On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
That's what I'm saying. How can we take these tweets and posts seriously when everyone else is saying something different. Someone HAS to be wrong or lying.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
Using "alleged" doesn't matter to me. Do you know 5 guys (maybe Canadians I suppose) who would agree to apologize, even in a round about way, to something they know they didn't do? I sure as shit don't. Most people I know would get purple in the face complaining that it's bullshit and they didn't do the shit they're being accused of. The oooonly way I'd buy that apology video is if it was a legitimate mistake by Crs because they had been explained the rules/regulations improperly as to what they were being accused of and used words they shouldn't have. That's a possibility, albeit I don't think that's the case.
Of course they'd say alleged even if they are guilty. But since they said allegedly we have to wait for more information because frankly MLG hasn't give us jack shit and none of Crs nor Dig has confessed.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
If they actually decided who would win prior to it, then that is much more serious than prize splitting. That is something you should be banned for.
I agree. The fact that Riot is saying that is what happened, yet hasn't said anything about further punishment is fishy. Something is rotten in the state of Denmark(or North Carolina, I suppose)
There's no reason to wait if you have indisputable evidence.(Although they may be waiting on conversations with Hubert and Odee to announce them, I suppose.)
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
That's what I'm saying. How can we take these tweets and posts seriously when everyone else is saying something different. Someone HAS to be wrong or lying.
MLG has stated that the teams did not defend themselves when confronted.
However, the CRS CEO was livid on stream when he found out.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
If they actually decided who would win prior to it, then that is much more serious than prize splitting. That is something you should be banned for.
I agree. The fact that Riot is saying that is what happened, yet hasn't said anything about further punishment is fishy. Something is rotten in the state of Denmark(or North Carolina, I suppose)
There's no reason to wait if you have indisputable evidence.(Although they may be waiting on conversations with Hubert and Odee to announce them, I suppose.)
Lol I live here - trust me - it always smells like that : [.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
If they actually decided who would win prior to it, then that is much more serious than prize splitting. That is something you should be banned for.
I agree. The fact that Riot is saying that is what happened, yet hasn't said anything about further punishment is fishy. Something is rotten in the state of Denmark(or North Carolina, I suppose)
Yeah I don't believe anyone right now at all. I mean I'm leaning towards believing MLG because they're the most legitimate of people who have chimed in on things, but I just don't know anymore. Too many different things being said.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
Using "alleged" doesn't matter to me. Do you know 5 guys (maybe Canadians I suppose) who would agree to apologize, even in a round about way, to something they know they didn't do? I sure as shit don't. Most people I know would get purple in the face complaining that it's bullshit and they didn't do the shit they're being accused of. The oooonly way I'd buy that apology video is if it was a legitimate mistake by Crs because they had been explained the rules/regulations improperly as to what they were being accused of and used words they shouldn't have. That's a possibility, albeit I don't think that's the case.
It seemed to me they were apologizing for the ARAM and disappointing their fans with that ARAM game.
I guess I am Canadian, but I feel like letting people who believe in you down is the worst thing ever. Feels awful.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
Using "alleged" doesn't matter to me. Do you know 5 guys (maybe Canadians I suppose) who would agree to apologize, even in a round about way, to something they know they didn't do? I sure as shit don't. Most people I know would get purple in the face complaining that it's bullshit and they didn't do the shit they're being accused of. The oooonly way I'd buy that apology video is if it was a legitimate mistake by Crs because they had been explained the rules/regulations improperly as to what they were being accused of and used words they shouldn't have. That's a possibility, albeit I don't think that's the case.
It seemed to me they were apologizing for the ARAM and disappointing their fans with that ARAM game.
I guess I am Canadian, but I feel like letting people who believe in you down is the worst thing ever. Feels awful.
They were. But they also brought up the collusion in the video as well. I don't see how 5 innocent people would accept condemnation willingly with a clear opportunity to present their side of the story or proclaim their innocence.
