EPT[M]Chill Hop Mafia
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 20 2018 21:48 Rels wrote:Some players dislike playing with them though, so it's up to the host and the other players to decide if they want to allow hydra or not In that case does anyone that's signed up / is signing up have an issue with me playing as a hydra? | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I've reflected on my role and realized that there is a GTO play for me in this game, and therefore I am compelled to pursue it. I am going to brute force my clearness immediately upon the opening of the thread. I am hard-claiming, and I will never be rescinding. I am the seer. When it becomes prudent I will provide my peek. Benefits: 1. I will survive tonight: I do not believe the wolves are able to kill me tonight, because it is so objectively unlikely that I would ever do this as the seer. I believe that this decision reduces the importance of the seer cover to be provided by all of you to the point of it being negligible. The wolves have already been outplayed, as it were. 2. I'm lock clear: All of you already know I'm lock clear, because it is so objectively unlikely that I would do this as a wolf. You know this for at least two reasons. First, this is the easiest, lowest-stress, lowest-demand game to wolf in that I've ever played in (except for turbos). I have no need to complicate my life, as a wolf, by open-claiming on thread open, when all Ihave to do is provide like a C-level wolf game to probably win. This is the rare instance where you literally [i]know[i] that I have a billion other options as a wolf, AND that I would pursue probably ALL of them before pursuing this. Second, I engage in FPS exceedingly rarely, which necessarily means that I *know* that this will look WEIRD and SHOCKING to you. There is no merit to a wolf play that instantly generates WEIRD and SHOCKED responses that I would be obligated to finesse and manage for the remainder of the game. As a villager, which I am, the burden is totally on you to not **** up and lynch me. Makes my life super awesome. 3. There are only 11 players you need to try to read, rather than 12: I have already provided a "free" peek of me in a game with a mere 13 players. Our win equity is dramatically improved by my being entirely off the table for the entire game. Conclusion: The burden of sound reasoning is now entirely upon you. I am the seer, and thus a villager, and thus lock clear. The game is immediately simpler than it would otherwise have been, because of my decision. Now, let us enjoy that benefit and win the game. Also, to preempt a lengthy and pointless discussion. It is NOT dumb to ponder this post and convince yourself of its wisdom. That is your obligation as a villager, and I encourage you to think it over for as long as it takes to quell your (initially valid but ultimately unnecessary) concerns. It IS dumb to, AFTER doing that pondering, conclude that I'm "neutral" or "wolfy." That is legitimately stupid, and I won't entertain it. ONE of the reasons it is a stupid conclusion is that the upside of this play as a wolf is absolutely DWARFED by the upside of this play as a villager. There is no equivalency between the EV gain for wolf-me in this position and villager-me in this position. They're universes apart. That means I wouldn't DO the poorer option of the two (by extension, wolf-me also wouldn't BELIEVE that I could convince the entire game of the truth of these assertions for the entire game, which as an end-game wolf I would have to believe if this strategem were to be worth pursuing). A SECOND reason that conclusion is stupid is that the EV bonus of oding this as a wolf is COMPLETELY DWARFED by me baseline wolf EV anyway. Anything that complicates my wolfing life is RIDICULOUSLY stupid for me to do, given that my wolfing life is ALREADY one of the smoothest, highest expectation wolfing lives in WW history anyway. A THIRD reason that conclusion is stupid is that you would probably have to worry about being EXPLOITED by this gambit in order to get there. However, I have NEVER engaged in this, or any similar, gambit in my entire career, meaning that if there IS exploitation to be had with this play, it is in FUTURE GAMES, not this game. For these reasons, pressuring me is extremely wolfy and should not be engaged in by any villager, ever, in this game. There will be no less productive pursuit than that in this game. Sucks for the wolves when meta is wielded this brutally, but my allegiance is plain and my strategy perfect. Get #rekt. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 08:15 Calix wrote: It was clearly written before he received his role because if he was an investigative role, he (or she, since this is Gemma?) would know that Cops on this site don't get N0 checks. Thus it's not AI. I would like to know more about the two players in the hydra though. How many games have they played, where are they from, stuff like that. I've played a little over 20 games, although most of them I wouldn't qualify as real games. I'm from Westeros, where we play alted games with usually pretty short deadlines. Regfan has been mentoring me for a while now, and my love for process comes from him. I'm good at some of the things he's terrible at, like having a personality, and he's good at some of the things I'm terrible at (nothing comes to mind right now), so we complement each other pretty well I think. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Vote: raynpelikoneet I thought their post was fine. They took a stance on something game-related, did it in a way that contributed to discussion in a healthy way, and started looking for ways to understand us better, which feels like a town thing. I don't really like that you just tagged along to someone else's read, and your post about Gemma bringing her C-game didn't help anyone with anything and didn't show to me that you care about understanding or being fair. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
For those that wanted a mini intro/bit about my head of the hydra, I've played ~100 games or so over the last ~9 years, played with Rayn and Slenderman a long time ago, remember a bit about how they play. I'm very much about people being open/forthright with their reads and thoughts on the game and think constant reevaluation is pretty much the best way to play this game, that said I haven't actually played a game in a little so I'm treating this game (And being in a hydra) to try and shake the rust. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Going to finish chatting with Gemma about where her heads, do another go over of the thread and I'll let you know where I'm at then. -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I've got a weak townish read on Ticktock, I liked his analysis and response towards Rayn and the "I'm unlynchable and you just don't know it yet" type of confident response towards Holyflare reads slightly townie, would strongly say that Ticktock/Holyflare are never knowing aligned here based on #105. @Tick - Can you explain the Mocsta town read for me please. (Is there a way to link post numbers here?) - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
@Rayn - Thanks for the link explanation. I'm a little troubled by your recent posting and my discussion with Gemma on you hasn't really helped (She's equally conflicted now too), not hugely happy about your sort of lack of response towards my initial few posts here (Recognition that the initial post from Gemma was a C/P and not a "Oh the post makes no sense" type thing would be the logical sort of reaction to it at minimum) and the way you've gone about responding to the Ticktock thing is ehhhhh in that people state a scum read on him earlier, you don't really weigh in then, I post a town read on him, you state you disagree with the scum reads on him 9 minutes later. It feels sort of like, picking the direction you're going based on my reads which I think you'd certainly be doing as mafia to a degree. So mind talking to me and walking me through on what your reads are entirely right now (Don't care if some of it sounds stupid) as well as what /you/ specifically like about TickTock, would be nice to see some thought process from you on that. On June 26 2018 11:08 CopCake wrote: I am a “soul reader”, “moon power” and idk, apparently I find mafia by mistake always. Ahhh, you're one of those players, fantastic. If I had a gun to your head right now and said "Name 3 players, if all 3 are town, you get to live OR name 1 player and if they're mafia you get to live" which would opt for and what would your answer be? - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 11:29 raynpelikoneet wrote: Holyflare isn't really wrong in that tt's early posting looked like him being an un-caring scum. I went to read his couple of last games i remember quickly and basically came to the same conclusion to what you did. I don't see any reason to repeat things that are already said. I basically just don't think he responds to the people scumreading in a way he did, while yes i realise he just called everyone town who is calling him scum. But i think as mafia he'd do it differently since it's not really likely to buy you any town redit when you weigh your chances to "get out of being scumread". I also don't think any response to Gemma's post is helping anything anymore, since it's a confirmed pre-planned copy paste post. It doesn't make it anything, except for stupid. My read on TT is without a lick of meta involved in it, if you've done some meta research that suggests he's town here, I think mentioning that is rather important -- I need to be able to follow /how/ you're getting to reads in this game here and the way it played out didn't really do that. What's your reads/thoughts on Mocsta at the moment? We both read a lot of his posts as him feeling somewhat detached from the actual game thread in a way I see mafia do more often than not, where he's there posting things that seem /somewhat okay/ but then looking at the body of content and going "huh". I'd imagine you've got some actual meta on him, is this something you'd say fits more his town/scum play and why? (Pretty much if you're town here dude I need to see it via your thought process/solving, please) -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 11:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:Basically what i found out to be mostly correct is that tt makes more detailed and not all over the place posts more likely as town in comparison to as mafia. It's partly meta partly just gameplay. Especially him looking like he is thinking about what he posts mid-post aka the post on Calix seems to me way more likely to come from town than from mafia. idk it is hard to explain, i think he can make a post like that as mafia as well but i don't think he makes THAT specific post as mafia, post would probably be more lazy and have a different umm... goal in mind that it seems like it has. Cheers, most of this makes a lot of sense. Wouldn't mind you getting to the Moscsta question when you get a chance, we're reading his posts here as busywork to a degree and Gemma can't work out why the things he's commenting on are important to him or where he's really trying to go with it and working out if this is just a playstyle concern or not would be nice. -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 11:33 Tictock wrote: Oh wow, I really hate this post >.