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On January 29 2014 07:26 Ketara wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 05:48 lega wrote:
Magic penetration is too good to pass on Lux. In lane, her passive is a big component of her damage output. For any opponent which I think I have decent chance to win , I would like to go Chalice->guise->sorc build for ap or tear->seeker->guise for ad. It gives you an earlier power spike compared with the typical Athene/Rabadon build. You can delete your lane opponent in one combo.
I am currently using flat cdr glyph and quits, which gives me 17.5 cdr at the beginning of the game with matery. Therefore I don't have to rush Athenes/Morello before I finish my Rabadons. This is an interesting build. Let's examine this. The first thing to note here is that you're going for offensive glyphs rather than magic resist, which is not the worst thing in the world on Lux. But for comparison sake rather than compare to MR glyph builds, I'm going to compare it to a build with flat AP glyphs. In the early game, this build will be strictly inferior to getting AP glyphs/quints. As stated previously, Lux's early lane is inhibited by mana rather than by CDR, so by having CDR runes over AP, you're reducing your early laning effectiveness. That's pretty easy to see. However, during the mid game it's a little bit more interesting. Athenes costs 2600g, while Chalice + Haunting Guise costs 2365. They're comparable. At lets say level 9, we'll be looking at 105 AP 21 mpen with an Athenes build, and 40 AP 36 mpen with Chalice+Guise. That's counting sorc shoes, btw. Your level 9 combo does 750+205% AP damage. I picked level 9 because it's about when you can expect to have these items if you're doing well. What does this look like against normal target MR? 42 MR (mr runes no mr items) Athene: 835.6 Chalice+Sorc: 825.8 82 MR (mr runes and athenes) Athene: 631.9 Chalice+Sorc: 597.4 So, going Athenes is actually giving you as much or more damage, more CDR, and more regen. Haunting Guise does give you 200 HP, but at the same time, this Athenes build gives you 10 more MR and increases the strength of your shield by 45, so that doesn't mean as much as you might think. After this point in the game going Athenes is going to jump ahead in efficiency. Once you get a Deathcap your AP in the Athenes build will start to scale multiplicitavely. You'll be forced to either get a 6th item Liandry since you went Haunting Guise, or sell the thing late game, neither of which is an attractive option. And since you went for Athenes plus CDR runes, once you start getting elixirs you'll be at 47.5% CDR which is inefficient. Basically, this just isn't as good as going Athenes.
I dont have time to do the math, but I just wanna point out that your calculation is not right.
1. the lv 9 combo damage for lux is 110 (lv 2 q)+240 (lv 5 e) +300(lv 1 ult) +300 (3 passive procs, in most cases you can get 2 procs at least) =950+ 2.05 ap.
2. you forget the 6% percentage penetration from mastery.
If you repeat the calculation, I think it will favor Mpen way better. Not to mention Mpen build is also better in e+aa poke.
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You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better.
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Two is almost certain. Since you ult can proc one, the only thing you have to do is to aa once after you hit anything. Getting 3 procs requires you aa twice during the combo, which is also easily achievable if you have flash or you start your combo close to the target.
Also I did a little bit math
full combo 850+2.05 ap (2 procs)
Athene+sorc vs 42 mr : 906.6
Guise+sorc vs 42 mr: 909.3
full combo 950+2.05 ap (3 procs)
Athene+sorc : 991.7
Guise+sorc : 1006.9
e+aa harrass
Athene+sorc : 343
Guise+sorc : 355
Mpen is worse against higher mr for sure. However mr does not prevent you from killing off laners, especially bot lane, who usually do not get any mr item early.
If the matchup is dangerous , like Leblanc or Fizz, Athene is definitely the superior build, since all you have to do is to farm and not to die. However if you wanna beat your opponent and/or roam early, guise is much cheaper, easier to build and provide more damage. Athene's build is underwhelming gold-wise before you can actually finish it.
