EPT[T] Jack of All Trades Mafia
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have to make sure my most recent game as town, as mafia and as third party were all hosted by Artanis after all, don't I? o/ | ||
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Let me check real quick if Palmar is in the game | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: ##PRESS DEVICE I like this guy. Devices are there to be pressed. Yoloswag all the way | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:17 Tubesock wrote: I've never played with a "device" although I was in Carol with presents so similiar? Why are they always scum favored? I'm newbdumb so this is an honest question. do you tend to ask a lot of question just because otherwise? | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:23 Tubesock wrote: It's a straight forward question. Oftentimes I'll ask someone what they think of X but I'm really just trying to read them as town/mafia. The device question probably isn't going to lead to a town/mafia read. Yes, I get it I'm scummy for not hunting scum in the first 23 minutes of game. it's fine, I do the same all the time. In fact if you look carefully at what you just quoted, I considered it quite unlikely for you to answer with "damn it, scumslip right there. Yes I waffle with questions I don't care about all the time" no need to get all dramatic. That's reserved for me | ||
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I'm pretty sure I played with you already and I'm pretty sure I heard who you were after the game... but I forgot | ||
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we had beef going on during a game, no beef in pms. | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:35 Alakaslam wrote: Wassup CHUPAZI BEFORE REASON see OMGUS.net I slay mafia teams by D2 but host error makes me die instead after confirming a scum town Fear me as both alignments; I bomb with the CHUPAZITRON 40K ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VGKDIsj.jpg) | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:41 raynpelikoneet wrote: no you literally said i tend to not be salty in PM's, again, you know this how? like I said, we had a huge shitstorm inthread 2 years ago and none whatsoever when we were pm'ing. That as well as my talks with Marv while we were both mafia in the invite game makes me believe that that isn't just an ingame / outgame thing about you but something you have in general when facing a lot of people or being one on one with someone. | ||
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I'd mind getting mislynched again because of some bullshit... | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: oh but the thing is we were clearly talking about a PM GAME with geript. Why would you take that out of context as town? because like I said, you tend to be a lot more toned down in pm's in general and the fact that you're so hyper in games comes from you being around a lot of people rather than it being ingame or outgame. At least imo and like I said, that does seem to be the case unless you changed drastically in the last couple years. | ||
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On March 03 2015 08:48 Keirathi wrote: If you are town and Toad is mafia, what exactly is his goal by saying "rayn doesn't tend to be salty in PMs"? You're blowing something completely trivial stupidly out of proportion. Is strange, yo. he's probably getting at "Toad is buddying", which is something I do as both mafia and town (look at my last town game, I buddied massively). But even if we ignore that I don't lie (on purpose) as mafia unless I absolutely have to, and the above is certainly not in that region even IF I'm mafia (I'm not). So whatever he thinks he has to know that I believe that to be true, he just doesn't want to know it. | ||
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On March 03 2015 09:00 sandroba wrote: @syllogism and foolishness I expect you both to suggest targets to shoot aproaching 24h. That way I (and the rest of town) can have an idea about your alignment and possibly follow up on one of you guys' suggestion. Also commenting as much as you can on stuff happening on the thread will also make it easy to id alignment, so if you are the town spirit post some to force the other dude to post aswel. wait, I thought they can't post and do anything other than their specific actions mentioned in the OP. ... They also have a few other powers to influence the game, but they cannot interact directly. I thought that means no talking for them and just randomly throw in their godpowers? | ||
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On March 03 2015 09:04 geript wrote: Also. I'm pretty sure I have a foolproof way to read Sandroba. It's actually quite interesting. does it involve shooting him in the process? | ||
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On March 03 2015 09:18 Half the Sky wrote: To answer you Damdred, from the previous page: not exactly, Rsoultin was the only one who bothered playing along while everyone else just ignored him. So yes you could have replaced the name with anyone else if you're looking for that kind of unconcerned but he was talking about the kind only Rsoultin showed. | ||
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On March 03 2015 09:34 Half the Sky wrote: Tube, how are you tracking people who are keeping open the option of shooting multiple people? Geript wanted to shoot me but pretty sure he was also looking at Onegu and Rayn to an extent. we just do it like with votes from now on. There's plenty of people I want dead in games, but only one I can vote. | ||
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agreed with (I think rayns?) idea that her early post was odd. She continues to make a lot of really, really crappy posts like: On March 03 2015 09:36 Half the Sky wrote: Which means SL is probably town as well. All in all, nothing like the shining beacon of towniness she was in last game. Leaning pretty heavy mafia right now, not only on lack of towniness but on actually being scummy the way she posts. That being said, can we please change it to just ##vote: XYZ I don't want someone to shoot someone because our "vote" and the official shooting phrase are the same thing except for a ':' ... | ||
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On March 03 2015 09:45 Half the Sky wrote: Might want to consider that was a conclusion from the previous post I was making. yeah I took both into consideration and just quoted the last one to keep it simple as I didn't go into detail about why I dislike it anyways | ||
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On March 03 2015 10:03 geript wrote: No. It's not the volatility. I'm assuming 3P won't die because of vest. That means we get to remove at least 3 KP from the game off the bat in addition to removing 2 people who don't really give a fuck about who they lynch. I've been ninja before. They tend to be pro town as surving lynches, when the only way to die is getting lynched gives you a boost to win the game because you can just outlast your opponent and win that way even if you don't figure it out. I also took 3 mafia bullets on n1 and n2 as a third party ninja by nature of being that townie. Trying to lynch third party is MASSIVELY anti-town. They're not using their shots to randomely shoot into town and unless we waste a townshot on one of them like today there's no downside to having them alive and let mafia shoot into them. | ||
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On March 03 2015 10:10 Fecalfeast wrote: I don't think we can find the ninjas reliably and I agree with toad's evaluation this is true as well. Just think about the role for a second. The entire point of it is to find the other ninja so even if you have never played it let's just assume it's difficult because otherwise the role would be imbalanced. It takes days to figure out the other ninja and it's a lot of work. Pushing for a ninja search troop means we effectively stop scumhunting. I can't stress enough how incredibly bad the idea from geript is but at the same time not a lot of people have played ninja on here or have experiences with it so I don't want to fault anyone for it. So let's just forget that. With that being said I need some sleep, see you tomorrow. | ||
