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Nice article, I agree with everything except I think Leenock vs Jjakji was more significant as a whole. Great write up, great year and most importantly
THANK YOU TL WRITERS!!
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Here's hoping for more amazing MC ceremonies in 2012 :D
Thanks for the article TL!
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I love how all the Europeans are saying MOUZ OMFG, and all the everyone else is like idc, EG and TL are pretty sweet <3
Similarly, getting Koreans on your team is NOT selling out, its increasing the commercial value of your team by virtue of your team's subsequent ability to post more better results as well as increase foreign interest, both of which draw sponsors and lots moar of teh monais.
Not entirely dissimilarly, I agree with @Mattchew. If Day[9] is happy, so should we all. <3
TL, can't wait for more amazing content like this and another amazing year.
As my persian friend would say: kiss
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Awesome article - well done
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I agree with mostly everything except for Best Game of the Year. Although I still think MMA vs DRG was good, MMA vs. TOP game 1 was absolutely spectacular. I'd still give the best series played to MMA vs DRG though, hands down.
Great write-up guys!
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On January 03 2012 00:58 Muruburu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 01 2012 21:58 EGalex wrote:Folks, please don't bash the EG/TL tie for team of the year  . While I do think that a case could be made for EG edging out TL as the singular team of the year (even by just a hair), and while that may be my (admittedly biased) personal opinion, I don't think an objective argument can really be made for either side coming out noticeably on top. When you consider all aspects of what makes a team great, including player support, fan engagement, community presence, business development, and (of course) tournament results, the gap between EG and TL - if it exists at all - is just too minimal to warrant either team winning the award outright. Both EG and TL have our respective strengths and weaknesses, but overall, I don't think there are any international teams doing a better job of running their StarCraft divisions than EG and TL. And I want to both thank and applaud Victor, James, Ken, and everyone over at TL for a job very, very well done. I mean this very sincerely. This is not meant to take credit away from any of the other very high-level international teams, of course; it's just that, as far as StarCraft goes, I think EG and TL are at the forefront of international teams. I'm very happy to share both the rivalry and team of the year awards with TL. Speaking comfortably for Scott, Colin, Cody, and everyone over at EG, we have so much respect for what TL does for its players and the community, and we're very excited to move into 2012 with such an intense and storied rivalry intact. Watching DreamHack Winter was a very interesting experience for me. On the one hand, I obviously want EG to win every tournament we enter (especially that particular event, which was so well-produced and carried such prestige), and as such, I was *absolutely* heartbroken when HerO defeated PuMa in game seven to take the event. The loss haunted me for the better part of a week, causing many fingertips-to-the-forehead head shakes and long-inhale-short-exhale sighs. Yet, at the same time, I found the logical part of my brain continually saying, "This is good for the sport. Liquid was overdue for a big win." I think that this anecdote is aptly representative of the dilemma and conflict you constantly face as a team owner. On the one hand, you want the sport to grow and flourish, and you understand that in the big picture of things, in order for that to happen, it's necessary for multiple teams to do well, and for intense rivalries to develop. Yet at the same time, you genuinely want your players and your team to win every, single map they play, and if you're not doing everything it takes to win (within the rules), you're doing yourself, your players, and your fans an unacceptable disservice. Somehow, these two desires, while in theory rather mutually exclusive, in practice coexist in every team owner's mind on a daily basis. And so, while on the one hand I hope that an EG player wins every single tournament in 2012, on the other hand I know that it's good for the sport if Liquid (and other teams) get their share of victories as well. So, Victor, and everyone at TL, I truly wish all of you good luck going into the new year. Just, y'know, not too much luck, please . -Alex @ottersareneat on Twitter This post needs more love. Thanks for writing this up Alex!
You're welcome... although, I think you're the only one that read it ;].