Also avoiding Athene gives you more flexibility on itemization. Sometimes if I am doing good in lane, I go straight chalice->needless rod and finish rabadons as my first item. It snowballs you much harder than athene's. When you are behind, you can directly go to void staff instead of rabadons, since you already have enough flat mpen. You don't have to build an athene's and sit on it for another 10 min until you can afford a needless rod. Athene's is usually my 5th/6th one to finish, after void staff/zhonya.
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Getting 3 passive procs on a person is basically impossible vs. a competant target unless you hit them with the E+auto and then snare them after. You don't have enough time during the snare duration to do it.
Lets say you have 10 ping.
At level 9 you have an attack speed of 0.7, so you attack once every 1.42 seconds.
R has a cast time of 0.5 seconds. E also has an unspecified cast time, lets say 0.1 seconds, it's small but it's there.
So, your target gets snared, right. You've got 10 ping, so when you see the snare hitting it's already been active for 0.1 seconds. You click E immediately, 10 more ping. 0.1 second cast time, so we're now at 0.3. Then you click R, 10 more ping followed by a 0.5 second cast time. We're at 0.9 seconds now.
You now have to auto the target, 10 more ping. After that you have to detonate the E, which is another 20 ping, 10 for seeing it on your screen and 10 for hitting the button, and then auto again which is another 10.
So basically, with 10 ping and absolutely no time lost while you make decisions and click these buttons, the time between your autoattacks has to be 0.7 seconds in order for you to detonate 3 passive hits while the target is snared. It's not, and it just doesn't happen. Your target flashes, it takes you a fraction of a second to realize the snare hit and press ER, the target has tenacity, etc.
If you had 0 ping, used smartcast and were Faker, or if your opponent was in Bronze, I think it could be possible. But realistically 3 passives in a combo just doesn't happen unless you E+auto them and then a couple seconds later Q+R.
It would also be possible if they gave Lux the Gragas and Ziggs treatment and let you detonate E's while they're in flight. I'd really like that buff.
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And regardless, it's a fairly moot argument.
With the build you're suggesting you're much worse in the early game and worse in the late game, and in the mid game have less regen and less CDR. The advantage is some HP and mid game damage that is situationally slightly higher and also situationally slightly lower but realistically about the same.
It's just not as good. I do not even need to try it out to think this.
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On January 29 2014 09:14 Ketara wrote:
Getting 3 passive procs on a person is basically impossible vs. a competant target unless you hit them with the E+auto and then snare them after. You don't have enough time during the snare duration to do it.
Lets say you have 10 ping.
At level 9 you have an attack speed of 0.7, so you attack once every 1.42 seconds.
R has a cast time of 0.5 seconds. E also has an unspecified cast time, lets say 0.1 seconds, it's small but it's there.
So, your target gets snared, right. You've got 10 ping, so when you see the snare hitting it's already been active for 0.1 seconds. You click E immediately, 10 more ping. 0.1 second cast time, so we're now at 0.3. Then you click R, 10 more ping followed by a 0.5 second cast time. We're at 0.9 seconds now.
You now have to auto the target, 10 more ping. After that you have to detonate the E, which is another 20 ping, 10 for seeing it on your screen and 10 for hitting the button, and then auto again which is another 10.
So basically, with 10 ping and absolutely no time lost while you make decisions and click these buttons, the time between your autoattacks has to be 0.7 seconds in order for you to detonate 3 passive hits while the target is snared. It's not, and it just doesn't happen. Your target flashes, it takes you a fraction of a second to realize the snare hit and press ER, the target has tenacity, etc.
If you had 0 ping, used smartcast and were Faker, or if your opponent was in Bronze, I think it could be possible. But realistically 3 passives in a combo just doesn't happen unless you E+auto them and then a couple seconds later Q+R.
It would also be possible if they gave Lux the Gragas and Ziggs treatment and let you detonate E's while they're in flight. I'd really like that buff.
You are basically saying that riven (Q right click AA)*3 combo is impossible.
