• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:25
CEST 20:25
KST 03:25
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202543Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments3[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced59
StarCraft 2
General
The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up Clem Interview: "PvT is a bit insane right now" Serral wins EWC 2025 TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy
Tourneys
Global Tourney for College Students in September Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays $5,000 WardiTV Summer Championship 2025 LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced Simple editing of Brood War save files? (.mlx) StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest BW General Discussion Help, I can't log into staredit.net
Tourneys
[CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2 Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition Does 1 second matter in StarCraft?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Bitcoin discussion thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 704 users

[NASL] Playoffs Day 1 - Page 59

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 57 58 59 60 61 72 Next
Reaper9
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1724 Posts
June 16 2011 17:47 GMT
#1161
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 17 2011 02:42 emythrel wrote:
i feel bad for idra, if that fungal in g2 had hit all the mutas he would have been in a good spot.... however it only hit 1 and that was basically gg, he was gonna lose a ton of drones and another queen.


That's the same concept with ghosts with emp vs toss and toss using feedback vs the ghost, or a well placed storm. You can't afford to miss.
I post only when my brain works.
Michaels
Profile Joined August 2010
419 Posts
June 16 2011 17:48 GMT
#1162
On June 17 2011 02:46 RoMGraViTy wrote:
Um, ive been looking at all this playoff info, and i must have missed something. Is Boxer out? And if so, how? If someone can clear that up for me it'd be cool. thx


Boxer is already in finals
lolsixtynine
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States600 Posts
June 16 2011 17:49 GMT
#1163
On June 16 2011 23:39 twndomn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 16 2011 18:46 Koshi wrote:
IdrA not making the top 16. Even though he told everybody NASL (and other "easy" money tournaments) was the reason he came back to NA for.
Incontrol not making the Play-offs but doing ok-ish in MLG.
Tyler not making anything.

It shatters my mind.


Your mind is not too knowledgeable about the SC2 pro scene then. In any tournaments that has Koreans in it, EG players would lose. Incontrol lost horribly when he played against Koreans in MLG, Idra eventually 2-4 lost to MC and 0-6 lost to Zenio, given history. They cannot defeat Koreans in do-or-die situation; common knowledge at this point.



Yeah, EG must really suck. It's too bad they can't be nearly as good as the other foreigners, like the ones who took 1-2-3 at MLG Columbus.

...
RoMGraViTy
Profile Joined February 2011
United States314 Posts
June 16 2011 17:49 GMT
#1164
On June 17 2011 02:48 Michaels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 17 2011 02:46 RoMGraViTy wrote:
Um, ive been looking at all this playoff info, and i must have missed something. Is Boxer out? And if so, how? If someone can clear that up for me it'd be cool. thx


Boxer is already in finals


Ah that makes sense. much appreciated. Wish the Nasl site had better links to the finals bracket.
"Khaldor is a younger version of Goro from Mortal Kombat" - Tasteless
iokke
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1179 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-16 18:04:41
June 16 2011 17:50 GMT
#1165
On June 16 2011 11:58 darthfoley wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 16 2011 11:58 Dexington wrote:
Good. What a loser.



He's a loser because he didn't "gg" after a build order loss and unluckiness in game 2?

ok


lol things like this are so funny to read and still are all over the place.
game 1, well thats a bo loss
Game 2, well... bo loss cant apply, imba can't apply.... unlucky!
... When will yall run out of things to say. Zenio was better today, ggs and gl to both of them

imo first game was a BO loss, sure, but mindgames and BOs are a big part of the game. Picking the right BO is a good skill to have^^. More seriously, it was a calculated BO win and a good decision on Zenio's part
Game 2 - if mismicro qualifies as unlucky, I'm the unluckiest player in the world and otherwise would be a GSL champ.
Crop circles are Chuck Norris' way of telling the world that sometimes corn needs to lie the f*** down. rerereredit.. I never get it right the 1st time
Mailing
Profile Joined March 2011
United States3087 Posts
June 16 2011 17:50 GMT
#1166
On June 17 2011 02:27 Reaper9 wrote:
My thoughts on the Idra Vs Zenio Match. Idra mis-microed with his lone infestor, and he paid the full price for it. He had a spot of unluckiness here and there, but it is also up to the player to make their own luck. Luck is not static, it is a stream that flows constantly. I have seen him do fast pool builds, but his mentality has been consistent: drone up to manage his own economy. What he should try to do is damage the opponents economy. It is risky, but I think that is what defines the Zerg race as a whole- taking risks. I know the Overmind sure took a hell of a risk making Infested Kerrigan.

Idra also needs to practice more. 3 hours vs at least 9 hours is a big gap he needs to overcome. Also his mentality is psyching himself out, that just makes everything more difficult. I know some people when they overplay tend to over-think things, but in Idra's case, that is way too little. Your mouse becomes an extension of your body, and from there on, your weapon and shield. One small miss, and it's your head lying on the ground.


