Sleeper Cell Mafia

On April 09 2011 09:11 GMarshal wrote:
A question, is this going to start after XXXVIII is over or as soon as its full?

[N] Sleeper Cell Mafia - (thread not created yet) due to start after XXXVIII (iGrok is host)

On April 13 2011 05:40 Lanaia wrote:
igrok, do you think this will start within the next three weeks?

On April 13 2011 06:41 Ace wrote:
why not just start this when it's full?

On April 09 2011 10:24 iGrok wrote:
Thanks to everyone who likes the mechanics ^^

Also, what do you mean "fake words" LSB?

On April 13 2011 12:26 why wrote:
Are the checkboxes in the player list to indicate "ready to go"?

Because if so, check me off because I'm ready to start whenever (although posting will be hard this weekend, but I doubt the game will start before then).

On April 18 2011 13:05 sandroba wrote:
/in
I'm currently playing in the mini mafia, but I would like to join this aswell if possible.

On April 21 2011 15:22 sandroba wrote:
Didn't LSB get shot by vig already in mafia xxxviii? What about trackster, is he busy?

Can you clarify some of the rules for me? As far as I can tell as an sleeper agent you can never kill each other, is that correct? even if the votes goes:
3x agent1 2xagent2 1xtownie, the target will be townie? Also cell leader can use the message ability only once per game?
Thanks in advance.
Cheers.

i thought it was an interesting mechanic, cause then it's about the GF figuring out waysto tell his agents who is who without us knowing, through the messenges. If it's particularly clever and we don't catch on to it, then i'd applaud the GF for beign so smart and his agents for figuring it out

On April 24 2011 23:08 Rean wrote:
If you need another player I can /in if you give me like a hour to understand the rules and stuff ^^

On April 24 2011 22:57 iGrok wrote:

Yes.

Game will be postponed until tomorrow if another player isn't found by 6pm EST

On April 25 2011 07:36 tnkted wrote:
Yep, got mine too.

This is going to be an interesting game, I got a strange role.

On April 25 2011 07:38 GMarshal wrote:


Bread-crumbing already huh? LYNCH HIM!

Too bad I noticed "I got a strange role" is a five word phrase! trying to communicate with your buddies...

##Vote: tnkted

On April 25 2011 07:45 Impervious wrote:

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think at this point. A phrase like that indicates he's not a normal citizen, however, I'm not sure what he actually is.

I mean, I can't see a single reason why any role would say that..... It gives away that you have a role.....

On April 25 2011 07:47 tnkted wrote:


It makes perfect sense once you see the role. I might actually claim pretty early this game. Debating the merits of it.

On April 25 2011 07:41 tnkted wrote:
Lol GM, the cell leader's messages can't possibly have gone out yet, the game hasn't even started yet.

I'm not crumbing, I'm just honestly stating that my role is strange.

Here:

WEIRD ROLE, DUDES

Welcome to Sleeper Cell Mafia you are The Mystic Avenger you live only to quench your thirst of vengeance. You will kill those bastards that murdered your family, see if you wont! You win when the serial killer and the Mass Murderer are dead. Thankfully you have some equipment to help you.

1.) Astral tables: Quite easy to use all you do is submit a number equal to the leading coefficient of the sum of all vowels used in all of your posts, ever, and then submit this number to the mod and three outside sources, if you figured it out right you will be told the astral signs of all players in the game, you know that the SK and MM are both sagitarius.

2.) Avenging Blade- its a sword of pure flame, you use it to smite the enemy, at any point you may type ##Smite Player in the thread and the player will be killed, if you hit an innocent (someone who has not killed anyone) the blade kills you as well.

3.) True Faith- If you die you may PM the mod a 100 word or less prayer. it will be edited into the OP as "divine revelation". Also you are immune to one night kill or one lynch, whichever comes first.

On April 25 2011 07:52 tnkted wrote:
...fuck

##smite GMarshal

Welcome to Sleeper Cell Mafia you are the Empath and are the bane of all psychic users. Your goal is to hunt down the Communist Mind Disruptor and the Communist Psychic Ravager, and have been trained specifically to combat psychic threats.

