghosts with emp vs toss and toss using feedback vs the ghost, or a well placed storm. You can't afford to miss.
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On June 17 2011 02:46 RoMGraViTy wrote:
Um, ive been looking at all this playoff info, and i must have missed something. Is Boxer out? And if so, how? If someone can clear that up for me it'd be cool. thx
Boxer is already in finals
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On June 16 2011 23:39 twndomn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2011 18:46 Koshi wrote:
IdrA not making the top 16. Even though he told everybody NASL (and other "easy" money tournaments) was the reason he came back to NA for.
Incontrol not making the Play-offs but doing ok-ish in MLG.
Tyler not making anything.
It shatters my mind.
Your mind is not too knowledgeable about the SC2 pro scene then. In any tournaments that has Koreans in it, EG players would lose. Incontrol lost horribly when he played against Koreans in MLG, Idra eventually 2-4 lost to MC and 0-6 lost to Zenio, given history. They cannot defeat Koreans in do-or-die situation; common knowledge at this point.
Yeah, EG must really suck. It's too bad they can't be nearly as good as the other foreigners, like the ones who took 1-2-3 at MLG Columbus.
...
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On June 17 2011 02:48 Michaels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 02:46 RoMGraViTy wrote:
Um, ive been looking at all this playoff info, and i must have missed something. Is Boxer out? And if so, how? If someone can clear that up for me it'd be cool. thx Boxer is already in finals
Ah that makes sense. much appreciated. Wish the Nasl site had better links to the finals bracket.
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On June 16 2011 11:58 darthfoley wrote:He's a loser because he didn't "gg" after a build order loss and unluckiness in game 2? ok
lol things like this are so funny to read and still are all over the place.
game 1, well thats a bo loss
Game 2, well... bo loss cant apply, imba can't apply.... unlucky!
... When will yall run out of things to say. Zenio was better today, ggs and gl to both of them
imo first game was a BO loss, sure, but mindgames and BOs are a big part of the game. Picking the right BO is a good skill to have^^. More seriously, it was a calculated BO win and a good decision on Zenio's part
Game 2 - if mismicro qualifies as unlucky, I'm the unluckiest player in the world and otherwise would be a GSL champ.
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On June 17 2011 02:27 Reaper9 wrote:
My thoughts on the Idra Vs Zenio Match. Idra mis-microed with his lone infestor, and he paid the full price for it. He had a spot of unluckiness here and there, but it is also up to the player to make their own luck. Luck is not static, it is a stream that flows constantly. I have seen him do fast pool builds, but his mentality has been consistent: drone up to manage his own economy. What he should try to do is damage the opponents economy. It is risky, but I think that is what defines the Zerg race as a whole- taking risks. I know the Overmind sure took a hell of a risk making Infested Kerrigan.
Idra also needs to practice more. 3 hours vs at least 9 hours is a big gap he needs to overcome. Also his mentality is psyching himself out, that just makes everything more difficult. I know some people when they overplay tend to over-think things, but in Idra's case, that is way too little. Your mouse becomes an extension of your body, and from there on, your weapon and shield. One small miss, and it's your head lying on the ground.
My thoughts on the Idra Vs Zenio Match. Idra mis-microed with his lone infestor, and he paid the full price for it. - The game was over, the fungal from that infestor was just blowing off steam, he only had 2 infestors I think, and even if he got a perfect fungal he couldn't kill even a single muta.
He had a spot of unluckiness here and there, but it is also up to the player to make their own luck. Luck is not static, it is a stream that flows constantly. - The game should work like this. You take a small risks to get rewarded, an advantage of some sort. If your risk fails, you ae behind, however you are not completely dead. Sadly, it's more like your opponent takes a small risk, and if it works, you could possibly fucking die in SC2. It's really sad actually and I don't blame idra for missing BW a lot.
I have seen him do fast pool builds, but his mentality has been consistent: drone up to manage his own economy. What he should try to do is damage the opponents economy. It is risky, but I think that is what defines the Zerg race as a whole- taking risks. - Do you even watch his games? He kills drones all the time. He loves doing ling runbys to get scouting and picking drones off. If you mean a full aggro build focused on killing drones, why? If you go an econ build and hold your opponents aggression, you are ahead. As people get better and better these aggro builds will stop working as much, and zenio is a korean zerg able to stop ling/bane fine.
Idra also needs to practice more. 3 hours vs at least 9 hours is a big gap he needs to overcome. Also his mentality is psyching himself out, that just makes everything more difficult.
