already got a decent idea for how to play this
Roulette Mini Mafia
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Ace
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already got a decent idea for how to play this | ||
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Maybe RNG every role right after the lynch, and allow Role Cop to send in his/her action during the day so they get result at the start of Night? Would still make it tough to deal with that Town setup but it's something. random nature of 1 Scum being godfathered vs competent Alignment Cops is also tough Either way I'm down for this just because it is interesting On May 27 2013 23:36 kushm4sta wrote: everyone will claim their role though because there's no reason for town not to Same thing I was thinking. | ||
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Looks Town favored but I guess Scum will have to work a bit harder with claims and day play to avoid the random worst case scenario. Ah well lets get this show on the road! | ||
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On May 27 2013 23:56 prplhz wrote: can't eduardo just claim something that one of his teammates got? yes, but it isn't about 1 night of claims itself. Since the roles are always "live" the Town can collectively vote on someone to be investigated in the case of an Alignment Cop. The Town will all claim the next day with result of their actions. Say a NK is missing - the doctor and Vet don't care about not being informed. They just speak up on what happened. In the Doc's case it most likely confirms a Town player (barring Scum taking a chance to shoot one of their own members). Since the roles get randomized again next night they don't need to fear dying and depriving the Town of a Power Role Town does this at the start of every day. Even with Scum getting the power roles the Town isn't concerned with their claims. All they need is a decent pool of suspects before Scum KP takes out the thinkers and investigate down the list and take chances with the RNG due to higher numbers. ETA: Just to be thorough that "live" means barring getting hit by Scum KP. There are other interesting scenarios that exist but I'd rather not get into all that theorycrafting. This is going to be fun either way. | ||
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On May 28 2013 05:16 Acrofales wrote: Why doesn't Nbobo get the actual role? That just makes the role rather useless. Scum probably doesn't want to shoot the roleblocker or the godfather. They DEFINITELY don't want to shoot the veteran. Having Nbobo reveal roles seems like a necessity for this to be useful. this actually is part of the reason it is Town favored. Scum can't risk losing the roleblocker or miller/gf roles . But we'll see when the game starts. | ||
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Scum will rely on the RNG much more heavily than Town who can all keep claiming every day. If Scum KP drops to 1 Town collectively agree that every night the roleblocker and the Cop claim and they decide who to investigate. How does Scum deal with this potential problem? | ||
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If roles can be lynched Scum at least have the option of counter claiming Cops or Doctors. The game can hit "follow the cop" scenario once Scum KP = 1. Without 5 or more Scum that isn't a far-fetched scenario. ETA: Game breaking scenarios: Once Scum KP hits 1 the Cop claims. Medic protects him. Roleblocker claims. A.) The Scum team can't hit the cop so they are left with looking for the doctor. Since the roles are random every night they have to get lucky and hope they get doctor themselves. There are no good power role hunting heuristics available since who gets the doctor role switches all the time. Scum clearly don't want to kill the roleblocker with only 1 KP as they lose the potential to stop a claimed Cop. They are at the mercy of the RNG heavily. Every day the Town tells the Doctor to claim. If the Doctor does not claim they know one of the people not claiming was Scum. This is the only option they have to deal with the Cop - pure RNG of getting the role. Otherwise the cop is unstoppable. B.) With the roleblocker claiming they can choose to RB anyone but the Cop. A roleblocked Cop = roleblocker is Scum. So that option is out of play for them. Scum would need to get roleblocker, hit the medic and shoot the cop most likely through random investigation with their RoleCop. Once again they are at the mercy of the RNG. No matter what path it takes the Town can ignore the RNG and have everyone claim as it is the most ProTown thing to do. The Scum team's options are limited. Without help from the RNG its a game of numbers. | ||
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read the OP? The powers get returned to the pool the next day. | ||
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On June 04 2013 11:04 Oatsmaster wrote: Why doesnt the cop just claim??? Why all the roles???? Why are you not answering my question If Night KP is stopped we'd want the medic claim yo nearly confirm the person as Town. Likewise with a roleblocker. The original plan was based on Scum with 1 KP but with it easier for them to maintain 2 it's a bit harder. Either way there is no downside to claiming the role and who we targeted in the night. | ||
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On June 04 2013 11:09 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: So what happens in scenario A when the doctor doesn't claim? If everyone plays innocent we have a dead cop and still hidden mafia. Same in B, if mafia RB'd the cop. I.E. we know there's a scum holding the role but we don't know who is holding it and is therefore scum, hence it doesn't break the game. It wouldn't kill us outright but it would be an anti-town move not to do so. Especially if a hit is stopped. If no one claims we'll just take the actual claimers as more likely Town than not. But once again it would be really stupid of us not to claim. If Scum RB cop same thing - we just have a narrower pool of suspects to look at. We'll take that small win in a random bad scenario happening every time. | ||
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On June 04 2013 11:13 Oatsmaster wrote: Ok sounds good. Ace whose scum? Don't know yet | ||
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On June 04 2013 11:30 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: But it wouldn't be gamebreaking like you said it would be. Hypothetically if I'm scum and me or my other scum (since 2 scum = 1 KP) roll the Doctor, we can shoot the Cop, and if we play as townily as possible we can claim either of the other roles later on and play along with town plan. Assuming we can survive the day we shoot the cop, we simply blend in afterwards and win by pure attrition. I agree that claiming does help town, but scum can still pull the situation to their advantage and win so it helps them a bit too. Guess it all comes down to the RNG after all. Greater probability of townies getting X role, so I guess it does benefit town after all. Once Scum KP dropped to 1 = Cop can claim at night, roleblocker claims at night. If RB doesn't claim we know he is Scum. Match that up with previous innocent investigations = Scum have limited moves. They can't counterclaim anything either. So it becomes a game of numbers which the Town will win. IF the Scum roll the doctor it isn't as bad as you think. We'd still know where they are. That's why I said for the Scum to succeed it would take the RNG to make them lucky whereas the Town can safely ignore it. That's how it was game breaking. | ||
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I was thinking someone would be like "that claim is bullshit!" then we have to force people to read the OP. Again. | ||
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On June 05 2013 01:57 VayneAuthority wrote: lol, how do you feel about mkfuba strolling into the thread and just choosing something random to quote then peacing out? I like to to call that illusionary participation unless thats common for him or something slightly bad but nothing damning at the moment. He could easily have just left the forum after asking. | ||
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On June 06 2013 05:04 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Whether or not I sheep rayne my vote will look scummy. Going with my gut I guess. ##unvote ##vote: raynpelikoneet dont see how it can but why would you think that? | ||