1) Psychic Barrier: After years of training, your mind has become an impenetrable fortress, rendering you immune to all psychic effects.

2) Nerve Gas: This is an experimental gas, which disrupts the pathways in the brain conducive to psychic abilities. Each day, you may ##Gas one player, permanently disabling any psychic abilities they may have.

3) Silenced Pistol: They may have psychic powers, but they aren't bullet-proof! Each day you may ##Shoot one player, killing them.

On April 25 2011 10:32 Jackal58 wrote:
I am going to be here until shortly after the day post guys. I get up before 5 for work so I gotta get some sleep. I just don't want to wake up to screams of "lurker"
I don't lurk. I sleep.

On April 25 2011 09:54 darmousseh wrote:
/confirm. Got my pm

On April 25 2011 10:34 GMarshal wrote:


Sleep is for weak people! Healthy, sane, well rested weak people, but weak people nonetheless!

On April 25 2011 11:15 GMarshal wrote:
Lets kick off the discussion shall we?

As I see it in this setup many traditional mafia "tells" dont apply as the mafia (except for the leader) have the same information as the town does, hell they don't even know who is going to die before they do. This means that we have to look for tells based not on more knowledge, but on pure behavior. I know this is a small distinction but I think its important enough to point out.

On April 25 2011 11:38 Jackal58 wrote:
Well Gman. Since it appears that only you and I are playing and I know what I am huge fos on you.
In other words I'm going to bed.

On April 25 2011 11:11 Jackal58 wrote:
1/3??? So five scum? Or 6? Fuck dude.
How many KP do they have? I don't see that in the OP.

On April 25 2011 11:55 Impervious wrote:


Also, I'd be looking for any unusual word choices/phrases that a player could use to help identify themselves to/complete a clue they left the sleeper agents. Unfortunately, we probably won't know what the clues will really mean, but it could lead us to the cell leader, or a red faking as the cell leader to take pressure off the leader.

On April 25 2011 11:55 Impervious wrote:
I think in this setup; the sleeper agents would want the game to go on as long as possible. This would allow more communication, as well as the ability to only kill non-agent positions (rather than mislynch). Once they've identified each other, this will quickly change, however.

Then again, the longer the game goes on, the more likely it is that the intelligence analyst can identify the reds and then claim who they all are. The downside is that they need to claim and give the town their info before they die.....

On April 25 2011 12:27 GGQ wrote:


In my experience, a short game means a mafia sweep with no losses while a longer game means at least a few mafia get killed. So I don't think the mafia wants the game to go on as long as possible at all.

On April 25 2011 12:29 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
Of course scum-hunting is going to be the best way to find scum, but breadcrumbs are also a good way of finding out the cell leader. It looks like he can only send one PM to one of his people per morning/evening, which means that he's going to have to find a way to get information out to them otherwise, or else he'll have no way to contact more than a couple of them. We can't really rely on the connections between players in this game, so if someone starts acting weird after PM time, maybe they're scum. Also, when we kill the GF, we can go back and look at who he was trying to direct, and who he was paying special attention to, and how.

On April 25 2011 11:41 Vain wrote:


Hey, i'm still here too. Am going to bed now BECAUSE ITS 5 AM HERE

btw, maby dt's should double check if they get that not info sufficient thingy if they have enough time and the player looks trusted. oh well, we'll see how it plays out. Goodnight!

On April 25 2011 15:33 sandroba wrote:
EBWOP: I also agree that pointing out vigilantes is not a blue tell, but neither is the post he quoted, which is basically the same thing. If he thinks that what vain did is a blue tell he wouldn't do it if he was blue. He would only do it if he wants to appear to be blue.

On April 25 2011 16:10 darmousseh wrote:



I did it because it's the biggest blue tell in the world.


"Hey guys, let's dt check someone, don't mind me". It's just bad play, that's it. I have no FoS on him, i'm just saying that if he is dt, then we are screwed because mafia would probably pick that up faster than I did.

For this very reason, I recommend a dt checks vein because if he isn't the dt, then he's probably scum with the whole "don't mind me" phrase.

