You're wrong. You are not having a basic paper pushing job for "somewhere close" to $100,000 a year. 30-50k? Maybe. 50k is on the VERY high end of that.
After a achieving a professional designation, your average salary for a Chartered Accountant is just under 6 figures. I should know since I am in the industry.
Professional Chartered Accountant = Just getting a regular old paper pushing job for 100k? Think your wording was misleading.
HuK spent 1 year perfecting his game. Professional Chartered Accounting designation takes like 2 years. Lets put the rest of HuK's "Other" gaming experience and clump it down to 1 year of experience... Therefore, if he worked just as hard at becoming a paper pusher, he'd make 100k right now wouldn't he?
Not only that, he's #1 right now as opposed to a paper pushing job where he'd make 100k at the middle of his tier.
So lets say he tried really hard and did really good.. 150K - 200k is what he should expect if hes one of the brightest paper pushers that exist.
Except we're not looking at paper pushers, we're talking about SC2 progamers in NA. As one of the top NA players, he should be making money at the top NA level. Whether or not it's in the 150k-200k range has nothing to do with how much he would make as a paper pusher.
So 150k to 200k would be less than what he SHOULD be making... since Grubby and Moon both made 7 figures in wc3...?
WC3 =/= SC2. EU/KR =/= NA.
What HuK should be making, based on accomplishments, publicity, and marketability, is about as much as or a bit more than w-e IdrA is making with EG right now.
OH WAIT........... thats about 150-200k...
Do you have where IdrA talks about what he makes? And take a look at the line of reasoning. "Professional paper pushers make 150k a year so HuK should make the same" doesn't make much sense. "IdrA makes 150k a year and HuK is just as good and on same team so he should also make 150k a year" actually does.
I'm afraid you are the one that is confused.
What I said was, under 100k wasn't very life changing because paper pushers could make that much pretty quickly.
Then you tried to force me to make the arguement that paper pushers can make 100k easily (which they can).
I did not say at any point in time that just b/c paper pushers make 150k that huk should make 150k. I merely said that it's a similar comparison to the amount of work that HuK put into what he does and that, again, 100k or less wasn't that life changing.
Then I further stated that HuK should be paid 150-200k because that is about the industry standard for North American players at #1. Then you stated that we should compare that to very top professionals (to which I said Grubby and Spirit_Moon would be those).
Then you said that HuK should probably be paid similar to Idra, to which I confirmed (and agreed) that its about 150-200k / year.
Don't ask me how I know, thats just what I've heard from being on my own professional team (www.check6gaming.com). My managers at check6 have been around the industry long enough to know the top salaries for top american players. Not saying I get paid, but they know and I trust them since Check6 has existed for a long time.
When did I try to force you to make any arguments about paper pushers? And again, life changing doesn't necessarily mean he has to make more than a high tier paper pusher. All it means is that it's a big improvement over what he had from Liquid and what Liquid currently offered.
On August 17 2011 07:01 wobbly wrote: I cant believe you take money over personally. That is bad personality.
When he has options, why would he take the lower paid one? He's not ditching the fans, just changing teams. Sorry but your post is completely ignorant and single minded
I dont like it that EG buys arrived players instead of young talent and grooming them. It just doesnt feel right, esp. in eSPORTS where it is relatively easy to tender young talent if you have a right setting (see BW-scene).
Business-wise HUK is 100% right but he kept saying he wanted to become the best in SC2. I wonder if moving to EG really improves his odds. Liquid gave him all possiblities to go anywhere he wanted and could train 24/7 with the best Koreans.
Great for Huk, sad for teamliquid, understandable for EG.
That said, I can't support buying an ace player. In this sense, EG is kind of a victim of Huk's success, this would have been such a non-story in my eyes if it had happened a couple months ago. Huk could have gone on to win dreakhack, hsc, and whatever else with an EG jersey and I would have commended EG for recognizing and appreciating his talent even when he hadn't won anything for awhile.
As it is now though, it just looks like they are trying to buy out his accomplishments and success and put their name on it, and coming off the Puma-right-after-NASL deal, I think it's pretty clear how EG's management is approaching expanding their talent. I won't blame Huk for taking a life-changing deal, but I can't support management (or complacent sponsorship) that is unable or unwilling to foster new talent.