IdrA has no way to practice. US internet, especially in shitty Arizona, lags to europe and korea. NA server has no real practice partners that he can gain anything from and ladder is pointless. Even if he gets in a house with the rest of EG, I don't know if he will improve much since he is the best on the team, he needs a korean ladder/house.
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its recorded live but re-broadcasted.
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DDE doing some great drops!
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dde _really_ bad luck in his game 3 and mannered as he is he gg'd and wished his opponent good luck. What does idra do in a similiar situation? he just leaves without a gg. Good that he is out.
Also ofc nice to see the best player of this 4 to advance to the finals
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I really enjoy DDE playstyle he is very good I think he might be a contender soon for the best NA player if he keep up with this play
Some1 make the DDE fan club he is playing amasing
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On June 16 2011 23:39 twndomn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2011 18:46 Koshi wrote:
IdrA not making the top 16. Even though he told everybody NASL (and other "easy" money tournaments) was the reason he came back to NA for.
Incontrol not making the Play-offs but doing ok-ish in MLG.
Tyler not making anything.
It shatters my mind.
Your mind is not too knowledgeable about the SC2 pro scene then. In any tournaments that has Koreans in it, EG players would lose. Incontrol lost horribly when he played against Koreans in MLG, Idra eventually 2-4 lost to MC and 0-6 lost to Zenio, given history. They cannot defeat Koreans in do-or-die situation; common knowledge at this point.
That's the most ridiculous post I've ever read. The people that Idra beat to get to round of 8 in the GSL were Koreans. Furthermore, Thorzain had to be two GSL champions to win the TSL and Jinro had to go through mostly Korean opponents to be able to get to the round of 4, twice, in the GSL.
About why Idra lost, I have not gotten to watch the Zenio game, but from what I see in the forum posts, I see basically the same responses to every game Idra loses, which usually goes something like this, "The better player lost to a gimmick!" or ,"Idra is just a very bad player and you're just in denial."
I feel that winning is not just determined by how good a player is or how bad a player is, like how Idra wishes. Idra believe that games should go this way: I pit my strengths and against your strengths, and the stronger guy wins. But it's never really that clear cut, in my opinion it's a stupid way to play. The key to winning is using your strengths against your opponents weaknesses.
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Is IdrA out of the NASL ? I don't understand jackshit about this play off stuff
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On June 17 2011 03:35 Sqq wrote:
Is IdrA out of the NASL ? I don't understand jackshit about this play off stuff
Yes
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They made the quality for the free stream worse? :/
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"very creative front pressure build" LOL
+ Show Spoiler +moot comment, but lets stop the idra thing from eating another thread alive 
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Russian Federation202 Posts
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Oh yeah! For the swarm! ^^ Brilliant punishment of a bunker rush, gg ^^
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stupid blunder by dde just a build a depot ffs
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On June 17 2011 02:46 Smancer wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 02:16 Bellygareth wrote:
My analysis:
I think the article misunderstands the reflexion Idra has and why it exactly works. The fact that he is himself predictable is wrong (he does cheese from time to time), and is not a bad thing in itself.
The problem is that he doesn't account for "coinflips" or "bad strategy", and thus he loses.
The reflexion I think goes that way. "Hey he could go Muta and I would lose but if I account for him making mutas he'd lose without any hope". so making mutas in that situation would be bad for him right? So he probably won't make mutas. So as he won't be making mutas I don't have to account for mutas. Hell I won't even scout for it because it would be dumb for him to do it and if he doesn't do it and I scout I'm behind.
So in order to gain a small advantage (not scouting), he relies on his opponent to not do a "stupid" strat. Doing that he takes a huge risk. And loses stupidly.
He went too far into the "gain small advantages" philosophy imo.
I realize that English is not the first language of many people here on Team Liquid. I thought I would do my part and try to take this analysis and form better sentence structure. I did this because I believe that Bellygareth really had a great point that many may not have comprehended because of his or her limited study of the English language. This barrier is preventing other on TeamLiquid from becoming better Starcraft competitors. Anyway, here it is: I think the author of the article misunderstands Idra, and why Zenio claimed victory. The assertion that Idra is predictable is wrong. For example he does cheese from time to time. Idra loses because he does not account for “coinflip” or “bad” strategies. I think Idra’s thought process was as follows: “Zenio won’t make mutas, because if I prepare for mutas then he will lose. I will not scout because it is a bad choice to make mutas and if I scout I will fall behind”. Idra is trying to gain an advantage by assuming Zenio will not attempt a risky strategy. Idra loses stupidly.
You can be my english-to-english private translator ♥
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EPT
