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Keep our forum clean! PLEASE post your WIP melee maps in this thread for initial feedback. -Barrin |
Brazil71 Posts
Leaving my previous map on hold untill I solve the cliff problem (working on flashlight idea)
Another standard map. Bases are like in Ohana but the low ground canion will give some horizontal mobility while being shot by high ground units (trade-off). The rocks at natural are weak spots that makes the base bit less safe againts rushes, but once secure will lead to a close fourth. For now i'm blocking buildings on the water to make it a realy neutral ground (no pilons/walls) but have to see how this affect creep spread, maybe leave 1x1 spaces for tumors.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/8WA6Lfh.png)
Map will end up split but since the terrain won't allow MM to stim and snipe tanks, locusts will be choked at the ramps etc...won't be easy to cross to enemy's side, and this may force more harass, air units, multipronged attacks on the edges of the canyon (has larger ramps), smart usage of the river mobility.
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This map is truly amazing.
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@ConCentrate405: I like the idea with the river canyon but as it stands the third is quite far. Not too far, but maybe move it in just a bit closer to the natural. Also, the fact that almost the whole map is on one cliff level (except for the river itself, fourth and main) is a bit boring. Just my opinion there.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/i8HOPvD.png)
This is obviously extremely WIP, but I thought that I should get feedback on some stuff (the possible difficulty of getting a fourth especially) before proceeding.
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@ConCentrate405: I have the same concerns that Coppermantis has, that third at the corner looks really far away and exposed and that could be a problem, other mapmakers have been exploring the idea of farther third bases but easier to defend (like having the third behind a thigh ramp in a highground) and i feel you could do that for this map, add a two stacked huge vertical destructible rocks and block the edges with doodads like this:
Corner thirds
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/va2EbN6.jpg)
The "other" posible thirds
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Qvn4g6N.jpg)
Also i see many vertical ramps around, i would also recommend you to change those for diagonal ones because those are less weird looking and more easily to spot, as for the height tool, that's not a tool i recommend to use in the pathable areas of the map or in areas that are in contact with the pathable areas because you need to make a distinction from where the units can pass and from where they can't and that distinction is normally done with doodads, and using the doodads in such a fashion it's a very hard task if you don't know exactly what are you doing, the general theme of your map and how those doodads will fit your theme, but if you feel that you can make it work, i tell you to go for it!
@Coppermantis: The map looks good other than the over exposed third, but i feel that since the army positioning fits the flow of that third it is not that worrisome of a thing, as for the fourth the player that takes his fourth first will force to take his opponents middle base as a forth base and that breaks the flow of the expansions and army. The center of the map is seems to be extremely chokey and that could be very problematic, it has it's advantages tho, the many counter attack paths makes it quite nicely for run-bys and stuff but for armies...
These (in white) are the areas that worry me:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/DWxqFAb.jpg)
The place that worries me the most is the ramp between what would be the forth and third of the red player, because if green gets a army there red is as good as dead if he tries to attack there (and i'm talking for any race here).
Also, have you decide what will you do for the top right side of the map? you have a lot of unused space there, and if you decide to leave it you could do a beautiful city there :3
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Maybe a couple of islands?
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ConCentrate405, I would focus on getting my proportions exactly right with that map before doing anything else. Right now it is very open and kind of big for a 10 base map. Also the fact that the enemy 4th is closer to my 3rd than my own 4th could potentially be problematic. That said, I really like this concept and the river and most of the terrain features you are working with are 100% workable. I also have a map with highground borders, I think it adds a nice touch and creates a different, more claustrophobic feeling to it - which is actually a nice contrast to the open terrain.
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On November 13 2013 06:17 TheFish7 wrote:
ConCentrate405, I would focus on getting my proportions exactly right with that map before doing anything else. Right now it is very open and kind of big for a 10 base map. Also the fact that the enemy 4th is closer to my 3rd than my own 4th could potentially be problematic. That said, I really like this concept and the river and most of the terrain features you are working with are 100% workable. I also have a map with highground borders, I think it adds a nice touch and creates a different, more claustrophobic feeling to it - which is actually a nice contrast to the open terrain.
Agree with this. ^^
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I have no idea what I am doing anymore.
+ Show Spoiler [map A] +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ryjX7Xq.jpg) dimensions: 144x136 n2n:horizontal = 51s horizontal w/o rocks = 42s vertical = 50s cross = 59s The ramps into the highground between the horizontal spawns ar blocked by a single rock and can be blocked with two collapsible towers (the two towers are collapsible independently) highground pods near mains will be unpathable. Inspired by old style 4 player maps (mostly BW Lost Temple and Kulas Ravine), small and compressed overall. 'third' is a true half base and is in the open but is right outside of the nat. horizontal or vertical spawns unplayable?