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On March 03 2015 10:28 geript wrote: The last game I saw this was with VE and BH I think. Where VE got lynched after a missed shot I think. Like them potentially soaking up KP is possible but unlikely until D3-4 unless one of a handful of people get it. There's also the aspect that if they're a good/decent player, they can suck up roles/powers given by the spirits. Like if they get medic or vet it's pretty useless. Tracker would be useless too. Louie them remaining in the game leaves more room for mafia to hide in and has far more potential to fuck up town than help town. Assuming all 4 shots go off, odds are they only hit 1 mafia. Maybe 2 if we're really lucky. Imagine if like batsnacks, Slam, Mocsta or LS got the role though. Like shit would hit the fan real fast. Like that's the really important thing. Is it they're ever about to be lynched then they 100% will fire indescriminantly and likely hit town. This isn't even considering them presumptively killing people to get them off their back. The roles are super wifomy. Like I remember Kita shooting someone as 3P 10 minutes before a lynch to try and get multiple people killed and they could manipulate things that way too. Like they're really really bad for us unless they never shoot or only shoot perfectly. two things we can't count on. Like I said, I absorbed 3 mafia bullets in the game I played as ninja, on n1 and n2. Frankly, your own post even proves yourself wrong. You want to lynch a ninja showing that what they care the most about is surviving and not getting "mis"lynched before figuring out who's the other ninja. So they'll make sure that doesn't help. Your standpoint even pushes for more chaos. A game that pushes for ninja lynches is a game that makes it more likely for them to panic and act unreasonable while townies do no scumhunting and mafia's don't even have to pretend they're scumhunting because they can just ACTUALLY ninja-hunt, making it super hard to distinguish them from townies who are doing exactly the same. I agree with you, we don't want them to randomly shoot around but if it's someone who just likes doing that... sucks to be us, nothing we can do about it. We can't even lynch them d1 because they have a fucking protection from at least 1 bullet (reads like only 1shot protection and not actually unkillable like in my game). So you're talking about this stupid worst case scenario that is some random guy going yoloswag without caring one bit while actively pushing for making it more likely that they're doing exactly that. Yes, if shit is stupid for us shit is stupid for us. No need to make it worse, especially when it's REALLY FUCKING hard to find them and and IMPOSSIBLE to kill them as well as giving mafia one more cycle, essentially giving mafia +1 shot, assuming we manage to lynch a ninja on d2 and. That's best case scenario for us and we just gave mafia one more round (don't even get started on what happens if we lynch town as well as wasting a day of scumhunting because we ninja-hunted), as well as most likely at least one random dead guy because one of them paniced during n1. | ||
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On March 03 2015 10:40 Toadesstern wrote: Like I said, I absorbed 3 mafia bullets in the game I played as ninja, on n1 and n2. Frankly, your own post even proves yourself wrong. You want to lynch a ninja showing that what they care the most about is surviving and not getting "mis"lynched before figuring out who's the other ninja. So they'll make sure that doesn't help. Your standpoint even pushes for more chaos. A game that pushes for ninja lynches is a game that makes it more likely for them to panic and act unreasonable while townies do no scumhunting and mafia's don't even have to pretend they're scumhunting because they can just ACTUALLY ninja-hunt, making it super hard to distinguish them from townies who are doing exactly the same. I agree with you, we don't want them to randomly shoot around but if it's someone who just likes doing that... sucks to be us, nothing we can do about it. We can't even lynch them d1 because they have a fucking protection from at least 1 bullet (reads like only 1shot protection and not actually unkillable like in my game). So you're talking about this stupid worst case scenario that is some random guy going yoloswag without caring one bit while actively pushing for making it more likely that they're doing exactly that. Yes, if shit is stupid for us shit is stupid for us. No need to make it worse, especially when it's REALLY FUCKING hard to find them and and IMPOSSIBLE to kill them as well as giving mafia one more cycle, essentially giving mafia +1 shot, assuming we manage to lynch a ninja on d2 and. That's best case scenario for us and we just gave mafia one more round (don't even get started on what happens if we lynch town as well as wasting a day of scumhunting because we ninja-hunted), as well as most likely at least one random dead guy because one of them paniced during n1. *help = happen now really sleeping | ||
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I change my stance on the device, I'll want to guard it and not press it right now. Reason being that I'd assume it has something to do with interacting with our spirits (like we get a vote on which one to kill?) Rayn is a little weird and there's some things I really agree and some things I completly disagree. But that's good, he's hyper, I'm hyper, that's bound to happen so I like him despite being weird... or more to the point because he's weird. One of the things I really disagree is his mafiaread on Sandroba based on him being useless. Yes Sandroba is really good as town but he's also lazy as fuck if he so chooses to be. It's way to early to read him and he hasn't done anything worth noting yet. Lack of doing things early on is not an indicator for Sandroba being either alignment. If anything he'll continually post more useless stuff when mafia because he thinks he has to and so far he's under that treshhold making me think he's town if anything. I wouldn't bet VEs balls on that but I certainly wouldn't call him mafia. You mom, I'm sorry I still think HTS posts were really awkward early on. In the game we played in she just fit in from the get go. This time around she's going around making weird posts à la "ehehe, you thought so too? Man good thing, good thing :3" that just don't seem to fit in at all and read like she's forcing herself, which certainly is a mafia trait. Not as sure as I was on it yesterday as I do agree that a big game is harder in that regard and it could be she's not able to fit in due to the sheer number of people but damn... she was fucking confirmed town d1 last game. I'd still shoot that. I realized my talk about two people that are neither town nor mafia was stupid yesterday. I was right about what I said but I should not have said it. Now Geript (who I highly believe to be town atm... sadly) and I are more likely to be shot by them due to the simple fact that ctrl+f'ing the n-word (not the racial slur one!) won't show a 0 for both of us Please don't shoot me. So HTS still #1 priority for me right now. Comming in third would be Kita for getting in, posting hi and nothing else when he happens to be someone cheery as well. I'd expect him to do some useless 1 or 2 liner follow up at least. #2 priority right now is Breshke. Never played with him before so I didn't pay too much attention when he was posting but his posts were rubbing me the wrong way a lot. I saw that someone made a bigger post about him later on. Have not read that yet, I'll see if I agree with anything in there. | ||
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On March 03 2015 23:42 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yes Breshke has a really high chance of being mafia here but that would also probably mean Koshi is town which i am not willing to believe yet. Kosi's posting hasn't gotten any better he is just making some weird comments. see what I mean with there's some things that I really agree with and some things I just don't like your read on Sandro? This one is part of the "I really agree with it" group. Those were EXACTLY my thoughts as well  | ||
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On March 03 2015 23:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: So in your opinion sandroba hasn't done anything? In my opinion he has done things. The things he has done are both bad and not scumhunting. ftr there is absolutely no town player who can argue against my logic regarding the device. it is just not possible someone is that stupid. I guess you can say that. I'd say all he's done so far are two posts: On March 03 2015 09:23 sandroba wrote: andIt's pretty nice in theory, but all we need is one person to randomly decide they want to shoot to screw with town pretty hard in case of a miss. The person is probably going to be mislynched the next day, because they will probably be town and there is no way to commit to this plan without setting up a pusnishment the next day. So this will sum up to the equivalent of 2 mislynches if things go south. That's why I think the best plan is for me to try to shoot correctly in 24h. All the glory or all the shame, I'll take my chances =P. On March 03 2015 09:36 sandroba wrote: well if somehow everyone gets behind it I see no problem turning this into a normal lynch. This will require extreme self-control by a town player who is about to get shot, however, because if you manage to shoot before someone shoots you, you will waste 2 of town lynches instead of one. which like you said, is not scumhunting but it's really early in the day so I don't mind yet. The other posts he did are just whatever. The only bad thing I see about him is that he feels the need to post this one, which isn't really his style imo: On March 03 2015 09:28 sandroba wrote: Also please can you guys please stick to the game in question? Half the posts in this thread are pretty hard for me to decifer what the hell people are even talking about, tons of people randomly aggroing each other for no good reason, tons of pointless spam. Let's keep it straight foward please. | ||
