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On May 15 2012 23:53 Sponkz wrote: So everyone's maxing Q over wall? Seems like i must be doing something wrong. I usually start lvl'ing W at 8 and max it second. i still prefer wall over Q cause i can make bigger plays off of walls than a higher ranked Q mid-game
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On May 16 2012 00:20 Frolossus wrote:Show nested quote +On May 15 2012 23:53 Sponkz wrote: So everyone's maxing Q over wall? Seems like i must be doing something wrong. I usually start lvl'ing W at 8 and max it second. i still prefer wall over Q cause i can make bigger plays off of walls than a higher ranked Q mid-game
I go back and forth depending on whether i am playing arranged or solo queue. In arranged I favor Wall over Q. However, I will favor wall over Q in solo if we are getting chased.
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On April 24 2012 09:08 Amui wrote: - Anivia has both the lowest health and lowest health scaling in the game. This is very bad because in bot, you probably aren't going to be able to get under tower to egg safely. - You can run oom very easily with RoA+blue on mid farm/levels. Support Anivia doesn't get any of this. - You aren't taking advantage of her scaling. Other supports have generally crappy ratios. Anivia has 1.0 scaling on 2 skills. You could either play mid and be able to burst an AD for over 2k late game, or do less than 1/3 that as a support anivia. - No sustainable zone control. Mid anivia should have the mana pool to ult siege a tower for 5-10 seconds at a time, and still have the mana to fight late game. Support anivia doesn't.
I see your complaints and raise you a Alistar Anivia kill lane with AD carry going mid. It happened in ranked in solo queue cause our AD demanded mid, so I was like wtf, but we'll try it. I ended up getting 4 kills fairly early thanks to our Alistar. This was a couple months ago, so you won't see it in my match history.
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On May 16 2012 00:20 Sabin010 wrote: I max them both out evenly. Wall is op in team fights man. If a tower goes down early, or for some other reason I think we're about to have a big team fight. I will get lvl two wall at 8 for the team fights.
Exactly wall is OP. So why lvl your Q, when it's only use in mid/late is the fact that it stuns and makes your E deal more damage? I'm kinda semi-ok with anivia, but i'm having trouble figuring out if Q is really worth it and also how many points in W is required to make it "op".
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Leveling up Q will reduce its cooldown, and in some lanes when Q is on cd you're a sitting duck. No pun intended.
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1 level of w is enough for most small skirmishes, in solo queue I would rarely level it over Q past level 1 however against people without gap closers etc a wider wall can often change the dynamic of the game greatly, people like singed, garen, rammus etc are often ruined by a wide wall whereas a small one would often do little to hinder their charges likewise, if you are focusing on farming (instaclearing mid and taking wraiths etc) additional levels of Q help wide walls are also nice if you find yourself often fighting in jungle (hard contesting of jungle control between junglers etc and would help against their jungler) more often than not though it is usually the placement of the wall itself rather than its size that determines its efficacy
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Anivia free week, so I tried her out.
I'm curious what the best item build currently is, now that Athene's Unholy Grail is out. I tried it in my game, and it worked very well (11/6/18), against a brand no less. I feel like it's core now, all the stats are amazing for Anivia, and chalice only costs 890, less than 2 doran's. Unholy grail + blue + masteries = 39% CDR, perfect.
I went:
boots 3 -> chalice -> catalyst -> sorc shoes -> RoA -> unholy grail -> deathcap -> void staff -> (defensive item) (the game ended before i could get 6th item)
I liked it a lot, but my AP sucked for almost the entire mid-game due to late deathcap. But I'm not sure how else to build it, if I delay RoA by too much it's not as useful, and I need the early chalice for mana. However it seemed to work out well.
I feel like RoA/deathcap/void staff/sorc boots are core. So for me it comes down to chalice -> unholy grail vs. tear -> AA staff. They both are very good. AA staff gives more mana, and more AP than unholy grail, but unholy grail gives MR, CDR, and more mana regen, especially if you're snowballing, and even moreso if you have blue buff, since the passive is %-based. But if you don't get blue buff, perhaps tear is better.
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I would delay the RoA, it is still good the thing is - in mid game the great trading power and power level in small skirmishes wtih the heavy AP of NL rod makes it superior IMO, so i would get it after chalice and leave catalyst&stuff for later
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I was under the impression a ton of AP was nice on anivia but not necessary which is why the Cata/Tear build worked so well as it gave her the base mana she needed.
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Tried anivia on some normals, and she seems super fun. Only problem is, that hitting Q is so super hard for me, that i think when i go to rankeds i wont hit it once in any match. Luckily my normal elo is so low (only used it for leveling and drunk playing with friends) that there they wont really even try to evade them. 
Oh, and wall over Q? I have to give it a try. Q just seems to be so much damage if you can hit it, that it seems stupid not to take it second. If you hit both procs its 360 + 1AP ratio, that has to be one of the highest damage normal spells in the game? Well, ill play until i feel comfortable with that Q in normals, and then give her a try in rankeds...