On April 25 2011 11:40 Ace wrote:
Analysis in this setup is still the same as a normal setup. The main difference here is that associating people by alignment in the beginning is much harder.

Scum still know they are Scum and that almost everyone else is Town. That shouldn't drastically altar their behavior.

On April 25 2011 21:35 GMarshal wrote:
Ladies and Gentlemen. I have a plan, a plan that costs us nothing and and aids us in defeating or at least confusing the mafia's ability to "crumb" with specific words or phrases. Don't know what I'm getting at? sence the mafia are going to likely identify each other based on a few words or phrases I am going to mimic peoples posts and steal whole sentences and words that seem suspicious to me. This way if the mafia is revealing themselves by key phrases I confuse them into either believing I am one of them or not being able to use code phrases, I suggest you all do the same, I mean we dont know if it will work jet, but anything that causes confusion amongst the scum team will help us.

I also suggest that if multiple people quote a post others of us do the same, as that might be a method of identification as well.

Also I agree we need to keep up the posting activity, as quality posts are important to foster discussion.

On April 25 2011 21:41 sandroba wrote:
I think this discussion about breadcrumbs is not productive at all, specially if you reveal your strategy before you put it in practice. Doing what you are suggesting is going to make scumhunting more difficult imo. Also I don't think that's the way mafia is going to identify each other, as there are several other more obvious ways I can think of.

On April 25 2011 12:21 tnkted wrote:
Everyone disregard this (crumbing for later):
DSBETNLBNTF

Now, on to the game. Trying to find scum's breadcrumbs is going to be extremely difficult imo. There are two ways I think we can play this game if breadcrumbing is vitally important:

1. Set up a posting standardization system where people refrain from using coloqualisms and any identifying characteristics. This system would have to be set up so that all players may only communicate using certain standard symbols or phrases. By simplifying the language like this we can dirastically reduce the ways in which breadcrumbing can happen. However, such a system would completely remove all sense of personality and also all other possible scumtells.

2. Not focus on breadcrumbing at all, except where it is obvious. If we focus on breadcrumbing, picking apart everybody's posts for clues and hints we're going to completely miss what we should be really looking for in those posts, which are scumtells. You can bet that since scum doesn't know who scum is, they are NOT going to want to vote for the scummiest players. Scum is going to act stranger than normal, so we can't waste time looking for scumtells. We can't stop the CL from pming his cronies, so looking for scumtells is a waste of time and town attention. Remember what happened when we focused on the item game in insane 2? We won the item game but lost the overall game. :/

Now, 1 is going to be pretty difficult to do, so I vote that we do 2.

On April 25 2011 21:46 Jackal58 wrote:

Please share.

On April 25 2011 21:46 Jackal58 wrote:

Please share.

On April 25 2011 21:41 sandroba wrote:
I think this discussion about breadcrumbs is not productive at all, specially if you reveal your strategy before you put it in practice. Doing what you are suggesting is going to make scumhunting more difficult imo. Also I don't think that's the way mafia is going to identify each other, as there are several other more obvious ways I can think of.

On April 25 2011 21:53 sandroba wrote:

If you can't think of one it's in my best interest not to share, because maybe the cell leader cannot think of one aswell. Why do you want me to share it?

On April 25 2011 21:57 Vain wrote:


Well for instance the cell leader could hint them who is who. It is stated in the first post that the cell leader is allowed to breadcrumb. He can also send that pm at dusk and down so in theory he could give some direction to who to vote for to lynch at dawn and also who to hit at dusk.

On April 25 2011 21:57 Vain wrote:


Well for instance the cell leader could hint them who is who. It is stated in the first post that the cell leader is allowed to breadcrumb. He can also send that pm at dusk and down so in theory he could give some direction to who to vote for to lynch at dawn and also who to hit at dusk.

