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Aaaaaand thanks to the visualizer I just realized that I'm using Beta 6.3 and everybody here is using the Alpha 1.0s and now I feel dumb and left behind ><.
Anyway, I see several changes and since I'm still learning, I wonder if I should skip there too or just go on like I am, feels a little dumb to drop my previous training time out so I wanted to ask any Terran who has made the change how they felt about it.
On April 16 2013 14:51 fengshaun wrote:
Has anybody thought about using space as a key in theCore? It's huge and seems easy to press!
I'm toying with using it as my "next subgroup" key, then I can hit it with my palm (a.k.a. the joint between my palm and my pinkie)
On April 17 2013 14:56 slowbacontron wrote:
Hey Irghen! I'll do my best to help you with some of those.
*snip*
Thanks for your response man, I'm making do without the last alert key (which was just laziness, since I used it to go to my last research when I forgot what I had researching) and yeah, trying to memorize the cams like you pointed out.
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Regarding select all army:
On April 19 2013 23:02 JDub wrote:
You posted the link to Demuslim talking about how he uses it to gather his reinforcements without having to look away, right?
That was me actually.
On April 19 2013 23:15 CursedFeanor wrote:
I've tried it on backspace, but it was uncomfortable since it needed my whole hand to move from the home keys, slowing down my macro. I just recently switched it to a side mouse button and it's much better!
I've had it on enter personally, since I think it's best on the keyboard (so it doesn't interfere with mouse accuracy) and on your index/middle finger so you can hit J quickly. Other options I see as viable (at least with my keyboard and my hand) are F8 and F9- the stuff currently on those keys can be moved to F7/F10
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Irghen,
If you are somewhat used to TheCore now, switching to alpha 1.0 goes a lot faster than learning it initially. Since there are a lot of good changes I'd recommend switching. A couple rounds on the unit tester map should get you used to the main new keys.
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Show nested quote +On April 16 2013 14:51 fengshaun wrote:
Has anybody thought about using space as a key in theCore? It's huge and seems easy to press! I'm toying with using it as my "next subgroup" key, then I can hit it with my palm (a.k.a. the joint between my palm and my pinkie)
@fengshaun: I actually put the "Center Camera on Selection" on Space. Since I set all of my cameras at the beginning of the game before any bases are put down, there is no reason for my camera to center on selection and find that it's more of an annoyance than a benefit for Alt to serve that function. For the rare occasions that I need to center on selection, Space is actually a very easy and accessible key because I just have to flick my wrist to bump it with my palm. It's hard to miss in that scenario and works great for me. I definitely would not put anything critical on it though.
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@Ninjury_J
At what point do you add units to control groups? Don't you need to move between your marines and tanks after you stim and befpre you siege?
You do when you have stim and siege on one "primary ability" key. In my method, stim and siege are on two different keys, and that saves me many keystrokes both before and during the battle because I don't need to "move between" -- having whole army selected is sufficient to deploy both abilities in two key presses.
Tested - does not work - sorry
Are there any tactical benefits (besides getting access to their control keys) to having marines, tanks, mines in a different control groups?
For example: I tried using vikings to sneak up on colossus from behind, but it seems that the best timing and protection is when they are mixed in "the ball".
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Canada408 Posts
Wait, if tanks and marines are together, you can activate both abilities without tabbing?
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Yep. Have been using it since the beginning of SC2.
- no, I haven't
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It doesn't matter because you often want to be attacking different things with your marines and tanks.
WoL example- having tanks focus fire down banelings while you're moving and stutter stepping your marines vs mutas and zerglings. If you have them all in the same control group (or just box them all) you can not do this. Or against protoss you want your vikings to target fire each individual collosi down while the rest of your army is attacking other things. If you just have a big ball the best you can do is attack move behind the opposing army and your vikings won't focus fire.
Shompol's "method" is nothing more than poor mechanics and poor play.
And it isn't even true- I just tested it, with marines and Stim on I and siege mode on O (TheCore already has stim and siege on different keys, both in TRM and ZRM) I still need to tab between them.
So not only is it bad play, not only is what he claimed not true, it's not even "wrong" in The Core.
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@Borskey
Thank you for answering my question. I never considered channeling tank fire on banelings, would be interesting to find some replays to see how it works.
However, not using control groups was not what I suggested. The "method" was about using different keys for primary abilities of different units. Basically I can siege, stim, and arm mines in 3 keystrokes, and we are talking about efficiency here.
As for your test: I was using it with the standard key bindings, never tried with with theCore. I will try to play around with thecore tomorrow to see if it works, and what could be the reason if it does not.
- the above is a load of BS, please disregard
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I am using the ALPHA PRM Layout.
I put "Select All Army" on CTRL+MouseButtonNextSubgroup. This way I can still hold CTRL while adding the Units to my MainArmy Key.
"Show Last Alert" is on MouseMiddleButton. But I don't know if its in conflict with something there.
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On April 20 2013 15:27 Shompol wrote:
However, not using control groups was not what I suggested. The "method" was about using different keys for primary abilities of different units. Basically I can siege, stim, and arm mines in 3 keystrokes, and we are talking about efficiency here.