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On January 03 2012 08:40 EGalex wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2012 00:58 Muruburu wrote:On January 01 2012 21:58 EGalex wrote:Folks, please don't bash the EG/TL tie for team of the year . While I do think that a case could be made for EG edging out TL as the singular team of the year (even by just a hair), and while that may be my (admittedly biased) personal opinion, I don't think an objective argument can really be made for either side coming out noticeably on top. When you consider all aspects of what makes a team great, including player support, fan engagement, community presence, business development, and (of course) tournament results, the gap between EG and TL - if it exists at all - is just too minimal to warrant either team winning the award outright. Both EG and TL have our respective strengths and weaknesses, but overall, I don't think there are any international teams doing a better job of running their StarCraft divisions than EG and TL. And I want to both thank and applaud Victor, James, Ken, and everyone over at TL for a job very, very well done. I mean this very sincerely. This is not meant to take credit away from any of the other very high-level international teams, of course; it's just that, as far as StarCraft goes, I think EG and TL are at the forefront of international teams. I'm very happy to share both the rivalry and team of the year awards with TL. Speaking comfortably for Scott, Colin, Cody, and everyone over at EG, we have so much respect for what TL does for its players and the community, and we're very excited to move into 2012 with such an intense and storied rivalry intact. Watching DreamHack Winter was a very interesting experience for me. On the one hand, I obviously want EG to win every tournament we enter (especially that particular event, which was so well-produced and carried such prestige), and as such, I was *absolutely* heartbroken when HerO defeated PuMa in game seven to take the event. The loss haunted me for the better part of a week, causing many fingertips-to-the-forehead head shakes and long-inhale-short-exhale sighs. Yet, at the same time, I found the logical part of my brain continually saying, "This is good for the sport. Liquid was overdue for a big win." I think that this anecdote is aptly representative of the dilemma and conflict you constantly face as a team owner. On the one hand, you want the sport to grow and flourish, and you understand that in the big picture of things, in order for that to happen, it's necessary for multiple teams to do well, and for intense rivalries to develop. Yet at the same time, you genuinely want your players and your team to win every, single map they play, and if you're not doing everything it takes to win (within the rules), you're doing yourself, your players, and your fans an unacceptable disservice. Somehow, these two desires, while in theory rather mutually exclusive, in practice coexist in every team owner's mind on a daily basis. And so, while on the one hand I hope that an EG player wins every single tournament in 2012, on the other hand I know that it's good for the sport if Liquid (and other teams) get their share of victories as well. So, Victor, and everyone at TL, I truly wish all of you good luck going into the new year. Just, y'know, not too much luck, please . -Alex @ottersareneat on Twitter This post needs more love. Thanks for writing this up Alex! You're welcome... although, I think you're the only one that read it ;].
Nono! I think many did, just, I don't think theres a lot to discuss, everything you said was on point. But yeah good post ^^
Also I think mouz dosnt participate in enough international tournaments for them to be considered team of the year. Team of the year should (imo) go to the team who has most wins, regardless of them being team wins or player wins, EG has most and the most prestigous imo wins so it's fair they get it, still like mouz moar tho :3
The funny thing tho is that it seems like Mouz players are the one refusing to go to the tournaments, judging from various interviews and articles I have read.
Sometimes I feel like mouz is being slightly underrated by a lot from other continents, but that's totally understandable as they don't have a very strong presence in said scenes, and it's not like I follow every NA scenes move, and there's a lot more to keep track of in the EU scene in general I think.
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Good write-up guys, well done Would've voted the Dreamhack finals as best game, but I have the bias of being there.
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On January 03 2012 08:40 EGalex wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2012 00:58 Muruburu wrote:On January 01 2012 21:58 EGalex wrote:Folks, please don't bash the EG/TL tie for team of the year . While I do think that a case could be made for EG edging out TL as the singular team of the year (even by just a hair), and while that may be my (admittedly biased) personal opinion, I don't think an objective argument can really be made for either side coming out noticeably on top. When you consider all aspects of what makes a team great, including player support, fan engagement, community presence, business development, and (of course) tournament results, the gap between EG and TL - if it exists at all - is just too minimal to warrant either team winning the award outright. Both EG and TL have our respective strengths and weaknesses, but overall, I don't think there are any international teams doing a better job of running their StarCraft divisions than EG and TL. And I want to both thank and applaud Victor, James, Ken, and everyone over at TL for a job very, very well done. I mean this very sincerely. This is not meant to take credit away from any of the other very high-level international teams, of course; it's just that, as far as StarCraft goes, I think EG and TL are at the forefront of international teams. I'm very happy to share both the rivalry and team of the year awards with TL. Speaking comfortably for Scott, Colin, Cody, and everyone over at EG, we have so much respect for what TL does for its players and the community, and we're very excited to move into 2012 with such an intense and storied rivalry intact. Watching DreamHack Winter was a very interesting experience for me. On the one hand, I obviously want EG to win every tournament we enter (especially that particular event, which was so well-produced and carried such prestige), and as such, I was *absolutely* heartbroken when HerO defeated PuMa in game seven to take the event. The loss haunted me for the better part of a week, causing many fingertips-to-the-forehead head shakes and long-inhale-short-exhale sighs. Yet, at the same time, I found the logical part of my brain continually saying, "This is good for the sport. Liquid was overdue for a big win." I think that this anecdote is aptly representative of the dilemma and conflict you constantly face as a team owner. On the one hand, you want the sport to grow and flourish, and you understand that in the big picture of things, in order for that to happen, it's necessary for multiple teams to do well, and for intense rivalries to develop. Yet at the same time, you genuinely want your players and your team to win every, single map they play, and if you're not doing everything it takes to win (within the rules), you're doing yourself, your players, and your fans an unacceptable disservice. Somehow, these two desires, while in theory rather mutually exclusive, in practice coexist in every team owner's mind on a daily basis. And so, while on the one hand I hope that an EG player wins every single tournament in 2012, on the other hand I know that it's good for the sport if Liquid (and other teams) get their share of victories as well. So, Victor, and everyone at TL, I truly wish all of you good luck going into the new year. Just, y'know, not too much luck, please . -Alex @ottersareneat on Twitter This post needs more love. Thanks for writing this up Alex! You're welcome... although, I think you're the only one that read it ;].