On April 25 2011 22:06 GMarshal wrote:


He isn't allowed to use player names, period, so thats going to be difficult to say the least. Yes the cell leader can hint at who is who but he has five words or 20 characters to do it in, its going to be a bitch to inform 1/3 of the players in this game about each others identity without being able to send out names. Assume it takes him one PM to reveal one player ,which makes sense as he can't just say it so he'd have to say something like "DT in Surprisingly Normal Mafia" to reveal a player assuming 5 members that means its going to take him 2 and a half days to inform everyone, (this is assuming any PMs are sent out to the whole group, if they are sent to individuals its even harder).

If they want to be efficient they have to find a way to post it in the thread, and thats what this plan sets out to hinder.

On April 25 2011 22:38 Impervious wrote:
Guys, this talk about breadcrumbing is nice and all, but I don't see it going much further at the moment. We should probably wait a while before bringing this up, so we can catch a slip up. Especially if they are trying to hide their posting in the thread.

I think we should talk about the pros and cons of of double-checking anyone who gets the result of "insufficient analysis", to make it easier on the DT.

The pros of double checking are that you are more sure of the result. The cons are that you could be checking someone else instead, therefore checking more people. I really think the cons outweigh the pros in this case.

Thoughts?

On April 25 2011 22:43 Ace wrote:


Even if you double checked someone and got "Incomplete Analysis" it's a waste of time. If you get it once and you checked the person because you assumed they were scum it's better to come out with it and play the odds that they are CL and not that you hit the 25% chance you rolled the wrong result.

Also there may be other roles not listed in the OP that have this same effect. Whether they are good or bad you won't know so you could end up wasting another day of your check to get you no further than your first check. Just roll with the odds on this one.

On April 25 2011 22:39 GMarshal wrote:
I like that question, I'll take the first shot at answering it.

Now, I'm assuming one person is receiving the message.

1.) Ace- "I'm the pardoner from XXXVIII": with a veteran player like Ace I would be trying to get as much information to him as possible, information is power and even with only a little bit of it I'm sure he could get stuff done

2.) Mr. Wiggles - " mafia will post 'serial killer' " or some other breadcrumb that would allow me to reveal myself to him and then the rest of the team. I might think of a more clever breadcrumb than that, and if it were clever enough I might use it for ace instead.

3.) why- same as for wiggles, as a veteran player both of them are people I could count on to work it into their regular posts without worrying too much about them messing up.

On April 25 2011 22:38 Impervious wrote:
Guys, this talk about breadcrumbing is nice and all, but I don't see it going much further at the moment. We should probably wait a while before bringing this up, so we can catch a slip up. Especially if they are trying to hide their posting in the thread.

I think we should talk about the pros and cons of of double-checking anyone who gets the result of "insufficient analysis", to make it easier on the DT.

The pros of double checking are that you are more sure of the result. The cons are that you could be checking someone else instead, therefore checking more people. I really think the cons outweigh the pros in this case.

Thoughts?

On April 25 2011 22:38 Impervious wrote:
Guys, this talk about breadcrumbing is nice and all, but I don't see it going much further at the moment. We should probably wait a while before bringing this up, so we can catch a slip up. Especially if they are trying to hide their posting in the thread.

I think we should talk about the pros and cons of of double-checking anyone who gets the result of "insufficient analysis", to make it easier on the DT.

The pros of double checking are that you are more sure of the result. The cons are that you could be checking someone else instead, therefore checking more people. I really think the cons outweigh the pros in this case.

Thoughts?

On April 25 2011 22:46 sandroba wrote:
Ace, I trust your analysis and think you are a smart player, but I don't like the idea of feeding ideas to the cell leader. I don't see how this can be helpful for town as I can think of other methods of comunicating with the sleeper agents that do not involve using the posts in this thread.

On April 25 2011 22:47 GMarshal wrote:


I think the DT should just push for a lynch on the target 75% chance of having the cell leader is worth the gamble of accidentally getting a town player lynched, IMO. Sure it might suck for the town player getting the shit end of the stick, but hey, we die for the greater glory and all that.

I also think this is usless discussion that allows scum to blend in, I'm sure the mafia is content to debate this to death, rather than worrying about us sabotaging their cutesy plans. Still I want to see what you guys awnser to Ace's question

On April 25 2011 22:54 Ace wrote:


Well you can keep those methods to yourself since you don't seem intent on sharing. What I'm doing here is something else. Guess you'll just have to read into it a bit more.