But you can't.
You still need to press tab. Whether you are using one big group or three different control groups it still takes 5 keystrokes. 6 if you count initially selecting your first group.
And your post was exactly about not using control groups. You said you just do nothing as you're producing, and when the enemy comes you box everything, seige, and stim. That's not using a control group.
On April 20 2013 15:27 Shompol wrote:
As for your test: I was using it with the standard key bindings, never tried with with theCore. I will try to play around with thecore tomorrow to see if it works, and what could be the reason if it does not.
It doesn't even work with standard. It never has.
My mind is absolutely boggled by your posts.
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Canada408 Posts
I must admit I am confused too. I understand why Medivaks and m/m share a command card, but why tanks? Sounds completely OP. By the way Borskey, "not even wrong" is one of my favourite sayings :p.
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On April 20 2013 08:11 Irghen wrote:Aaaaaand thanks to the visualizer I just realized that I'm using Beta 6.3 and everybody here is using the Alpha 1.0s and now I feel dumb and left behind ><. Anyway, I see several changes and since I'm still learning, I wonder if I should skip there too or just go on like I am, feels a little dumb to drop my previous training time out so I wanted to ask any Terran who has made the change how they felt about it. Show nested quote +On April 16 2013 14:51 fengshaun wrote:
Has anybody thought about using space as a key in theCore? It's huge and seems easy to press! I'm toying with using it as my "next subgroup" key, then I can hit it with my palm (a.k.a. the joint between my palm and my pinkie) Show nested quote +On April 17 2013 14:56 slowbacontron wrote:
Hey Irghen! I'll do my best to help you with some of those.
*snip* Thanks for your response man, I'm making do without the last alert key (which was just laziness, since I used it to go to my last research when I forgot what I had researching) and yeah, trying to memorize the cams like you pointed out.
Basically, I had been using the core fairly heavily for a week or two when we were given a lookahead on 1.0. I switched immediately, because:
1) 1.0 is better
2) It's never going to be easier to switch than right now.
3) That previous training time that you're going to waste is only going to get bigger. The only way to don't waste it all is to stay on 0.6.3 forever.
Hotkey trainer is your friend, btw.
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On April 20 2013 09:01 Borskey wrote:Regarding select all army: Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 23:02 JDub wrote:
You posted the link to Demuslim talking about how he uses it to gather his reinforcements without having to look away, right? That was me actually. Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 23:15 CursedFeanor wrote:
I've tried it on backspace, but it was uncomfortable since it needed my whole hand to move from the home keys, slowing down my macro. I just recently switched it to a side mouse button and it's much better!
I've had it on enter personally, since I think it's best on the keyboard (so it doesn't interfere with mouse accuracy) and on your index/middle finger so you can hit J quickly. Other options I see as viable (at least with my keyboard and my hand) are F8 and F9- the stuff currently on those keys can be moved to F7/F10
So what's your opinion of select-all-army? My concern has always been that you accidentally grab things you don't want to move. E.g. drops, harass, scouts. I also have this *feeling* that it develops bad habits, but I honestly haven't thought about it too deeply or put it to the test.
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On April 20 2013 14:02 Shompol wrote:@Ninjury_J Show nested quote +At what point do you add units to control groups? Don't you need to move between your marines and tanks after you stim and befpre you siege? You do when you have stim and siege on one "primary ability" key. In my method, stim and siege are on two different keys, and that saves me many keystrokes both before and during the battle because I don't need to "move between" -- having whole army selected is sufficient to deploy both abilities in two key presses. Are there any tactical benefits (besides getting access to their control keys) to having marines, tanks, mines in a different control groups? For example: I tried using vikings to sneak up on colossus from behind, but it seems that the best timing and protection is when they are mixed in "the ball".
Personally disagree on the vikings not being separate. I've seen good flanks be absolutely devastating, where I'm chewing through colossus before the stalkers can really engage. And its very common to see the pros dancing their vikings and stalkers separately to snipe and get better position.
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On April 20 2013 15:33 Becuula wrote:
I am using the ALPHA PRM Layout.
I put "Select All Army" on CTRL+MouseButtonNextSubgroup. This way I can still hold CTRL while adding the Units to my MainArmy Key.
"Show Last Alert" is on MouseMiddleButton. But I don't know if its in conflict with something there.
Interesting. So basically, you're *just* using select-all as a method for adding to control groups?
Could you walk me through the steps you'd use to update your control groups if you had marines, ghosts, and viking waiting to be added? (I'm assuming they each have their own CG).
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@Borskey
@Ninjury_J
Just tested on standard -- sorry for making ridiculous claims. I can stim marines when all army is selected because they are the first subgroup, I can stim marauders because the command is enabled for marines, but I cannot siege tanks. I assumed that I can because marauders get magically stimmed without being selected.
I will put a disclaimer in my previous posts so as not to confuse more people...
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When I download the Alpha 1.0 ZRM sc2hotkeys file from github, none of the keys are bound. 
This led to some very panicky moments ingame when I was completely unable to select units or builds or even chat. haha
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Canada408 Posts
Hmmm what keyboard do you use?
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EPT