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On June 06 2013 05:22 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I vote for him -> looks like a last minute bus I don't vote for him -> looks like conveniently ignoring him How is it a bus? I may have missed it but I didn't notice you pushing rayne late. | ||
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On June 06 2013 05:23 JarJarDrinks wrote: What a terrible lynch this is. No one thinks it's strange that there's only a single wagon? Who here actually expects rayn to flip red? Not really. It isn't like the case made on rayne is super weak. If you've got a better target then I'm willing to hear it. Otherwise I'm guessing you want a no lynch? It's plurality votes win so we'd have to explicitly vote for it. | ||
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On June 06 2013 05:26 jaybrundage wrote: Im curious why is rayn getting so much votes. He just seemed to not be very active. I recall someone saying that he is usually more active is that the main reason people are going for him? It just seems like everyone is consolidating but im not sure why on him :o On June 06 2013 01:02 mkfuba07 wrote: Sorry, passed out soon after my post. There's been lots of unexpected stuff popping up, distracting me from the game. The most concerning one is taken care of, so I'll be less distracted. In any case, it's unlikely I could have given you an answer. As I said, D1 I typically sheep someone I feel pretty strongly is town, on someone that person has convinced me is scum. I don't really dictate lynches D1. The only time I've actually "dictated" a lynch was at the end of Doctor Who mafia, which surprised even me in its insistence upon my lynch, as well as the fact that I was actually right XD If you'd insisted on an answer, I probably would have said vayne, since he's the one that's been on my mind the most, and I saw him as having the most potential to be scum, despite not having done anything I would call overtly scummy. While he's still on my mind, I have a different lynch target at the moment. SlOosh brought up a good point about rayn that makes me comfortable with a vote on him. His reasoning for having a town read on vayne is pretty scummy. Thinking someone's town because they accurately describe your playstyle doesn't show the level of suspicion that I'd expect from a townie. I mean, it's easier than trying to make a fake case against someone you know is innocent. It's up there with talking exclusively about setup speculation and asking the host questions to appear active. ##Vote: raynpelikoneet I previously found sentinel town (no specific reason, just general feelings after reading his posts), but I'm going to take a closer look at him since slOosh brought him up. Also, we're falling on different sides of the oats debate, which is interesting because we both just played in a scum oats game. I can believe that town oats believes Ace to be a legit lynch, since I have *kind of* the same feelings. Problem being, I don't like playing hypocritically, and if I vote Ace for activity (whether or not I expected more from him), then I might as well vote myself (though that would be playing against my wincon ). I haven't seen anything that would pick out Ace as scummier than anyone else in the game, so I'm not voting for him today. highlighted in bold. I think it is the main reason people are voting rayne. It's a pretty solid line of reasoning. If people are voting for him based on inactivity and not this case then yea we might be mislynching the guy. | ||
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Zephirdd, mkfuba07, WaveofShadow, Vivax, Stutters, Vivax, layabout, Ace, [UoN]Sentinel Zephirdd: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18807061 Activity and rayne taking things out of context. Based on his post this is looking more like an activity reasoning. mkfuba: made the case on rayne Wos: also made a case on rayne Vivax: looks like from questioning rayne. Is just as up for a Vayne lynch. Not inactivity, but a best of the worst lynch. Stutters: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=414632&user=276621¤tpage=3 looking at his last filter page I think it's an inactivity vote since he mentioned me and I was also afk. layabout: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18807613 says rayne tries to discredit him, lies about him Sentinel: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18808864 sheep/gut read Of these 2 are votes with really strong reasoning, another which comes off as vengeful (layabout) but equally valid since his feeling could be legit. All the other votes could be lumped into inactivity/not strong but rayne will do. And mine which is based on furba's case. That means half the wagon is voting for rayne based on inactivity and the other half because we think he is likely scum more than anyone else. I don't know if that is enough to actually overturn the wagon on him in 2 hours. The only person I'd consider at the moment over rayne is Oats and I don't think many people are up for lynching him. | ||
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On June 06 2013 06:02 WaveofShadow wrote: Rayn can 100% get me to switch my vote off of him if shows up in a bit like he says and performs as I would expect him to. Ace knowing how Oats plays why do you say Oats is a good lynch? I said I'm considering. He was my original choice before I got the point in the thread concerning rayne. On June 06 2013 04:42 Ace wrote: Oats I was afk and you've singled me out for not doing jack shit. even though I was around at the start of the game. Iirc you were the one prodding me for answers which I gave. How come you singled me out to be lynched and no one else? | ||
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Thread activity died since I came back and I think this is fiisht. For the remaining people voting for rayne do you believe he is really just inactive or just Scum? | ||
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He pushed his case vs rayne stronger than anyone else did and didn't have any reservations. | ||
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what Scum were you trying to find since this is the standard you are holding me to? prove it. | ||
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What about that chain of events is scummy? What was I supposed to do - lurk? And then get accused for that too? | ||
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On June 06 2013 12:13 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm too lazy to check atm...when 'we' established Rayn might be an inactivity lynch? When was that ever established? I'm not sure who attempted to push that line of thinking in the first place. You had a long post that analyzed everyone's pushes on Rayn I believe and in the end you summarized it as 'half of us are voting because of inactivity, and the other half have legit reasons.' yes that post. read up the discussion surrounding it. On June 06 2013 12:16 jaybrundage wrote: Regardless of what reasons people have for voting him. The reason YOU had convinced you that he was scum. (That reason being that he thought vayne was town simply because vayne know his play style) Having that piece of information lead you to believe that rayne was scum. However you back tracked after you said other people might have given reasons for inactivity. But other peoples voting reasons shouldn't of had such a big impact on your read. Why does it matter why they vote for him. If you think rayne is scum? It does matter what they think - notice how I originally voted for rayne. I was first on Oats (who ignored my question) and as I read the thread switched to rayne based on furba's post. As it went on it was clear some people were voting for rayne because he was inactive, and not based on scum reads. That is prime setting for a mislynch. | ||
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@jay: Once again, read my posts. I was questioning the nature of the lynch even though I agreed with furba's post. The only thing holding me back was Oats' behavior. His filter consists of throwing my name around even when I'm not here. He still never answered my question that I posed when I first got back. But it doesn't matter that much. Oats is Scum. And yea I know the possibility of a Miller exists, but Oats Day 1 play by itself should be raising red flags. ##vote Oatsmaster | ||
