EPTOn July 14 2012 18:23 Roblin wrote:
PM from kabel:
if there are "..." in the text below then it means I edited out something from his messages because said text is not directly related to the question asked and/or the problem presented. PMs are after all private messages told to me and for that reason I will not share his words with others unless I have reason to do so.
however, I will share any and all analysis, suggestions and opinions which I end up doing, saying or having, for that reason I will also present the question. which may or may not come in the form of a PM.
+ Show Spoiler +
Original Message From Kabel:
...
I think there are three "dimensions" for a unit, ability or mechanic. A unit/spell need to work in all three of these areas in order to work in the game.
1. The theoretical aspect: In what general area will the unit/spell provide something? Will it effect the economy, area control, defence, harassment capabilities or other areas. That is to determine what the unit INTENDS to do, in a broader way. After all, you can´t have a Battle cruiser to heal your enemies, no matter how a player uses it or wishes that it did. Its not its purpose and has no methods of doing that.
2. The practical aspect: Making the unit/ability able to do its purpose as well/easy as possible. Take the Siege tank as an example. Its designed to be a siege unit. You can siege the enemy, you can defend. It controls an area. Imagine if it did not have an auto-attack. It would still be an area control unit and work as its theroetical suppose to do. But to manage the unit would be annoying, probably in such a way that it disturbs the gameplay.
(An example of this is Breed. In the later versions, you could lay the eggs where you wanted. It worked in theory: spawning units where you want, imagine all nice things players can do! But the execution of the spell was so annoying. You could not select eggs via hatcheries and lots of players got frustrated of eggs lying everywhere. Thats why I axed it cause I could not solve it.)
3. Balance: When a unit/spell works in theory and can be used in a practical way, its time to make the spell/unit fit in the game. It must limit itself to follow the game rules and it exists in relativity to all other spells/units. A spell that deals 1 damage is great if all other spells deals 0 damage.
Theoretical purpose, practical execution, balance.. Thats the golden line I aim for..
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So.. with this being said, I´ve stumbled upon a couple of problems.
The first one is a problem, but I think I can manage to find a solution to it. I tell you anyways cause you might have a good idea about it. The Hellfire missiles.
In the daily replay, you can see an example of it. In theory, your fast moving jet fighters carries only 2 rockets which you can use. The purpose is not to use them in the combat, since they are so slow, but rather BEFORE combat, where you seek the enemy, launches the barrage to soften their armies. Then you attack. The opponent has to respond properly to the missiles to minimize the damages. It creates a nice dance of APM and a nice scenario.
The problem lies in number 2, the practical aspect. It doesn´t matter how much damage it does, or the splash radius or anything. The problem is that 10 wraiths can launch 10 missiles at a close distance to the enemy, This creates a scenario where neither player can control what happens. The wraith player spams the spell, the opponent has no chance to react to such a number of missiles. I need to find a solution to that. Probably:
- Make wraiths more vulnerable. You can´t be close the enemy units and launch the missiles since your Wraiths dies of a few shots.
- Make the missile accelerate slower, which gives more time to the enemy to react.
- Add a minum range, which means that you can´t be to close to the target and launch the missile.
If I can´t improve the spell in this area, I will have to scrap it. Or move it to the Science Vessel as a more deadly spell.
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The real problem: Tremor.
A while ago, I fell in love with the animation when a nydus pops out of the ground. It looks so dramatic and Zergesque! Making it spawn units seemed like an interesting idea, since in theory that makes an area dangerous. Plus you can use it as a siege weapon, if you rally your free units to the front door. The problem is that Tremor falls on aspect number 1, the theoretical thing: It adds nothing to the game that isn´t already there.
Look at Zergs lair tech options:
- Baneling speed upg, they get a charge unit that dominates on open field and can bash the front door.
- Mutalisks, one of the best harassment and map control units in the game.
- Lurker, both defencive and siege unit that controls area excellent.