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On March 04 2015 00:27 Half the Sky wrote: Toad is reminding me much on the way he played in Hammertime. He's most likely town, as he's starting off relatively carefree (looking at his first 4-5 posts) and the question to Tubesock is coming off natural considering he doesn't know him (whereas I've played with both separately and I'd expect Tube to be making those elementary questions). The scumread on me is also following logically, since he has his expectation on how I should be playing, though I feel I've answered his concern there. Also his logic in arguing against the 3p campaign is pretty sound, and we're coming to the same conclusion on Kita as well. To me disagreement on the Sandroba read doesn't jump out to me as alignment indicative since it's very possible you two could have very different interpretations of his play as town. I'm actually trying to be less townish this time around as that didn't seem to work out in Hammertime when I was confirmed town alongside you 24 hours in and got lynched for "I thought he'd do more" + "there was something else but I forgot" Better not get lynched for being too townish and not living up to it this time around | ||
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On March 04 2015 00:40 Half the Sky wrote: Palmar scumread you for your scumhunting methods, IIRC, the fact that you were trying to PoE and as a result weren't coming up with any scumreads early enough. He was town and tunnelled on you, and we bowed to his pressure D2, which we shouldn't have. I didn't know your play any better otherwise I wouldn't have hammered you that game. Although considering most people here are scumread for not having scumreads, if that's the method you have normally used to find scum (PoE) I can completely understand why you've changed it since. nah his reasoning was that I waffle, which he used once before vs me and I ended up being mafia by chance in that game so he used it again despite it being something I do no matter of alignment. I don't think he scumread me for PoE On March 04 2015 00:43 kitaman27 wrote:[...] I'm just bitter. Had you stood next to me while I pressed enter you would have seen the fact that I did not type it with a straight face | ||
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##vote: Breshke | ||
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+ Show Spoiler [list] + he played another game that included:
as well as obs:
so he's not one of them. I posted this On September 01 2014 23:27 Professor Apathy wrote: > posts in weird 4chan/reddit style I got an idea who this guy is but forgot his name about him and I still can't my head around what his actual name was... some guy that's been around long but isn't actually a good vet and just smurfed for the sake of having some fun. I knew at the end of the game... | ||
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On March 04 2015 02:02 rsoultin wrote: Soooo...maybe not the best thing to bring up, but how do we even know the identity of the shooter will be revealed? lol >< he has to write the killcommand in this thread | ||
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On March 04 2015 02:03 kitaman27 wrote: I've read your explanation about why koshi should be 100% town to your mom a couple times, but I don't fully understand why you're saying he should be so confident about this. mafia hts + mafia koshi implying mafia isn't doing anything doesn't seem like enough to make koshi confirmed town from his perspective. I suppose you can make the pre-flip association analysis for why mafia rayn and mafia koshi doesn't make sense from his perspective, but him not mentioning koshi in less than a page filter in a game with 25 of players doesn't seem completely out of the question like you suggest. Is there more that I'm missing that makes you go from your mom being suspicious to your mom being 100% scum? I vehemently disagree with rayn's assertion on that part as well. That's just way over the top exaggerated. The part about hts was good, assuming it actually happened, which I did not check yet. | ||
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On March 04 2015 02:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: Same question to you Toad. If you thought i am mafia, and HtS is mafia, is there a world where mafia!rayn is not pushing a lynch on a townie? I don't think he has to be that certain on either of the reads for you to put it as drastically as you did. I have reads that don't match up all the time and I'll still discuss them, mostly stating something along the lines of "so that's what I think, but here's the thing: Those two being mafia together makes no sense whatsoever so I'm wrong on one of those two but no idea which one yet" afterwards (and people lynch me because that's apparently waffling) | ||
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On March 04 2015 02:22 raynpelikoneet wrote: You just did the same thing when i talked about Breshke/Koshi. You literally did the thing i am implying your mom as town SHOULD have done. The thing here is he is not saying "if i am wrong on one of those". He is stating he is sure HtS is mafia, he is sure i am mafia, because that's the only fucking two things he is talking about in the whole game. If he wasn't sure he would be considering alternatives, but he isn't. Therefore he is sure, and if he is sure, he should consider Koshi town for the reasons i have outlined. It really is that simple. that's because I'm smarter than him Don't get me wrong, I could get behind a your mom shot I just don't like people exagerating their reads and saying they're 100% certain on something. That's a lie, in 99% of the cases. Most times it's something townish because people want to look confident to get people on their side rather than being wishy-washy but I don't like it nontheless. Look at it from my point of view, my last game I played was a game that HTS and I were both about confirmed town 24 hours in (72 hours), Palmar stopped playing and spammed away "lynch Toad, I am 100% certain he is mafia" and nothing else. In the end people gave in, mostly out of annoyance as well as an unfortunate timeschedule on my part because Dungeons&Dragons on the day the lynch happened so people were annoyed about me not posting. And I flipped town obviously. And that's what I'm saying here. I don't think the chances are anywhere close to being 100% for it to be that way even if it sounds cool to say so. And as I'm saying that towards you the same could be said for him, he could be overselling his confidence while leaking out his true uncertainty about it when he's not paying attention. Still makes him look bad, just not 100% bad. | ||
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On March 04 2015 02:36 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yeah and look at the second last game i played. I was fucking lynched for making cases on all mafia and the serial killer on D2 and noone bothered to read my post. They just said "you need to prove your innocence if you are town". Can you at least go read my conversation with your mom starting somewhere around p3 in my filter and ACTUALLY READ IT? It is really fucking damning. While i know i do present myself as overconfident often jsut because i think i am the best player in the game always and i have the most chances of lynching mafia, this is a case where i am 100% confident for a REASON and i am not "over-pushing" anything. There is no fucking way your mom is town with the stuff he has put up in this game. I'm not even sure I know what his case is he did on you. I think you're referring to that post when he quoted me and took a jab at you for not explaining all your reads except for one? Just asking to be sure before going into more detail. | ||
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yeah figured. So point by point: I fully agree with the fact that that's stupid and makes him look bad. You calling someone mafia without backing it up and limiting your time on the things you consider to be most important and thus only explain that is not a mafia trait at all. In fact it shows that you're focussing on what you think is important, while (probably) leaving some things out in the open unexplained for other people to at least see what you're at. I fully agree with the fact that making it sound like you're unwilling to commit is a stretch. I did not mind his read on HTS. Yes she was asked to deliver a read but I agree with it looking weird. The correct thing would have been to have some balls and answer that she's not sure from HTS pov imo. I'm not certain on what to make of that whole "he should be thinking about how his reads relate to each other" yet | ||
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On March 04 2015 03:06 rsoultin wrote: rayn, talk to me about this post and how it fits in your narrative, pls that's a really good post from rsoultin btw. First time I read it I too thought that it's more him taking a jab at rayn in spite because I mentioned rayn rather than him. So as a result I didn't read too much into it, which seems to be what rsoultin is implying here. Rayn even calls it a case on him, considering it to be way more serious. The points raised by your mom in the latter part of that post are crap indeed. | ||
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On March 04 2015 03:13 rsoultin wrote: I guess for me, and maybe this is just cause I'm looking at things too simply, if you're scum pushing a town (shot/lynch/whatever) that has some traction, why go out of your way to claim responsibility for it? His stubbornness and reads are bad, but if I'm scum I'll just let others take the heat on the push I started. Maybe that's what makes me bad at scum though lol -flicks geript- it is a common thing to accuse people for not having any reads. Thus making sure you have at least 1 read that's "yours" is an important thing for mafia to do. He can totally do that as mafia and get back at it the next day saying exactly what you just did, assuming we shoot HTS and she flips town. No problem whatsoever to do that as mafia. | ||