On April 25 2011 22:58 sandroba wrote:

I'm going to post my three people without the msg then.
Ace, GM, Mr. Wiggles.
I would inform them of all other mafia players so they can operate normally without the fear of mislynching one of the other agents.

On April 25 2011 23:28 Jackal58 wrote:
My 3 would be
tnkted

Tackster

GMarshall

My messages to all 3 would be from shared game experiences

tnkted would be a simple one My beloved. He would know exactly who sent it.

Tackster would be just as easy. You're easiest. He also would know who it was from.

GMarshall would be a bit more difficult but it would refer to LSB's Clues and Puzzles game where we were both scum together and LSBs first clus was basically Jackal is scum. I'd have to think about how I wrote it but it would allude to that.

All of these are fun and all but basically what I'm seeing from all of these is the CL can reveal himself to cell members one at a time. Does nothing for each cell member to id each other.
For that to happen something has to be left in the thread.

On April 26 2011 00:10 tnkted wrote:
it wouldn't matter who I sent my 3 to, I'd just have to write: "Twinkle Twinkle Little Scum 3rd" and they'd know who I am.

Technically, theres no reason that scum needs to know who their buddies are if they know who the CL is. The CL can use them like a conductor, posting a scumlist or an analysis that triggers the agents to pick a certain person, perhaps the person third in the list or something (ie the 3rd from above). So I'll be watching scumlists to see if anybody dies from that.

IMO, the cell leader is going to be posting with the best of us this game. He's got to blend in more than anyone, and since he's godfather he's immune to checks. I'm guessing that the first time the DTs 'insufficently' checks a vig and the vig is lynched, we're going to be a lot less likely to lynch on results from DTs.

On April 26 2011 00:18 Ace wrote:


I have no idea what "Twinkle Twinkle Little Scum 3rd" even refers to. Either way can you just answer the question? It does matter.

On April 26 2011 00:10 tnkted wrote:
it wouldn't matter who I sent my 3 to, I'd just have to write: "Twinkle Twinkle Little Scum 3rd" and they'd know who I am.

Technically, theres no reason that scum needs to know who their buddies are if they know who the CL is. The CL can use them like a conductor, posting a scumlist or an analysis that triggers the agents to pick a certain person, perhaps the person third in the list or something (ie the 3rd from above). So I'll be watching scumlists to see if anybody dies from that.

IMO, the cell leader is going to be posting with the best of us this game. He's got to blend in more than anyone, and since he's godfather he's immune to checks. I'm guessing that the first time the DTs 'insufficently' checks a vig and the vig is lynched, we're going to be a lot less likely to lynch on results from DTs.

On April 26 2011 00:29 Rean wrote:
the fuck is this shit.

youre discussing how the gf can crumb in his messages WHEN THATS USELESS TO TOWN.
seriously, we dont give a fuck how they crumb because we wont find out about it anyway if mafia is even half-decent.

and now you're even making cutesy lists on who you would message if you were the GF? STOP BEING USELESS. seriously, you people are randomly discussing things that don't get us anywhere.

fos list so far:

ace/tnkted/more idiots filling the thread with bullshit lists

On April 26 2011 00:43 Ace wrote:
Good job Rean, contribute more please. You're path to the lynch wagon won't take long with shit posts like that.

Post your lists or at least give some damn good reasons why this is useless.

On April 26 2011 00:48 GMarshal wrote:


Interestingly enough do you mind if I ask you a question?

Why are these lists useful?

I'd like to hear what reasoning went behind asking us to post these.

On April 26 2011 00:51 Ace wrote:
That will become clear soon, I'm just waiting for more lists.

Rean, why, Kenpachi, Zorkmid, Vain, darmousseh, and GGQ still have to post their lists.

On April 26 2011 00:43 Ace wrote:
Good job Rean, contribute more please. You're path to the lynch wagon won't take long with shit posts like that.

Post your lists or at least give some damn good reasons why this is useless.