- Infestors... neural parasite as main spell (can be used while burrowed) which is good for sniping enemy key units; vessels, tanks, warp prism, archons, reavers.. Plague is good because it can weaken the enemy army a lot before combat, thus changing the position in the game.
Tremor.. It acts as a siege weapon AND an area control unit. You can onlý use that spell occasionally. In theory, it adds nothing to the game that the lurker already does. (or even the Brood lord!)
When I play as Zerg I never get infestors. Only if I am far ahead and wants to use Tremor to overwhelm bases. The Infestor gives me no map control, it doesn´t stop the enemy army or it does not prevent them from expanding. The spell does nothing that the lurker, mutalisk, baneling, brood lord does better.
I know you have written suggestions on this matter a day ago in the thread, and they are nice ideas. The problem is that in theory they still does the same thing as the lurker; control area, or siege : /
The only thing unique about Infestors are that they are sneaky.. Neural parasite on a burrowed infestor can mess up the enemy key units, and if an Infestor gets a plague of on the enemy, they are in trouble..
So I think Tremor needs a major rework or be replaced of something else. And that is the problem.
What can the Infestor do that no other zerg unit does?
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Lastly: The Science Vessel.
I can´t have both Irradiate and Hellfire in the game. I would prefer Hellfire because that Irradiate lacks in the practical aspect (number 2 if you remember ^^) . The Irradiate cloud is so messy that it is hard to distinguish on which unit its attached to. The missile is more distinct and funnier to play with/against and observe.
A possible scenario on Science Vessel can be:
- Area control spell (PDD or something similar. Reduces melee attacks, range, all attacks, speed?)
- A spell that drains energy and makes units unable to use abilities for 30 seconds. (EMP)
- ???
(Perhaps move Hellfire missile here. But I would prefer that the Science Vessel was not a damage unit, only a strong supportive unit. Like the Swarm Guardian with Dark swarm is for Zerg.)
If you have a suggestion for a thid fitting spell (or for all spells) for the Science vessel, I would be happy. Or rather, you don´t need to come up with a complete spell, but if you can figure out an area where Terran lacks, that can be a possible start for a spell. Don´t worry if the spell can be made or not. We need to find the area where Terran needs a spell, from that point we can try to solve the practical issues.
Summarize my questions:
1. Hellfire is probably a problem. Not even a real question. : /
2. What can the Infestor do with its second spell that makes it do something Zerg can´t do otherwise?
3. In what area does Terran lack so much that a third spell for the Science Vessel can fix that?
Bonus question ^^ : What area should PDD cover that would benefit Terran most and make the spell better and more interesting? Stop ranged attacks, melee, speed or something else?
...
...
I think there are three "dimensions" for a unit, ability or mechanic. A unit/spell need to work in all three of these areas in order to work in the game.
1. The theoretical aspect: In what general area will the unit/spell provide something? Will it effect the economy, area control, defence, harassment capabilities or other areas. That is to determine what the unit INTENDS to do, in a broader way. After all, you can´t have a Battle cruiser to heal your enemies, no matter how a player uses it or wishes that it did. Its not its purpose and has no methods of doing that.
2. The practical aspect: Making the unit/ability able to do its purpose as well/easy as possible. Take the Siege tank as an example. Its designed to be a siege unit. You can siege the enemy, you can defend. It controls an area. Imagine if it did not have an auto-attack. It would still be an area control unit and work as its theroetical suppose to do. But to manage the unit would be annoying, probably in such a way that it disturbs the gameplay.
(An example of this is Breed. In the later versions, you could lay the eggs where you wanted. It worked in theory: spawning units where you want, imagine all nice things players can do! But the execution of the spell was so annoying. You could not select eggs via hatcheries and lots of players got frustrated of eggs lying everywhere. Thats why I axed it cause I could not solve it.)