For lux combo, only the hitting snare part needs comfirmation (a lot of times I do faith combo, at least I always throw q and e together if I am confident), rest of them is just practicing. You can also move between AAs to close the distance and your e also slows the target. It is not easy to hit 3 procs for sure in all situations (merc, distance, flash, etc) for sure , but I don't understand why you rarely get 2 procs.
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I'm really interested in what MMR you're playing in if you think it's even possible to hit 3 passives in a combo before they flash or do something to stop you. I'd like to see it.
Maybe I am just bad, who knows!
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3 passive only need 2 autos.
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On January 29 2014 09:54 Ketara wrote:
I'm really interested in what MMR you're playing in if you think it's even possible to hit 3 passives in a combo before they flash or do something to stop you. I'd like to see it.
Maybe I am just bad, who knows!
You only need 2 autos to proc all 3. 1v1 doing something like snare e walkup auto pop e r auto is pretty easily done vs champions without tenacity.
Downside of walking up for the auto is it often puts you in range of their spells. You can do the entire above combo in slightly more time then snare duration.
You should always do this when people facecheck into you in a bush/you catch people at short range over walls, however.
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On January 29 2014 09:57 dae wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 09:54 Ketara wrote:
I'm really interested in what MMR you're playing in if you think it's even possible to hit 3 passives in a combo before they flash or do something to stop you. I'd like to see it.
Maybe I am just bad, who knows! You only need 2 autos to proc all 3. 1v1 doing something like snare e walkup auto pop e r auto is pretty easily done vs champions without tenacity. Downside of walking up for the auto is it often puts you in range of their spells. You can do the entire above combo in slightly more time then snare duration. You should always do this when people facecheck into you in a bush/you catch people at short range over walls, however.
But if it's longer than the snare duration, can't they flash the ult?
I've never been able to do something like that, but I just don't do faith combos unless people facecheck you in a bush like you said.
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On January 29 2014 08:42 Ketara wrote:
You get max CDR on Lux with Athene+DFG+blue elixir.
DFG on lux is like super last priority item... You basically never get max CDR then? I don't understand why you would chose to play mid-game without max-cdr, when it's basically the difference between casting 2 and 3 q's per fight and given that q is the set up for your ult, as well as incredible damage mitigation spell for your team. I think you're missing out.
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On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better.
I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins.
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On January 29 2014 10:07 Ketara wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 09:57 dae wrote:On January 29 2014 09:54 Ketara wrote:
I'm really interested in what MMR you're playing in if you think it's even possible to hit 3 passives in a combo before they flash or do something to stop you. I'd like to see it.
Maybe I am just bad, who knows! You only need 2 autos to proc all 3. 1v1 doing something like snare e walkup auto pop e r auto is pretty easily done vs champions without tenacity. Downside of walking up for the auto is it often puts you in range of their spells. You can do the entire above combo in slightly more time then snare duration. You should always do this when people facecheck into you in a bush/you catch people at short range over walls, however. But if it's longer than the snare duration, can't they flash the ult? I've never been able to do something like that, but I just don't do faith combos unless people facecheck you in a bush like you said.
With regards to flashing the ult, if you do it perfectly and are not THAT far away you can get it all off before snare duration is over. (0 tenacity) If they have tenacity yes, they can flash the ult if you do this.
You kinda need to start commiting when you throw the snare, since you wont have time otherwise. Alot of the time in lane I don't feel comfortable getting that close to them, since you kinda need to kill them in this combo otherwise they can turn on you (or at least get them low enough they have to run), since after its over your kinda dead in the water for 6 seconds.
Also, its rare the auto mid combo actually makes the difference between a kill and no kill, so its meh. (getting an auto off after combo and comboing without it is way faster and easier)
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On January 29 2014 14:23 Kiarip wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better. I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins.
Don't go chalice and guise, you do no damage on a hero that does no damage anyways, and you don't even have the cdr benefit that's one of the main reasons you buy Athenes for.
If your going burst go full burst and spend your first 900 damage on mana that doesn't help you kill stuff, get like sorcs or mejais instead (mejais kinda needed for full burst to scale through the game, or you just stop 1 comboing stuff eventually).