On August 27 2012 12:26 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I don't buy the idea that it was a joke. There is no way Crs for a minute would've issued an apology video about something they didn't actually do. They'd have fought that shit tooth and nail. They would have immediately denied the colluding charges.
Well, Saint did say "allegedly colluding" in the video and both him and Elementz only really apologized for the ARAM. Frankly, we don't know anything until the water clears.
Using "alleged" doesn't matter to me. Do you know 5 guys (maybe Canadians I suppose) who would agree to apologize, even in a round about way, to something they know they didn't do? I sure as shit don't. Most people I know would get purple in the face complaining that it's bullshit and they didn't do the shit they're being accused of. The oooonly way I'd buy that apology video is if it was a legitimate mistake by Crs because they had been explained the rules/regulations improperly as to what they were being accused of and used words they shouldn't have. That's a possibility, albeit I don't think that's the case.
It seemed to me they were apologizing for the ARAM and disappointing their fans with that ARAM game.
I guess I am Canadian, but I feel like letting people who believe in you down is the worst thing ever. Feels awful.
They were. But they also brought up the collusion in the video as well. I don't see how 5 innocent people would accept condemnation willingly with a clear opportunity to present their side of the story or proclaim their innocence.
Because it's better for them to keep their mouth shut and let the higher ups of Curse handle it. If they're truly innocent then they have nothing to worry about.
1 week until one of the biggest lol tournaments in NA and this is what we'll be talking about for the next week. Sigh.
Really need for MLG to lay out all the facts officially (everything is spread out over twitter and such) Then, statements from Dig and Curse and maybe Riot. Then maybe they can get the focus back on one of their premier tournaments
Three main points to consider here: 1) ARAM Game 1, obviously not too professional but it's the smallest infraction and highly doubtful it will be punished tbh 2) Prize splitting, this is acceptable in some arenas (MtG) but I don't think it's suitable for LoL. Riot needs to take an strong, official stance here. 3) Match fixing, the biggest issue of this scandal. A lot of hearsay atm, so I'd request people just wait a day or two until more information is released. It's just speculation until all things can be held accountable. There's simply too much double talk and half truths atm.
Until then, I would hope our subforum will maintain the TL spirit and keep a level mind. No witch hunts please.
I don't understand why so many are defending the teams and hating on MLG. Playing aram in the finals would be like playing monobattles in the finals of SC 2. It was a complete joke and that there are so many defenders about it shows that the LoL scene has a long way to go regarding professionalism.
I saw riot/mlg employees tweeting about the aram finals like it was awesome and fun to see. Only after the fact where there was outrage by other teams and reddit did they change their tune. They say it's about colluding now because they were complicit in the aram beforehand, so want a new scapegoat answer instead of it being aram.
I agree with the outcome in the end, but I wish they would have just stated the reason was aram in the first place, instead of using the collusion cover. Aram itself was reason enough to DQ the teams in my opinion as it turned the finals into a joke.
On August 27 2012 12:53 Canucklehead wrote: I don't understand why so many are defending the teams and hating on MLG. Playing aram in the finals would be like playing monobattles in the finals of SC 2. It was a complete joke and that there are so many defenders about it shows that the LoL scene has a long way to go regarding professionalism.
I saw riot/mlg employees tweeting about the aram finals like it was awesome and fun to see. Only after the fact where there was outrage by other teams and reddit did they change their tune. They say it's about colluding now because they were complicit in the aram beforehand, so want a new scapegoat answer instead of it being aram.
I agree with the outcome in the end, but I wish they would have just stated the reason was aram in the first place, instead of using the collusion cover.
They were not complacent with ARAM in the finals, in fact Adam was furious about it.
Edit: Misread woops.
But MLG never tweeted like it was awesome to see unless you're talking about @MLG which is used for hype.
On August 27 2012 12:53 Canucklehead wrote: I don't understand why so many are defending the teams and hating on MLG. Playing aram in the finals would be like playing monobattles in the finals of SC 2. It was a complete joke and that there are so many defenders about it shows that the LoL scene has a long way to go regarding professionalism.