3. Balance: When a unit/spell works in theory and can be used in a practical way, its time to make the spell/unit fit in the game. It must limit itself to follow the game rules and it exists in relativity to all other spells/units. A spell that deals 1 damage is great if all other spells deals 0 damage.
Theoretical purpose, practical execution, balance.. Thats the golden line I aim for..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So.. with this being said, I´ve stumbled upon a couple of problems.
The first one is a problem, but I think I can manage to find a solution to it. I tell you anyways cause you might have a good idea about it. The Hellfire missiles.
In the daily replay, you can see an example of it. In theory, your fast moving jet fighters carries only 2 rockets which you can use. The purpose is not to use them in the combat, since they are so slow, but rather BEFORE combat, where you seek the enemy, launches the barrage to soften their armies. Then you attack. The opponent has to respond properly to the missiles to minimize the damages. It creates a nice dance of APM and a nice scenario.
The problem lies in number 2, the practical aspect. It doesn´t matter how much damage it does, or the splash radius or anything. The problem is that 10 wraiths can launch 10 missiles at a close distance to the enemy, This creates a scenario where neither player can control what happens. The wraith player spams the spell, the opponent has no chance to react to such a number of missiles. I need to find a solution to that. Probably:
- Make wraiths more vulnerable. You can´t be close the enemy units and launch the missiles since your Wraiths dies of a few shots.
- Make the missile accelerate slower, which gives more time to the enemy to react.
- Add a minum range, which means that you can´t be to close to the target and launch the missile.
If I can´t improve the spell in this area, I will have to scrap it. Or move it to the Science Vessel as a more deadly spell.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The real problem: Tremor.
A while ago, I fell in love with the animation when a nydus pops out of the ground. It looks so dramatic and Zergesque! Making it spawn units seemed like an interesting idea, since in theory that makes an area dangerous. Plus you can use it as a siege weapon, if you rally your free units to the front door. The problem is that Tremor falls on aspect number 1, the theoretical thing: It adds nothing to the game that isn´t already there.
Look at Zergs lair tech options:
- Baneling speed upg, they get a charge unit that dominates on open field and can bash the front door.
- Mutalisks, one of the best harassment and map control units in the game.
- Lurker, both defencive and siege unit that controls area excellent.
- Infestors... neural parasite as main spell (can be used while burrowed) which is good for sniping enemy key units; vessels, tanks, warp prism, archons, reavers.. Plague is good because it can weaken the enemy army a lot before combat, thus changing the position in the game.
Tremor.. It acts as a siege weapon AND an area control unit. You can onlý use that spell occasionally. In theory, it adds nothing to the game that the lurker already does. (or even the Brood lord!)
When I play as Zerg I never get infestors. Only if I am far ahead and wants to use Tremor to overwhelm bases. The Infestor gives me no map control, it doesn´t stop the enemy army or it does not prevent them from expanding. The spell does nothing that the lurker, mutalisk, baneling, brood lord does better.
I know you have written suggestions on this matter a day ago in the thread, and they are nice ideas. The problem is that in theory they still does the same thing as the lurker; control area, or siege : /
The only thing unique about Infestors are that they are sneaky.. Neural parasite on a burrowed infestor can mess up the enemy key units, and if an Infestor gets a plague of on the enemy, they are in trouble..
So I think Tremor needs a major rework or be replaced of something else. And that is the problem.
What can the Infestor do that no other zerg unit does?
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Lastly: The Science Vessel.
I can´t have both Irradiate and Hellfire in the game. I would prefer Hellfire because that Irradiate lacks in the practical aspect (number 2 if you remember ^^) . The Irradiate cloud is so messy that it is hard to distinguish on which unit its attached to. The missile is more distinct and funnier to play with/against and observe.
A possible scenario on Science Vessel can be:
- Area control spell (PDD or something similar. Reduces melee attacks, range, all attacks, speed?)