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On June 07 2013 08:56 layabout wrote: Ace comes back and jumps on rayne immediately claiming it's because of fuba's case. Then he look's more in depth at the wagon and tries to see if anyone will switch. He unvotes and ends the day without voting. To me this behavior feels a little off for mafia. It's careless. + Show Spoiler + no idea what happened to that quote Actually a little clarification, I didn't immediately jump on rayne. First thing I did was address Oats. I hadn't read up to the rayne thing yet. And yes I have a red check. I was Cop last night. | ||
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Also explain why scum would fakeclaim in this setup and that weakens your claim significantly. I don't understand why you're asking me this. Where did I ever say scum would fakeclaim? | ||
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On June 07 2013 09:17 WaveofShadow wrote: Alright we're going to have to take this slowly and methodically. With this claim (or fakeclaim) I don't think it's possible for both Oats and Ace to be scum. They can both be town if Oats is a miller...is miller self-aware or not? (I would assume not.) Ace could be scum fakeclaiming as Oats says, or it could be as simple as cop Ace catching scum Oats. I think it might make sense to have a look at all of the theory talk Ace had been doing regarding setup to see if it's likely he would try a fakeclaim here. Just getting this stuff all down in the thread; I will be doing all the stuff I've said myself pretty soon. Just to make this exceedingly simple: If I'm Scum fakeclaiming just investigate me tonight. | ||
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On June 07 2013 09:25 mkfuba07 wrote: Ooh, this is getting exciting. word yo. | ||
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On June 07 2013 11:39 kitaman27 wrote: lol, that's a silly statement. So you are you saying you weren't trying to turn around a lynch that you believed to be a mislynch? Perhaps I'm having trouble getting things straight regarding whether or not you wanted to lynch rayn at the end of the cycle? You're getting lynched if you afk for a second cycle. There is more to discuss past the cop check. 1.) How is it silly? You claim I didn't produce. I ask you to show evidence of it. Nothing wrong with that. 2.) I wasn't. The only thing I did was get hesitant about the nature of the lynch, especially when the thread activity died. Re-read that part of the thread again. I took my vote off of rayne towards the end. 3.) Yea, lynch me because I have stuff to do. lol. I'm generally afk from the forums around the same time since I have a demanding schedule. Stop killing me for it. | ||
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On June 07 2013 11:21 Oatsmaster wrote: Not a point. He can just say, OH MILLER MY BAD. And cause its 1 shot night roles, he doesnt have to explain why he is alive or not roleblocked or whatever. You understand? 1 reason why I think Ace is scum its cause he isnt addressing the scum side of possibly claiming cop in this setup AT all. Thats bad. Thats really bad. you're wrong about me. Maybe you are wrong about Ace too. I did address it. I said the next night a cop can just check me. | ||
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On June 07 2013 13:59 jaybrundage wrote: Wow never thought about that if scum get cop tmw they can really cause a shitstorm. With that being said vote for ace the wagon of justice calls. yea but it's more likely that they dont get it. Are you really trying to push a worst case scenario that isn't likely to happen as an excuse to lynch me? Why have you tunneled me but not even considered that my check is legit and Oats is Scum? Do you even have a read on Oats? | ||
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On June 07 2013 14:03 VayneAuthority wrote: The day is young and it's late here so im going to bed but im leaning towards lynching oats at this point as town getting cop is more likely than scum getting it. People hate that I play like that but yea. Percentages all day. I don't mind playing like that. I just want people to remember I checked Oats because I thought he was Scum on day 1 in the first place. This isn't solely about percentages On June 07 2013 14:11 jaybrundage wrote: Tunneling you? Are you kidding me you were not even on my radar till this last night. Your weird as hell reasoning with the people on your wagon having the wrong reasoning for voting someone holds no water at all. You thought you had a legitimate reason to vote rayn as scum. But when other people are voting for inactivity you say it could be a mislynch. Did it not occur to you that a scum could be inactive. Scum lurk all the damn time. Mafia could of got cop today and just are trying to get a free mislynch. While it is less likely numbers wise. The fact that your scummy makes it a lot easier to mafia got the cop role. As for Oats. I have been pretty null on him. He hasn't really been a player in the game IMO. He was just calling for your lynch for reasons I didn't really agree with (mostly inactivity reasons i believe) I would like to see more from him @Oats I would like it if you write up a bit why you think prlphz is scum. I'm gonna guess you mean rayne's wagon since I didn't have one. And if the reasoning does not hold then you should have addressed that post, you didn't. I outlined that 4 of the voterswere lynching rayne based off of inactivity and provided their votes and quotes of their reasons. You're lost. And yes, Scum could be inactive, so can town. Just because he ended up being inactive Scum doesn't mean we should discount the other possibility. On June 07 2013 14:21 jaybrundage wrote: But you know what ace I'll give you benefit of the doubt. If you were not going for Oats as your scum read Could you gimme your 3 top scum reads and your 3 best town reads thx Brosef Sentinel is the only other person I have a somewhat strong Scum leaning on because he voted for me after my check, after he already suspected Oats. I've already given my top Town read in furba. On June 07 2013 15:13 Oatsmaster wrote: Why dont you look at who got the fucking cop. Ace. A dude that has been whining about us lynching him for his lack of activity. Ace, who has never fully explained his read on me. Ace, who tried to switch off rayn and get other people lynched. Namely me. Then again I did this too, so maybe its not a scum tell. Ace, who is scum! Heaven forbid me for not wanting to get lynched since I was lynched in all 3 of my previous games when I was afk. Even with heavy activity the minute I leave the thread you guys wild and off me. I thought I explained my read on you already, but if it isn't concise enough I can do it again. Also for the last time, can you show where I was trying to get other people to lynch you? I was hesitant about a mislynch and even stated not enough people were around to switch votes on your wagon. That would be the laziest push ever. On June 07 2013 18:52 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Vayne and prplhz voted for Oats and defending Ace on little evidence despite public opinion, are we having a repeat of the rayn lynch? Can we be right twice? ##unvote ##vote: ace Neither of them defended me from anything. They just merely offered explanations. On June 07 2013 20:06 Oatsmaster wrote: Ace is scum because This post is shit reasoning why someone is town. 'no reservations' does not make someone town. Shit. And Ace isnt shit. Therefore he is scum fabricating a reason for a town read he already knows is true. OK PRP time. Reading through his filter, I find that I read that its townie. Ok. Prp is town. Why? Generally because he brought up Rayn as a lynch target earlier, and although he switched off of rayn, he explained it in a townlike way that was similar to what I thought. Whoop. Stay on Ace guys. Once again, taking extreme positions on what I said. I said most likely confirmed Town. Furba would be bussing rayne with a strong case if they were both Scum. I doubt it, especially since he never moved his vote or tried to push anyone else. He is most likely Town once rayne flips. The reasoning is solid. Every post I make notice you are the only person finding something scummy in them. That is an extreme level of bias that I don't think the town version of you is capable of. On June 07 2013 20:42 prplhz wrote: Right. I don't see why a scum Ace would want to trade 1-for-1 with some townie that people were already throwing suspicion on. The most logical conclusion then is that he is town who got a red check. I'm not willing to dismiss a red check because of the 1/9 offchance that you're the miller. There are also some other things pointing at you being scum such as your weird Ace push yesterday and how you wanted us to lynch outside of you and Ace. Scum would obviously want that because if Ace flips town then you're dead the next