Can't wait to see which Blizzcon player they pick up so they can have a jersey in that tournament. Or maybe they'll just skip that step and head straight to the winner!
Did you realize, that in the Ro8 CodeA match between MarineKing and Jjakji, Doa says the following in game3, when Jjakji drops a lot of units into MarineKing's forces:
It's like an Evil Genius dropping its subordinates into Liquid Hot water.
Way before the announcement was made. When I just watched the VOD, that really scared me, along with all those X-Files Hype.
After a achieving a professional designation, your average salary for a Chartered Accountant is just under 6 figures. I should know since I am in the industry.
Professional Chartered Accountant = Just getting a regular old paper pushing job for 100k? Think your wording was misleading.
HuK spent 1 year perfecting his game. Professional Chartered Accounting designation takes like 2 years. Lets put the rest of HuK's "Other" gaming experience and clump it down to 1 year of experience... Therefore, if he worked just as hard at becoming a paper pusher, he'd make 100k right now wouldn't he?
Not only that, he's #1 right now as opposed to a paper pushing job where he'd make 100k at the middle of his tier.
So lets say he tried really hard and did really good.. 150K - 200k is what he should expect if hes one of the brightest paper pushers that exist.
Except we're not looking at paper pushers, we're talking about SC2 progamers in NA. As one of the top NA players, he should be making money at the top NA level. Whether or not it's in the 150k-200k range has nothing to do with how much he would make as a paper pusher.
So 150k to 200k would be less than what he SHOULD be making... since Grubby and Moon both made 7 figures in wc3...?
WC3 =/= SC2. EU/KR =/= NA.
What HuK should be making, based on accomplishments, publicity, and marketability, is about as much as or a bit more than w-e IdrA is making with EG right now.
OH WAIT........... thats about 150-200k...
Do you have where IdrA talks about what he makes? And take a look at the line of reasoning. "Professional paper pushers make 150k a year so HuK should make the same" doesn't make much sense. "IdrA makes 150k a year and HuK is just as good and on same team so he should also make 150k a year" actually does.
I'm afraid you are the one that is confused.
What I said was, under 100k wasn't very life changing because paper pushers could make that much pretty quickly.
Then you tried to force me to make the arguement that paper pushers can make 100k easily (which they can).
I did not say at any point in time that just b/c paper pushers make 150k that huk should make 150k. I merely said that it's a similar comparison to the amount of work that HuK put into what he does and that, again, 100k or less wasn't that life changing.
Then I further stated that HuK should be paid 150-200k because that is about the industry standard for North American players at #1. Then you stated that we should compare that to very top professionals (to which I said Grubby and Spirit_Moon would be those).
Then you said that HuK should probably be paid similar to Idra, to which I confirmed (and agreed) that its about 150-200k / year.
Don't ask me how I know, thats just what I've heard from being on my own professional team (www.check6gaming.com). My managers at check6 have been around the industry long enough to know the top salaries for top american players. Not saying I get paid, but they know and I trust them since Check6 has existed for a long time.
When did I try to force you to make any arguments about paper pushers? And again, life changing doesn't necessarily mean he has to make more than a high tier paper pusher. All it means is that it's a big improvement over what he had from Liquid and what Liquid currently offered.
There is truth your argument only in that there is ambiguity. However, there shouldn't be any illusion: that it all came down to the $-figure.
Its going to be around 150k or more. If we ever find out you can mark my words. Otherwise, I don't see any point in further arguing this.
In my mind and opinion, it has to be at least 150k as in my opinion less than 100k non-life changing based on what I have said already. If you disagree, then whatever, its not like I really give a shit what some random scrub on TL thinks. I was just posting my opinion and did not need to write an essay to back up my opinion or how I came to that conclusion, even if you try to discredit me.
On August 17 2011 07:01 wobbly wrote: you know HuK ( im not going to write liquid or EG because you dont deserve that) the only reason that i what sc2 still is that i had a man that was true...true too himself his fans and his team.