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On March 04 2015 03:19 raynpelikoneet wrote: NO HE IS SETTING HIMSELF UP FOR BLAMING ME NEXT. rofl.  are you guys fucking blind? yeah that too. That's what I meant with making sure you have 1 read that's "yours" as mafia. One that you push and actually explain why you think that way. If he's mafia he's making sure the thread knows that he has one of those reads while setting you up for being the actual bad guy because unlike him, you just sheeped instead of properly explaining. | ||
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On March 04 2015 03:23 Tubesock wrote: I'm ##unvoting Koshi due to his appearance. Probably going to sheep Rayn about Your Mom. More in a minute. Day 1 Shoot Vote Count Half The Sky (1): Koshi (4): Siclucker, Geript, LightningStrike, Geript (1): AT.Epiphany Mocsta (1): Batsnacks Breshke (2): Mocsta, Toadesstern Your Mom (3): Raynpelikoneet, Obiwanshinobi, Half The Sky Nominate a Vigilante:Geript Not voted : Everyone else As it currently stands, Koshi is slated to be Shot. Countdown: A loose device count: (If someone says they PM'd the host I'll Underline) Armed: Damdred, Fecalfeast, Rsoultin, Guard: Sandroba, Keirathi, AT.Epiphany, Tubesock, Kitaman27, Toadesstern Destroy: Mocsta fixed a little | ||
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On March 04 2015 03:26 LightningStrike wrote: Okay I more inclined to shoot Your Mom and see if Koshi will Shape up later like I said I like Rayns thing on Your Mom and willing to sheep it. ##Unvote ##Shoot: Your Mom for the love of god please don't use that command to vote someone. That's awfully close to actually shooting someone... just write vote as well isntead of shoot, everyone knows what you're talking about. | ||
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On March 04 2015 04:03 geript wrote: I'd replace tube/ff/Koshi with slam/breschke/ +1. Probaly Kita. This doesn't remind of the game where I was mafia with him. Not really seeing agenda driven play. why slam? | ||
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On March 04 2015 04:50 your mom wrote: the shot should be placed at the real day deadline, or traded for a lynch. anything else is scum favoured on day 1. i for myself wont be shooting anyone, and if i get shot i demand the shooter to be lynched for playing pro-scum. I kind of agree with that. I'm not going to shoot when deadline hits either. I'm a PoE guy and I need more time to make that work... At the same time, yes mafia benefits from shooting early but I'm not sure if they'd really risk doing that themselves. That's so much heat they'd get. So yes I'd agree. Don't shoot the second you can, best case for mafia would be if a townie misshots into another townie because we only had 24 hours to look at stuff while they didn't even have to pull the trigger. | ||
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On March 04 2015 04:55 Toadesstern wrote: I kind of agree with that. I'm not going to shoot when deadline hits either. I'm a PoE guy and I need more time to make that work... At the same time, yes mafia benefits from shooting early but I'm not sure if they'd really risk doing that themselves. That's so much heat they'd get. So yes I'd agree. Don't shoot the second you can, best case for mafia would be if a townie misshots into another townie because we only had 24 hours to look at stuff while they didn't even have to pull the trigger. the problem is getting us that when there's insane people in here like batsnacks, robik, geript who all crave recognition like a teenager. Assuming they're town. | ||
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On March 04 2015 05:03 kitaman27 wrote: More often than not a lazy/afk sandroba equals a mafia sandroba. We obviously can't rely on mechanics we aren't aware of, but leaving him around a day or two and seeing if he follows this metric usually does the trick. early on, not really. If he keeps doing it yes but we're only 24 hours in, thus making him a bad target for d1 imo. He's not that hard to read if you just give him some time. | ||
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On March 04 2015 05:10 LightningStrike wrote: Hmm you put a spirit as Mafia yet lacking content in your post can you filter dive someone and give me your thoughts on them? lol | ||
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On March 04 2015 05:13 LightningStrike wrote: Well Mr.Toad aren't you glad Palmar isn't in the game calling you Mafia 24/7 this game? Also what you think of Kurumi? I'd slightly lean town but who knows, it's Kurumi | ||
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Under the rader, only doing 1 line posts, none of them do anything, only talking about mechanics or something that looks like something but isn't actually because he refuses to do the extramile and do some analysis, like: what's that even telling us On March 03 2015 18:24 sicklucker wrote: more of pretending he's doing something as in "see I totally have a read, it's Koshi" without doing anything.Rayn just tell everyone to shoot koshi. Whoever shoots anyone besides koshi with out an insane reason is claiming mafia It's not his read on Koshi or what he's posting really, it's the elusive not really afk but just enough under the radar that deserves a shot imo. | ||
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On March 04 2015 05:34 IAmRobik wrote: hahahahahahaha i literally just read his filter and came to the opposite conclusion why do you think he's townie | ||
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On March 04 2015 06:24 sandroba wrote: I'm underwhelmed at myself too, I don't blame you. I could provide excuses like being away from mafia for a while or not knowing the meta of 2/3 the players in this game. However that would be lazy and I'm not feeling particularly lazy right now. I shall go back to reading filters. is that supposed to be funny? | ||
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On March 04 2015 06:44 your mom wrote: toad, youre the sandro connoisseur, can you do something like a live feed of what hes doing cause i might be having too high expectations for his town play. last time we played together I called him useless, tried to lynch him. He said I'm mafia, tried to get me lynched. We both were town. The thing about town!Sandroba is that he will be useless before he figures out the game and I don't think 24 hours is enough to figure it out for him in a big game. I'd like to wait for at least d2 on Sandroba | ||
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On March 04 2015 08:05 IAmRobik wrote: THIS IS ABSURD ASDAF ASDIOFASDNOIFASNIDOF NI I LITERALLY DIDN'T GET MY SHOT COUNTED BECAUSE I SAID "STORM" INSTEAD OF "STRIKE" DASFNIOASDFNIOSADFASDFASDFASDNIOASDFIONFASIODFIOASNDFIONASIO I am willing to bet VEs balls on this being fake. Lynch robik imo. Someone who really wants to shoot doesn't just get the name wrong. He sits there waiting with the text prepared making sure he gets his shot off. The shot robik did was faked and so is that post. | ||
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On March 04 2015 08:17 IAmRobik wrote: of course i'll get shot by mafia. I'm universally townread and have better reads than anyone in this game. my only saving graces are getting medic saved or getting a bp vest from syll/phil my spelling's superior to yours though | ||
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On March 04 2015 08:47 geript wrote: Toad you can chime in on this too. I want to bounce ideas off of people and these are the people I'm the least sure of right now. all pretty much in the same boat for being under the radar. I wouldn't be able to distinguish between any of them readwise atm. Would make for good vig shots in general if we have any. | ||
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nope, I in fact said I wouldn't mind shooting him a couple hours before the deadline. He is emotional and seems convinced about what he's saying all right but he's a smurf so I'd expect him to be able to look that way. | ||
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On March 04 2015 09:09 sandroba wrote: Sorry man I'd disagree on that one. That big wall of reads he made does not look like stream of consciousness at all and is the sole reason I'm pursuing this. you are right, I did indeed mix up names there... + Show Spoiler [sicklucker] + On March 04 2015 05:32 Toadesstern wrote: sicklucker seems like a really good shot to me right now. Under the rader, only doing 1 line posts, none of them do anything, only talking about mechanics or something that looks like something but isn't actually because he refuses to do the extramile and do some analysis, like: what's that even telling us more of pretending he's doing something as in "see I totally have a read, it's Koshi" without doing anything. It's not his read on Koshi or what he's posting really, it's the elusive not really afk but just enough under the radar that deserves a shot imo. gimme some time to look at that guy in that case | ||