On April 26 2011 01:16 Rean wrote:


How about you give us a reason as to why this is NOT a waste of time? How is knowing what everyone would pick in the hypothetical situation they're GF getting us anywhere close to catching scum?

On April 25 2011 21:51 sandroba wrote:


I don't see any reason whatsoever to limit ourselves in our scumhunting methods. I sure that there are some players here that have skills in doing both. I would encourage everyone to do both 1 AND 2, at least in some form. There's no way to predict what form breadcrumbing will take, so let's not force analysis through a top down approach.

I completely agree with method number 2 here. Behaviour analysis is going to be our main weapon, as always. As we get further into the game, it will become even easier to compare the behaviour of mafia from day1 and 2 when they most likely don't know each other to how they are acting on the next days (3+) which they most likely figured it out.

On April 26 2011 00:51 Ace wrote:
That will become clear soon, I'm just waiting for more lists.

Rean, why, Kenpachi, Zorkmid, Vain, darmousseh, and GGQ still have to post their lists.

On April 26 2011 02:13 Zorkmid wrote:


Ok, read through the whole thread, no idea what list it is that I have to post...

On April 26 2011 02:16 GMarshal wrote:

Imagine for a second you are the cell leader, who would you message and what would you tell them in that message? Pick 3 people ( assume in this imaginary world that anyone you choose to message is automatically a member of the mafia) .

I think I can guess as to why Ace wants this, but we'll see, just play along with and post it.

On April 08 2011 14:51 iGrok wrote:
Cute attempts to get around the "No Names" rule or the word/char limit will result in the message being "lost".

On April 26 2011 03:33 why wrote:
a) Although I don't like the way he posted it, I generally agree with Rean that the discussion so far has centered on setup analysis and not much scum analysis. I read through it and was surprised by how cordial everyone seemed. There just aren't any FoS's being thrown around yet, which is how stuff usually gets done.

At this point my best FoS is Jackal58. It seems really weird to me that everyone jumped on sandroba when he said that he had a way to communicate all the sleeper agent names via the 20 character message but wouldn't tell everyone. If he was scum, he would have jumped on the chance to reveal the strategy in the hopes that the scum leader would use the idea. Not giving up the idea is a null tell at worst. Since Jackal was the most vocal about sandroba giving up the information (and even going so far as to lightly FoS sandroba over the matter), I'm voting him.

##Vote: Jackal58

b) Depending on the exact meaning of



scum may be able to identify their entire team (or the majority) in one message that doesn't rely on the thread. I see no reason to give specifics, as that will only help mafia, but it should be kept in mind that a new sleeper agent MAY know the entire team each PM cycle. That said, we should definitely be on the lookout for repeated phrases, although the godfather would have to be dumb to make them easily detectable.

c) If I was godfather, I'd send messages to Ace, Wiggles, and GGQ. These are just people I think are particularly good at playing the game. My message would depend on exactly what the restrictions on naming names is. If too restrictive, I'd probably tell them to do something specific in their posts.

On April 26 2011 03:43 Jackal58 wrote:

My entire point to him was if you don't want to discuss it don't bring it up. And I'm always "vocal"

Glad you could join us.

On April 25 2011 22:30 Ace wrote:
Look at the player list. Let's pretend you were the Cell Leader for a second. What 3 players on the list would you send a message to and what would it be? (assume everyone is Scum for a second so you can just pick anyone)

On April 26 2011 03:58 why wrote:


What sandroba did made perfect sense as town (and, yes, as cell leader). If it doesn't involve the thread then there is no reason for him to post specifics. However, it is still useful to say that there is a method he can think of that will inform the PM'ed scum of the entire list. The possibility he brought up, not the method, is the important part.

And Ace, I'm excited to see what you've been up to...

On April 26 2011 04:57 Zorkmid wrote:

I guess that another strategy the CL could use would be to send out suggestions on lynch voting one by one, night by night in an attempt to lynch greens and reds.

On April 26 2011 04:57 Jackal58 wrote:

And he made no mention of not wanting to discuss it until I asked him to share. So I'm scummy because I'm not a mind reader?