I am not here to flame you, but i am here to tell you that i am not going to be your fan anymore, i dont know if that is important to you, but let me tell you what it is...I am not going to wake up early to watch your stream, i am not going to watch MLG, i am not going to support SC2 anymore, since you and liquid was the only reason i am still here.
you leaving Liquid, a team that took you in while you still though that mothership builds was good and cute, and then leave them when you are the best player and get good results. This is in my eyes a betrayal in a degreed like few. EG is a fine team, but the value that liquid require is so high and that is the reason why people still watch them, even thou they still need to prove themself as the best team.
your the E-sport Puma, the basketball Le Bron James, the soccer Sol campel and so on...
I hope in my heart that you cant stay at oGs/liquid house in Korea, since you have no reason to stay there, you are no longer apart of the team and I hope you will regret this move and never come back.
I am so made and sad about this news, if you guys had posted this I would had payed some of the pay for HuK and so would EVERYONE here, because we are a family and we want to stay together ...but you dont want to and that is a shame.
this is my first post and most likely the only post that I ever write at liquid. That is how I feel. I am made and sad and I dont know how to tell how I feel...I dont want you back, since you dont fit in. I am full of shame because I been a fan since beta and watching you and felt like you were a good and loyal guy.
I cant believe you take money over personally. That is bad personality. Think about how the team feel about loosing the ace player, damn, I was rooting for you to get at Blizzcon so I would had had another reason to watch on the stream.
Last, I am so disappointed that I as a fan after a year get four lines "A HUGE thanks to my fans, I give so much to try to do as much as I can for you guys and you guys return that 10x every time... I dont think there are any more die-hard fans then HuK fans, when i look at your art, blogs, pics, tweets, gifts, candy, etc. EVERYTHING, it makes me so happy to know that people are there to help me along the way and really do appreciate me as a player."
you have Nazgul and Team EG to write a long and "its okay" letter...damn I am a shame that I ever watch you.
Once apon a time your fan David from Denmark
If you cared that much you would have made an effort to use proper english
true that, people getting mad for huk trying to make a living for himself lol. these are the sc2 fans that we dont need. goodbye david!! also, if ur really rich and want to pay for huk, please contact nazgul, im sure he wouldnt mind donations.
Totally agree. These guys dont get to go to school or work a job for the most part and unless they want to live in a one bedroom apartment the rest of their life or marry a rich chick if their gaming career ever dries up what will he have... nothing. I think its un fair to judge a guy who obviously really did care about liquid and all his friends and everything they helped him accomplished. I am so glad that at least EG( even if i am not a fan of them) has the ability to help gamers make a living for themselves.
As a True fan of huk, I dont need to stay up late to see how he does or follow him every where. I love watching his games when i get a chance and watching him grow as a player. It doesnt matter what team he is on I will cheer for him. Any of the so called fans that throw him away because he joined a different team really wasnt a fan at all. Give him a break its not like team liquid will break now that he left and he didnt leave for a minor difference in salary or cause he hated team liquid. But i guess haters got to hate. HUK you will always rock. <3
On August 17 2011 07:26 Stuv wrote: Business-wise HUK is 100% right but he kept saying he wanted to become the best in SC2. I wonder if moving to EG really improves his odds. Liquid gave him all possiblities to go anywhere he wanted and could train 24/7 with the best Koreans.
I really don't see how it possibly could. Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, if you compare the rosters (not even including the oGs guys), he is leaving extremely talented practice partners.
On August 17 2011 07:26 Stuv wrote: I dont like it that EG buys arrived players instead of young talent and grooming them. It just doesnt feel right, esp. in eSPORTS where it is relatively easy to tender young talent if you have a right setting (see BW-scene).
Business-wise HUK is 100% right but he kept saying he wanted to become the best in SC2. I wonder if moving to EG really improves his odds. Liquid gave him all possiblities to go anywhere he wanted and could train 24/7 with the best Koreans.
Yep, I 100% agree with you there. EG makes offerings that any reasonable person wouldn't want to refuse, but, in the end, they leave the great, developed players with so much more potential in a likely worse practice environment than they had before. I mean... PuMa? Prior to him joining EG, he had an entire house of talented Korean-level teammates to practice with, and when he left, I don't know what his practice environment became, but I doubt it was as good as it was in TSL. HuK? He had the entire oGs house to practice with, but, now, he's just living with IdrA and PuMa, both of whom are pretty good, but it's nothing compared to the oGs house.