day, delaying this little duel you have going will net you extra KP for another cycle which is bad. On June 07 2013 21:53 prplhz wrote: I don't really think of Ace as someone who crumbles under what little pressure he was under. Just Oats exaggerating to make his case against me look stronger. He was the only guy strongly pushing for my lynch, kita called me out for being afk but I guess he thinks that means I'm under pressure. On June 07 2013 22:05 JarJarDrinks wrote: It is a point. It may not be a point that stands on it's own. But it would be dumb not to take it into consideration. You know that he can't just say "OH MILLER MY BAD" and expect to not get lynched. There's like a 6% chance that you rolled miller. We just can't take miniscule possiblities into account like that. Right. I even said if Oats flips Town and you guys don't believe me just have the Cop check me tonight. In the post where I claimed I even, never mind I'm just repeating myself. On June 07 2013 22:28 Oatsmaster wrote: Yes it makes me look bad, no its not fucking relevant. Ask Kita, Ask Ace. This numbers thing should not be why you wanna lynch me rather than Ace. Scum IS gonna make a 1 for 1 trade rather than a 1 for none. Especially since they get rid of a vocal townie in the process. Ace may have felt that this ploy was the only way he would survive to the end of the day. I dont know. Too many things to speculate about which means that its not useful in determining my alignment, or Ace's alignment. Tell me why please, not referring to the fact that I am checked red by a claimed cop. survive what? I was never in danger of being lynched. You are making things up again. I mean let's assume for a second what you say is true. I'm under pressure from 2 people and feel I will be lynched. I'm supposed to be a great Scum player, so I fake a check on you knowing that if you flip green I will possibly be lynched the next day. I've attracted attention to myself ensuring I get put up for a lynch when I could have just deflected the attention. You think this scenario is plausible? On June 07 2013 23:21 kitaman27 wrote: First off, Ace's "if Oats flips town you can cop check me" idea is absolutely terrible. If oats flips town then we lynch Ace and use the cop check on a player who know don't already know the alignment of. 1:1 trade is deceiving in name. It's really 1 mafia in exchange for two wasted cycles of discussion, a mislynch, and an extra kp by preserving the mafia numbers. 10v3 would end up as 6v2, assuming no saves, although saves are pretty likely in this setup. Speaking of the setup, I think a shorter game definitely benefits mafia and mafia do appear to be playing the numbers game based on the night hits. From a mafia perspective, in Ace's position, I would only make the fake claim if I deemed the upcoming cycle to be doomed from the start, whether it be the top two mafia candidates being scum or the top scum candidate being unquestionably lynched. 6v2 gives the mafia a fighting chance, but 9v2 is pretty much over. I hate that Ace is the one providing the check, but I think a cop check is a sub-optimal mafia strategy from his current position. If I were a mafia Ace, I'd go for the mislynch this cycle and pull shenanigans on day three if the opportunity were available. If he is indeed offering himself up in a poor exchange, then I suppose we take it and go into day four in a good position. If I had a town read on Oats, I might reconsider, but with him flopping from Sent to prpl and then considering for a moment that someone other than Ace should be lynched, ##Vote: Oatsmaster I do question in what world Ace considers being afk as a viable defense. If you're busy, yet still signed up for the game, give up some sleep if you have to. I'm quite willing to switch back to Ace if he doesn't provide a scum read outside of a cop check on Oats. As a town cop, he certainly has put no effort into establishing his credibility and he needs to comment on other individuals. Oats, I'd suggest you provide as many reads as possible. Calling people scum in caps doesn't count. Maybe you can sway me. It's a wonderful idea. We know the possibility of a miller does exist so Oats flipping Town implicates me. A simple check resolves whether I am lying or not unless I am scum and get miller/gf. Lynching me results in up to 6 dead Townies when 1 check could have saved us time and lives. Also when I have been here I've participated a lot. You also know it's my standard mo not to just be throwing reads around all day long. Mentioning it isn't relevant here. On June 07 2013 23:31 Oatsmaster wrote: Kita, I dont think prp is currently scum, sent scumslipped so there's that too. Ace/Sent wouldve probably been discussion topics, and now its Ace and me. Someone other than Ace should be lynched when there is a possibility of me having gotten miller. Which is low. And since I read through his filter again, and the fact that mafia KP gets lowered if we lynch scum today, I firmly wanna lynch Ace. Why are you so dense? You see, my current hypothesis about Ace's absence, is that he knew he would be absent and he knew that fakeclaiming cop check on me would be the only way someone other than him gets lynched. I was absent because I have a job and a busy schedule during the week. I'm more than capable of being active scum in the thread. Your hypothesis doesn't hold. I was never in danger of getting lynched anyway so why would I leave the thread hoping for an alternative if I am Scum? On June 07 2013 23:48 Stutters695 wrote: Absence isn't a scum tell on its own. I also don't think Ace was a guaranteed lynch without the claim. I need to check both of you guys but right now I'm finding it hard to believe ace would lie when it wasn't absolutely necessary. On June 07 2013 23:49 JarJarDrinks wrote: All I'm saying is it should be taken into consideration. It should NOT ne ignored. Why would they believe that it's gonna be a 1 for none? I saw nothing indicating that Ace would be lynched today. In fact I think town sentiment was that Sentinel was on the chopping block. So if scum made this play to save Sent then they exposed Ace in doing so and if you turn up green and we Lynch Ace and he's scum, then Sent is probably not far behind. So congrats, your death netted us 2 scum. See this is why Ace's play makes no sense for scum. You're saying that there's too many things to speculate about. But I'm not seeing any situation that makes sense here for scum. Please point out a scenerio where Ace exposing himself makes sense. Because "he felt he couldnt handle the pressure." sure as heck isn't a good reason. You keep saying not to refer to the biggest piece of evidence against you. But Ok, to answer, here was my original case against you: + Show Spoiler + : On June 05 2013 21:39 JarJarDrinks wrote: ##Vote Oatsmaster His gung-ho Ace-is-def-scum-guys push seems so contrived. I can't imagine he can actually act so cocksure, especially when his reasons are so weak. Here's his reasoning (which btw came 12 hours after his vote): I don't want to really defend Ace since he isn't exactly playing pro-town, but these reasons are terrible: - "His contributions have been setup speculation" - Ace just made one post saying we should claim and report results. Oats was the one prodding him further which forced Ace to talk more about it - "random vote on WoS." - OK, I'll agree w/ this one. Random votes are lame. I'd like to see him explain if he actually has a reason for voting WoS or if it was truly random. - "defending mkfuba for basically no reason." Here's the post he's talking about:His "Scum love to defend people cause it makes them look good." is dumb. How is that post supposed to make Ace look good? Ace was specifically asked what he thought and he answered. How can that possibly be seen as scummy? Not to mention the fact that there's plenty of people posting "defences" for other people On June 05 2013 22:34 JarJarDrinks wrote: Huh? You voted him without explaining your vote. Something that you're accusing him of. Yes, you eventually gave your weak reasoning. I don't buy how you can be so sure of yourself with such a bad case. I feel like it's an act. And here's something else you accused him of while doing the same thing:So does defending 2 players in the same post make you like twice as likely to be scum? Like I was already voting for you yesterday. It's not like the cop thing is the only thing I'm considering Good post. I'm not Scum so the situation where me and Sent are Scum together doesn't exist. But if it did that means I would be exposing myself to save him, and both of us would be dead pretty soon. I think we all