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On June 26 2012 07:36 Gaslo wrote:Tried anivia on some normals, and she seems super fun. Only problem is, that hitting Q is so super hard for me, that i think when i go to rankeds i wont hit it once in any match. Luckily my normal elo is so low (only used it for leveling and drunk playing with friends) that there they wont really even try to evade them.  Oh, and wall over Q? I have to give it a try. Q just seems to be so much damage if you can hit it, that it seems stupid not to take it second. If you hit both procs its 360 + 1AP ratio, that has to be one of the highest damage normal spells in the game? Well, ill play until i feel comfortable with that Q in normals, and then give her a try in rankeds... You need to lead them with Q in a certain direction and then wall them into that direction. So launch Q->WE. But in lane I pretty much harass with E->R for the second proc, if they seem retarded I'll then go for a QWE when they are still slowed but hitting Q is hard unless you are sitting on them. Which is another think you can do. Use E-> R, run to them while they are slowed for an easy Q -> E and if you want to be done with aggression use W etc. Theres so many ways to use her spells.
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On June 02 2012 09:35 BlasiuS wrote: Anivia free week, so I tried her out.
I'm curious what the best item build currently is, now that Athene's Unholy Grail is out. I tried it in my game, and it worked very well (11/6/18), against a brand no less. I feel like it's core now, all the stats are amazing for Anivia, and chalice only costs 890, less than 2 doran's. Unholy grail + blue + masteries = 39% CDR, perfect.
I went:
boots 3 -> chalice -> catalyst -> sorc shoes -> RoA -> unholy grail -> deathcap -> void staff -> (defensive item) (the game ended before i could get 6th item)
I liked it a lot, but my AP sucked for almost the entire mid-game due to late deathcap. But I'm not sure how else to build it, if I delay RoA by too much it's not as useful, and I need the early chalice for mana. However it seemed to work out well.
I feel like RoA/deathcap/void staff/sorc boots are core. So for me it comes down to chalice -> unholy grail vs. tear -> AA staff. They both are very good. AA staff gives more mana, and more AP than unholy grail, but unholy grail gives MR, CDR, and more mana regen, especially if you're snowballing, and even moreso if you have blue buff, since the passive is %-based. But if you don't get blue buff, perhaps tear is better. I like that path - AP really is optional with the great base damage that Anivia has. Mana means more than AP to her because you can just endlessly E-R harass and push all day. Might want the Catalyst first, though - for the Health sustain.
Well, not really optional. She has great AP scaling - but without constant mana to back it up, you aren't going to be able to get the most out of her. And her base damage is damn good anyway, and more importantly - her SUSTAINED damage is also way better than most APs - only Karthus and Cassi really can compete/surpass her there. Sustained damage means it's more important that you can keep throwing out spells / sustaining ulti than it is to make your burst combo the best possible - thus, delayed deathcap.
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On May 16 2012 00:29 NEOtheONE wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 09:08 Amui wrote: - Anivia has both the lowest health and lowest health scaling in the game. This is very bad because in bot, you probably aren't going to be able to get under tower to egg safely. - You can run oom very easily with RoA+blue on mid farm/levels. Support Anivia doesn't get any of this. - You aren't taking advantage of her scaling. Other supports have generally crappy ratios. Anivia has 1.0 scaling on 2 skills. You could either play mid and be able to burst an AD for over 2k late game, or do less than 1/3 that as a support anivia. - No sustainable zone control. Mid anivia should have the mana pool to ult siege a tower for 5-10 seconds at a time, and still have the mana to fight late game. Support anivia doesn't.
I see your complaints and raise you a Alistar Anivia kill lane with AD carry going mid. It happened in ranked in solo queue cause our AD demanded mid, so I was like wtf, but we'll try it. I ended up getting 4 kills fairly early thanks to our Alistar. This was a couple months ago, so you won't see it in my match history. AMUI CALL YOUR HAND IS STRONGER
I was watching pobelter play anivia today (my pick for best anivia, only one to ever beat my cho mid pre-6) and he just rushed rod with basic boots which I agree with.
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Added a section with small notes on matchups. While Anivia doesn't get hard countered by mids, some matchups are harder than others, although aggressive junglers are more scary for her than the mids, because of how slow Anivia is. Generally blow flash first, ask questions later, because lowest base HP doesn't play well against junglers like Alistar or nautilus where you can get egged before being able to move again.
Also if OGN is anything to go by, Anivia nerfs are definitely a possibility. She's definitely one of the hardest AP's to get good with, but she is probably #1 in terms of common competitive AP's by single target burst, around 3-4th ranked AP by overall damage and #1 in terms of teamfight control(arguably most importantly).
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So with the new s3 items, anivia seems to be very very strong.
Both tear and cata are cheaper, meaning your core gets finished faster.
Flask is just amazing for sustain in lane.
Tear stacks amazingly fast, like when I went tear/sorc/cata/roa/aa, my tear was stacking before I finished aa, and i was pretty fed and farmed too.
Seraph + barrier makes you almost undivable, as its like 1200ish shiled (at full mana) later in the game.
She just seems so strong atm.
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Liandry's Torment is also pretty stupid on her.
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Wait... does Liandry's deal the double damage to every1 standing in anivia ult.... That would be so completely broken..
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I'll update the thread sometime after my finals.
And yes, I think liandry's applies on every tick of ult for pretty absurd damage. Sadly it doesn't really fit into her build path until later though. RoA/Tear is best gotten early,
You'd probably want to open bottle+2pots+faerie. Back for tear+ruby crystal+boots and then just farm til RoA. Dunno what to get from there, could go the Dcap void route or liandry's for huge siege/antisiege potential. Can't touch anivia ult without taking 3.3% magic damage per sec on top of the normal ult damage.
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Okay I updated items and masteries for season 3, and cleaned up some of the wording. Still needs some more work though.
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