- A spell that drains energy and makes units unable to use abilities for 30 seconds. (EMP)
- ???
(Perhaps move Hellfire missile here. But I would prefer that the Science Vessel was not a damage unit, only a strong supportive unit. Like the Swarm Guardian with Dark swarm is for Zerg.)
If you have a suggestion for a thid fitting spell (or for all spells) for the Science vessel, I would be happy. Or rather, you don´t need to come up with a complete spell, but if you can figure out an area where Terran lacks, that can be a possible start for a spell. Don´t worry if the spell can be made or not. We need to find the area where Terran needs a spell, from that point we can try to solve the practical issues.
Summarize my questions:
1. Hellfire is probably a problem. Not even a real question. : /
2. What can the Infestor do with its second spell that makes it do something Zerg can´t do otherwise?
3. In what area does Terran lack so much that a third spell for the Science Vessel can fix that?
Bonus question ^^ : What area should PDD cover that would benefit Terran most and make the spell better and more interesting? Stop ranged attacks, melee, speed or something else?
...
another PM from kabel
+ Show Spoiler +
Original Message From Kabel:
...
I wonder if you can analyze the overall roles of the races, and see if the spell casters can fit to do something the race can´t do overall. (Supposed that it is something the race should be able to do)
Spellcasters are generally late tech now. Getting a caster over a bunch of combat units gotta be worth it. If you invest to get access to the spells, it has to provide you with something. I want the presence of even one Swarm Guardian, Dark Archon, Arbiter, Science Vessel to be feared by the enemy.
This is how the current spellcasters probably will look like: (According to the theoretical aspect of what fits and not and after I read your brilliant post of what areas of spells the races are lacking)
Protoss
High Templar - Force field (area control, stop spell), Psi storm (damage) and Hallucination in SC2. (pre-combat, information spell) The units summoned can´t be distinguished from normal units, thus making them able to trick the opponent plus tank damage.
Arbiter - Cloaking field, Vortex (stop-spell, area control) and "Psi shield", which creates that visual shield I showed you. (protective, area control) haven´t decided its actual balance yet, how it protects etc.
Dark Archon - Feedback (snipe spell) probably make it stronger so it kills any unit with energy.
The other two I haven´t figured out something fitting.
Zerg:
Infestor - Neural parasite (snipe), Plague (pre-combat, damage) and one more...
Swarm Guardian - Dark Swarm (protection, area control), Ensnare (stop spell), I will probably make it similar to BW, but give it a missile that needs to hit the enemy in order to ensnare them. (I like when those mini-games within the game are created, where the enemy needs to react.)
Terran:
Medic - Heal (protection) and some kind of D-matrix (also protection, but can be used on any unit). (The medic only has 1. Just as Spider mines and Wraiths have 3 mines and 2 missiles.)
The spell can be used with good micro to shield one marine vs many banelings, cannons, a reaver shot, spider mine, spine crawler, lurkers etc. Protect one of your tanks, or your dropship being hit by scourges. The enemy can always choose to not attack it, thus it creates this small micro scenario where they don´t want to waste firepower on the shield. Plus that the Terran do not want to waste the shield when its not necessary.
The only problem is that it is easy to make Ghosts invulnerable, so I will probably add so the unit only takes 75% of the damage or something. Or a minimum of 5 damage per shot..
The reason I will probably try adding the medic again is because that Terran lacks the ability of early pressure. Plus that Marines + Medics are a standing force, thus providing more map control to the Terran. (Marines + medivacs are rather a moveable force)
Neither Protoss or Zerg fears the Terran early. Zerg has so many ways to nullify early marine pressure; zerglings, banelings, queens and moveable spine crawlers. Protoss Stalkers are better now than in SC2. Plus that the Marauder does not add anything unique to the Terran race. Having only 3 infantery units feels like SC1 without expansion.. T_T
Ghost - Snipe, (snipe biological unit), Lockdown (snipe mechanical unit), Nuke (pre-combat damage)
Wraith - Hellfire missile, (splash damage, snipe?)