< I'm kinda getting the sense that I am just going to dislike Gamma based off personality here, but this is really bad. It's adding nothing, acts as an appeal to emotion via thin humor, and worst off is just a reaction to the other head of the hydra. I was actually kinda liking Reg's post at the top of the page here, but even before I saw this ^ post I was not willing to give a townread to Reg because I feel like their mafia range could be quite good. It wasn't a joke. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 11:48 Mocsta wrote:Can you please share an example. Most of my posts are one-liners, so im curious what body of (non-existent) content you are referring to. I would actually prefer as well if "R" did one, and "G" did one. This is due to the above proclamation that you share opinions outside the thread; whereas, I find your opinions posted to be non-congruent beyond differences stemming from personality. Sure, Gemma will likely get around to doing it later too. I found your initial catch up posts...underwhelming for the most part, the response towards Rayn in #78 to be make sense and be something I agreed with but the agreement on TT scum read in #80 with nothing attatched to it as to why you agreed there and to move on from there to focusing on CopCakes question to Rayn in #122 feels like you're...sort of aimlessly posting if that makes any sense, like "I can talk about this for a bit", "I'll focus talking about this" and when I look at it the progression/entirety of it I'm left thinking "His reads are what and why???" and I'm trying to work out if this is a playstyle type thing or not and am hoping Rayns response will help with that. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I can't follow what your reads are on the players here or why you're thinking what you are. I'm fully aware that others think about the game quite differently than I do, I'm also very aware that the meta on TL is hugely different to most of the places I've played at. That doesn't change the fact that when attempting to get a read on someone (No matter who/where it is) I need to be able to see "Oh they're doing A for B" or "They think C due to D/E", I don't need to agree with the reasoning of why you've got somewhere or have a particular read for it to be a real/genuine read from them, I do need to see that it exists. I don't even have a strong scum read on you here at all, I'm very much in a headspace where I'm just gathering data to try and work out/solve the game right now and having others comment on your playstyle (Plus I'm planning on reading through 1-2 of your town/scum games when I get a chance to be able to work it out myself) will help me massively when it comes to you. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 12:28 CopCake wrote: Yeah it leans mafia, well not exactly how different gemma/reg are but the mini case of you seemed out of place. Hum. I'd like you to run through this a little more for me please, how it's played out is me mentioning a few of my concerns re; Mocsta to Rayn given he'd know him better than I would and asking if the concerns I have are playstyle based or not and wanting to know his reads there. Then having Mocsta ask me to elaborate on the concerns/what I'm talking about ther leading towards me making the post linking his earlier ones, so this "Seemed out of place" thing is kind of ???? - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Oh jesus, I can tell playing with you is going to be a pain and a half already. I'll make it easy for you; - I made a post directed to Rayn asking him for his thoughts on Moscta and his meta/playstyle while listing my concerns that I've got with Moscta at the moment. - Moscta quoted that thing I posted to Rayn and asked me to elaborate on it / quote an example of what I'm talking about - I made a post running through my concerns with Moscsta for him. It wasn't a case, it wasn't a "mini-case" or anything, I'm not currently voting anywhere. Was literally just answering his question and putting my thoughts down. Simple? | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 11:48 Mocsta wrote:Can you please share an example. Most of my posts are one-liners, so im curious what body of (non-existent) content you are referring to. I would actually prefer as well if "R" did one, and "G" did one. This is due to the above proclamation that you share opinions outside the thread; whereas, I find your opinions posted to be non-congruent beyond differences stemming from personality. Man, it's really strange to have a townie say that their own body of work is non-existent, especially when it isn't. I mean, sure, you've only made 3-4 "serious" posts, but that's still a body of work and I don't get why your response to someone having an opinion on you is that they shouldn't have an opinion on you. Like, if you're scumreading us, that kind of doubt about our read on you would make sense, but I don't think you are. I also don't entirely know why you expect that an example will change that. On the other hand, I guess I like your approach to getting content from separate heads. Anyway, I don't really understand your process, and your tone is pretty incongruent. You're swinging between this low-effort type posting and these super formal and robotic posts and I don't understand how your brain is bending like that. Here's an example for you. On June 26 2018 11:34 Mocsta wrote: i dont understand how it leads to anything. If rayn calls you town, as either alignment, you will walk away feeling good about yaself. If rayn calls yo mafia, as either alignment, you will walk away with a sense of OMGUS. Dead question. Having said that, I do share suspicion towards Holyflare. Not enough to lean scum, but enough to pay extra attention to new content. Whether you agreed or not, at least to me, superfically, the Tictock stuff is fine. On the otherhand, whilst the strikethrough is more likely to be mafia than town in origin, its not conclusive and I find to be overly hammed up by HF. My expectation for a town!HF is for him to do his own campaigning. If he does this, even if its against me. I shall call him town. We will have to wait and see. I don't understand why you made this post when you did. There's nothing wrong with making delayed comments on things, or not responding to everything right away, and I'm not reading into that, but I think it's strange that you weren't really engaging with anything that was going on at the time, and instead making posts about these other things, in a way that doesn't feel to me like you were compelled to respond to them because they just itched at you, if that makes sense. You're like, fiddling around. Which is fine, if that's genuinely your process, but right now I don't understand it. My concerns with you are more of a "niggle" than anything, but when I see mafia make posts like these, it's because they're not able to find a real or fluid foothold in thread discussion, and fall back on making "look at me thinking about the game" type posts that don't really go anywhere or accomplish anything and lack a kind of underlying emotional drive to them, which is the feeling I've had about your posts so far. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I'm very much a player that'll spend a lot of time trying to extract and get information, when I have an actual scum read or someone I feel very confident is mafia, you'll know; this was not it at all. Find your response in #157 very very very townie though and don't think that's how you respond to everything that's been put down on you as mafia there at all. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Don't have much of a read on HF, dislike his reasoning behind his TT scum read and the over-focus on TT in their following posts but don't think it's an implausible read for a townie to have there, more interested in their thoughts on the game when they re-enter the thread. Heading out for a but, will be without access of a computer for a solid chunk of the next 24 hours but hoping to be able to read bits and pieces on my phone if my girlfriend allows me to. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
It's entirely possible that he's town and genuinely has those stances, but the way he went about it, without really trying to engage with either of us on a deeper level and kind of flinging egg at Regfan, doesn't feel like how I would expect town to behave there. In particular, I don't think that Regfan's post warranted this response at all: On June 26 2018 12:36 CopCake wrote: I literally dont understand this post. Someone halp, it is like many fancy words but I cant follow. Like, I don't see any fancy words in that post and I know I understand Regfan better than most people but I think it's very plainly laid out by him. And, this doesn't really feel like the way that town progresses through a thought. The "in fact, it is pretty townie" bit especially feels so unnatural. On June 26 2018 12:20 CopCake wrote: Nah, Mocsta question about why I asked that makes a lot of sense. It doesnt bother me at all, in fact it is pretty townie. @Copcake, why are you so unconcerned about whether you're getting Mocsta's alignment wrong? And why are you so unable to understand Regfan yet so easily able to understand Mocsta? I don't get why there's such a difference there in your process between those two reads. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 13:21 Mocsta wrote: I am struggling to comprehend how regfan can devote pages of posts to fleshing out a weak to null scum read in me. Yet gloss over hf. This startles me even more when the basis of their issues with me stems from my reaction to HF tictock comments. My recollection of regfan is lots of "process" nitpicking that leads nowhere ##vote: regfan He literally just arrived at a townread on you, dude. How is he not leading anywhere, exactly? -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I don't understand why you ask us both to elaborate on our read on you, then basically ignore it all and say that we're scummy because we spent too much time trying to sort you. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