Seems like you're reliant on the mr/hp combo as a crutch to keep yourself alive. Lux is much more about vision and positioning to survive encounters, and not raw tankiness (often if your at a point where your tankiness matters you've already screwed up). Exceptions to this are nocturne, kassadin, leblanc, basically anyone that can gap close onto you at will with nothing you can do about it, and where you actually need to be tanky and just be a utility bot, otherwise you become food.
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The extra HP on Haunting Guise is nice, but you'd be surprised how much it's actually worth in comparison to 10 MR on Athenes.
10 MR increases your effective HP against magic damage by 10%.
Using our fictional level 9 Lux as an example, she's got 1124 HP with 21/9 masteries. 1330 with Haunting Guise. With Athenes she shields for 233.5, and with Guise she shields for 188. Barrier shields for 275.
So, her effective HP against magic damage is more like:
3004 with Athenes
3110 with Guise
A difference of 106. Since Athenes Lux is making a net gain of .1 EHP for every HP point regenned, has 450 HP in regen with her flask and 2.29 HP/sec regen, she's going to make up that difference in about 4 minutes assuming she doesn't shield any additional damage.
I mean, the Haunting Guise certainly does give you more survivability, especially vs. an AD lane or an all in. But like, here's the thing.
If you're Lux in a lane where you're going to be all inned or taking lots of consistent harass damage, you're first off not going to want a build that makes you weaker in the early game. And secondly, in the mid game if Lux needs to prevent herself from taking damage, the way she does it is by farming exclusively with E, which takes Athenes regen and CDR.
Where the haunting guise would give an advantage would be in a lane where you're trying to aggressively engage with and kill your opponent in a short period of time. Lux just doesn't do that very much in almost any matchup unless she's seriously ahead. She goes slow and steady and pokes people out of lane.
And if she's seriously ahead, you might as well just buy an NLR instead of that Haunting Guise. It's more damage and works with your build better, and if you're far ahead you don't give a fuck about not buying HP.
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On January 29 2014 14:44 dae wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 14:23 Kiarip wrote:On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better. I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins. Don't go chalice and guise, you do no damage on a hero that does no damage anyways, and you don't even have the cdr benefit that's one of the main reasons you buy Athenes for. If your going burst go full burst and spend your first 900 damage on mana that doesn't help you kill stuff, get like sorcs or mejais instead (mejais kinda needed for full burst to scale through the game, or you just stop 1 comboing stuff eventually). Seems like you're reliant on the mr/hp combo as a crutch to keep yourself alive. Lux is much more about vision and positioning to survive encounters, and not raw tankiness (often if your at a point where your tankiness matters you've already screwed up). Exceptions to this are nocturne, kassadin, leblanc, basically anyone that can gap close onto you at will with nothing you can do about it, and where you actually need to be tanky and just be a utility bot, otherwise you become food.
Do you think the Lux vs. Kassadin matchup will be easier with the proposed Kassadin changes? I feel like it really will be and I am excited for this.
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On January 29 2014 15:06 Ketara wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 14:44 dae wrote:On January 29 2014 14:23 Kiarip wrote:On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better. I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins. Don't go chalice and guise, you do no damage on a hero that does no damage anyways, and you don't even have the cdr benefit that's one of the main reasons you buy Athenes for. If your going burst go full burst and spend your first 900 damage on mana that doesn't help you kill stuff, get like sorcs or mejais instead (mejais kinda needed for full burst to scale through the game, or you just stop 1 comboing stuff eventually). Seems like you're reliant on the mr/hp combo as a crutch to keep yourself alive. Lux is much more about vision and positioning to survive encounters, and not raw tankiness (often if your at a point where your tankiness matters you've already screwed up). Exceptions to this are nocturne, kassadin, leblanc, basically anyone that can gap close onto you at will with nothing you can do about it, and where you actually need to be tanky and just be a utility bot, otherwise you become food. Do you think the Lux vs. Kassadin matchup will be easier with the proposed Kassadin changes? I feel like it really will be and I am excited for this.