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On March 04 2015 09:17 sandroba wrote: You quoted the post I was responding to rsoultin so I don't know if you got it right. To be clear I think sepuclchre is town and LS is scum. yeah wanted to quote myself, the post above that... so Sandro: Toad you don't think sep is town? Toad: No I think he's mafia Toad: wait no... I think I mixed up names... yep it's this sicklucker dude I considered to be mafia | ||
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On March 04 2015 09:23 rsoultin wrote: -_- except he does these list posts as town so y'all didn't actually find anything? someone asked him for his updated reads and he gave them in the form of a list whatever, keep being dumb robik lol give this guy a medal please, You made me look at his filter and he answered a question that reads "yo, gimme updates on all of your reads you had so far". If he's not downright ignoring that question that's bound to end in some kind of list one way or the other, even if he leaves out half of his reads because he considers them unimportant. The fact that he did not focus on the changes he consideres important and gave a list of fucking everything is the only thing bad about that post imo. | ||
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On March 04 2015 17:18 sicklucker wrote: who was it that was so sure robik was faking it? That was me. I still think he faked it, just that he did it for some convoluted town plan. There's just simply one post that shows that it has no mafia motivation to it. Other than that however, there's just no way someone's that stupid. On top of that he even lied about it being copy&pasted because had he copy&pasted it, that mistake would not have happened... so yes, I'm fairly sure that was a fake and he knows how to type in allcaps to look all dramatic. There's all kinds of bad things you can say about robik but if there's one positive thing you can say about him it's that he knows how to do that. You later on said that we should lynch me because of my stance on it being fake. Can you explain why? Usually it tends to be mafias that just eat any kind of claim and go with it (unless they know it to be fake like a fake-RB when mafia has no RB), ESPECIALLY IF IT'S A TRUE ONE AS YOU SEEM TO BE ARGUING, because they know it's correct while townies tend to be the one sceptical more often then not. What would the reason for mafia!anyone be if they know that town!Koshi is indeed not mafia and thus get in the thread to tell people you don't believe him despite knowing that he's town? Furthermore, what would be the reason for mafia!anyone be not just to do that but to go out of his way and call him a stupid townie? Not a mafia who's lying but some townie who did some weird shit for some weird reason and who knows why. What would the reason for mafia!anyone be if they know that mafiabuddy!Koshi is indeed mafia and thus get in the thread to tell people you don't believe him? That's heat for you as well as your ally. | ||
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Sandro has done more but I'm not sure I like what he's done... still pretty scummy for me but I'm willing to wait a little more until I'm more certain on it or until he gets shot. If he is indeed town, mafia will take care of him soon enough because he's scary as town while not being particularly scary as mafia. No need to be concerned about him either way right now imo (sry Sandroba ). So still belongs on that list but not really a priority.batsnacks belongs on that list. Breshek... I'm not sure. I really think he's mafia but that'd make no sense with Sandroba being mafia so... meh I agree with rayn that I don't think LightningStrike is particularly scummy, in fact he looks fairly townish. I have a tendency to think people who defend me are mafia and he did defend me or at least call me town early on alongside HTS but that's all I've got against him. And those two were in Hammertime as host/player so it's actually reasonable to make those statements from their pov imo. Rayn and Robik are obviously town but won't do shit tomorrow because they're both emo. Let's just hope mafia shoots one of them Out of the "vets" that I'm not entirely sure about: Kita / Sandro / Keirathi it's Kita > Keirathi > Sandro, from townish to mafiaesque. Not sure if I can get a last second post in so take that from me for what it's worth. I obviously have more townreads but they're not worth talking about, unlike Rayn / Robik / Kita for reason being "get off them" for the first two, and my change of stance on the latter one. | ||
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On March 05 2015 00:42 kitaman27 wrote: Toad where are you at in regards to Tube? have not really looked at him yet, just arrived back at my place | ||
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On March 05 2015 00:42 kitaman27 wrote: Toad where are you at in regards to Tube? On March 03 2015 10:43 Tubesock wrote: Does the progression from being ok with a random shooting to "I'm not voting to shoot someone....I will be shooting someone." bug anyone but me? while obviously wrong, the guy is reading the thread enough to remember something like this. slightly townish for me, mafias don't actually read the thread | ||
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On March 05 2015 01:02 Mocsta wrote: fuck u guys contemplating a modkill. will make a decision in the morning. night. I should take that into my repertoire as moves to pull to not get shot at night | ||
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On March 05 2015 02:37 raynpelikoneet wrote: ..or rather "who knows why"? I don't need an answer. leave it at that. I don't want more modkills pretty please | ||
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qCM4NLA.png) left out the other green tone for obvious reasons right now. | ||
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Slam I feel fairly sure he's town atm, the only thing scummy about him is that he didn't google picture search my picture and answer with something himself like he used to Breshke I could myself being wrong on but don't really want to put him into town because I'm not certain on Sandroba and if Sandroba is town Breshke suddenly makes a lot of sense. Onegu I agree. Not for those reasons but I felt like he behaves the way he should in general. I'm somewhat scared Keirathi or Kita could be something I don't want to say to not get hit by ctrl+f a certain word in my filter but otherwise they're both likely town imo. Kita more so than Keirathi. | ||
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On March 05 2015 03:22 raynpelikoneet wrote: I don't think there is "more" between Keirathi and kita. It's highly likely they are both town because they have been saying really smart stuff this phase. Just compare to sandroba lol. yeah both have done that but unless I'm missing out a lot in my memory Kita did that more than Keirathi to the point that I felt it's still somewhat possible for Keirathi to do that as mafia as well. | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:02 raynpelikoneet wrote: Robert do you seriously think town!geript doesn't have a clear shot target at 24h mark which he has been pushing at least for 12 hours? Because i am pretty sure that is impossible. yeah that has giving me some thought as well. In general, talking about shooting nonstop or making it sound like you want to without actually attempting to shoot is REALLY anti-town. Everyone was talking about how mafia would want to shoot 24h after start without a question and I was just sitting here thinking that mafia would just sit back and not do shit at all with people like robik, geript as well as batsnacks and co in the game... Geript is probably the most craving for attention and recognition out of all the people in here and EVEN IF we ignore that, that'd be all fine had he just not left it at that, but making other people shoot by heating up the discussion is mafia agenda if there ever was one. | ||
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good point, completly forgot about that. That would give him a second to think about and question himself. | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:13 raynpelikoneet wrote: not really he just said "koshi is a good shot" and then gave a list of other players who could be good shots too. nah, he was pushing koshi really hard I think? | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:13 raynpelikoneet wrote: not really he just said "koshi is a good shot" and then gave a list of other players who could be good shots too. just ctrl-f "Koshi" in geripts filter and look at the number in the top right, including stuff like (and I stopped after a couple posts): On March 03 2015 12:55 geript wrote: @Damdred. What do you think about Koshi and Rayn? On March 03 2015 09:42 geript wrote: Rayn not trying to game the system with shit is really outside of his town meta. Like he destroyed my pyp game by making sure that the picks were predetermined. He's really good at that sort of thing. I really like his Koshi push though. Like it's really weird that Koshi'sarguments trying to bully people into not shooting when someone is definitely going to shoot at 24hrs. Probably 3-5 people will try in the least. Like Koshi as town would be having some fun with this or trying to do something to push a read. Or something, anything. On March 03 2015 09:53 geript wrote: I *could* be wrong on both, but that's really unlikely. I don't thing scum Rayn busses scum Koshi. They're both not doing things that define their town meta. Like that's really important. I think of the