I saw riot/mlg employees tweeting about the aram finals like it was awesome and fun to see. Only after the fact where there was outrage by other teams and reddit did they change their tune. They say it's about colluding now because they were complicit in the aram beforehand, so want a new scapegoat answer instead of it being aram.
I agree with the outcome in the end, but I wish they would have just stated the reason was aram in the first place, instead of using the collusion cover. Aram itself was reason enough to DQ the teams in my opinion as it turned the finals into a joke.
What would you do if two SC2 greats played a monobattle for their first game in a BO5? Imean I would watch that. Hell yes I would.
Edit: Post above should check complicit vs complacent
It's not even a fair comparison. Were people outraged when HuK mothership rushed in an online tournament that didn't mean shit?
This tournament had no consequences for Dig/Crs. So they ARAM'd game 1. The only problem is if they actually colluded to influence the rankings for the regional finals.
edit: Saw a post on reddit that speculated that maybe Dig and Curse talked about how the finals didn't even matter and tried to ARAM and then split the prize money after whoever won. MLG then told the two teams not to ARAM again after game 1 (this was on stream apparently?). So they played a legit series once they were no longer allowed to ARAM. All speculation, but this seems kind of plausible to me.
so that's what i get for not switching browsers to accomodate MLG's shitty stream :/
my 2c: Pot splitting is a moral grey zone, but I don't really have a problem with it as long as the games are still high quality/entertaining (weird strats/risky big plays, etc, stuff that's cool to see but not probably optimal in a game you really need to win), but if you agree to split the pot and proceed to put 0 effort into the matches, it's a disservice to the fans and disrespectful to the tournament organizers. I haven't seen the games in question, so I can't comment on their quality, but imo this isn't as big a deal as its made out to be.
With that said, I think playing the ARAM was a bad decision. Regardless of whether or not it was entertaining/competitive, it gave the message that the players weren't taking the series seriously, *edit which imo isn't appropriate for the finals of a major tournament.
Nothing left to do but wait and see, everybody involved is blaming somebody else it seems
On August 27 2012 12:53 Canucklehead wrote: I don't understand why so many are defending the teams and hating on MLG. Playing aram in the finals would be like playing monobattles in the finals of SC 2. It was a complete joke and that there are so many defenders about it shows that the LoL scene has a long way to go regarding professionalism.
I saw riot/mlg employees tweeting about the aram finals like it was awesome and fun to see. Only after the fact where there was outrage by other teams and reddit did they change their tune. They say it's about colluding now because they were complicit in the aram beforehand, so want a new scapegoat answer instead of it being aram.
I agree with the outcome in the end, but I wish they would have just stated the reason was aram in the first place, instead of using the collusion cover.
They were not complacent with ARAM in the finals, in fact Adam was furious about it.
Well to be honest I had trouble deciphering Adam's tweet regarding beating his 9 year old in chess. I read it as, it doesn't matter if they're playing ARAM, players compete to win in anything they play.
With Riot, I saw these two tweet about defending Aram while it was happening.
In the end they can say it's about collusion, but I believe it's about Aram and changing their tune after community outrage. Like I said, I thought Aram itself was sufficient ground to DQ the teams, so would have had no problem if they stated it was because of Aram. It was a serious enough offense itself to warrant action.
I just started getting into esports as a LoL and occasional SC2 spectator, but have my whole life been a fan of pro basketball, baseball, and football. I get that this didn't have any impact on Pax, but it's still a tournament, and still a finals, and still (at least in name) professional.
This seems to me comparable to a pre-playoff NBA game where each team has its seeding locked up. They may rest their starters, and they may not play their absolute hardest, although each team will without question gain more respect from most fans for playing their hardest. They would never, say, have two players from each team stand off to the side while the others play 3 on 3 "because it's fun."
Not talking about the DQ or the collusion on prize money thing. If that part is true, it's a whole new league of shady and unprofessional. I'm just talking about the ARAM, and why I was disappointed to see it.
EPT