Oh please... Get a grip.
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On January 02 2012 08:29 Sliver wrote:
IdrA won over Destiny for most entertaining? What in the world? We all know IdrA is better but Destiny is so much more entertaining, which is why he gets so many viewers.
Not sure if youre aware, but idra gets 2-3 times more viewers than destiny
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Like many I don't agree with all the choices made here, but it was still a fun read. Keep the great content coming in 2012 TL writers.
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Awesome write-up guys, keep up the good work in 2012!
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Thanks for the write-up and Happy new year to every SC2 fan
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On January 03 2012 09:56 Brett wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2012 08:40 EGalex wrote:On January 03 2012 00:58 Muruburu wrote:On January 01 2012 21:58 EGalex wrote:Folks, please don't bash the EG/TL tie for team of the year . While I do think that a case could be made for EG edging out TL as the singular team of the year (even by just a hair), and while that may be my (admittedly biased) personal opinion, I don't think an objective argument can really be made for either side coming out noticeably on top. When you consider all aspects of what makes a team great, including player support, fan engagement, community presence, business development, and (of course) tournament results, the gap between EG and TL - if it exists at all - is just too minimal to warrant either team winning the award outright. Both EG and TL have our respective strengths and weaknesses, but overall, I don't think there are any international teams doing a better job of running their StarCraft divisions than EG and TL. And I want to both thank and applaud Victor, James, Ken, and everyone over at TL for a job very, very well done. I mean this very sincerely. This is not meant to take credit away from any of the other very high-level international teams, of course; it's just that, as far as StarCraft goes, I think EG and TL are at the forefront of international teams. I'm very happy to share both the rivalry and team of the year awards with TL. Speaking comfortably for Scott, Colin, Cody, and everyone over at EG, we have so much respect for what TL does for its players and the community, and we're very excited to move into 2012 with such an intense and storied rivalry intact. Watching DreamHack Winter was a very interesting experience for me. On the one hand, I obviously want EG to win every tournament we enter (especially that particular event, which was so well-produced and carried such prestige), and as such, I was *absolutely* heartbroken when HerO defeated PuMa in game seven to take the event. The loss haunted me for the better part of a week, causing many fingertips-to-the-forehead head shakes and long-inhale-short-exhale sighs. Yet, at the same time, I found the logical part of my brain continually saying, "This is good for the sport. Liquid was overdue for a big win." I think that this anecdote is aptly representative of the dilemma and conflict you constantly face as a team owner. On the one hand, you want the sport to grow and flourish, and you understand that in the big picture of things, in order for that to happen, it's necessary for multiple teams to do well, and for intense rivalries to develop. Yet at the same time, you genuinely want your players and your team to win every, single map they play, and if you're not doing everything it takes to win (within the rules), you're doing yourself, your players, and your fans an unacceptable disservice. Somehow, these two desires, while in theory rather mutually exclusive, in practice coexist in every team owner's mind on a daily basis. And so, while on the one hand I hope that an EG player wins every single tournament in 2012, on the other hand I know that it's good for the sport if Liquid (and other teams) get their share of victories as well. So, Victor, and everyone at TL, I truly wish all of you good luck going into the new year. Just, y'know, not too much luck, please . -Alex @ottersareneat on Twitter This post needs more love. Thanks for writing this up Alex! You're welcome... although, I think you're the only one that read it ;]. Oh please... Get a grip.
lol. why don't you? i guess your humor-detector is off.