two, Rayn is the more likely to flip mafia but at this point it's hard to tell because there's a world where Rayn is town and Koshi is one of the 3P but I don't think the reverse is true. Im just really sad that the only blues I can hunt this game are 3P. On March 03 2015 15:26 geript wrote: Either way, I'm going to ignore the yipping chihuahua for a bit. Keir what do you think of Koshi and Rayn? More Koshi than Rayn because maybe I'm over thinking Rayn. On March 04 2015 01:22 geript wrote: I'm more wait and see on Damdred. @Rayn. Think about the sprirts. And think about Ssndroba. That's all I'm going to say. Koshi is dead to me. Kita. Idk. I just idk. There was one point he made that I really liked but I forgot it. Idk. Hard to focus. On March 04 2015 02:44 geript wrote: Rayn. I'm going to be honest. I don't really get your your mom read. I think I'd rather shoot Koshi. Idk. I real hard time think right now. Not sure if I will shoot. | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:22 IAmRobik wrote: not only this, but if i were town and was wrong about my strongest read, my usual reaction is to sit back and not be as active because I need to yeah On March 05 2015 04:13 Toadesstern wrote: good point, completly forgot about that. That would give him a second to think about and question himself. | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:19 raynpelikoneet wrote: Honestly does anyone know who geript thinks is mafia? not anymore. Koshi probably still mafia who flipped town because of some spirit / mafia power | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:27 geript wrote: ATTENTION WHOEVER GOT A MEDIC ROLE!!! I WAS GIVEN A GUN!!! I WILL BE SHOOTING RAYN!!! SO IF YOU FUCKiNG SAVE HIM I WILL LYNCH YOU OUT OF SPITE!!!!!!!!!! why are so many people faking... like srsly who would give you a gun | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:28 ObiWanShinobi wrote: lol are you kidding me Also, that AT post is a huge problem. =/ the above post is what geript thinks! | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:47 geript wrote: Bullshit. I was universally townread D1. 1) I also had good targets to shoot. 2) Now I've added another. If I were mafia, I wouldn't tell a soul about it. I also wouldn't try to get thoughts on people I was planning to shoot. It'd 100% be extra scum kp. Hell I'd probably hold onto it for a day or two. Maybe the mafia spirit gave it to me. Maybe but I really doubt that. I've played really tucking well this game so I can't see being given KP. 1) Koshi flipped town if you havn't realized yet 2) If you're town you're not telling anyone about it either because if we have powerroles so does mafia. If mafia has powerroles you are essentially a +1 mafia KP because if you hit town (they know who is mafia and who isn't) they'll let it get through while RB'ing / protecting him if he is mafia. Also there's no way to prove wether or not you actually did anything. | ||
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On March 05 2015 04:57 raynpelikoneet wrote: FUCKING NO! HE DIDN'T! You have the same dumb thought that Toad has that he was pushing Koshi really hard and then he went "clueless" when Koshi got modkilled. Here, look at these posts which happened before Koshi got modkilled: (this was robik he was talking about) SO AGAIN, WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU GUYS TALKING ABOUT? the one thing consistent in there is that Koshi is either his #1 priority or #2 priority in all of these posts you just quoted | ||
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On March 05 2015 05:09 raynpelikoneet wrote: why would he take a bullet? if he shoots me he will get lynched. if he doesn't he will still probably get lynched. this logic doesn't really make any sense robert... maybe he's implying geript is trying to get shot by a potential, actual townvig? It really doesn't make sense... I'd say 90% chance he's a VT who's talking bullshit on purpose though | ||
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On March 05 2015 05:11 IAmRobik wrote: meaning he is lying about getting the cop/vigi shot to try to take a bullet but vigs usually just have one shot. Why would mafia shoot that? | ||
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On March 05 2015 05:15 IAmRobik wrote: he literally just changed his story from shooting rayn to being given a cop check/vig shot. Are you for serious ? and you honestly think anyone believes that? | ||
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On March 05 2015 05:30 kitaman27 wrote: Lets swap topics. On March 05 2015 02:58 Toadesstern wrote: rayn, anything you disagree with or want to add? I honestly don't really care all that much about mafia reads right now and am trying to go by PoE seeing as that your mom thing totally did not work out yesterday and we just have a crapton of people that are just nulls for me. Feel like we should focus on those guys atm, so: left out the other green tone for obvious reasons right now. anything that caught your attention? | ||
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On March 05 2015 06:16 Alakaslam wrote: Ain't got much time these days Update me real quick what has happened ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ewUjmqR.jpg) | ||
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fear not man, I've got your back: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/476732-jack-of-all-trades-mafia?page=88#1757 Also, we don't need more people ragequitting so keep playing. | ||
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Mafia is probably not too willing to duel people and just leave that to other people hoping for a town vs town 1vs1, right? So we should probably just have someone really townish duel whoever is the most scummy and effectively kill him that way. I don't want 2 bad looking guys to duel each other if I'm bound to think one of them is town just by virtue of starting a duel but at the same time being bad enugh to have no towncred thus probably picking his opponent randomely. | ||
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Just thought I should get that out before dying | ||
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On March 05 2015 06:39 raynpelikoneet wrote: I don't really care about the dues shit at this point. It's not like if mafia duels me they get lynched anyways and no townie would ever think i am scum anyways. Duels should not be decided hastily. Probably that is our worst possible lynch mechanic because if the town spirit will not veto the shootout every day then there is no town spirit. duel is like a shootout but in actually good is what I'm saying. Yes, they should not be hasty because there's no way some idiot will push the idea that mafia will hastily duel someone to make the day short | ||
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Koshi signs up to get himself modkilled on purpose on d1 Geript is doing stupid bullshit because who knows why Mocsta is apparently ragequitting because he's not getting enough attention rayn asking to be shot as well as some other guy (might have been one of the above) slam asking to be lynched .... you guys are a bunch of assholes and need to get your shit together. See you tomorrow if I'm still alive | ||
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sicklucker (10): Onegu, Sepulchre, geript, Breshke, Sandroba (6): Onegu (1): Kurumi Tubesock (2): batsnacks, sicklucker Not voted (1): Keirathi At the current vote count, sicklucker will be lynched. You have to vote here. | ||
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On March 07 2015 07:42 Half the Sky wrote: With all due respect, there's 18m to check... done checking, I'm good | ||
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It is now Night 2! It will last ... I think. | ||
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On March 10 2015 09:01 kitaman27 wrote: lol seriously? You post that Onegu can take the shot and then you modkill him when he posts? For such a simple misunderstanding, ending the game is incredibly extreme. Furthermore, if you're going to enforce a rule like that with no exceptions, how about the fact that both keirathi and kurmi missed a vote in a game where voting is mandatory? Kurumi didn't even post during day three, yet you kill epi for the same reason. If you're going to make an exception to the voting rule and let people off with a warning, you really felt that you had to enforce the onegu modkill? Town got 2 mislynches in a 6 mafia setup? What a waste of our time. it was endgame no matter what. Pretty much just a fast night to end it... btw, I saved your ass n1 from being shot and you did get shot! get killed n1, protected a townie from being shot. I did my job I'm honestly still shocked that you guys didn't kill Sandroba. He was the deepest red I give out to people that have not yet flipped in my chart, Rayn said Sandroba is super mafia. Rayn and I both die, Sandroba ends up in Cell and you guys just lynch the random whatever-guy? | ||
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On March 10 2015 09:04 syllogism wrote: Look at Foolishness spirit QT. He had enough points this cycle to buy 4 bulletproof vests. He gave stuff to mafia N1. Three shurikens hit town. The only reason you had two mislynches was due to everything going our way. we had this in obs-QT: I think some kind of diminishing returns or well, the opposite of that I just don't know what it's called in english, would have been nice. Something like "buying a role makes buying the same role again X more expensive during that very night it's used as well as Y more expensive permanently." To force some variety thoughts? would have made it a little more interesting... I mean you just ended up buying vig no matter what because it's plain the best thing you can get | ||