My thoughts on the Idra Vs Zenio Match. Idra mis-microed with his lone infestor, and he paid the full price for it. - The game was over, the fungal from that infestor was just blowing off steam, he only had 2 infestors I think, and even if he got a perfect fungal he couldn't kill even a single muta.

He had a spot of unluckiness here and there, but it is also up to the player to make their own luck. Luck is not static, it is a stream that flows constantly. - The game should work like this. You take a small risks to get rewarded, an advantage of some sort. If your risk fails, you ae behind, however you are not completely dead. Sadly, it's more like your opponent takes a small risk, and if it works, you could possibly fucking die in SC2. It's really sad actually and I don't blame idra for missing BW a lot.

I have seen him do fast pool builds, but his mentality has been consistent: drone up to manage his own economy. What he should try to do is damage the opponents economy. It is risky, but I think that is what defines the Zerg race as a whole- taking risks. - Do you even watch his games? He kills drones all the time. He loves doing ling runbys to get scouting and picking drones off. If you mean a full aggro build focused on killing drones, why? If you go an econ build and hold your opponents aggression, you are ahead. As people get better and better these aggro builds will stop working as much, and zenio is a korean zerg able to stop ling/bane fine.

Idra also needs to practice more. 3 hours vs at least 9 hours is a big gap he needs to overcome. Also his mentality is psyching himself out, that just makes everything more difficult.
IdrA has no way to practice. US internet, especially in shitty Arizona, lags to europe and korea. NA server has no real practice partners that he can gain anything from and ladder is pointless. Even if he gets in a house with the rest of EG, I don't know if he will improve much since he is the best on the team, he needs a korean ladder/house.


Are you hurting ESPORTS? Find out today - http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=232866
Coutcha
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada519 Posts
June 16 2011 17:51 GMT
#1167
Is this live for real??
This is what the world is for Making ELECTRICITY :D
TheResidentEvil
Profile Joined September 2010
United States991 Posts
June 16 2011 17:52 GMT
#1168
its recorded live but re-broadcasted.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
June 16 2011 17:56 GMT
#1169
DDE doing some great drops!
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Tofugrinder
Profile Joined September 2010
Austria899 Posts
June 16 2011 18:02 GMT
#1170
dde _really_ bad luck in his game 3 and mannered as he is he gg'd and wished his opponent good luck. What does idra do in a similiar situation? he just leaves without a gg. Good that he is out.
Also ofc nice to see the best player of this 4 to advance to the finals
Nerdslayer
Profile Joined April 2011
Denmark1130 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-16 18:24:36
June 16 2011 18:03 GMT
#1171
I really enjoy DDE playstyle he is very good I think he might be a contender soon for the best NA player if he keep up with this play

Some1 make the DDE fan club he is playing amasing
lisward
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Singapore959 Posts
June 16 2011 18:32 GMT
#1172
On June 16 2011 23:39 twndomn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 16 2011 18:46 Koshi wrote:
IdrA not making the top 16. Even though he told everybody NASL (and other "easy" money tournaments) was the reason he came back to NA for.
Incontrol not making the Play-offs but doing ok-ish in MLG.
Tyler not making anything.

It shatters my mind.


Your mind is not too knowledgeable about the SC2 pro scene then. In any tournaments that has Koreans in it, EG players would lose. Incontrol lost horribly when he played against Koreans in MLG, Idra eventually 2-4 lost to MC and 0-6 lost to Zenio, given history. They cannot defeat Koreans in do-or-die situation; common knowledge at this point.


That's the most ridiculous post I've ever read. The people that Idra beat to get to round of 8 in the GSL were Koreans. Furthermore, Thorzain had to be two GSL champions to win the TSL and Jinro had to go through mostly Korean opponents to be able to get to the round of 4, twice, in the GSL.

About why Idra lost, I have not gotten to watch the Zenio game, but from what I see in the forum posts, I see basically the same responses to every game Idra loses, which usually goes something like this, "The better player lost to a gimmick!" or ,"Idra is just a very bad player and you're just in denial."