On April 25 2011 23:14 Jackal58 wrote:

Well thanks for that. And how would you transmit this information? You said you can do so without posting anything in the thread. I'm curious how that mechanic would work. You can't send names. You can only contact 1 at a time. You have 5 words or 20 characters/msg.
Please don't answer that. God forbid the cell leader gets his hands on super secret stealth communications abilities.
Please stop posting pointless "I would do something but I'm not telling you what it is" posts.
This thread is for discussion. If you don't feel you can discuss something don't mention it. You're beginning to look a lot like somebody that wants to post a lot of useless stuff just to appear to be contributing.

On April 26 2011 05:27 why wrote:


Jackal, this is the post I am referring to:



At this point sandroba has already laid out why he wouldn't want to say anything. You FoS him for it. This is anti-town, since you are FoSing someone for hiding something that only a scum would want/need to know about. You are the one prolonging discussion about something that shouldn't require further discussion.

On April 26 2011 05:27 why wrote:

At this point sandroba has already laid out why he wouldn't want to say anything. You FoS him for it. This is anti-town, since you are FoSing someone for hiding something that only a scum would want/need to know about. You are the one prolonging discussion about something that shouldn't require further discussion.

On April 26 2011 05:27 why wrote:


Jackal, this is the post I am referring to:



At this point sandroba has already laid out why he wouldn't want to say anything. You FoS him for it. This is anti-town, since you are FoSing someone for hiding something that only a scum would want/need to know about. You are the one prolonging discussion about something that shouldn't require further discussion.

On April 26 2011 05:36 GMarshal wrote:
God dammit, I figured out what sand was getting at. He is right, it can be done, the whole mafia team can be informed of who the other members are, in my method they won't find out who the GF is but they *will* know who the entire team is. I *think* its doable in five words too, assuming the team consists of five members or less.

Assume that by night 3 the whole mafia team will be aware of the other members are.

Time to work on lynching people I guess. Mr.Wiggles, have you figured out why my vote is on you yet?

On April 26 2011 05:59 Tackster wrote:


How does revealing this help town?

On April 26 2011 06:05 GMarshal wrote:


We now know we have to work on the assumption that the mafia will have all their names by day 3.
I think thats a pretty relevant piece of knowledge for us to have, no?

On April 26 2011 05:31 Zorkmid wrote:


I don't really fervently disagree with FoSing him for it, I made my post which technically reveals things that agents and cell leader can do, but I did so after thinking about it for 5 minutes. I think that Sandroba is acting at least as anti-town as Jackal58 for failing to point out situation for the town to be vigilant of.

On April 26 2011 05:42 Ace wrote:


That's not anti-town. Whether or not sandroba is correct in sharing his information and whether anyone believes what he is hiding is beneficial to the town, Jackal laying a FoS on him for that isn't anti-town.

anti-town is doing something that hampers the goal of killing scum. This isn't such an incident and it is a relevant discussion.

Add it up to your suspicion points and keep letting him dig a hole for himself if you think he's so anti-town.

On April 26 2011 06:12 Ace wrote:
That doesn't mean anything. Posting frequency is just as much affected by what's being posted by other players and if people are directly asking you questions. That's a waste of time.

On April 26 2011 06:18 why wrote:


Sandroba did point out the danger. Basically, it went like this:

Sandroba: I can think of a method for scum to communicate all teammates in one PM. Watch out.
Ace, Gmarshal, Jackal: What is it?
Sandroba: Don't want to say because it might help scum.
Ace, GMarshal (eventually): ok
Jackal: FoS



I guess I misused the word "anti-town". My point is that Jackal FoSing him serves a mafia purpose: if Jackal was town there's no incentive for him to know it, given that it can't be looked out for in the thread. The only reason Jackal would want to know is if he a scum or cell leader looking for effective PMing strategies. I think it is pretty clear that there is no benefit to town knowing the information and there is benefit for mafia, so the FoS can't be justified in terms of creating discussion.

Anyway, I think everyone gets where I am coming from so I'll let the discussion move on. But my vote stays on Jackal unless someone can come up with a better lynch (why are people voting Mr. Wiggles?).