@Mocsta - I had asked Conversion about his thoughts on non HF players, don't think he's posted since. Just a quick bit about my play in general and in this game, I find myself to increase in read accuracy and my ability to gamesove substantially as the game progresses, D1 and particularly the early section of the day phase is when I'm notoriously at my weakest. Its largely why I don't actually push anyone and admit to myself that my scum reads/concerns with players are just that and not much more. I focus on just trying to push the game forward and actually make sure there's content inside the thread early on, information I can look back on later to analyse, information others can comment on when they enter the thread so it's not just a stagnant period. It's mostly why this game, you'll find the players that I've talked about or focused on (TT, Ryan, Moscta, Cake) are those that are active or online while I have been since I can interact with them, question them or talk with others about them so they can react and not be playing a big waiting game. Despite being frustrated some small sections of the early game I'm actually reasonably happy with where I'm at, I feel pretty good about TT being town and find Moscatas reaction towards our comments on him and the way his progression of his read on us went (Him very noticeably talking himself into the scum read and trying to find reasons to sell himself on it when caught up in the moment to him pulling back and realising what had happened) to very insanely townie and don't think that analysis from him or timing of how it happened is ever fake here, would bet the entire game on him being town. Have a bunch of people I think are almost certainly not W/W and have a few people I'm somewhat keeping an eye on with lots of others yet to enter that I can read once they've done so. Anyway, yeah, that's where I'm at. -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 18:44 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well at least i got confirmation to one of my concerns.  Please share with the class. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 18:56 CopCake wrote: Lol, Calix got heated and instead of fighting the people that pointed fingers at him his first post is to make a case of me 🤷🏽♀️ Ofc that shit is staged. Like any town would try to clean himself but creating a case of me (Bad one). Literally his case is “town do this, mafia do that” not wveryone play the same way. @mocsta Like forcing me to push someone lmao, I already said before I suspect HF and I am not liking the last couple of posts of regfan, specially his engage towards you I'd appreciate some other perspectives on this. In the world where CopCake is mafia, his last bit there is presumably him still trying to buddy mocsta and push him in a certain direction. I feel like the way he approaches that, telling mocsta about how stupid/wrong the person pressuring him is, planting seeds of paranoia / trying to break down his townread on us, makes a lot of sense if that's the world we're in. I feel like if he's town, trying to guide mocsta like that is pretty hard to understand, especially when mentioning us is basically irrelevant to what he's supposed to be feeling strongly about in that moment, and I think he'd probably be more engaged with Calix and shutting down Calix directly, rather than sort of playing to the thread at large and mocsta in particular? I also think if he genuinely had concerns with us and was worried about mocsta getting pocketed, he might've mentioned it earlier and differently, rather than tossing it in on the side where he did. I'm not sure how strongly I feel about this, because I don't think it's super unrealistic that CopCake can just be town with a really wolfy way of talking about things and generally really bad process, especially when I haven't looked super closely at Calix's case on him (it could be as bad as CopCake says it is), and I don't know CopCake well enough to figure out whether "that shit is staged" and such is the way he approaches someone scumreading him when he's mafia, but it certainly doesn't fill me with joy. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 21:13 raynpelikoneet wrote: I don't get what is so hard to understand there? I'm just going to leave reading you to Regfan, because I don't understand how you are ever town after that post. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 21:03 raynpelikoneet wrote: I will tell you a secret. During work i went through every single mafia game i ever remember Cake playing on teamliquid and as mafia she has absolutely zero townreads during the first cycle. Literally zero. I will tell you another secret, there is simply no reason to think Cake is mafia because she is mostly interested in my alignment or what i think her is. You could simply just go look at any game we have played together in in last years or so. Painting one question you can't understand (while you could just simply ask -- or go check) as "useless questionS" is not only lazy as hell, it's also misconstruing the whole thing in the first place. Third secret. Who needs Gemma the seer when you have Calix the "i didn't really care to read anything much i just went to some random person's filter that btw doesn't make any sense to go to in the first place given the playerbase and hallelujah!! Every post was a mafia post!" yeah right. Looking for mafia or looking for a lynch? a) Cake never having made a townread during the first cycle isn't a reason to townread her in this game, that's such a copout way to townread someone and I don't understand how it's real. b) You aren't even explicitly saying that you do townread her or giving reasoning for townreading her, so much as saying there's no reason to scumread her. c) The way you're talking through this whole post as if your reads have already been thoroughly established, but they haven't, and there's a huge gulf of missing process where I have no idea where anything you're saying is coming from. It's like you've jumped into positioning yourself in a certain way that feels really forced. c) You're not talking about Calix as if you even think he's mafia. You're coming at this from sideways still, and it's like you're more interested in making Calix look stupid and bad than really scumreading him or actually analyzing anything he's doing. d) You completely ignored my posts on CopCake, despite apparently townreading her, which again makes me feel like you're not really interested in seriously digging into her alignment or approaching any of this honestly, so much as discrediting Calix's push on her. And Regfan just told me while I was writing this that you're dating CopCake, so that's a thing apparently. Don't think it really changes how I am reading this from you very much. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
What I meant with missing process was more the "here are suddenly all of the hard stances that I have" out of nowhere type thing, that I didn't see coming at all from your previous posts. Which, I guess can just be playstyle? I need to touch base with Regfan, he wanted to take point on reading you and I trust him more with it given his familiarity with your meta anyway. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 20:10 Calix wrote: I don't care about what kitaman did last game. I'm not kitaman nor am I scum. So you say that I missed the possibility that mafia didn't read the OP and didn't know about the cop. Then say that "any smart person" (important qualifier that reveals you're not calling me mafia, just stupid) would have asked some questions instead of concluding it meant nothing. Then you make a very weak meta read that you're not really qualified to make. Forgive me if I'm not wowed by your analysis. I'm more convinced you're taking shots at me yet again as opposed to thinking you believe any of this makes me scum. I guess if Calix has a stronger wolf game then this post isn't something I would townread. I could be reading him on too low of a level. The reason I thought this was town was because I don't really think that's how wolves talk to people scumreading them very often. Like, there's discrediting the person pushing on you when you're mafia, and there's saying "I don't believe your scumread on me is real", and it takes two different breeds of wolves. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 21:52 Calix wrote:In any case, talking to you has made me more convinced that you are also mafia. Also uh, I wouldn't say tonereading is my specialty by a long shot, but, ew. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 21:59 CopCake wrote: Lol what is this, make hard accusations and when someone debunks you or has more experience playing with someone suddenly his reasons are invalid? I actually found his clarification response pretty helpful, I just didn't understand his first post about you. -G (Flood control sucks.) | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G (Fyi I am INFP. I play against type a lot of the time because my intuitive side needs that grounding in process and fundamentals or I just fall off track and lose myself.) | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 26 2018 22:34 Mocsta wrote: thats exciting for me Im your complete opposite.. entj We are meant to be mentors for each others weaknesses :excitedjumpinghifiveanimeemoji: Night! -G (Also I kind of suspect that Regfan is going to read through and end up exactly where I'm at right now given how closely matched all our thoughts on the game so far have been, which means we'll probably put out a readlist or something tomorrow that will be full of goodfeels about where we're at with the game. Looking forward to seeing what you think of it / how your reads compare.) | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Actually going to sleep now. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Regfan doesn't proof my posts before I post them and I don't proof his. We don't always know what the other person is going to post. When I was pushing on you, he was at his girlfriend's house, and he wasn't really available. He sent me a message around the time I made my first post saying your read on CopCake made no sense, but he hadn't read up and we didn't talk about anything else. I don't know what he's going to think about any of that until he finds time to read it and let me know. He told me that he wants to take point in reading you, but that doesn't mean that I'm not allowed to have my own read on you or try to figure you out, and he also wants me more in charge of figuring out scum reads / our lynch for today while he takes care of townreads more. It just suits our respective strengths to do it this way. There has been very very little I have disagreed with him about, so pretty much everything he has posted you can take as me having that read too. We both felt bad about you at similar points, him slightly before me, then felt good about you at the same time (I started off by immediately calling you town based on your push on my copypasta, and he said it wasn't AI because of meta stuff and actually was really worried about what you were doing). We both felt good about TT at the same time. We both felt bad about mocsta at the same time and we both great about him at the same time. We both felt bad about CopCake at the same time. All of them for very similar reasons. I didn't like some of his reasoning on mocsta early, and I thought some of his other reasoning was bad (he said something like the "you're never going to lynch me" was townie, which feels like a typical meaningless thing that Regfan will read into in the wrong way early because he sucks at mafia), and he thought some of the things I posted were bad (there's generally going to be a bigger ratio of that, because I do more things that he dislikes than he does things that I dislike, mostly due to playstyle differences), but that's about it. I'm including his knowledge that you and CopCake are dating as meta knowledge, I guess. And you've not exactly been a small presence so far. I don't really know what else to say other than you're wrong? That's not really helpful for you, though. If you want to quote posts that don't make sense to you together then that might help, but I don't understand how you think that we've had different opinions when the only time our opinions have been out of sync has been when we're not caught up together. Like, one of the main things that we've done this game is voice our concerns early about mocsta, and we were both looking at pretty much the exact same things at the same time, which we both posted about, and which we then realized were wrong at the same time. All of that is in the game thread, except I didn't +1 our mocsta townread, and I was annoyed that he wasn't reading us properly and took longer to feel completely sold on it. It could be inexperience dealing with hydras? I'm not sure if you expect both of us to just say the exact same things all the time or not, but that doesn't really make sense, it would be annoying and redundant for everyone else to read if we just went "yes I agree with my hydra partner here is a slightly different telling of that same read" all game. We both focus on slightly different things and divide the work so that we can get more done and express both our individual perspectives properly. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
It looks too logic-heavy for me to parse when I'm heading out the door sorry but I like Calix votes right now based on how he was positioning himself on CopCake last night. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Going to dump some thoughts in my breaks at work so this'll come out in bits and pieces. -> Not remotely a fan of Koshi's entrance and posting so far, his buddying up to Rayn in particular is problematic given if Rayns town here I'm not seeing eye to eye with a fair chunk of his reads and can easily see mafia taking advantage of that as well as using him as an excuse to not have to actually post readable content. Would like others to let me know if this is just TypicalKoshiThings or not. -> Shockeeys posts thus far aren't much better than Koshis, dislike that his posts suggest he's already got around to reading parts of the thread but seeing little to no thoughts from him yet. Am very much hoping it's a case of him working towards a bigger catch up post but otherwise can see him easily being scum that's trying to coast through the day while focus is elsewhere. -> Box & Slendy being no-shows so far isn't great at all given we're more than half way through the day phase. Even moreso disappointing from Slendy given he's a large part of the reason I joined this game and was someone I thought I'd be able to still get a grip on and read even after all this time relatively easily. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Current headspace is that I'm very confident (Bet the game level) that there's never more than 1 scum inside of Rayn/Calix/Cake, have Rayn/Calix as non-aligned, Rayn/Cake as non-aligned and Calix/Cake as non-aligned meaning it's going to take a looooot to convince me to lynch inside that grouping since the odds of hitting mafia outside of that is significantly higher. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
If you think of at it from an angle of "Put them three to the side, remove people I'm confident are town" (Ideally it'll be 2-3 people at minimum) I'm left with a good chance of being in a position where I'm hitting in say 2/6 or 3/6 of the remainder which is fairly decent for D1. I consider the game as a puzzle so to speak, I build and move pieces until I've worked out and gamesolved and I've got a fairly high success rate doing it. If I go through the deep read throughs and come out thinking one of them is suuuper likely scum, obviously this changes and turns into a "They flip scum, clear 2 people from it" but as it currently sits I don't feel that way about any of them at all. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 15:12 Mocsta wrote:Aside from my wrong % (lol) this is still a fancy way to campaigning towards a lurker lynch - which I dont support. Im not going to argue this further. Its a philosophical opinion that people are entitled to have. Isn't really that at all. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Think you're just linking the fact that the players I've spoken about in my catch up post then are the lower-quantity posters and the fact that I'm not interested in lynching those three players (That happen to be active ones) as wanting to lynch in the inactives when it's merely just a case of I'd commented on those as they're the easiest ones to get down while I'm at work and the ones that require the least thinking about. Can understand how you'd have that stance though but isn't really what's happening. Anyway yeah, you're right, not worth discussing much more until I'm home and ready. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-> Still like Ticktocks early posting re; Rayn on a reread though the unlynchable comment isn't as strong a town tell as I had it earlier. Little conflicted as to what to make of his post about Cake/Calix in #315, the last sentence about Calix that I need to mull on a bit, it shows a huge amount of confidence to make a comment like that which I don't think matches the read he has or how quickly it was sort of reduced afterwards but it's also one that I don't very often see from scum and is a more natural thought to come from town. I like most of the process in #407 but the timing of the downplaying of the Calix read feels a bit like pandering there in a way that has a fair bit of scum motivation, not implausible to come from town that were able to pull back and admit they've mostly tunneled themselves into something though. Disagree with most of his #453 but can kind of understand how he might have those thoughts and especially like #455 process wise. Was hoping to solidify this town read a little more than I have, will have another go over him later but yeah, still think he's town but isn't a read I'm suuuuper confident on and would like to see where Gemma lands on him after we talk later. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 14:39 ShoCkeyy wrote:Meh, the only person I'm not feeling is tictock, they have "six" scum reads, me being included which I haven't done much like you said, and seem very indecisive when trying to pin some one as mafia, then the whole "I'm unlynachable" doesn't sit well. It's still early in D1 to tell, we have till 6pm EDT tomorrow before I actually make any decent reads unlike how everyone is at each others throats D1 calling each other scum instead of working together to find scum lol... but yea, that bigger catchup post will happen. I'll happily take some thoughts of yours thrown out now over a bigger post later at this point. Actually forming a read on your slot would be hella useful and I don't think I've got enough to do that with right now. Don't need you to 'be at someones throat' or need huge explanations for reads but just picking the players you're most confident on and writing a sentence or two about them would do me since right now I only see your stance on TT and while I can follow some of the logic behind it, it isn't a read I'm in agreeing with conclusion wise. (Also to state that people aren't working together to find scum while prolonging your content until later in the day is eh, need to remember timezone wise there's a few of us that won't be around for the last like 10 hours of the day phase.) - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