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Basicly an enemy boss in a game, but everyone likes her so much despite her being an enemy because she's frickin' adoreable so we're just keeping her around as long as possible and HNNNNG everytime we see her. Should have explained that before dying Also, geript played really well d1. He should not play while drunk though, he instantly scumslipped on d2 lol | ||
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Mostly just the sheer amount of KP that was floating around with mafia spirit buying nothing but KP for his team as well as a lot of people behaving really toxic early on. Mostly looking at koshi (modkill), robik (confirmed himself by posting info about a pm conversation with the host and it's contents), Mocsta during n1 (could have been a stunt but who knows) as well as just a lot of bullying in ego in general... Oh yeah, probably change the ninja to 1-shot + ninja-cop instead of 2-shot without ninja-cop if it's already this swingy. | ||
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On March 10 2015 09:23 Keirathi wrote: How were hte lynch mechanics mafia favored!?! Everything else that happened in the game might have been, but Resistance and Cell were by far the "worst" lynch mechanics available in the pool for mafia. 2 "list check" mechanics in a row could have have been devastating if it weren't for all the extra KP going around. the duel thing is another nightmare for mafia because whoever duels is almost confirmed town lol | ||
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On March 10 2015 09:13 Half the Sky wrote: [...] EDIT: Also people were under the impression that she was shot because of Rayn and Koshi telling the ninja to shoot her. In actuality, that was completely untrue. I'm painfully aware dead townies can be wrong. you should have lynched Sandroba like the dead townies told you to | ||
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Also the correct play for Robik is to 100% hold his shot. Shooting there was really really stupid. holding his shot was always a 100% lose for Robik because it was endgame before reaching d3 EVEN WITH double mafia kill on d2. It was between shooting mafia and killing the ninja during n2. If he had no idea who the other ninja was he has to shoot mafia to at least try and avoid endgame, even if unlikely. He proably should not have claimed though. On March 10 2015 09:45 Half the Sky wrote: Ahhh so you are asking why I lynched SL instead of Sandroba? Thought I explained in obs qt. I could not decide between the two. They both looked bad. [...] so sheep the two townies that conveniently both thought one of the two options you had is the most likely mafia in the entire game, who both conveniently got shot by mafia. | ||
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16 people alive(6 vs 2 vs 8) => Mafia lynch => 15 people alive (5 vs 2 vs 8) => night action, if mafia got a vig again it's even possible endgame despite the mafialynch because 5 vs 2 vs 5, ninja lost without getting to day3, without using his shot. Had robik shot a townie in an attempt to use his shot it would have only looked worse. Goes to show that geript really didn't understand ninja wincon or has more information that isn't available to us and robik. Like wether or not Mafia wants to doublestack, wether or not Mafia has a vig this night again. That's information we don't have. On the other hand, with Sandroba dead that's mafia down to 5, if town manages to get 3 townies on the mission and kill geript that's mafia down to 4 and thus KP reduced to 1 KP + vigs. Thus stalling the game by a lot, making town like him and at least getting a chance to win by chance rather than outright losing before even reaching d3. The shot robik did was the by far best thing he could have done from his point of view. Holding his shot would have been the worst thing he could have done because that's always, in all possible scenarios a lose for him because the game ends before he uses his shot because it stops before d3, thus literally being 0% chance to win had he hold the shot. Wether he should shoot mafia or try to hit mafia depends on how certain he is on his reads. If he has no idea who the 2nd ninja is shooting mafia is the best thing he can do in that situation to at least try and get some lucky win somehow like HTS did. Sure that's crappy but better than 0% chance to win. You just were angry because he shot mafia and you were mafia but it was the best possible thing for him to do in that sitaution, there's really no arguing about that. | ||
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Toadesstern
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On March 10 2015 09:56 kitaman27 wrote: I think he should have shot in that situation but not at sandroba since he was almost certainly mafia at that point. If I were him I would have shot into the scummiest ninja suspect. Maybe someone like kurumi or slam where they had a decent chance of being third party, but the game wouldn't end if he was wrong. After the shot, claiming isn't all that bad since the 2nd ninja had already shot. It informs mafia not to shoot him and town not to lynch him. yeah he could have shot slam/kurumi but that as well comes down to wether or not he has confidence in his reads in the first place. The fact that he didn't opt to give it a last try and did not just go for his best ninja-shot shows that he went for safety before anything else. If that's what he's going for because he's so unsure about his reads that's perfectly fine imo. The claim is questionable. I thought it's good too, Sandroba disagrees and thinks he should not have claimed. It's a bit tricky. The claim makes it impossible for mafia to claim ninja because anyone claiming ninja after robik's claim would have been lynched for being a fakeclaim from mafia and it makes the town like robik. Has it's ups and downs | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On March 10 2015 10:07 geript wrote: First things first: Killing mafia during the night lowers KP. I'm pretty sure Artanis commented on this in thread even. So there's no point to do so during D3. Second, let's pretend Onegu (or one of his proposed team) is mafia. Mafia will use the lynch as KP and just kill an obvious towny. Then shooting mafia does him absolutely no good as he will just get endgamed after being shot. Like mafia will just pretend he's not even in the game. Third, let's pretend the 3P gets elected (who will obvious fail it). Then we just kill Robik most likely out of gratitude because it removes extra votes etc. Fourth, if all town gets elected, he knows not to shoot any of them. Let's also just look at the situation. Pretend he uses his shuriken; his only way of getting the other ninja killed is to do it via lynch (which is essentially the same as shooting them) OR by having mafia put NKs on the other ninja. By killing a mafia (and where 1 mafia is outed), mafia KP is reduced so he's unlikely to get his wish. Like there's literally no situation where I can think of that Robik is in a better spot by specifically shooting Sandroba instead of aiming for 3P. Yes, it helps him not get endgamed sooner, but it doesn't ever actually help him win the game. you completly fail to realize that he would not have gotten a lynch on d3 because the game ends before d3 and thus everything you mentioned there is just wrong. Yes, mafia loses KP once down to 4, that's the reason he shot mafia. To try and get a d3 lynch instead of just losing without getting another lynch. So no, what he did was the best he could have done (assuming he has no idea who the ninja is). I'm not going to argue wether or not he should have used his shot to shoot ninja, that's obviously best play but holding his shot like you said would have been the worst possible scenario for him. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On March 10 2015 10:16 sicklucker wrote: I think when two people are pitted against each other (me and tube) but both INSTANTLY jump to the conclusion its fake instead of going after each other then that third party is always mafia. I think people ignored this fact too much it wasn't fake at all. It was just not alignment indicative, why should it be? He picked Onegu because there was 0% of Onegu being ever lynched in that Cell. Everyone was townreading him during d1. So dishing out a green check on someone who already was townread but almost everyone should not have mattered at all. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On March 10 2015 10:18 geript wrote: He was alive on D3. Mafia in order to endgame can't win until D4. It was 8v2v6. Killing 1 town doesn't make endgame because he still has his bullet. And if he's going to shoot mafia during the day. Then he should shoot during the night because he might actually remove a Mafia role. Like if you want to argue that he has to shoot mafia with it to prevent endgame, then it's 100% better to shoot that mafia player at night (after roles are given out). take a look at it from his point of view for a sec, because 8v2v6 IS endgame for him, even with spare KP to doubleshot.