+ Show Spoiler [map B] +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wPttXVk.jpg) dimensions: 136x128 n2n: 44s The frontdoor nat is a true half base (4m1g). Backdoor nat is blocked by rocks, a bit like Kulas Ravine crossed with Bifrost. Overall low resources. highground pods will be unpathable.
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Your maps don't feel natural, don't restrict yourself into a cube shape unless it is beneficial to the map.
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I dunno, I kind of like the look of the first one. Aesthetically, at least.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/UOTDyOO.png)
Airspace lol
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Enjoy frozen acid water 
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/JZC1taH.png)
Seriously , i quite like it. Suggestions ?
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@copper, that looks really pretty now :D
@lezael, I like it too but you have too many bases scrunched together at 4/10 oclock. I would get rid of the outer lowground base, which still leaves 7 bases per player. 
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More experiments with open naturals. I rather like this one, any major dislikes before I start painting?
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zUuapD1.jpg)
Also, does anyone know how to kick the blue texture glitch off the temple walls doodads so they show up correctly in editor pictures?
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Brazil71 Posts
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@concentrate, I think you can get your S shaped river without making the map too big. Try moving around the other pieces more, like the lowground base which could be scooted towards the main cliff a lot more. I know this might tear apart the ridge design but the river is the more important map feature, you should build everything else around that.
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@concentrate You may want to check out some pictures of real rivers to get an idea of how to apply the textures/doodads for your theme, i usually go search some Speedpaint art in DeaviantArt to get some ideas now and then and you could do that for your next map's theme. So here's the Loa river in Chile that crosses the arid north of Chile, and some others river pics
@Eat you mean that the temple wall doodad textures are using the Shakuras theme instead of the bel'shir/aiur theme right? that's why you mean by blue?
Also when using open naturals try to keep distances short and with enough overlord pods around the principal attack path, that way the players (Z) can react against a push, but not with time enough to plant down some spine crawlers and be done with it, also, when a map has a open natural and a long distance the players (in non Zerg match ups) will tend to all in more for what i have seen because it is easier to snipe the natural of the other player and because of the false sense of security the distance gives the non all-ining player making him more greedy that he should be, meanwhile if the rush distance is shorter the players will be more defensive and scout each other more often making the game less revolved around all ins, or at least that's my experience i have gathered from my maps.
@Namrufus i like both! to hell with haters square maps ftw!
As for the first one i would make the half bases full bases and remove horizontal spawns, not because the may be too close but because the attack paths are too linear for my taste, and reduce that area behind the LoS blockers a bit, other than that the map is fine by me.
In the second one...
+ Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/lv8LUo0.jpg) Open this image and yours and swap the tabs between them so you can see the changes more easily, also separate the Main base from that third (?) base with a lowground with some doodads on it, that way blink stalker all ins won't be so strong
@IeZaeL I'm extremely worried about that backdoor because the defender has to walk a bigger distance than the attacker to hold off all ins, so if you want to keep that layout i would add like other two rocks stacked one over another, and even tho i'm not sure that it would work because when the attacker destroys the rocks that could be a trick and he could attack the undefended natural instead, so i'm not sure how that would work out for the map, also you have quite a bit of the main base exposed to blink stalkers and that could be a problem too, as for the rest of the layout, i quite like it, i love complex terrain, i feel it makes the smart players shine, but i would change the center of the map, the attack path is just too linear for my taste (same as Namrufus map), other thing about the map could be to add a set of huge diagonal rocks that touch the edge of the map like this but even tho that base doesn't quite fit the army positioning for a forth base (when taking that base the army would be placed between the third base and that 3x ramp instead of the outer region between the fourth and the third, so that worries me a little too, as for the rest of the map, i feel the concentration of bases at 4/10 is just fine, and nothing that should trouble you all that much.
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You should watch out for straight edges in the cliffs and a lot more doodads! Also the attack paths are too linear and too few so i would add a ramp more around the 6 and 12 or around that area (other than the one that's already there)
Here are some of the changes i would do to the map
+ Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xay2rZG.jpg) I forgot to tell you to move the main minerals & gas a bit closer to the ramp because it looks a bit too long a distance (which affects ZvX and the way zerg holds off early all ins quite a bit)
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How do you feel about this one?
I wanted to make an interresting middle with close mains that forces movement out to the sides. The shortest path is for small units only. It is also an attempt to create an interesting nat-third layout. The gold base may split the map horizontal early in the game, but vertical in late game. The tower may belong to one player early game and helps detect incoming air, but is conquered by the oponent in a vertical split.
The half base becomes valid in the middle because of the indirect paths across. It also ensures the gold base comes into play in late game.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/uQRJ6fa.jpg)
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Changed a bit layout and started working on textures.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Jp09h9p.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/n6N8VtS.png)
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3vwTECY.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/JIGYJnH.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wd7BYX4.png)
I know there are horizontal ramps and they are bad but no one gonna wall off them 
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/4NGABEM.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CJSYY33.png)