@Conversion - 1) Can you please just run through where your concern with HF stems from; what's he done here or previously that makes you think he's a worthy policy lynch type player? Can you also try and pull away from your issues with him as a person/player and run through what you think of his alignment in this game 2) How'd your dive into TT go, wouldn't mind you running through your stance on Vivax a little more for me, in #373, you mention you don't really think either him or Calix is mafia, I can follow your reasoning for not thinking they're a scum team there but I don't really see much more to it and removing him and throwing Shockwave/Koshi as your lynch pool feels fairly lazy. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I disagree with his analysis on Moscsta re; Mosctas "If HF does this he's town" comment but I can very much follow his thought process there and think his own turn around on Moscta in #286 and #324 read very town. I find his reads/thoughts/analysis very easy to follow and understand in posts like #255 and #261 and pretty much all up can see him actually trying to work towards gamesolving inside his posts, his pushes, votes and reads all ring very genuine. Would consider him my second strongest town read after Moscta at the moment. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Going to run through why I think you're wrong on Calix here because I'm pretty sure you're both town and I think it's important you realise that and actually start focusing elsewhere. Running through your case in #441. --> I think it was relatively obvious that Gemmas post was either a) pre-game or b) copy-pasta and not a serious post from a neutrals point of view, both of which aren't really alignment indicative so Calix's stance there shouldn't be "strange". --> Calix voted HF at 9:22, 22 minutes after game-start and a time when HF hadn't posted, it was clearly a joke/RVS vote, that's pretty standard from just about everywhere I play and I don't think there's anything to make of that. --> A large part of the reason you've stated for scum reading Calix is his reasoning behind his scum read on you, does the fact that both Gemma and myself, not just agreed with but mentioned some of these similar reasons (And I think Moscta did too) before Calix even said it affect your thoughts here? If you're town here, he can easily be town and just wrong about you, it doesn't mean his thought process was impossible at all. His concern was with the fact that it felt like you were buddying players in the manner you were giving out reads. --> He wasn't saying that he doesn't care about old games and meta at all, just stating that the strength and impact of meta isn't enough to completely whittle down his scum read on you, that's logical. I think meta is often horrendously used by a lot of players and have seen it lose town games frequently, don't take "meta" on board quickly is a good thing. You need to be able step back here, assess here. - R (Also fwiw, I'm actually pretty damn sure you're town here and that he is too). | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 20:15 Calix wrote: I'm as good as rayn and HF? Since when? lmao Anyway I've skimmed the thread. I'm making the executive decision to largely ignore the TWO (!!!) giant cases against me since I'll be working for most of the day and putting me on the defense near EOD is a really bad idea. I'll be around for EOD though so I can do some filter-diving and give reads then ^^ Also Regfan goes up a notch for being sensible, looking into things and discouraging that dumb fight or whatever you'd call it between Tictock and Mocsta (while Mocsta's case was pretty bad, it's not mafia-terrible, I don't think). Regfan also realises that, in a game where about 1/3 of the players aren't actually playing, lynching someone who is playing on D1 is suboptimal. Yes, yes, this argument is really self-serving but it's not wrong so you should probably just do it. In a normal game, this would be the part where I tell you who the best lynch is but I would be lying if I said I had any preference. Sure, I can analyse Koshi/ ShoCkeyy/ Vivax or whine about how terrible it is that two players haven't posted yet. But I don't think it's possible to accurately assess players with such low post counts so I don't see the point of wasting time by pretending to do so. I could lynch literally any of them right now and my thoughts are probably not changing until they actually start doing stuff. I actually think you're town now and so does Regfan, he's taking care of that and I'm supposed to be taking care of our lynch but I'm not really functional IRL right now so I could use some help, I know you've kind of fallen apart and don't know who to lynch at all but I'd appreciate having your voice. My favored lynches right now are Vivax/TT/Conversion but Regfan doesn't want to lynch TT and Mocsta says that Vivax is self-resolving so I feel a little bit stuck. It's probably worse because I feel like shit and my reads on them are basically just gut at this point. Anyway I'm going to filter them and try to read and figure out what I think properly and put down some stuff in thread hopefully and would really appreciate it if you look over it with me if you feel up for it. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 20:27 Calix wrote: Wasn't that post #203 that Gemma made this comment about? O.o Is something she linked me to very recently. On June 27 2018 20:33 CopCake wrote: I made a beautiful case against Calix and in went directly to the bathroom it seems. Have made a big post about yours above. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I had a town read on TT but Gemma is leaning the opposite way and he's the sort of player that I think normally slips through my cracks on D1 so think he's certainly worthwhile another look over and a conversation with Gemma about at minimum. Also want to go over Rayn, initial impression from his posting here is that he's probably frustratingly town but it's a read I want to make sure on because I know how much shit he'll give me if he's scum and I'm wrong on him post-game and losing to him if his tactic was to fake spitting the dummy to get out of posting would be very painful. If people want to talk to me about anyone in particular some more while I'm doing some reading, go for it. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 08:15 Mocsta wrote: ##Vote: Calix + Show Spoiler [quotes] + On June 26 2018 08:06 Calix wrote: Sup, long time no see. Fancy randomly bandwagoning some AFK person for the lulz? On June 26 2018 08:14 Tictock wrote: On second thought, lets vote Regfan, purely for having an obscene prepared post, that I will prob never read. On June 26 2018 08:15 Calix wrote: It was clearly written before he received his role because if he was an investigative role, he (or she, since this is Gemma?) would know that Cops on this site don't get N0 checks. Thus it's not AI. I would like to know more about the two players in the hydra though. How many games have they played, where are they from, stuff like that. On June 26 2018 10:05 raynpelikoneet wrote: Calix literally didn't take a stance on anything since the conclusion says "not alignment indicative". Which is by the way the opposite you claimed a conclusion towards your post should be in the first place. Secondly, the conclusion sucks even more since the first paragraph of her post includes an indirect assumption that your hydra is town, which again contradicts clearly to the conclusion she has made. There is no reason to believe, in case your post is pre-written, that you do not believe you have a cop check on N0 as a cop so a smart person, instead of making that post would instead of writing a nice looking nice sounding nonsense post ask "why don't you wanna claim your check right now?" If you think people who are being nice are more likely to be town and people who are not nice are not, then you have a very terrible view of what this game is about. Also if what you said here: ..if you actually believe this, then you should probably call yourself mafia for the very first post you made this game. On June 26 2018 10:49 Tictock wrote: I'm not sure I saw anything in Calix's post that made the assumption that Gemma-Reg is town, but I overall agree with rayn here. Calix's switch in stance from "lets rando vote someone for lol's" to "thats not AI, don't vote" seemed sudden to me. Especially when my suggestion to pile votes on Reg had nothing to do with alignment. I feel slightly hypocritical here though, kus I switched my own stance of "I don't wanna vote pointlessly" to off the cuff voting someone just kus they did something I think is stupid. Actually maybe I do see what you mean here Rayn, there is no way Calix should be able to make any assumption about when Reg prepared that post. PM's went out an hour before the game started so there was plenty of time to decide to do something like that after getting a role, and there should be no real way to tell when someone makes that call. Anyways, I'll optimistically call Rayn and Mocsta town here. On June 26 2018 10:54 raynpelikoneet wrote: If the underlined part is really what Calix believes, there is no reason to assume a mafia fakecliming to be a cop would not believe they don't have a N0 check (since that's how it clearly works where Gemma usually plays, and there are indications of that for anyone whop has ever played anywhere else since it's almost always how it works). So instead of writing the post off as non-alignment indicative any smart person -- again, believing what Calix clearly implies here -- would try to possibly catch a mafia in a lie by asking "so why don't you wanna claim your check now?" Calix has struck me as a player who digs into stuff and small discrepancies even when they possibly don't matter (especially in the game where i was mafia with bugs and oats), and this "ignorance" towards a possibly revealing discussion seems very un-Calix-like. I have highlighted key parts of the quotes in red, as I do believe this is a genuine scum slip/town tell & may have gone over most peoples heads. (1) Calix requests random vote bandwagon (2) Regfan posts a fake post (3) TT requests to vote Regfan (implied to Calix) (4) Calix provides "analysis of Regfan post" by commenting on validity of cop claim (5) Other posters comment on "Regfan post" by simply stating "copypasta" What I find critical about this sequence of events is that: - Calix cop claim assessment doesn't consider a world where Regfan is mafia and fake-posting, instead - Calix auto-assumes a world where Regfan is cop or VT This is important because Calix is changing gears from "random vote" to "analysis before vote" to provide this contribution that is in essence providing town-lean evidence to upgrade from scummy to NULL. This only satisfies mafia agenda. You provide authentic contribution (i.e. town read), make a potential ally in Regfan, and possibly start a wagon on those that scum read Regfan. I think the townier way to go about the fake-post was what others did. Comment that its a copy/paste and move on. In a world where you only have your PM that is green or blue; how do you read into that fake-post any further.... well, you cant. So why does Calix then go out on a limb so early? Why jump to the conclusion that a fake-post is from town land only? Why change gears in the first place? I absolutely understand why town and scum would not want to random vote; but I cannot comprehend why any town would want to feign a care-free attitude to then ditch it immediately. I want to respond to this before I start on anything else because I know you said you value my input considering how differently we think about things, and I don't want you to think that I don't respect your reads or care about the work you've done. I actually don't think what you're looking at is super indicative, I think town make small assumptions like that pretty often and sometimes it's just that they make an inductive leap or because it isn't or doesn't seem necessary. I don't think you're right that what he did only satisfies scum agenda. I understand what you're seeing there, but I think it can also just be him as town making a post, maybe a bad post, but just a post about things that he thought. I kind of think that you might be going a little too deep. I don't think that mafia very often think on that many levels inside one post, or try to do all of those things at once like that. Not that early in the game anyway. I think if you simplify the whole thing, then you've got Calix seeing people talk about something, recognizing to himself that it's not actually indicative, and moving to put a close to a discussion that isn't really fruitful by saying that it's not AI. I think there's actually a fair bit more mafia motivation in stirring shit up about it, trying to keep town distracted from meaningful gamesolving, keep them thinking that it's a scummy or weird post, or even attacking someone who is attacking it. I don't know if any of that makes sense or not or helps you at all. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
(Just for you, person whose name I don't even remember who thinks this hydra is boring and awful. Ugh, I blame Regfan for this flood control.) Oh uh, Regfan forgot to sign a post too, cool. 509 is R, 510 is G. -- (Fuck flood control. I'm still trying to find a Conversion post to filter him) On June 27 2018 14:39 ShoCkeyy wrote: Meh, the only person I'm not feeling is tictock, they have "six" scum reads, me being included which I haven't done much like you said, and seem very indecisive when trying to pin some one as mafia, then the whole "I'm unlynachable" doesn't sit well. It's still early in D1 to tell, we have till 6pm EDT tomorrow before I actually make any decent reads unlike how everyone is at each others throats D1 calling each other scum instead of working together to find scum lol... but yea, that bigger catchup post will happen. Actually, add this person to my lynch pool. This thread entrance feels way too informed and narrow. I also dislike that they have no other presence in the game and didn't stick around at all after making it. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I'm not going to continue to talk with you about this though, because really can't be more clear than what I have. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Maybe there's a reason that Gemma and myself weren't playing much as a hydra for the prior parts? Hmmm. Let me think, oh yeah, I wasn't fucking here for ~20 hours and mentioned a few times I'm going to my girlfriends last night and would have zero chance to get to a computer. You know, that thing that I haven't been joining games of mafia for a while due to and why I've had to tell you no to playing prior games, yeah that? This really should be something that you'd have realised fucking ages ago. Oh and me playing this game a jigsaw puzzle and that I'm trying to break things into blocks and solve them that way re; what I was saying with you/calix/cake, the same thing where I've mentioned I assess things differently and look for anti-alignments in games to you before I agreed to come play a game here. And it really shouldn't be that difficult to understand why I'm more hesitant when it comes to reading you here, I pretty much know if you're scum and I state a town read on you here, you'll shoot me N1 and then make fun of me post-game for misreading you; sure I may have had a fairly good grip on reading you in the past, and heck, maybe I still do, but I've made it pretty clear in that I've changed a lot as a player since back then and I'm normally more patient when it comes to some reads. I wanted to be able to interact with you a lot and actually see you gamesolve to be able to solidify a read on you. But yeah, you're town, I don't think you go with this much of a stupid attack here if you're scum at all and think it's literally just another case of you not thinking about anything deeply at all, or stepping back and analysing and trying to solve. So congrats, you've properly tilted me, happens very fucking rarely, but yeah, you're wrong on Calix, you're town and you're still completely unbearable to play with and I'm going for a run because I don't want to even deal with this shit anymore. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
I really disliked the way he was pushing on HF, I also don't know if I entirely believe that he was just joking about scumreading him, because in #349 he responds to a serious post about a different read by saying he's not pushing that person, he's pushing HF. If his HF push is a joke, this feels like abusing that as a way to avoid responsibility for other stances, which would be the main mafia motivation for such a tunnel in the first place. He also says in #373 that HF is in his lynch pool, and given that the rest of that post is entirely serious, I don't really understand him not dropping the shtick there if that's what it was and being like "okay I'm being real now guys, here's my lynch pool" or whatever. Sidenote I have no idea why I keep gendering Calix as male. #216 was the first post where I started to feel tangibly bad about him, the way he talks about Cake feels disconnected but that's really just a little thing and more gut than actual reasoning I can talk about in a sensible way. I'm a little bothered by the difference between his serious posts and the rest of his content. It feels fake somehow, that he's making a lot of little bite-sized posts that are kind of empty, then interspersing them with more serious ones. I don't know exactly how to explain this right now but the process inconsistency there feels bad. I also just don't really have any real idea of who Conversion really thinks is mafia and why. I don't think he's really put himself out there at all or taken any meaningful stances and that also feels bad. His read on us in particular I dislike. It feels like he's been trying to deny us towncred for as long as possible. He started off by asking people why we were town, excluding the most obvious reasons why we were town, then later says that we're logical in a good way but unmemorable and it doesn't feel like something he's genuinely thought through on his own. He also says that we're unmemorable literally right after rereading us, so I don't understand how that's even a thought? That's from #373, if you want to go see what I mean. I also think the way he has treated Vivax is weird, he's said twice now that he doesn't feel like Vivax+1 make sense as mafia together but not really shown any deeper thought than that and that doesn't feel genuine to me. I struggle to follow his thoughts in #517 and for the most part the way he talks about his stances feels kind of fake. I wouldn't say I strongly scumread him by any means but I don't think he's town right now and I don't think I'd be opposed to lynching him today. There are a bunch of little things from him that I sort of slightly dislike, one or two things that I dislike more, and not really anything from him that I like except his tone and well, the fact that he's at least made some posts. I would definitely appreciate some help with this read because there's probably a chance that some or a lot of this is playstyle and I don't really want to get hung up on that kind of thing. I wouldn't mind hearing him respond to any parts of this that he feels inclined to, especially if he were to talk about who he actually wants to lynch and why that would be really great. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 22:19 Conversion wrote: These are exactly the type of posts I have an issue with concerning your play. You make this long-winded post that is teetering on the edge of painting me scum, and even saying you wouldn’t mind lynching me, but then you do this soft cry for help shit. Stick to your guns and actually push and make a read? If my playstyle is scummy to you, then stick to that. If you’re unsure, then don’t lynch me over your stronger scumreads If I'm not sure about my read on you, I'm not going to pretend to be sure. That would be stupid and horrible play. I'm also not going to not talk about a read just because I'm not sure about it. Don't tell me how to play and I won't tell you how to play, thanks. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 22:37 Conversion wrote: I’m not “dictating” how you play, I’m calling bullshit on you partly scumreading me because I’m trying to “debunk” your towncred. I had bad feelings about you even though what you were doing is town-aligned, hence the question to the thread. I moved on from it pretty quickly once it got no steam and I resolved myself you being most likely town and moving on to figuring out who I want to lynch D1. If you don’t want me talking to your points, don’t ask me to softly clarify in your posts. Simple as that. Right, that's why you addressed none of my actual concerns and instead just insulted the way I play the game. Screw off. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 22:49 Calix wrote: You cannot be serious. Instead of trying to explain yourself to others so that they can understand where you're coming from, you deliberately leave things vague and up to interpretation. Even though, from your POV, I'm either misreading you (as town) or I'm intentionally misrepresenting your posts (as mafia). I don't see how a townie makes this post ever. So I'm just going with ShoCkeyy/ Vivax/ ??? for my current scum reads. I'd like some thoughts on ShoCkeyy/ Calix from the rest of the thread please. Regfan has Shock and Vivax as unaligned and he's never wrong about unaligns, fyi. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 02:35 Calix wrote: No, I was calling you mafia for that within the context of when you posted about the inactives while a bunch of other shit was going down. Meanwhile I'm talking about inactives because few of the active people look like good D1 lynch candidates. Okay yeah, I could #yolo vote Regfan or HF but that would be dumb since they'll actually play and respond to accusations and the like. Also I'm going to ask you why you think HF is townish now. You were scum-reading him, then you said you felt better about him but you never really explained why or what posts made you conclude that. @rayn, if you don't like Regfan's reasoning then try this. I don't think mafia almost ever makes this post when they're in the position that Calix was in there. There are two main things for me here to notice about the context of this post. 1. If he's mafia then he had been spending a bunch of effort in trying to pocket us, earlier when we were pushing similar reads to him. 2. At the time of this post he was being widely scumread and basically no one was defending him. Now look at his attitude here. He's saying that he could yolovote us (who he knows are town, and who he was actively trying to pocket earlier) / isn't sold on us being town. If he's mafia, that is going to feel like a super super sketchy as fuck thing to put into thread, he has to have a super super high amount of confidence in order to go there, but there's no way he has that kind of confidence because he has to think he's always dying at that point as scum. It's also just a completely natural way to express yourself. "Sure I could vote them I guess but I don't really want to because they're actually playing" is not the way mafia treat us there, not without overdoing it. Furthermore, he's actively shooting himself in the foot if he's mafia, because he's risking estranging us, and it runs completely against what he was trying to do, to buddy us and get us to townread him. You can't fake that kind of a turnaround without it coming across really clunky and that isn't clunky at all. And the last little bit about HF is just, I don't think it ever even occurs to him to bring HF into the conversation there if he's mafia. I wouldn't be defending him like this if Regfan didn't townread him as strongly as he does but I believe in Regfan, I townread Calix as well and even if we don't hit scum today I'd really like to not see a townread get lynched. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 23:10 Koshi wrote: Ended up reading TT and think we should vote Vivax over Calix. I'll still follow rayn but Vivax looks worse from what I read. hard yikes -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Regfan Mocsta Holyflare Calix raynpelikoneet CopCake TheSlenderMan boxerfred Conversion Ticktock Vivax Koshi ShoCkeyy We wouldn't lynch anyone in the top tier right now and we think they're all town with varying levels of confidence. We'd both bet the game on Mocsta being town, and I don't think we're very doubtful of anyone in that grouping being town. The second lot are question marks but probably not people we would lynch today when it comes down it, unless we couldn't get anyone in the bottom grouping, and the bottom grouping are people we scumread to some degree, although I'm somewhat uncomfortable voting Vivax at this point given Koshi's treatment of him. I feel really conflicted about all of my scumreads which isn't particularly good when it's supposed to be my job to take care of that side of things but I'm in the middle of a nervous breakdown IRL so I'm just going to blame that. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 21:11 Vivax wrote: Hydra boi is lock town @Vivax, why did you say this re: Regfan? | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
| ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 00:01 CopCake wrote: How am I even town in the eye of both you? Lol Didn't Reg talk about his townread on you? I didn't hate the reasoning he gave me and my own read on you is that some of your responses have felt genuine and your reads feel almost too stupid to be mafia. I don't really know how to put that nicely, sorry, it's late. You're our weakest townread, if that makes you feel any better. I'm mostly just giving the read to Reg honestly since he has actual feelings about you and I don't, plus I can't be bothered dealing with rayn. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 00:10 Tictock wrote: Why do you want to lynch me? I’ll admit I sometimes just skim your guy’s posts but I don’t recall you sharing anything about that. Because of posts like this. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
o.O -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 00:42 ShoCkeyy wrote: When did you read HF town? I may have missed it in your essays. I started townreading him based on his Vivax push, Reg followed suit a bit after. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 00:51 Holyflare wrote: So what's wrong with the evaluation of the vivax lynch that you complain about it while joining it? Koshi moved there. I was very comfortable lynching Vivax until then. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 00:54 Holyflare wrote: Can we get some kind of paraphrasing of your conversations together and the medium through which you communicated each reg/gemma? Discord. And no, I really can't be bothered. I'm too tired and worn out by this shitty game. You can read our filter if you want to know what our reads are, our chats are just those in short form. If you can't already tell that we're town then getting a paraphrase of our talks together isn't going to help you. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:05 Vivax wrote: Yawn Didn't peace out for long I'm back at a pc. Why I said that regfan? Cause I felt like saying it? No deep reason behind it just a thought that was crossing my mind at the time. Why are you voting TT? -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
-G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:15 Holyflare wrote: Fwiw I'm kinda off this vivax is mafia train. Will be voting tt when i can be bothered. Can't really see us voting TT today, fwiw. I scumread him but not at all confidently, certainly not confidently enough to lynch him with how active he's been for day 1, also Regfan townreads him (albeit weakly) and I'm pretty confident that I can get a stronger read on him tomorrow regardless of his alignment. And on the plus side if he's mafia we'll get to bleed him for spew. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:21 raynpelikoneet wrote: Gemma i dont want to engage because she wants to engage me but when i do she doesnt. You should tell her its bad. I have zero desire to engage with you for the rest of the game after the way you treated Regfan. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Just quickly, the main thing I mentioned to Regfan re: TT when he asked me to sell him on that scumread was the way that his scumreads progressed, his worlds started to become noticeably incongruent around the time he started backing off Calix. I also don't really like the way he's been catching up recently, making more personal type appeal posts to people that don't actually have anything to do with his reads or solving the game. He's probably my strongest scumread even if I don't want to lynch him today (for reasons I already went over). Would really like to see more from him and be able to interact with him real-time some to solidify my read there. We both think the way Vivax treated TT in #539 was slimy, he's the kind of player that I know I will be able to get a solid read on at some point in the game based on some reaction from him or something impulsive he does in the moment somewhere, and there are certain things from him tonally that make me shy away from super scumreading him, but he hasn't done anything to make me really want to pull him out of the lynch pool today. I only weakly scumread him and feel meh about lynching him but he's not a bad lynch. Shock's thread entrance was really icky and I dislike the things that he has been focusing on. I don't think his meta self-defense means anything for his alignment and I don't really like the way he's been making big-ish posts at the end of the dayphase here but not really interacting with anyone about reads or show me that he's actively solving the game in a meaningful way. Feel mildly annoyed that people don't want to lynch him but I don't feel strongly enough about killing him to force the issue. Koshi just hasn't done anything except sheep rayn and when I think there's a pretty high chance of at least 1 mafia in the inactives I can find exactly 0 reasons not to lynch him other than how little information it will give us. Lynch preference is Shock>Koshi>Vivax, would vote in Conversion/TT to secure a lynch that isn't Calix. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:34 Vivax wrote: Mocsta is totally mafia btw ... No. I actually want to lynch you now. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:38 Holyflare wrote: I also don't like this. It would quite succinctly tie up your alignment for me if you could do it. It really shouldn't be hard either because you just have a history log on discord right? Why is the game shitty when you seem to have narrowed a quite substantial town list down? Because it's fucking toxic, rayn made Regfan hate the game when he's trying to get back into mafia and find time to enjoy it again, I love Regfan and you have no idea how much that horseshit fucking pisses me off it's actually unbelievable how insensitive rayn and his girlfriend have been towards Reg. Not to mention half the players have just been insulting us for our playstyle. So yeah it's a shitty game. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 02:02 Holyflare wrote: I don't really understand what rayn did to annoy him at all to be honest. Your playstyle is good but it's just the fact you're a hydra that people are "annoyed" about (I'm pretty sure only mocsta or rayn have even commented on this) since you're not playing like a hydra, you are just two players posting from one account. If quoting timestamps weren't illegal, then I would be more than happy to just c/p for you. We have been playing like hydra and I don't get your insistence that we haven't. We disagree on ONE read, which is TT. What are you even talking about? Literally all of the reads I've talked about over the past few hours have either been things that we've talked about together, or things that Reg has given me charge over or asked me to talk about. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 27 2018 22:39 CopCake wrote: And I dont like regfan being all “oh but i havent played you know this rayn” Sounds like appeal to emotion. Everyone is busy. Everyone has a life. Me right now is answering from a gym so yeah. You shouldn't have touched this, at all, with a ten foot pole, CopCake. Anyway, I'm upset about this, and I don't want to talk about it because it's not helpful. I'm overdue for sleep anyway. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 02:11 Conversion wrote: I don’t understand why I’m considered toxic for calling you, Regfan/Gemma, out for coming to the conclusion of being “okay” with a lynch when there are clear, STRONG scumreads from your other posts? Yeah, I could have packed it up nicer, but I attacked your stance and words. It’s BS to think that town would be “okay” with a lynch instead of pushing for their clear scum reads, especially one (two?) who has the presence of mind to be able to talk through and actively drive discussion. You got mad at me because I didn’t “address” any of your other glaring concerns because I didn’t disagree with anything else but that. The fact that you’re still carrying on with a “I’ll lynch a null read over my town Calix read” instead of convincing others on your stronger scum reads does not give you town credibilty in my eyes. None whatsoever. I didn't call you toxic. Who are you even talking to? I'm voting Vivax, I've never tried to lynch you at any point in this game. And I didn't get mad at you, btw. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Votecount has changed drastically since when I went to bed. Can someone make a two line post on why it's mostly moved away from Vivax etc and who I should vote/why please. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 07:45 Calix wrote:Wasn't a particular reason it moved away from Vivax aside from people preferring TT/ myself/ ShoCkeyy. But vote ShoCkeyy plz. If you want a case, just skim his filter. I don't even think it needs an explanation. Going to try and read Shockey now, in a weird spot where I don't think Shocky/Vivax are partners and have a ~decent~ strength scum read on Vivax here so blah, especially since I've got a message from Gemma saying if I wake up and there's a chance to lynch TT I should since she thinks he's mafia. God fucking damn it. Also never worth lynching BF & TSM here, if they're town, we learn nothing, if they're scum, we still learn almost nothing given there'll be no interaction analysis to do. Leave them to the mod, deal with them tomorrow if they're not modkilled. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
- R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
If there's modkills in the game, it's taking away one shot of us hitting scum that we could use better. If there's not modkills then we can make sure to overly focus on the slot tomorrow. Aiming at BF or TSM here doesn't make sense, regardless of their alignment. - R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Maybe Gemma will feel otherwise and keep playing or ideally we just die tonight but consider me done. -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Hunt inside Vivax, Shockey, TT, GSM, Conversion and Koshi. TT did vote to save himself and at :59, timing that makes more sense for mafia to do it where there's minimal time for people to react to the vote and 5he way the EOD played out there's some worlds that he fits inside of as mafia, Vivax-TT is 100% a world people need to entertain and look inside of tomorrow. There's probably only ever 1 in Shockey/Vivax which is why Shockeys flip would have helped immensely but if you hit scum in these two would suggest moving the other to the side for a bit. Vivax / TT + 1 of Koshi/TSM sort of fits a few things. Okay you've got my thoughts albeit I've missed a lot of content from pages 30 to 50, now can feel better about leaving and never coming back to this game again. Oh and everyone that actually voted Boxer can go fuck themselves. Outtahere -R | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 09:17 Holyflare wrote: I know this is a post from Gemma but notice how it says here "we both think". This clearly means they talked or "talked" about vivax's treatment of ticktock and found it slimy. Reg hadn't been to the thread for ages so this should be about the last thing he remembers them talking about but it is never a factor. Are you fucking kidding me. -G | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Bye, enjoy whatever the fuck this game is. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
Gemma - Yesterday at 9:01 PM yeah http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/534607-chill-hop-mafia?page=20#381 Regfan - Yesterday at 9:01 PM not sure how up to date you are on the thread Gemma - Yesterday at 9:01 PM i don't get how mafia can talk that way Regfan - Yesterday at 9:01 PM but i've dumped a LOT of analysis lately Gemma - Yesterday at 9:01 PM in that situation ok i'm at page 22 or so Regfan - Yesterday at 9:01 PM ah, page 25 is me walling nonstop Gemma - Yesterday at 9:02 PM goodie Regfan - Yesterday at 9:02 PM really like that calix post that you linked also feel free to correct me if you disagree but i kind of feel like this second half of d1 has felt even more dead than the first half and i can easily see that being the case if it's cake/calix walling each other and scum reading each other and they're t/t here and scum just standing back Gemma - Yesterday at 9:04 PM i mean i think tt is mafia and pulled back on scumreading calix at at point where it looked like he was going to be lynched so yes i think that's the world we're in Regfan - Yesterday at 9:04 PM i need to talk with rayn in real time badly if he's town here he's likely to decide the lynch he's got koshi and cake as his 2nd & 3rd voters imo Gemma - Yesterday at 9:05 PM yeah we need to talk to mocsta too Regfan - Yesterday at 9:07 PM hum Gemma - Yesterday at 9:07 PM he's reading calix for a lot of stuff that doesn't mean anything Regfan - Yesterday at 9:07 PM oh, yeah i'm planning on dropping a post on calix/cake as a duo-post and then doing a separate post re; rayns & moscatos cases on calix is next on my list after that i've just got a rayn post/vivax post and to talk with you and i'm fully up to date Gemma - Yesterday at 9:10 PM ok i'm not sure if i'm doing well enough to post anything but i'll try Regfan - Yesterday at 9:12 PM np just try and catch up and read my posts i'm happy to be the one making the posts in the thread (i have the night free) but want you to be up to date with where my heads at so we can have a proper convo Gemma - Yesterday at 9:19 PM i'm caught up Regfan - Yesterday at 9:20 PM agree HF is VERY town? i went over calix, dude is obvtown imo Gemma - Yesterday at 9:21 PM yes how confident are you on calix? Regfan - Yesterday at 9:22 PM mocsta>hf=calix huge gap, everyone else Gemma - Yesterday at 9:23 PM so let's save him? Regfan - Yesterday at 9:23 PM yeah, i'm going over cakes case on him atm Gemma - Yesterday at 9:23 PM k Regfan - Yesterday at 9:23 PM let me focus on that part? and you focus on who we're actually lynching -G Mocsta, get out of here, you're too nice for this site. Calix, I really like you, you remind me of a good friend of mine from the site where I normally play, you should also never play here again. I really think you're dead wrong on TT. Never ever ever ever ever lynch like that again, please. | ||
|
Regfan
124 Posts
On June 28 2018 01:50 Regfan wrote: I'm going to bed. Regfan will hopefully be up before deadline to check in quickly and move our vote if it needs moving. Please don't lynch Calix. Just quickly, the main thing I mentioned to Regfan re: TT when he asked me to sell him on that scumread was the way that his scumreads progressed, his worlds started to become noticeably incongruent around the time he started backing off Calix. I also don't really like the way he's been catching up recently, making more personal type appeal posts to people that don't actually have anything to do with his reads or solving the game. He's probably my strongest scumread even if I don't want to lynch him today (for reasons I already went over). Would really like to see more from him and be able to interact with him real-time some to solidify my read there. We both think the way Vivax treated TT in #539 was slimy, he's the kind of player that I know I will be able to get a solid read on at some point in the game based on some reaction from him or something impulsive he does in the moment somewhere, and there are certain things from him tonally that make me shy away from super scumreading him, but he hasn't done anything to make me really want to pull him out of the lynch pool today. I only weakly scumread him and feel meh about lynching him but he's not a bad lynch. Shock's thread entrance was really icky and I dislike the things that he has been focusing on. I don't think his meta self-defense means anything for his alignment and I don't really like the way he's been making big-ish posts at the end of the dayphase here but not really interacting with anyone about reads or show me that he's actively solving the game in a meaningful way. Feel mildly annoyed that people don't want to lynch him but I don't feel strongly enough about killing him to force the issue. Koshi just hasn't done anything except sheep rayn and when I think there's a pretty high chance of at least 1 mafia in the inactives I can find exactly 0 reasons not to lynch him other than how little information it will give us. Lynch preference is Shock>Koshi>Vivax, would vote in Conversion/TT to secure a lynch that isn't Calix. -G On June 28 2018 08:38 Regfan wrote: HF, Cake, Rayn, Moscta and Calix are still all town, if you fuckwits can learn to come and work together this games still winnable. Hunt inside Vivax, Shockey, TT, GSM, Conversion and Koshi. TT did vote to save himself and at :59, timing that makes more sense for mafia to do it where there's minimal time for people to react to the vote and 5he way the EOD played out there's some worlds that he fits inside of as mafia, Vivax-TT is 100% a world people need to entertain and look inside of tomorrow. There's probably only ever 1 in Shockey/Vivax which is why Shockeys flip would have helped immensely but if you hit scum in these two would suggest moving the other to the side for a bit. Vivax / TT + 1 of Koshi/TSM sort of fits a few things. Okay you've got my thoughts albeit I've missed a lot of content from pages 30 to 50, now can feel better about leaving and never coming back to this game again. Oh and everyone that actually voted Boxer can go fuck themselves. Outtahere -R Mocsta, please please please please please please leave this site and never ever come back. I'm begging you, for your own good. Please don't stay and "learn" from these people. | ||
| ||