know I do a really good job of reading the thread and that would be a major error. On June 07 2013 23:50 kitaman27 wrote: I think you have to treat continued absence as a scum tell, otherwise it establishes a policy that it's fine to disappear without consequence. I agree, especially if the absentee player isn't contributing when they are here. On June 08 2013 01:01 Stutters695 wrote: Continued absence without any posting sure, but when there is posting there is stuff to interpret. People accuse me of being scum when I'm absent all the time, but reading my posts should make it pretty obvious I'm not. Rayne avoided saying anything in his posts and was lynched for it. Oats throwing out incredibly unlikely theories of how Ace is lying because he is absent isn't a reason to lynch and he should be showing how his posting shows that he's absent with the intent of avoiding discussion or something equally scummy. Hopefully that makes sense, typing from my phone. Right on the money. This was why I kept asking them to prove where my lack of scum hunting is. It's not like I was blowing off questions or ignoring scenarios where it was obvious I needed to participate. On June 08 2013 01:18 Vivax wrote: My analysis of Sentinel's play and why he is most likely town: At first glance this post looked really scummy for the reasons he used to switch to ace, but it provides valuable information. Sentinel is basing all his reasoning on two other people being scum, while having Oats as scummy as well (I disagree with the notion but it's probably town-motivated) Now, imagine Oats is scum and Sentinel too. That doesn't really fit, right? Sentinel has been pushing Oats throughout D1, then he added Vayne and prplhz as his scumreads, and ace revealed the cop check, and Sentinel thinks "Oh well two scummers are on another scummers' wagon so ace is scum", and Oats can't be scum. What has been going on here? These are the explanations: 1: Sentinel is scum, Oats is miller and ace is cop. Sentinel lynches Ace and still can lynch Oats afterwards. (improbable) 2: Sentinel is scum, Oats is standard town and ace is scum. Sentinel busses ace over his scumread for maximum town cred cause he knows that whatever happens, ace will die after Oats. (improbable, he has been pushing Oats all the time before) 3: Sentinel is town and genuinely thinks that Oats can't be scum cause two other scum reads vote for him, discarding the possibility that they know that Oats will die sooner or later. (probable) That means that, in case of an Oats red flip, Sentinel is town. And in case of an Ace red flip, he's also town, simply cause I don't see him going for an ace bus when all he has been doing so far in the game would have allowed him to keep pushing Oats instead of ace. If Oats was miller, then the reasoning is obviously useless, but I guess we have to gamble here. _____________________________________________________________________________________________________ As for who to choose today, Ace was in no danger of getting lynched any time soon, and Oats seems like a likely target for a check for his strange D1 tunnel on Ace. I've never played against scum-Ace, but I doubt he would be so stupid to throw away his life with a fake check, hoping that town believes Oats was miller last night. Situation 1 is probable. If you believe Sent is possibly Scum then switching his votes between 2 Town players isn't going to get him killed here. When we look at his reasoning for doing it though we see it's illogical. I agree that Situation 3 is probable. Situation 2 I covered earlier and isn't. Based on your conclusion I assume you have Sentinel firmly down as Town. Of course if you accept that S2 is flawed then the conclusion is also. On June 08 2013 01:33 Oatsmaster wrote: Vivax, what zeph said doesnt mean anything. He didnt provide a conclusion. You wanna provide a conclusion? Ok. Current Premise im operating under until Ace returns. He knew that if he were to just normally afk, HE WOULD GET LYNCHED, No doubt. 0. People were already turning to the idea of lynching Ace. So he busts out fake cop check to make sure I get lynched(Most fucking vocal person in the thread) And he doesnt die today. Also when he gets me lynched. Oh miller, sorry guys. ITS NOT A 1 for 1, and you guys need to stop thinking that way. What people? You keep acting as if being vocal means you are Town. What you're vocal about matters more than the number of posts you make, and your filter was ACE AFK! ACE SCUM! You didn't get any major support for this and you still kept doing it. | ||
Ace
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On June 08 2013 01:45 JarJarDrinks wrote: Can you show me where you're getting this from? Serious question because I really never felt that anyone aside from you were considering lynching Ace. You're analysis is correct. On June 08 2013 01:49 WaveofShadow wrote: I do remember other people warming up to the idea a little, me being one of them, that being said, Ace isn't the kind of person to freak out and fakeclaim because he's worried about being lynched that early. (That's something I'd do lolololol) WoS needs my coaching yo. On June 08 2013 01:54 Oatsmaster wrote: Kita, some people were warming up to the idea Kita posted this just before deadline Remember this? So people were gearing up to lynch Ace, Ace thought this nails him, he fakeclaims redcheck on me, we end up here. Kita is 1 person. Him saying he would lynch me doesn't support the situation you've been painting. Somehow I would have managed to not read the thread, fake claim because of panicking, and then get myself eventually lynched because I didn't think through how many people really want me gone. Does this sound plausible to you? On June 08 2013 01:55 Oatsmaster wrote: The thing is. Fakeclaiming in this setup isnt risky. LOL MILLER OOPS. Yeah. yeah. I think its a perfectly legit mafia strat. It is risky. Go back to pre-game and read the exchange between myself and Dandel Ion. On June 08 2013 02:26 VayneAuthority wrote: idk man in carnival you tried to lynch people that you actually thought were scum, whether it was vets or scrubs. You seem to have a build up in your town games that allows you to reach that point and vote where as in your scum games you're kinda just like THIS GUY IS SCUM and vote him and tunnel it. See I don't even subscribe to "meta" and you came to the same conclusion independently of me. This was what got him checked. When I came back in the thread, before I even got Cop powers I asked him why he ignored all the other afk people and solely focused on me. He never answered and went right back to tunneling me. On June 08 2013 03:28 WaveofShadow wrote: Vayne Null-leaning scum. I'm not sure I can push a lynch through today, doubt it's even a good idea to do so.Getting this stuff out there nonetheless. This coming from a guy who says So, you don't really care for meta when used on you, but you're ok to use it to back up a scumread about whom you haven't offered up any other evidence other than 'gutreads,' and 'percentages?' Well this is a really good point. If Vayne is Scum it would show he is just opportunistic about getting a lynch off at any cost. On June 08 2013 03:53 JarJarDrinks wrote: Heh I actually agree w/ Oats on that last one. The only scenerio in which I can imagine scum Ace lying about Oats is if Sent is also scum and they decided to take a huge gamble becuase Sent looked like he was headed towards a noose today. Sent planting seeds that he may not vote for Ace worries me. No need to worry, I'm not Scum. Don't associate his behavior with me. I already outlined it would be a crazy idea for me to gamble with his defense here. On June 08 2013 03:57 VayneAuthority wrote: Im pretty much confirmed town after rayne flipped red, anyone pushing on me reminds me of goodkarma from the les mis game, except im goodkarma this game. On June 08 2013 04:02 kitaman27 wrote: If Ace doesn't start posting, I'm canceling the NBA finals. Don't test me! (Me and Stern former scum buddies), not funny. @WoS: My vote on you wasn't serious. I don't know how it picked up steam but I never mentioned you again when I got back - I immediately unvoted so I could read what was going on. When I came back I called out Oats. Voting for Rayne was not the first thing I did. I got to furba's post and thought it was a good reason to vote rayne. I started looking at it possibly being an inactivity lynch after it was suggested. I don't see how that doesn't make sense. When half of the wagon can be spotted as voting for a guy because of inactivity that is a prime mislynch. I saw rayne could easily be Town getting lynched not