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Someone should have won Worst Drama...T_T
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On January 02 2012 23:36 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 16:29 IdrA wrote:On January 02 2012 13:43 DueSs wrote:On January 02 2012 11:04 IdrA wrote:
its team of the year, not most accomplished team of the year. mouz is a successful team with a lot of good players, but they dont really do anything otherwise. tl and eg are both out there interacting with the community and creating content and interest both for fans and to bring in new people to esports, mouz isnt, or they arent successful at it. tl and eg do a million times more for esports than mouz does. theres not a very clear winner in terms of whos won the most, but mouz clearly loses on the other stuff. (and eg wins but tl bias obv) I don't think people have their panties in a wad because Mouz didn't win. I think they do because Mouz wasn't mentioned. You said, "mouz is a successful team with a lot of good players"--isn't that AT LEAST good enough to be......... . ... .. .. mentioned? not really. winning, even a team league, is still largely individual. you practice with your team and receive some support from them, but honestly that comes into play more in individual leagues more than team leagues. team leagues are all online, you're not there together talking and giving each other advice (unless you're eg cuz we're the best) you're all sitting at home playing your own individual matches and winning or losing on your own. and even the practice, most people are more likely to practice with friends and regular practice partners, whether theyre on their team or not. its the extraneous stuff that really defines a team, particularly outside of korea. Greg, That's why we hand out individual titles for those who deserve them. Most of the prominent teams outside of Korea do next to nada when it comes to grooming their player's skill. All they do is setup shop. Hell T-Zain didn't even join Mouz until after he won TSL3. Not like times have changed all that much. [pG] and ToT's players would vote players into their respectful teams as well after getting to know them. In the beginning, a lot of them flew under the radar. Not so much after 04. Like I said, most teams. Then you have teams in Korea such as SlayerS where Lim wanted the freshest meat possible and guess what? He groomed them just like SK Telecom. Deja vu. As for practice regimes. Not all players on international teams practice religiously with one another. You know this; I know this. You stuck with your [Media] boys and other boys for a long, long time. There will always be exceptions to the rule.
whats your point?
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Bot edit.
User was banned for this post.
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I don't even know what StarStruck is trying to say... I never really thought that skill in team leagues could be less bolstered by the team than in individual leagues, but now that Greg explained it, it makes sense. Very counterintuitive, interesting.
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Also, Thorzain joined Mouz just before winning TSL3, didn't he?
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On January 03 2012 08:40 EGalex wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2012 00:58 Muruburu wrote:On January 01 2012 21:58 EGalex wrote:Folks, please don't bash the EG/TL tie for team of the year . While I do think that a case could be made for EG edging out TL as the singular team of the year (even by just a hair), and while that may be my (admittedly biased) personal opinion, I don't think an objective argument can really be made for either side coming out noticeably on top. When you consider all aspects of what makes a team great, including player support, fan engagement, community presence, business development, and (of course) tournament results, the gap between EG and TL - if it exists at all - is just too minimal to warrant either team winning the award outright. Both EG and TL have our respective strengths and weaknesses, but overall, I don't think there are any international teams doing a better job of running their StarCraft divisions than EG and TL. And I want to both thank and applaud Victor, James, Ken, and everyone over at TL for a job very, very well done. I mean this very sincerely. This is not meant to take credit away from any of the other very high-level international teams, of course; it's just that, as far as StarCraft goes, I think EG and TL are at the forefront of international teams. I'm very happy to share both the rivalry and team of the year awards with TL. Speaking comfortably for Scott, Colin, Cody, and everyone over at EG, we have so much respect for what TL does for its players and the community, and we're very excited to move into 2012 with such an intense and storied rivalry intact. Watching DreamHack Winter was a very interesting experience for me. On the one hand, I obviously want EG to win every tournament we enter (especially that particular event, which was so well-produced and carried such prestige), and as such, I was *absolutely* heartbroken when HerO defeated PuMa in game seven to take the event. The loss haunted me for the better part of a week, causing many fingertips-to-the-forehead head shakes and long-inhale-short-exhale sighs. Yet, at the same time, I found the logical part of my brain continually saying, "This is good for the sport. Liquid was overdue for a big win." I think that this anecdote is aptly representative of the dilemma and conflict you constantly face as a team owner. On the one hand, you want the sport to grow and flourish, and you understand that in the big picture of things, in order for that to happen, it's necessary for multiple teams to do well, and for intense rivalries to develop. Yet at the same time, you genuinely want your players and your team to win every, single map they play, and if you're not doing everything it takes to win (within the rules), you're doing yourself, your players, and your fans an unacceptable disservice. Somehow, these two desires, while in theory rather mutually exclusive, in practice coexist in every team owner's mind on a daily basis. And so, while on the one hand I hope that an EG player wins every single tournament in 2012, on the other hand I know that it's good for the sport if Liquid (and other teams) get their share of victories as well. So, Victor, and everyone at TL, I truly wish all of you good luck going into the new year. Just, y'know, not too much luck, please . -Alex @ottersareneat on Twitter This post needs more love. Thanks for writing this up Alex! You're welcome... although, I think you're the only one that read it ;].
Best post of the thread, it just hasn't got enough drama for people to answer to Talking sense to a screaming mob is rarely very effective.
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EPT