Science Vessel - PDD (area control), EMP (pre-combat? stop spell?) and 1 more... (I would like to add some kind of movement spell, since you said that is lacking for Terran.. Recall would be nice, but weird since it is so assoicated with Protoss : / )
I found a nice model in the editor that can be attached to the PDD. It adds a large red border around the PDD, thus showing the range of the area to all players. I am considering make the area have a significantly stronger impact on the game.. No enemy units inside the area can attack.. It is easy to see where that border is.. Cast it on your tanks to protect vs melee units.. cast on the enemy tanks.. or in the protoss choke point to prevent them from having a good angle of attacking... Or on the burrowed lurkers etc..
Summarize:
- Dark Archon needs 1 or 2 spells, (Preferably strong since they are expensive late game units)
- Infestor needs 1 more important spell that does something Zerg can´t do with other units.
- Science Vessel needs 1 more spell (the easy solution is to just give it Hunter seeker again)
Whats your thoughts of this potential line-up of spells I am suggesting? Anything seems weird or wrong?
...
I wonder if you can analyze the overall roles of the races, and see if the spell casters can fit to do something the race can´t do overall. (Supposed that it is something the race should be able to do)
Spellcasters are generally late tech now. Getting a caster over a bunch of combat units gotta be worth it. If you invest to get access to the spells, it has to provide you with something. I want the presence of even one Swarm Guardian, Dark Archon, Arbiter, Science Vessel to be feared by the enemy.
This is how the current spellcasters probably will look like: (According to the theoretical aspect of what fits and not and after I read your brilliant post of what areas of spells the races are lacking)
Protoss
High Templar - Force field (area control, stop spell), Psi storm (damage) and Hallucination in SC2. (pre-combat, information spell) The units summoned can´t be distinguished from normal units, thus making them able to trick the opponent plus tank damage.
Arbiter - Cloaking field, Vortex (stop-spell, area control) and "Psi shield", which creates that visual shield I showed you. (protective, area control) haven´t decided its actual balance yet, how it protects etc.
Dark Archon - Feedback (snipe spell) probably make it stronger so it kills any unit with energy.
The other two I haven´t figured out something fitting.
Zerg:
Infestor - Neural parasite (snipe), Plague (pre-combat, damage) and one more...
Swarm Guardian - Dark Swarm (protection, area control), Ensnare (stop spell), I will probably make it similar to BW, but give it a missile that needs to hit the enemy in order to ensnare them. (I like when those mini-games within the game are created, where the enemy needs to react.)
Terran:
Medic - Heal (protection) and some kind of D-matrix (also protection, but can be used on any unit). (The medic only has 1. Just as Spider mines and Wraiths have 3 mines and 2 missiles.)
The spell can be used with good micro to shield one marine vs many banelings, cannons, a reaver shot, spider mine, spine crawler, lurkers etc. Protect one of your tanks, or your dropship being hit by scourges. The enemy can always choose to not attack it, thus it creates this small micro scenario where they don´t want to waste firepower on the shield. Plus that the Terran do not want to waste the shield when its not necessary.
The only problem is that it is easy to make Ghosts invulnerable, so I will probably add so the unit only takes 75% of the damage or something. Or a minimum of 5 damage per shot..
The reason I will probably try adding the medic again is because that Terran lacks the ability of early pressure. Plus that Marines + Medics are a standing force, thus providing more map control to the Terran. (Marines + medivacs are rather a moveable force)
Neither Protoss or Zerg fears the Terran early. Zerg has so many ways to nullify early marine pressure; zerglings, banelings, queens and moveable spine crawlers. Protoss Stalkers are better now than in SC2. Plus that the Marauder does not add anything unique to the Terran race. Having only 3 infantery units feels like SC1 without expansion.. T_T
Ghost - Snipe, (snipe biological unit), Lockdown (snipe mechanical unit), Nuke (pre-combat damage)
Wraith - Hellfire missile, (splash damage, snipe?)