I hope for EG's sake that HuK and PuMa don't display some decline in skill, because they're going to be blamed for being the guys who essentially bought great, promising players, and in the end, hindered what they could have become due to being unable to provide them with as good a practice environment as they once had.
On August 17 2011 07:16 wobbly wrote: I am sorry that i am 14 years old and dont know how to spell prober, but i am going to share my mind and the feelings i have how this...
narcissistic? no I dont think so, since it is about HuK and not me...I use a lot of time watching a couple of players and he was one of them and on a team that only chose special people. that is why i am i am angry, i am sure that liquid as Nazgul writes, that liquid made a good offer.
Oh, you're 14? That does explain it. Everyone is a narcissist at that age. I'll explain why I said that.
What you wrote is "I..." "my..." "me..." Everything is about your thoughts, your feelings, your expectations. Nowhere do you stop and think about how HuK might feel. Why he might choose to do that. What his current needs/future plans are.
Everything this announcement is to you is you being betrayed. Whereas I can tell you that HuK doesn't care about your feelings, when he's thinking about which job to take. And if you expect him to, in a way that is absolutely unrealistic, then the fault lies with you, not with him. Things do not work this way. We're not in a glorified high-school movie where the beloved underdog team suddenly wins the big tournament and everyone is happy forever except for the bad villain team who get exposed as frauds. Real life is not a movie.
I am not picking on you here, I just want you to think a little bit about what you are writing, why you are writing it the way you are writing it, and how the result comes across to people who are not you.
And to be fair, you are definitely not the only person on TL who has been churning out stuff like this today. And deep inside they whisper "but this is not supposed to happen, the good guy is supposed to stay with his team until they win"... But it never does happen anywhere except in the movies. And when the main actor doesn't behave properly, he gets chewed out for not conforming to people's delusions.
On August 17 2011 07:27 geno wrote: Great for Huk, sad for teamliquid, understandable for EG.
That said, I can't support buying an ace player. In this sense, EG is kind of a victim of Huk's success, this would have been such a non-story in my eyes if it had happened a couple months ago. Huk could have gone on to win dreakhack, hsc, and whatever else with an EG jersey and I would have commended EG for recognizing and appreciating his talent even when he hadn't won anything for awhile.
As it is now though, it just looks like they are trying to buy out his accomplishments and success and put their name on it, and coming off the Puma-right-after-NASL deal, I think it's pretty clear how EG's management is approaching expanding their talent. I won't blame Huk for taking a life-changing deal, but I can't support management (or complacent sponsorship) that is unable or unwilling to foster new talent.
Can't wait to see which Blizzcon player they pick up so they can have a jersey in that tournament. Or maybe they'll just skip that step and head straight to the winner!
I'm certainly no expert on the situation but from what I read EG was looking with interest to Huk before, but he simply had a contract. Now that that is comming to an end they were looking to negotiate taking him over, which seems logical. I very much wonder how well Huk/Idra/Incontrol are going to get along, but then I have no idea what any of those people are like when they are relaxed with their team, so who's to say? I'm fairly sure both EG and Huk have taken this into consideration so I'm just stoked to see how both teams will go on from here, and i'll follow it with interest =)
Anyone who says they wouldn't change jobs at a company for higher salary is lying. Rarely are we committed to the company that hired us over the paycheck we bring home. It the way business works. I don't blame huk or liquid in the least for any of this. I'm glad he is earning for his success. While i'm sad to see him leave Liquid i will still enjoy watching him play.
While everyone cheers for favorite teams, there are always players on opposite teams you hope to do well.
On August 17 2011 07:01 wobbly wrote: I cant believe you take money over personally. That is bad personality.
When he has options, why would he take the lower paid one? He's not ditching the fans, just changing teams. Sorry but your post is completely ignorant and single minded
this kid's 14, its what they do.
Yeah, once the kid has a taste of the real world and sees what it means to worry about your livelihood both immediate and future he'll stop moaning. As of now his only understanding of it comes from his parents saying "No you can't use our credit card yet again"
HuK made the smart choice. Sucks that he's on EG but you'd have either be crazy, stupid or a trust fund baby to refuse a bucket load of cash.
EPT
Keep doing what you do