because people actually found him scummy. Also I'm not Scum hoping to get Cop and lolmiller Oats. Look at the thread after the rayne lynch. Even if you ignore everything before then who did you think I would check once I got Cop? That would be a crazy gambit for me to be setting Oats up for the fall before I was even awarded the role. On June 08 2013 06:20 WaveofShadow wrote: Before filter diving I can say that I have experienced this play of his before in the last game we were in together and he was town. Anything that people attribute to him as scummy I was essentially told in Carnival Cruise 'just Oats being Oats.' In fact, I'd really like Ace to comment on Oats in this game vs Carnival Cruise since he hosted it. If it's too much to ask him to do come up with this himself, then when i get the chance later I will dig up examples for him to look at. Oats was one of the worst players in the game in CC. Knowing this, if he is Town again then why make some of the same blatant mistakes that led to Scum winning? Oats is rational so he would know that is bad. He's still tunneling to an extreme amount and exaggerating situations trying to paint me in a worse predicament than reality shows. Even if I were to believe Oats is just that bad to not change his play, his Day 1 play still reeks. On June 08 2013 06:33 layabout wrote: His playstyle mathces what i have seen of his town, in particular is is suspicious of me again, He wants to lynch prplhz if not Ace and i am inclined to agree with him (but more on that if it becomes a possibilty/ before nks). I don't see why anyone would want to lynch prp right now. On June 08 2013 06:47 jaybrundage wrote: Ugh im struggling with sent as a read. I dont like his flip flop from oats. He was really against oat's push on ace. Then after ace makes the cop claim. Sent just completly reverses. On one hand I think ace is scum so i like it. But on the other the complete turn around doesn't seem very townie. The reasoning for it too is bad. You shouldn't change your opinion of someones alignment cause your other scum reads voted for your scum read. Because at the end of the day you have no idea whether they are scum or not. Not to mention it was a reverse from someone Sent defended to someone hes trying to lynch now. I honestly don't know what to make of him. But regardless I want to kill ace so. Ill deal with sent tmw. Read the earlier post where I outline me and Sent being scum buddies is highly unlikely. On June 08 2013 07:03 jaybrundage wrote: If Ace is scum he can just back out with a Miller MAH BAD bullshit. If anything if ace is as strong a mafia player as so many say he would just fakeclaim like he did on Oats. Then try to talk him self out the second lynch by saying Oats was miller. I'm town and in the unlikely event Oats flips Town I would do the same. Which is why I asked to be Cop checked tonight to avoid that scenario. Look at it from both sides of the coin. also to your future posts layabout wasn't trying to derail anything. On June 08 2013 08:43 Stutters695 wrote: Well it's one of my main points in favoring an oats lynch. That and the fact that scum Ace should be wise enough to realize that a 2-1 trade isn't in scums favor when we still haven't mislynched. I really can't read oats though and that worries me. On June 08 2013 10:17 jaybrundage wrote: This isn't even coherent nor does it have any logic. 1Ace got on the Rayn wagon early left it. Went on Oats then came back on it because of Fuba's reasoning saying it was sound reason for why Rayn could be scum. He thought he had a valid reason for trying to lynch Rayn. But later in the day he compiled the votes and said that if people were voting for Rayn cause he was inactive then it might be a mislynch. This doesn't make any sense and doesnt follow logic. This isn't true. I came back and unvoted Wos, called out Oats, and then voted Rayne. I wasn't on the wagon early at all. The logic holds up where I say rayne might be a mislynch. Go back and read that part of the day over. Read my filter for the order of events. On June 08 2013 12:59 jaybrundage wrote: Wtf? You really don't even feel confident to say one other scum read. It helps stimulate discussion. Thats why even tho we are lynching in a pool of two. We should still talk about other scum reads so we can gauge reactions and see what people's opinions are. What do you plan to do the rest of the day if your not willing to talk about other scum reads? Or is it that your afraid of saying your scum read. And then later when you flip flop and dont take stances (like you usually do my scum friend) You wont have to worry about what you said earlier. It doesn't make him Scum though, just careful with his reads. I'm the same way. You see it as stifling discussion and he sees it (I think) as not adding useless chatter if it isn't going to get us anywhere at the moment. @JJD: I guess you'll read the Sent/Me Scum team thing eventually. It answers your post to Vivax. | ||
Ace
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On June 08 2013 14:17 Oatsmaster wrote: Ace, lets say this whole situation didnt happen. Someone else got cop. Would your activity be the same? Do you think you would be under more pressure/votes? Ace, why are you being reactive rather than proactive? Reactive is what scum do cause they dont have a reason to be proactive. Yes it would, because I would be pushing you to start the day. I would have still been afk and when I came back to the thread things would have been different. I'll be active today though as it is the weekend. I'll also say part of the reason I kept pushing you is because you were tunneling an extreme amount and exaggerating things. I also doubt I'd be under more pressure. It's not like when I was around I trolled and posted nonsense. I was contributing. I didn't see a big thread sentiment to take me down for inactivity. I don't see how I'm being reactive and not proactive. I threw out my cop check and convinced people on it, left the thread and posted about everything I missed. You consider this reactive behavior? If so what else was I going to do? I don't even think your theory of proactive = town, reactive = scum is valid. On June 08 2013 14:18 Oatsmaster wrote: Also Ace, talk about the fakeclaiming side of this. Is it likely, why/why not, what benefits does fakeclaiming have, what disadvantages and so on. I think we should clarify the difference between fakeclaiming and lying about a check which is what I think is the real discussion here. Scum can't fakeclaim in this setup because it is Open. If I claim Cop and someone else claims Cop its guaranteed one of us is guilty. The only time I can see Scum pulling this is near lylo, Now lying about my check is what I think you really are asking. I can see the Scum benefiting from it as they could entirely get the Cop role, and with unaware Millers easily have a legit claim to stand on. This scenario also happens for Town Cops so they have nothing to fear. They have to convince the Town after an innocent flip that they are still town and the most likely explanation is "lulzmiller". Town would be screwed arguing this because the reality of lynching 2 town would be brutal: that would be 6 dead townies in a row. Massive Scum advantage. Of course this is why I pointed out long ago that you can stop this by just checking me tonight. If I was Scum I'd return a red check and the Town avoids that doomsday scenario. The advantage isn't that great after all. | ||