I feel that winning is not just determined by how good a player is or how bad a player is, like how Idra wishes. Idra believe that games should go this way: I pit my strengths and against your strengths, and the stronger guy wins. But it's never really that clear cut, in my opinion it's a stupid way to play. The key to winning is using your strengths against your opponents weaknesses.
Opinions are like phasers -- everybody ought to have one
Sqq
Profile Joined August 2010
Norway2023 Posts
June 16 2011 18:35 GMT
#1173
Is IdrA out of the NASL ? I don't understand jackshit about this play off stuff
Dead girls don't say no.
rysecake
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2632 Posts
June 16 2011 18:36 GMT
#1174
On June 17 2011 03:35 Sqq wrote:
Is IdrA out of the NASL ? I don't understand jackshit about this play off stuff


Yes
The Notorious Winkles
Valikyr
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden2653 Posts
June 16 2011 18:37 GMT
#1175
They made the quality for the free stream worse? :/
nepeta
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
1872 Posts
June 16 2011 18:38 GMT
#1176
"very creative front pressure build" LOL

+ Show Spoiler +
moot comment, but lets stop the idra thing from eating another thread alive
Broodwar AI :) http://sscaitournament.com http://www.starcraftai.com/wiki/Main_Page
vende
Profile Joined April 2011
Russian Federation202 Posts
June 16 2011 18:39 GMT
#1177
rofl
nepeta
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
1872 Posts
June 16 2011 18:39 GMT
#1178
Oh yeah! For the swarm! ^^ Brilliant punishment of a bunker rush, gg ^^
Broodwar AI :) http://sscaitournament.com http://www.starcraftai.com/wiki/Main_Page
AsnSensation
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany24009 Posts
June 16 2011 18:39 GMT
#1179
stupid blunder by dde just a build a depot ffs
Bellygareth
Profile Joined October 2010
France512 Posts
June 16 2011 18:40 GMT
#1180
On June 17 2011 02:46 Smancer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 17 2011 02:16 Bellygareth wrote:
My analysis:
I think the article misunderstands the reflexion Idra has and why it exactly works. The fact that he is himself predictable is wrong (he does cheese from time to time), and is not a bad thing in itself.

The problem is that he doesn't account for "coinflips" or "bad strategy", and thus he loses.

The reflexion I think goes that way. "Hey he could go Muta and I would lose but if I account for him making mutas he'd lose without any hope". so making mutas in that situation would be bad for him right? So he probably won't make mutas. So as he won't be making mutas I don't have to account for mutas. Hell I won't even scout for it because it would be dumb for him to do it and if he doesn't do it and I scout I'm behind.

So in order to gain a small advantage (not scouting), he relies on his opponent to not do a "stupid" strat. Doing that he takes a huge risk. And loses stupidly.

He went too far into the "gain small advantages" philosophy imo.


I realize that English is not the first language of many people here on Team Liquid. I thought I would do my part and try to take this analysis and form better sentence structure.

I did this because I believe that Bellygareth really had a great point that many may not have comprehended because of his or her limited study of the English language.

This barrier is preventing other on TeamLiquid from becoming better Starcraft competitors.

Anyway, here it is:

I think the author of the article misunderstands Idra, and why Zenio claimed victory. The assertion that Idra is predictable is wrong. For example he does cheese from time to time.

Idra loses because he does not account for “coinflip” or “bad” strategies.

I think Idra’s thought process was as follows: “Zenio won’t make mutas, because if I prepare for mutas then he will lose. I will not scout because it is a bad choice to make mutas and if I scout I will fall behind”.

Idra is trying to gain an advantage by assuming Zenio will not attempt a risky strategy. Idra loses stupidly.




You can be my english-to-english private translator ♥
Prev 1 57 58 59 60 61 72 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
16:00
Warm Up Cup 5
uThermal640
SteadfastSC224
Liquipedia
Stormgate Nexus
14:00
Stormgate Launch Days
BeoMulf366
TKL 266
IndyStarCraft 263
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
uThermal 640
SteadfastSC 224
BRAT_OK 65
goblin 50
MindelVK 16
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 24522
Bisu 1526
Mini 589
ggaemo 189
Dewaltoss 138
sSak 114
Aegong 43
soO 25
Rock 20
scan(afreeca) 14
Stormgate
B2W.Neo456
BeoMulf366
TKL 266
IndyStarCraft 263
UpATreeSC108
JuggernautJason55
Dota 2
Gorgc6809
LuMiX1
League of Legends
Dendi1131
Reynor127
Counter-Strike
fl0m2889
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu264
XaKoH 83
Other Games
gofns7820
Beastyqt772
Grubby733
ceh9430
Hui .164
oskar90
Trikslyr59
QueenE41
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 23 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta20
• Reevou 4
• LUISG 3
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• 80smullet 6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• HerbMon 0
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2906
• WagamamaTV858
• masondota2760
League of Legends
• Nemesis4983
• Jankos1431
• TFBlade403
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur691
Other Games
• imaqtpie1550
Upcoming Events
DaveTesta Events
5h 35m
The PondCast
15h 35m
WardiTV Summer Champion…
16h 35m
Replay Cast
1d 5h
LiuLi Cup
1d 16h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 20h
RSL Revival
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
RotterdaM Event
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
HCC Europe
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
Thunderpick World Champ.
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.