Science Vessel - PDD (area control), EMP (pre-combat? stop spell?) and 1 more... (I would like to add some kind of movement spell, since you said that is lacking for Terran.. Recall would be nice, but weird since it is so assoicated with Protoss : / )
I found a nice model in the editor that can be attached to the PDD. It adds a large red border around the PDD, thus showing the range of the area to all players. I am considering make the area have a significantly stronger impact on the game.. No enemy units inside the area can attack.. It is easy to see where that border is.. Cast it on your tanks to protect vs melee units.. cast on the enemy tanks.. or in the protoss choke point to prevent them from having a good angle of attacking... Or on the burrowed lurkers etc..
Summarize:
- Dark Archon needs 1 or 2 spells, (Preferably strong since they are expensive late game units)
- Infestor needs 1 more important spell that does something Zerg can´t do with other units.
- Science Vessel needs 1 more spell (the easy solution is to just give it Hunter seeker again)
Whats your thoughts of this potential line-up of spells I am suggesting? Anything seems weird or wrong?
well, to start off: the two posts presents a number of questions, some of which overlap, so if there is some question that does not feel addressed then that is because I deem it indirectly addressed by some other question that I answered.
theoretical, execution and balance aspect
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I agree with the theoretical and execution aspect.
a spell should have a reason to be in the game, however, it is my belief that many spells that seem useless and/or redundant will often find their way into the game regardless. a good example of this is the vortex in SC2, in early development it did not really have a purpose. it was underused, bad at controlling territory and failed in splitting the enemy army in half because the enemy just marched all of his army in there instead of leaving one half outside.
much later protoss discovered that archon/zealot is an amazingly powerful force but it has the problem of being unable to reach the enemy. as it turns out, vortex solved that problem nicely (the clumping of the enemy army was a bonus), which gave the modern use of archon-toilet (it was not the first use though, at first it was called the colossus toilet, but that was so op it was nerfed)
the execution aspect is the basis of design put in other words, a different way of saying it is ease of use.
and indeed, if something is too annoying to use, then noone will use it even if it is amazing. for example, lets say the below spell exists:
COMBINE!
use neural parasite to take control of 1 of every kind of units the enemy can build, then select each such unit you mindcontrolled as well as 5 spellcasters of your own. if all of these selected units have less than 50 energy you can use COMBINE! the selected units dies, for the rest of the game you have no supply cap, you have infinity resources and your units get a bonus +100 armor.
basicly: do something almost entirely impossible, become extremely OP.
noone would use it even if it is an I WIN button, why? because it requires you to force him to build every kind of unit, then take control of 10-15 different enemy units, make sure all of them are at low energy and then select your own units, all of this within the timeframe of the first neural parasite.
its too annoying to use.
so yes, I agree with the execution aspect, if something has a role, it must fulfill its role well and in a simple manner.
the balance aspect however is not something I will care much about right now, balance is a later stage and comes when the core principles and gameplay has been put down, until then some dummy numbers can be put in as a representation of "something that resembles the end balance".
fun fact: when starcraft BW first came out, psionic storm dealt 250 damage (1 storm killed a tank/lurker in half of its full duration) and dark templar dealt 110 damage per hit (because they were based off of zeratul in the campaign, you know, a hero unit).
a game does not need to be balanced upon release, thats a later issue.
for example, when blizz designed storm they probably didnt think "this is a spell that deals 250 damage" but rather "psionic storm deals a metric crapton of damage"
low caster count
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you mentioned that you want the presence of even a few spellcasters should shake fear into the enemy. I think the reason they don't today (possibly with the exception of swarm guardian) is because most spells stack with each other. there are very few "spells of supreme power" so to speak.