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On June 08 2013 16:18 WaveofShadow wrote: Ace if you're still around, can I ask you one more thing? I still don't understand your reasoning around which you argued with jaybrundage and your removal of your vote from the Rayn wagon. Your reasoning that he might be a mislynch because other people are voting him for inactivity...I just don't follow it whatsoever. If a bunch of people are voting somebody scummy for the wrong reasons, but you know someone is scum and you vote him for the right reasons, then all that matters is after the successful lynch you have to look at those who were doing so for the wrong reasons. It doesn't mean you shouldn't lynch someone you still find scummy. This was my thought process: I analyzed the votes on the wagon and come to the conclusion that 4 of them are inactivity based. I already feel a little iffy that this could be a Town mislynch. I also noticed outside of you IIRC, I was the only one that mentioned furba's case. It was possible at the moment while furba had a good case, it could be a misunderstanding leading to rayne's death. I unvoted after that. I wasn't as sure of him being scum, and I didn't want to appear on the wagon of a dead Townie. I don't agree that looking for those who voted for him for the wrong reasons after he flips was the right course of action. Once I feel he is going to be a mislynch I look at what we have and decide before he flips. Overall I'd say I'm pretty damn convinced of your towniness (though this is probably the most effort I've ever seen you put into a game, and I've never seen you play scum...lololol) but I want to go over a couple other things as well. You mentioned you don't see why anyone would vote prplhz did you mean today specifically? Because personally his Rayn flipflop still looks awful to me and after this thing between you and Oats is dealt with one way or another he's going to have to be looked at. You also mentioned you agree with my analysis of Vayne...the problem is I'm not so sure I agree with me. Again, meta states he should be town with this shit way he's playing, but I just don't see why anyone who wants to show people they are town would play so blatantly horribly. (Again if you take what he said about changing his own meta at face value it flips around and he's playing scummy or something.) Some other random things worrying me like Vivax barely being around at all, me being not 100% sure of my Sent townread. I also still have to do an objective filter dive of Oats and I don't think I'll get to it tonight. I put effort into my games, you guys just ignore me when I do For prp I meant including Day 1. I may have missed his rayne flip-flop. If you think he is Scum with rayne and flip flopped, and also believe one of me/oats is Scum you can use that assumption and read one of us based on his vote. Vayne is suspicious to me for the meta thing and calling himself confirmed Town. I think he's joking about the latter though, possibly. Other than that I'd say don't argue with him and sort him out later since he's in his own world thinking he has done a lot. Vivax is afk along with some other people. He did have a decent post about me/Oats/Sent. Also if you're going to filter dive I suggest reading the posts in context at the same time for Oats. | ||
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On June 08 2013 16:35 Oatsmaster wrote: Um lol Im not playing ANYTHING like carnival. Where do you get that conclusion from? Carnival, I was sheepy sheepy lazy townie, I didnt really push anyone. The thing that worries me about Vivax, is that he has done all the 'right' things, but he hasnt been anywhere near as active as he has been normally. Ace, would you do this cop thing if you were scum? Since your current position is that you are town. Pretend you are scum in the thread. Would you do it. Town is Ace's current role as he has said it to the thread. No. The risk is too great as a simple Cop check would get me lynched. | ||
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On June 08 2013 16:50 Oatsmaster wrote: Can you point out where my play is similar to Carnival? the post you quoted isn't enough? On June 08 2013 16:51 Oatsmaster wrote: I dont like this sentence. I dont know why. Ace, can you explain what risk is involved fake claiming a red check that turns out green? If I'm Scum faking a check I'd be lynched tomorrow and drop our KP to 1. On June 08 2013 16:52 Oatsmaster wrote: Ace, why are going through and answering stuff post by post? How does this help town know you are town, and to find scum? I missed the entire day. I'm not sure what you're getting at here as it makes sense for me to come back and comment on what went on. On June 08 2013 22:22 layabout wrote: No i am explaining the risk for mafia fake-claiming since it's not as bad as Ace is telling us it is. I would have preferred if we had done that earlier on but that's actually a terrible idea. I think there would be more value in a check on someone else. If I'm Scum and getting autolynched the next day I think that's a pretty big risk. On June 08 2013 22:25 JarJarDrinks wrote: OK, but I feel like a an Oats/Sent team is kinda unlikely and Sent is just blatently scum right now. I'd still rather Lynch Oats than you for all the reasons I've already said. But I;d rather Lynch Sent than either of you Ace, you do realize that is Oats flips green, you're autolynched tomorrow. The cop isn't gonna waste a check on you. I really don't like how you're already making contingency plans for a town flip. If we're planning on wasting a copcheck on you in the case of a mislynch, it makes more sense to not lynch you or Oats today and wait till we get results back. This is why I think we should lynch Sent today. An unlucky miller check basically means we lose 6 townies before we get back to the game. We should lynch Sent cause he's scum, have the cop check Ace tonight, and lynch one of Ace/Oats tomorrow. Don't look at it as a contingency plan then. It's literally me spelling out every explanation of the various scenarios I've been asked over and over. I know I'm Town and confident in my check. In the unlikely scenario Oats flips Town then clearly I'd ask to be checked to clear myself and avoid 6 Town deaths. What else would you expect me to say? Go ahead and lynch me? | ||
Ace
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On June 08 2013 22:38 Oatsmaster wrote: Yeah I was gonna say that this actually didnt involve much risk for Ace to do. Now that we have determined that Ace, arguably best scum player has deliberately increased the possible danger of fakeclaiming and didnt take into account, scum might get the cop. Its safe to say that Ace is scum. ??? Are you guys forgetting if I'm scum and get autolynched scum Kp drops to 1. How is that not much risk? | ||
Ace
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On June 08 2013 22:44 Oatsmaster wrote: Because. By lynching me, you definitely get an extra KP. Cop wastes a check. Scum could get cop. You could get GF. Its not the definite 1 for 1 you are making it out to be. You are ignoring any reason that scum has to do this. Why Ace? Ace, I mean specific portions in carnival where im playing like in this game. I don't have any KP. Think about what you're saying here. Assume I'm Scum. I was in no danger of getting lynched today. I could let any random Townie die and get my "extra" KP. Instead I cause a ruckus with a check on you knowing it could lead to my death and drop the Scum team's KP to 1. Also stop putting words in my mouth. I've never said anything about a 1 for 1 trade. That was someone else. I'm not going to go back and read the entire game but I know in my write up I mentioned how you were not reading people's posts. On June 08 2013 22:47 JarJarDrinks wrote: No I understand as either town or scum you'd want the cop to check you @ that point. But you understand that it's unlikely to happen and we'd most likely autolynch you? If you could choose between these 2 scenarios, what you would choose? Lynch Oats and if he flips green autolynch you tomorrow OR Lynch Sentinel and have a cop check you tonight and then we lynch based on the cops info tommorrow. Assuming I was a neutral observer, I'd lynch me if Oats flipped Town. I don't think lynching Sentinel is the right move here. | ||
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I don't know what your second quote is from. Post the entire quote so I know what I was speaking on. Stop taking my stuff out of context. I did not meta read you. I commented on how you were terrible last game, and I don't think you would be bad enough to know what you did wrong and keep doing it. Once again, you can quote the post where I said for everyone to see. | ||
Ace