Whats Kassadin, never seen a hero with that name. Don't think the patch will change that.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On January 29 2014 16:55 dae wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 15:06 Ketara wrote:On January 29 2014 14:44 dae wrote:On January 29 2014 14:23 Kiarip wrote:On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better. I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins. Don't go chalice and guise, you do no damage on a hero that does no damage anyways, and you don't even have the cdr benefit that's one of the main reasons you buy Athenes for. If your going burst go full burst and spend your first 900 damage on mana that doesn't help you kill stuff, get like sorcs or mejais instead (mejais kinda needed for full burst to scale through the game, or you just stop 1 comboing stuff eventually). Seems like you're reliant on the mr/hp combo as a crutch to keep yourself alive. Lux is much more about vision and positioning to survive encounters, and not raw tankiness (often if your at a point where your tankiness matters you've already screwed up). Exceptions to this are nocturne, kassadin, leblanc, basically anyone that can gap close onto you at will with nothing you can do about it, and where you actually need to be tanky and just be a utility bot, otherwise you become food. Do you think the Lux vs. Kassadin matchup will be easier with the proposed Kassadin changes? I feel like it really will be and I am excited for this. Whats Kassadin, never seen a hero with that name. Don't think the patch will change that.
It's that thing that shows up in champ select next to "Blitzcrank".
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On January 29 2014 14:44 dae wrote:Show nested quote +On January 29 2014 14:23 Kiarip wrote:On January 29 2014 08:50 Ketara wrote:
You will never get 3 passive procs in a combo. You rarely get two.
I did forget the 6% mpen, but it's not really going to make a big difference.
With the mpen:
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 845.9
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 834.6
In terms of E+auto damage (340+60% AP)
Athenes vs. 42 MR: 334.5
Chalice + Guise vs. 42 MR: 365.1
That looks better, but in terms of harass damage over time, it's important to also factor in your regen. With Athenes you have 8.82 mana/sec regen, while with just Chalice you have 6.42 mana/sec regen. With about an 8 sec cooldown on E, that means during the cooldown you regen 70.56 mana with Athenes (54% of an E) and 51.86 mana with Chalice (40% of an E).
So counting your regen over time into your overall damage the numbers look more like this:
Athenes: 515.13
Chalice + Guise: 511.14
So, even in terms of harass damage, Athenes is equal or better. I don't think this is fair, Athene's mana regen is very overrated in lanes where you get harassed back or tend to lose health since if you go back without having spent all your mana, you've basically wasted your money. chalice + guise is also 300 gold cheaper and gives you 200 health which helps to survive ganks and all-ins. Don't go chalice and guise, you do no damage on a hero that does no damage anyways, and you don't even have the cdr benefit that's one of the main reasons you buy Athenes for. If your going burst go full burst and spend your first 900 damage on mana that doesn't help you kill stuff, get like sorcs or mejais instead (mejais kinda needed for full burst to scale through the game, or you just stop 1 comboing stuff eventually). Seems like you're reliant on the mr/hp combo as a crutch to keep yourself alive. Lux is much more about vision and positioning to survive encounters, and not raw tankiness (often if your at a point where your tankiness matters you've already screwed up). Exceptions to this are nocturne, kassadin, leblanc, basically anyone that can gap close onto you at will with nothing you can do about it, and where you actually need to be tanky and just be a utility bot, otherwise you become food.
There are tons of champions that can guarantee trades. With w + e + passive proc you can win most trades with chalice/guise.
I don't push with e until I get blue, because I can last hit everything anyways.
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You're making a lot of overgeneralizations there, man.
Probably the only mids in the game that can put guaranteed harass damage on Lux after you get chalice are Kassadin, Leblanc and Ziggs. Everybody else if you want to you can farm without ever being in any danger, or they have some skillshot that's not too hard to dodge like Nidalee or Jayce.
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EPT