in other words, spells whose effect cannot be increased or decreased, some examples:
dark swarm: 1 dark swarm will not stack with other dark swarms, no matter what you do.
reaver: not really a spell, but... having 10 reavers really isnt much more efficient than having 2, so in a way reavers dont "stack" their power higher just because you have a ton of them.
plague: having more plagues doesn't do anything, everything is already down to 1 hp. 1 plague does the job just the same as 10 does.
ever seen an armada of BW arbiters? nope. why? because what do they do?
stasis field: 2 stasis fields will freeze his entire army anyway, do we need 5?
cloaking field: lets cloak while we cloak so we can cloak while we cloak. oh wait...
recall: 1 recall can bring 50ish supply of army, thus 3 should be the most you would ever want in any one place. (thus being able to recall 150 supply)
2 examples of non spells of supreme power
hellfire missile: do stack, 2 missiles are roughly twice as efficient as 1 missile. 10 missiles are roughly twice as efficient as 5.
tremor: 1 tremor have little effect, 4 tremors are tough to deal with, 10 tremors defeat armies by themselves.
see my point? if you want a spellcaster to be feared no matter how many there are, make them not stack with each other very well.
Hellfire missile
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Right now the hellfire missile is indeed a damage spell, but I am not entirely sure it is a pre-combat spell.
The reason why Im not sure about pre-combat is that technically speaking the hellfire missile is the most efficient when the enemy has the least amount of time/concentration to micro against it, and this happens to be during large scale combat.
Thus the hellfire missile is at its highest efficiency not before the battle, but during the battle.
The easiest way of making pre-combat spells have always been to make spells whos efficiency increases by how much time have went by since it was applied (this can also be used as an informal definition of pre-combat spell), prime examples of these are plague and irradiate, both of which deal damage over time. they dont get to deal much damage if used during combat, but if used before or away from combat they could be devestating.
but we already have DOT spells, it would only demonstrate poor imagination to make another one and besides, a DOT missile? art and story-wise it seems really weird.
but as you said, the issue right now is not really about when it is used, for some reason people tend to use it when both players can concentrate on it instead of when no player can concentrate on it, even if it is theoretically stronger in the second case.
the solutions you found would do nicely to discourage mass random missile spamming though, which was the problem you found, personally I would add a minimum launch distance.
Point Defense Drone
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so you want the PDD to be a spell of supreme power? easy.
do what you suggested, make it prohibit enemy attack in the area (completely), however, make it usable a little more often and make it last for a much shorter duration.
if it lasted for minutes like it does now then people would just mass them and build a PDD road to the enemy base (much like a creep highway, except way more powerful) however, if it still costs lots of energy then people might very well build 5-10 science vessels simply to be able to use the spell fairly often. to discourage massing science vessels I recommend making 1 science vessel able to use it more often, if having 2 science vessels lets you put 1 PDD down every major engagement then there is no reason to build 10 of them.
right now I'm in a little bit of a hurry (RL calls) so I will write more on the below cathegories this evening (about 10-12 hours from this post)
Dark Archon last spells
Infestor last spell
Science Vessel last spell
p.s. note that a game with only spells of supreme power will create quite weird gameplay where battles are mainly fought between casters and the rest is more or less just fodder. I recommend letting the dedicated casters have 1 or 2 spells of supreme power and some number of stacking spells, and letting auto-attacking units have only stacking spells.
this way spellcasters will be powerful, but won't take over the entire game.
Thanks for your reply Roblin. Looking forward to hear your thoughts regarding the spells for the Infestor, Dark Archon and Science Vessel.
On July 14 2012 06:49 Laertes wrote:
Gossen, when will you be online so I can show you what I've done?
Gossen, when will you be online so I can show you what I've done?
I´ve been busy for 2 days now with things in real life, but today I´ve probably be able to try it. PM me when you get online and hopefully I can come online today
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Ebbwf.jpg)
]Image[/url]