That's already endgame even with mafia on 1 KP. Had he not shot mafia there would have been 1 more KP for mafia. There's no way he gets to day3. | ||
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On March 10 2015 10:24 Keirathi wrote: Was everyone townreading him day 1? I don't remember that. When i made my case/points about him being mafia during night 1, no one contested them or anything, and afaik I didn't remember anyone hard-towning him at that point anyways. Maybe like 1 person. Rayn and I both had him as town. Pretty sure there were more than just us two? | ||
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On March 10 2015 10:27 sicklucker wrote: If there mafia its "fake" to me. I never really considered that mafia would be trying to trick the own spirit ill admit. Because I honestly didnt think a town spirit would give them anything oh silly me it was even pointed out by Artanis in the thread that that's possible when Kita asked? | ||
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On March 10 2015 10:30 Keirathi wrote: I just looked back. You had him as null, then rayn said "I feel like he is kinda playing like I expect" and then you said "I agree". Those are like the weakest town reads ever :p I had him as town in my sheet that I posted though. Sure it's a super weak read but when in the same Cell as someone labeled "KILL IT WITH FIRE" as well as two nulls that's more than enough lol | ||
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Toadesstern
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On March 10 2015 10:27 geript wrote: Toad. This post. If he shoots mafia on N3, he not only can get a role that's been given out (thereby further delaying endgame) but it also reduced KP. Like if you want to argue that shooting during D3 is better than shooting during N3. Then you're just wrong. There's literally no benefit to shooting during D3 instead of N3. Oh I get it... I thought you were arguing that he should have hold his shot until the day-cycle that would have come now had it not endgamed because you were so angry about it. Well wether he shoots during day or night hardly makes a difference for you, except like you said that he can make you lose a role but do you really think Syllo would have given Sandroba an item ? So don't really see the point there. | ||
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Toadesstern
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On March 10 2015 10:36 Keirathi wrote: Your sheet had him as null? Or did you post an updated one and I just didn't scroll down far enough? Edit: This was the one I was looking at: http://i.imgur.com/qCM4NLA.png why does noone read the fucking sheet.... I include some basic explanations to it for a reason. | ||
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On March 10 2015 10:43 Keirathi wrote: Playing devil's advocate: what if sandroba was town, and he did actually check Onegu (which I still think would have been a solid check overall). Sure, your scenario is possible (and was the case), but why aren't the other scenarios possible? Why, in this specific case, is that scenario the only one that makes sense and make sandro scum? There is more to making an argument than just seeing a scenario and thinking "That makes sense, that must be how it happened!" this exactly. That's what I meant in obs QT with 'SL and tube are carrying town d2 but for all the wrong reasons'. You two had it completly figured out (SL started derping later on) but there just was no reasoning behind it. The check Sandroba did had no indication towards any alignment whatsoever and should have been treated just liked that. | ||
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Toadesstern
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On March 10 2015 10:45 Keirathi wrote: Oh, herp derp. Somehow I read all the other ones, but didn't see the note about Onegu granted it's an increadibly weak read but the first thing I said to artanis when I got shot was something along the lines of "wow, that Cell is pure cancer... anyone could be mafia in there ... except for maybe Onegu who looks ever so slightly townish" but if you have him in contrast to the other 3 he was the shining beacon of towniness | ||
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On March 10 2015 10:53 Keirathi wrote: Meh, I disagree. Tube was the shining beacon of townness in that cell Man, that day 1 only being 24 hours really fucked me I was having a good game going into the end of night 1, but stupid exams. That time I missed should have been in the night phase instead of day After the day started? Yeah tube looked really good and was obviously town but before or when it started Onegu was the only one I townread, which is when you have to decide who to pick for your cop-check. | ||
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Toadesstern
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On March 10 2015 10:58 Keirathi wrote: FWIW I don't trust syllo/sandro soulread anymore after they fucked with me in Catastrophe by both being mafia :D I mean Sandro really isn't that hard to read... and if you're unsure, wait until d3 and lynch him if he's still alive. | ||
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On March 10 2015 11:08 kitaman27 wrote: Having TL Mafia LXVI as his most recent town game really didn't help the cause. Sometimes tough to tell between "I'm not posting because I'm too busy" and "I'm not posting because I'm mafia". His lazy post about Breshke should have probably made the difference I suppose. the laziness wasn't really it. He was doing a lot more in this game than what you linked, just that what he did in this game was all really bad stuff. I probably would not have mafiaread him had he posted less. | ||
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I always pick the opposite of what I read VE as when I try to get his alignment. Think VE is town? -> MAFIA Think VE is mafia? -> Town it's not stupid if it works... it's just really hard to explain | ||
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On March 10 2015 11:19 LightningStrike wrote: Also Toad when you said that people usually give bad reasons to call you town and defend when they are Mafia was that case for me when I meta'd you? yeah I remembered that as something I considered slightly scummy but thought it's okay because you co-hosted that game and thus it's pretty likely for you to share some information like that. There's no way I would have pushed for you, my townread on you was quite massive otherwise on d1. | ||
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On March 10 2015 11:33 Keirathi wrote: Anyways, just some random babbling thoughts: I personally thought I had a pretty solid first cycle (particularly night 1). The problem was, I really did have 2 midterms last Thursday. So I get home ~6-7pm every night, then have a few hours to catch up/post, but I couldn't even do that Wednesday night because i had to study. Then I made a (albeit probably poor) decision to go out with friends Thursday after midterms were over and didn't get home until way too late to look at the thread and actually be able to get up for school the next day, so I put it off again. Somehow, in the middle of all of that, my TL tab got closed, and since I generally don't visit TL unless I'm playing mafia, I didn't think to check it friday, and so I didn't vote. All the good play in the world doesn't excuse leaving the thread for ~72 hours or whatever. Basically I threw away any real good-will I had for my day 1/night 1 play and put me on the back foot. So, sorry to my teammates for that. It's pretty inexcusable. I was in a position to have a good game and I fucked it up. [snip] Bleh, I was going to write a bunch of stuff here about individual players, but it felt kinda sleezy only mentioning the players I was familiar with and leaving out a bunch of people, so I decided it was better not to. I do have a question for Toad though: Why did you save Kita night1 instead of rayn? Not that I think it's a bad decision to save kita there, obviously, but I feel like rayn has a lot more...uh...thread control? than kita ever does. Kita is an excellent player, but not very often is he the driving factor behind a lynch. Rayn can and is that person. Also @rayn: you scumread me last game and townread me this game. Boggling :O I explained that in the obs QT. Came down to me thinking that geript was town at that point. I was thinking about wether to protect Kita or rayn quite a lot actually but thought that there's no way geript actually got a vig and would claim it because if he got a vig power that'd confirm his as mafia. So I thought he fakeclaimed it as town. Because I thought geript was town I thought mafia might be scared to shoot rayn in fear of wasting a KP on someone a crazy townie was shooting anyways and changed my protection to Kita thinking that mafia would shoot Kita+Toad n1 instead of Rayn+Toad (was pretty damn obvious that I'd get shot). I lucked out that you actually had 3 KP in the end I guess Had I not townread geript I would have protected rayn 100% of the times. | ||
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(Artanis): you saved kita though Erik: did I? (Artanis): yup Erik: fuck yes (Artanis): they were shooting damdred first (Artanis): then changed for kita Erik: I fucking wanted to do that last second post Erik: but fucked up Erik: GOD DAMN IT Erik: screwed up by 60 seconds for some reason (Artanis): so the ninja shooting damdred made your save useful Erik: why would they shoot damdred Erik: wtf Erik: so wait, who shot rayn (Artanis): because damdred can suddenly start playing really really well (Artanis): geript Erik: ... Erik: so geript is mafia? (Artanis): yes Erik: ... (Artanis): that should've been obvious on account of him getting a vig shot Erik: yeah Erik: I did not think he got one (Artanis): what are the odds the town spirit is going to give a vig shot to anyone on the first night Erik: 0% Erik: but I did not think he got one (Artanis): ah Erik: I fucked up big time Erik: DAMN IT Erik: that would be a 100% kill had I gotten that post in | ||
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of BH?