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On June 08 2013 23:19 Oatsmaster wrote: No Ace, Im saying that you imply through your posting and current attitude that If I flip town, you die tmr. That makes it so you are saying that its a 1 for 1 trade today. I've never implied anything. There isn't a trade. I'm Town, so if you die and flip Town then we both just drop Town numbers. I think you're mixing up my posts with someone else's because I'm as clear as day. Oats was one of the worst players in the game in CC. Knowing this, if he is Town again then why make some of the same blatant mistakes that led to Scum winning? Oats is rational so he would know that is bad. He's still tunneling to an extreme amount and exaggerating situations trying to paint me in a worse predicament than reality shows. Even if I were to believe Oats is just that bad to not change his play, his Day 1 play still reeks. This is the meta read. It says I play like I played in Carnival. Which I flipped town in. Which somehow makes me scum in this game. OH MAN. [/quote] That is NOT a meta read. Honestly, after this game we need to sit down and talk about "meta" because you guys keep using the term wrong. I didn't make any notions about some trait specific to you. All I did was say I don't think you'd make the same mistakes as Town on purpose as you did last game. You keep skipping this part as if I didn't know you were Town that game and can't explain myself. Because. By lynching me, you definitely get an extra KP. Cop wastes a check. Scum could get cop. You could get GF. In response to this, you said. I don't have any KP. Think about what you're saying here. Assume I'm Scum. I was in no danger of getting lynched today. I could let any random Townie die and get my "extra" KP. Instead I cause a ruckus with a check on you knowing it could lead to my death and drop the Scum team's KP to 1. 'Let any random townie die' Thats probable but not definite. A red check is pretty definite.[/QUOTE] Your saying it's probable that a mislynch would occur if I was Scum correct? And me knowing this pulled this stunt to avoid one. Is that what you're getting at? | ||
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Lastly, I don't think it's a 1 for 1 trade assuming Mafia did it. I never said that and if I did point it out to me and I'll own up to it. I seriously think you are stretching whatever I said to fit your definition here. I didn't imply anything in any of my posts either. | ||
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On June 09 2013 00:12 Oatsmaster wrote: you have reading comprehension problems. 1 Reason why I think you are scum, is because you havent said anything more about the possbility of fakeclaims other than the dude gets lynched when I flip town. You havent said anything about the chance for scum to get cop, for yourself to get gf, for town derping it up. Many things that dont make this a 1 for 1 trade for scum. Like 3 people have asked me about the fakeclaim. I've answered everything and if I left something out, then how does that prove me as being Scum? Not one person has come to this conclusion except you. You are the only person that can read my posts and see some hidden meaning in them via something I didn't do. @prp: I stated this in my big post my top Scumread outside of Oats is Sentinel | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
I argued that I should be checked first thing to open up as I know I am Town. You can easily catch me as lying Scum with this check, and drop Scum KP to 1 with my lynch tomorrow and do as I said pregame to break it. When I flip Town though: you'll have zepphird, sl0osh, Oats, Townie A, Townie B, Me, Townie C, and Townie D assuming no vet/med saves all dead. That is 8 dead town players in a row all because Scum are trying to convince you not to check me. It is THE easiest thing to do to avoid this situation - why would you ignore it? | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
For me to be Scum here I'd have to: A.) fake a check on Oats. B.) Set up a reason to investigate him But my suspicions on Oats started entirely because he tunneled me when I was afk for most of Day 1. I even asked him why and he never responded. For me to be Scum here I would have to be gambling hard that I set him up and roll Cop the following night. That is a major stretch but ok, assume this is true and I am Scum. The next day, I am under no pressure to be lynched. However, I claim a Scum check on Oats knowing he'd eventually flip Town and screw me over. I'd have to be once again, gambling on the chance I get GF role or my scum team gets off another fake check. Ahead of time. For you to lynch me you have to accept that these 2 long- shot scenarios occurred. That I set myself up to be immune from investigation days before this scenario actually popped up. Now honestly, kita, Wos, and anyone else that wanted to lynch me before we even got to this point do you think I set all of this up? How would I have accounted for a bad roll of the dice if I am Scum? And how in the world are you all ignoring the fact that I am Town results in 8 players deaths in a row? Anyone who didn't take the time to think this scenario out and wanted a quick lynch are most likely Scum. You want to investigate someone else tonight? Pick between yourselves. Because Im not getting lynched tomorrow. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 09 2013 12:53 kitaman27 wrote: In fact, I think posting your reads of every single player would be a great idea. If you are truly town, then you understand what position you are in and should do whatever you can to prove it. I never do this, so stop asking. I'm not in a bad position so you can quit parroting that theme. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 04:34 kitaman27 wrote: Please tell me you're not analyzing an anonymous poll -_- gotta admit, I lolled | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 04:45 VayneAuthority wrote: is that a serious post? I hate having to decide on Dumbtelling I voted for the "lynch him" option. Follow my lead. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 04:50 layabout wrote: Because you are taking a risk that has a potentially huge payoff right, but I would have needed to get lucky 2 nights in a row and setup Oats ahead of time. Without checking me we mislynch and get up to 8 Town deaths and lylo. Which one seems like the smarter option here? | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
zeph, sl0osh, Oats. 2 Town tonight, Me, 2 Town tomorrow night On June 10 2013 04:58 kitaman27 wrote: Gotta start ahead of time knowing oats will flip town. ??? So when you guys advocate not checking me, why didn't I take that as an out and run? | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 05:49 Stutters695 wrote: Sure, shoot. LXI you were the serial poisoner who was playing so town you got caught because you kept getting defensively RBd. Aww I'll take that as a compliment. Although I'd like you to point what is so un-Town like about me this game. So here's my question. Imagine you get cop night 1 this game. Your top scum read comes back with a red check. You are under no pressure of getting lynched. Would you claim? In essence tell me what you would have done differently than I did because this isn't making sense to me. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 05:57 kitaman27 wrote: By the way, Ace's cop discussion is likely an attempt to try to figure out who it is. Don't bite. More WIFOM from kita. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 06:04 Vivax wrote: Layabout, question: Don't you think it's a waste to check ace? If he's scum that's exactly what he wants. It's one less cop check to use on someone else. If he's town then, yeah ok we saved a townie but we also lynched one, and there's always the risk that he rolled godfather or that scum got cop again, albeit being a small risk. But do you feel that ace has a sufficient chance of being town? I found his way of talking to Oats suspicious tbh, he already knew that he was scum but he almost sounded as if he wanted to convince him of his own innocence IIRC. At least that's the impression I got from checking their interactions. Suspicious? :/ Seriously how many ways can you guys stretch things? If my name wasn't Ace no one would be questioning that check. There's some bias going on with scum motivation to get me lynched. Can one person tell me how a Town Cop coming out with a check is a bad decision there, especially when the check is on his top scum suspect. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 06:11 kitaman27 wrote: Ace, may I ask you for your read on Vivax? I dont have one on him either | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 06:13 Vivax wrote: read on everyone you have a read on Read the thread. I've given 2 scum reads in the last day. This stuff isn't exactly hard to find. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 08:06 kitaman27 wrote: ^_^ nice shot last night Kita. Couldn't have picked a better target myself. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 08:08 prplhz wrote: oh well lets get to it ##Vote Ace get your vote off of me, we're lynching Kita today | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
But yo, I'm going out to watch the game, don't do anything hasty while I'm gone. | ||
Ace
United States16096 Posts
On June 10 2013 08:15 Ace wrote: I think not not. But yo, I'm going out to watch the game, don't do anything hasty while I'm gone. On June 10 2013 08:14 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Might as well. ##Vote: Ace | ||
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